Githyanki/Githzerai in Eberron. - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 zombiegleemax Sep 04, 2008 13:36:50	How do they fit into the setting?
#2 Arcane_Guyver Sep 04, 2008 16:05:55	They're the refugees of one of the many worlds the daelkyr have destroyed. They're pretty rare in Eberron, often in out-of-the-way locations. Save for the githyanki's deal with red dragons, they pretty much act the way they normally do in Eberron.
#3 aseran Sep 04, 2008 20:48:57	It's also noted (in Races of Eberron, I think it was) that between 'zerai and 'yanki, there isn't so much open hostility as a sort of sullen rivalry; little violence, but the same sort of cold disapproval that members of different religious denominations might feel for one another--it's not as if they're forced to share the same living space. They will, on occasion, get together to go a-daelkyr slayin' all the same.
#4 rauric Sep 04, 2008 21:23:55	I placed some "yankis" in the mountains near New Cyre in my game. Their is an area in those mountains that contain a great Dalkyr lord and they created citadal that protects the seals of the overlords prison. I made them very xenophobic since an illithid is always sending spies to enter the citadal. He uses adventurers to try and break into the place all of the time. He also uses his minions (Keepers from Fiend Folio) to capture gith scouts and steal their memories. Anyone that is a scout has never been near the inner level of the citadal so they cannot leak any info to the illithid. Only an elite few can enter the inner sanctum of their citadal and they may never leave the walls of their "home".
#5 rekko Sep 05, 2008 8:07:49	From the Eberron Expanded article on Lords of Madness Eberron is not the first world that the daelkyr have attacked. It is possible that the mind flayers were created when the daelkyr destroyed the native world of the gith races. If so, the githzerai and githyanki are descendants of those few survivors who fled to Kythri and the Astral Plane, while the mind flayers are descended from survivors of the progenitor race who were twisted in the same manner as the dolgaunts and dolgrims. I don't recall any information on the Gith races in an Eberron book except for that small entry on page 123 of Player's Guide to Eberron. However, it contradicts the article. And both were written by Keith Baker. This would be a good question to ask Hellcow. Rekko
#6 romulus_lonewolf Sep 05, 2008 19:16:07	Just thought of a way to have the Githyanki/Red Dragon pact in Eberron.. Namely, the Githyanki allied themselves with a powerful Red Dragon member of the Chamber. In essence, it's a pact of mutual cooperation where the Githyanki and members of that Dragon's brood aid one another to deal with Cults of the Dragon Below and their Aberration servitors, especially the Illithids.
#7 Hellcow Sep 06, 2008 1:52:35	I don't recall any information on the Gith races in an Eberron book except for that small entry on page 123 of Player's Guide to Eberron. However, it contradicts the article. And both were written by Keith Baker. Quite a few people worked on the PGtE, and I didn't work on that particular section of the book. So the Eberron Expanded article reflects how I run things; the PGtE mention is an alternate view.
#8 rekko Sep 06, 2008 7:01:44	Thanks Keith. If we go down a route similar to yours, how do you suggest we handle the "Gith came from another world destroyed by Daelkyr" part? Is the other world Xoriat? As in the Daelkyr conquered the plane and twisted everything to their own tastes. Or more in the line of Sigil, the city of doors? Or only very far if you lose your way in the Astral plane? Rekko
#9 stagnation_dup Sep 06, 2008 10:15:11	They also get mentioned in the Explorers Handbook, which is traditionally taken as "more" true to canon than PGTE is.
#10 Hellcow Sep 06, 2008 14:09:34	If we go down a route similar to yours, how do you suggest we handle the "Gith came from another world destroyed by Daelkyr" part? Is the other world Xoriat? There's stars in the night sky of Eberron - and as such, it's reasonable to assume that there are other worlds in the material plane. What's said in the ECS is that "for the daelkyr, destroying worlds appears to be a form of art." Note "worldS" there, which was no accident; in my opinion, it's something they've been doing since the dawn of time, and there may be dozens of broken worlds out there. The principle behind this is that the daelkyr created the illithids when they destroyed the Gith world - that illithids are to Gith as dolgaunts are to hobgoblins. As such, the Gith hate the daelkyr for destroying their world - and they despise the illithids because they are the embodiment of their failure and the tool of their destruction. My goal with this was to keep the Gith-flayer rivalry, but true to the general principles of Eberron, to explore a new direction with it (just as the Aereni are different from elves of other settings). The flayers serve the daelkyr. The daelkyr destroy worlds and transform the inhabitants. The Gith hate the flayers. And so it goes. By comparison, the ExH simply says "The mind flayers invaded created the gith as slaves." First, this shows a flawed understanding of the setting; the flayers were the lieutenants of the invading force, not its commanders. Second, it gives very little depth to the Gith, and essentially just makes them additional Dolgaunts (even suggesting that they might have been created from goblin stock). My version takes the idea that the Gith have a culture far older than that of Galifar, but that they have seen their world destroyed and are now refugees clinging to their planar sanctums... and gives them an interesting motivation, as they hate Xoriat most of all, but at the same time have to feel bitter jealousy towards the world that survived when theirs fell. Beyond this, it does mean that there are broken worlds waiting to be found; perhaps a scholar at the Arcane Congress will hire players to test an eldritch machine that teleports people to other worlds (Stargate!) - only to discover that the world in question is the devastated homeworld of the Gith.
#11 rekko Sep 06, 2008 16:34:00	Wow, this is deep thought design. What could be the goal of the Gith society? Finding some deserted world in the Astral Sea and make it their new home? Stealing one for their own, and make innocent suffer their curse in their place? Trying to protect other worlds from suffering like them? Trying to regain their home world and, if possible, reestablish it the way it was? Make the Daelkyrs pay, eliminate them? What is the Gith reaction towards the Kalashtar and the Dreaming Dark? What could be the Gith reaction in front of Cyran refugees? True, their world wasn't destroyed, but they did lost everything, or almost. Aside from the Gith, what other creature would you see as having their own world (destroyed or not by Daelkyrs)? Or what other creatures were living with the Gith? Rekko
#12 Hellcow Sep 06, 2008 17:03:13	What could be the goal of the Gith society? Finding some deserted world in the Astral Sea and make it their new home? Stealing one for their own, and make innocent suffer their curse in their place? Trying to protect other worlds from suffering like them? Trying to regain their home world and, if possible, reestablish it the way it was? Make the Daelkyrs pay, eliminate them? This could easily be the subject of an article in its own right, as I'd want to give them depth and a strong role in the campaign. I would personally maintain the philosophical divide between the Githyanki and the Githzerai, making the Githyanki the militant force who seek to conquer others - regaining their own sense of strength and power by dominating others. The Githzerai remain more philosophical, looking at the destruction of their world as a stage in the evolution of their race and culture - In this, I could actually see them following the Traveler and being agents of change and disruption in the world, spreading chaos not for personal gain or out of malice but to force their victims to rise to new challenges (of course, while they might be agents of change, I'd see their actions as less brutal and absolute than the daelkyr). I would thus see the Githzerai as believing that planar exploration and colonization is part of the destiny of mortals - with the Githyanki conversely being more interested in the conquest of new worlds within the material plane. With that said, I'd see both as still harboring a bitter hatred for Xoriat and its creatures. The Githzerai might embrace change and evolution - but not the pure horror and madness of Xoriat. As such, I'd expect the Githzerai to encourage the kalashtar or Cyran to draw strength from their hardship, to create something new and stronger than what came before... and for the Githyanki to see them as failed weaklings who must either learn to fight or be crushed. Aside from the Gith, what other creature would you see as having their own world (destroyed or not by Daelkyrs)? Or what other creatures were living with the Gith? I've never gone through the Monster Manuals and made a list. I'm sure there's others that fit the category. I don't know that there need to have been other (sentient) creatures living with the Gith; while Eberron may be a Mos Eisley cantina of sentient races, I don't see why GithWorld couldn't be more like our world, with Gith in the role of humanity. With that said, an interesting option would be to say that there were dragons on GithWorld - that there are, in fact, dragons on ALL worlds in the material plane. If this is the case, the Githyanki-red dragon alliance could be maintained, but based on the idea that the dragons in question are not from Eberron at all, but rather from GithWorld - raising the interesting question of how they interact with their distant cousins of Argonnessen, and if you could have a crazy Gith/Dragon infiltration of the Chamber. And, it further raises the question of what happens when you let a daelkyr play with a hundred dragons...
#13 rekko Sep 06, 2008 17:43:33	And, it further raises the question of what happens when you let a daelkyr play with a hundred dragons... Why do I think of Tiamat all of a sudden? With that said, an interesting option would be to say that there were dragons on GithWorld - that there are, in fact, dragons on ALL worlds in the material plane. If this is the case, the Githyanki-red dragon alliance could be maintained, but based on the idea that the dragons in question are not from Eberron at all, but rather from GithWorld - raising the interesting question of how they interact with their distant cousins of Argonnessen, and if you could have a crazy Gith/Dragon infiltration of the Chamber. Well, first, there isn't very much info on the Red Dragon Githyanki path beside that the dragons tend to agree more easily to let the Githyanki ride them. Did the pact was made when the Gith races were still one unique race? If so, do the Githzerai get to ride red dragons too? Or only the Githyankis continued to honor the pact? What was the pact for? Was it made before, during or after the Daelkyr GithWorld invasion-destruction? If the Dragons were on GithWorld, does it mean the Prophecy reaches that far? Did the Dragons of Argonnessen discover the other worlds and travelled to them to fully understand the Prophecy. Or did Siberys created Dragons in all worlds somehow connected with each other. Or are the dragon of other world not interested in the Prophecy at all? Githyanki the militant force who seek to conquer others - regaining their own sense of strength and power by dominating others. I like this. It reminds me of V for Vendetta. "What they've done to me was monstrous. -And you've become a monster" Without wanting it, the Githyanki are become more like their hatred malefactor. Might be a good adventure/campaign for PCs to reason the Githyanki society and putting all this military force to better use. All of this while Githzerai are serious and dedicated trainers for the innocents in front of change. However, some Githzerai could be more violent than others and put their victims in scenarios similar to those found in the Saw movies. Rekko
#14 Gilo Sep 06, 2008 18:34:20	Did the Dragons of Argonnessen discover the other worlds and travelled to them to fully understand the Prophecy. I remember an old Dragonlance novel in which the heroes travel to one of the moons using a gnomish airship and find a Dragon living there. The idea was that there is breathable air in "space" - so if you have flying capabilities you can at least get to the moons and possibly other planets (distance will probably be an issue) - is Eberron space similar? I like this. It reminds me of V for Vendetta. For a second there I thought you where going to refer to the 1983 t.v series "V". V spoiler A seemingly benevolent alien race forces Earth into fascist rule. In Los Angeles, a brilliant medical student unintentionally becomes the leader of one of the world's most effective resistance movements against the invaders. With the help of an intrepid journalist and a motley group of people from different walks of life united in the cause, they help to reveal the secret of the Visitors--who turn out to be a reptilian race--and aid in the global effort to save Earth for future generations.
#15 Hellcow Sep 06, 2008 18:42:04	Is Eberron space similar? I doubt that you'll ever see any official source stating that it is, but nothing's stopping you from making it that way if you want it to be.
#16 Gilo Sep 07, 2008 3:15:35	I don't think I'll be sending my PCs to space anytime soon - there is still allot to do on the surface of Eberron (and the planes) before that. tho a hook like: "House Lyrandar have lost contact with his (geosynchronous) mining complex on the Siberys ring. the last report mentioned something about winged Kobolds. " sounds tempting (and those ancient Druid observatories can come in handy). Thanks Keith for taking the time and gives us this insight into Gith ecology (especially with all those deadlines you mentioned having).
#17 rauric Sep 07, 2008 6:04:56	I like the idea about Eldritch devices that send players to different planets. I want to play a Githyanki now also from reading this. :D
#18 That_Blasted_Somoflange Sep 09, 2008 11:25:05	I know it flies in the face of what was written, but how I treat the Githyanki and Githzerai is similar, to those who are familiar with it, to the Ur-Quan Kzer-Za and Khor-Ah. These races from star control 2 were enslaved but threw off the shackles of slavery but had divergent ideas. One wanted to wipe out all sentient life, while the other wanted to enslave it. So, I use the Githyanki coming to the world to wipe out all life, so the daelkyr have nothing to corrupt. The Githzerai seeking to cut off all planar travel, which has devastating effects on the world - no access to the other planes, such as Dal Quar, Thelanis, etc. Magic is altered, and the world saved, though stuck in their own little 'dimension' Trapped forever.
#19 davethebrave371 Sep 12, 2008 20:28:38	All this has sparked some interesting thoughts...is Eberron just one world that interacts with the myriad planes, or is it the current world interacting with the 13 planes? If every star has planets that all interact with the planes, that's a lot different from a sort of..."chosen" planet. It also begs the question...if lycanthropes retreated to Lammania on Eberron, what creatures might have retreated to other planes from other worlds before the birth of Siberys, Eberron and Khyber? Or, if all the planes are in various states of coterminousity (it's a word now) with every planet at every star, are there constantly new species and what have you being introduced to the inter-planar milieu? And most fascinating to me, what does all this have to do with the Progenitor myths, the Draconic deities as constellations, the Sovereign Host, and for that matter any form of religion centered around Dolurrh? The Silver Flame would obviously be pretty Eberron unique. And what about the concepts of a creating force...is every planet a draconic creation, or is Eberron special in that regard? How far-reaching was the influence of the Progenitors prior to the creation of Eberron? This is especially interesting to ponder vis a vis this thread and others like it.
#20 Hellcow Sep 12, 2008 23:01:19	And most fascinating to me, what does all this have to do with the Progenitor myths... The Progenitors are said to have created the planes. I'd likewise assume that they are commonly held to have created the stars... and presumably the other planets that might be out there. However, it is Eberron that actually has the Ring of Siberys, said to be the actual remains of Siberys; and where you are said to actually have Eberron containing Khyber, and beings such as Tiamat, the Daughter of Khyber. So, I'd say that ONE interpretation of this is exactly that. Eberron IS the chosen planet, because among other things it is the LAST planet - it's not simply created BY the Progenitors, as the other worlds were, but rather created FROM the Progenitors. As such, I'd expect Eberron to have a stronger tie to the Prophecy, and also say that this justifies the incredible diversity of life found on Eberron - both the natural creatures (gnolls, orcs, goblins, humans, elves, dwarves, dragonborn, etc, etc, etc) and rakshasas and the like. Which is why I'd suggest that Githworld would actually be much closer to OUR world - with the Gith as the dominant species taking the place of humanity, and few other intelligent species challenging them. Essentially, these "created worlds" would have a tighter focus - while Eberron's diversity is in part due to the fact that it is the actual world OF Eberron - the source of life itself. But all of this, of course, assumes that you take the view that the Progenitors actually existed in a literal sense, and aren't simply a metaphor for creation.
#21 davethebrave371 Sep 12, 2008 23:16:12	Of course, that metaphor might still hold true in terms of what is chosen by prophecy and why there is diversity. For example, if these forces of creation are only symbolic, they still all converged on the single point of Eberron after creating everything else. So even if they were just some triune of cosmic energies, mindless and accidentally creating things, I think your version can still hold true. Oh, and an aside, these archived threads are good too: http://forums.gleemax.com/archive/index.php/t-1056248.html and http://forums.gleemax.com/wotc_archive/index.php/t-968227 are just as good as my original link to http://forums.gleemax.com/wotc_archive/index.php/t-984802 I wish these were still active, they are truly shining examples of the Eberron boards coming together and making some AMAZING.

Post/Author/DateTime

Post

zombiegleemax

Sep 04, 2008 13:36:50

How do they fit into the setting?

Arcane_Guyver

Sep 04, 2008 16:05:55

They're the refugees of one of the many worlds the daelkyr have destroyed. They're pretty rare in Eberron, often in out-of-the-way locations. Save for the githyanki's deal with red dragons, they pretty much act the way they normally do in Eberron.

aseran

Sep 04, 2008 20:48:57

It's also noted (in Races of Eberron, I think it was) that between 'zerai and 'yanki, there isn't so much open hostility as a sort of sullen rivalry; little violence, but the same sort of cold disapproval that members of different religious denominations might feel for one another--it's not as if they're forced to share the same living space.

They will, on occasion, get together to go a-daelkyr slayin' all the same.

rauric

Sep 04, 2008 21:23:55

I placed some "yankis" in the mountains near New Cyre in my game. Their is an area in those mountains that contain a great Dalkyr lord and they created
citadal that protects the seals of the overlords prison.

I made them very xenophobic since an illithid is always sending spies to enter the citadal. He uses adventurers to try and break into the place all of the time. He also uses his minions (Keepers from Fiend Folio) to capture gith scouts and steal their memories. Anyone that is a scout has never been near the inner level of the citadal so they cannot leak any info to the illithid.
Only an elite few can enter the inner sanctum of their citadal and they may never leave the walls of their "home".

rekko

Sep 05, 2008 8:07:49

From the Eberron Expanded article on Lords of Madness

Eberron is not the first world that the daelkyr have attacked. It is possible that the mind flayers were created when the daelkyr destroyed the native world of the gith races. If so, the githzerai and githyanki are descendants of those few survivors who fled to Kythri and the Astral Plane, while the mind flayers are descended from survivors of the progenitor race who were twisted in the same manner as the dolgaunts and dolgrims.

I don't recall any information on the Gith races in an Eberron book except for that small entry on page 123 of Player's Guide to Eberron. However, it contradicts the article. And both were written by Keith Baker.

This would be a good question to ask Hellcow.

Rekko

romulus_lonewolf

Sep 05, 2008 19:16:07

Just thought of a way to have the Githyanki/Red Dragon pact in Eberron.. Namely, the Githyanki allied themselves with a powerful Red Dragon member of the Chamber. In essence, it's a pact of mutual cooperation where the Githyanki and members of that Dragon's brood aid one another to deal with Cults of the Dragon Below and their Aberration servitors, especially the Illithids.

Hellcow

Sep 06, 2008 1:52:35

I don't recall any information on the Gith races in an Eberron book except for that small entry on page 123 of Player's Guide to Eberron. However, it contradicts the article. And both were written by Keith Baker.

Quite a few people worked on the PGtE, and I didn't work on that particular section of the book. So the Eberron Expanded article reflects how *I* run things; the PGtE mention is an alternate view.

rekko

Sep 06, 2008 7:01:44

Thanks Keith.

If we go down a route similar to yours, how do you suggest we handle the "Gith came from another world destroyed by Daelkyr" part?

Is the other world Xoriat? As in the Daelkyr conquered the plane and twisted everything to their own tastes. Or more in the line of Sigil, the city of doors? Or only very far if you lose your way in the Astral plane?

Rekko

stagnation_dup

Sep 06, 2008 10:15:11

They also get mentioned in the Explorers Handbook, which is traditionally taken as "more" true to canon than PGTE is.

#10

Hellcow

Sep 06, 2008 14:09:34

If we go down a route similar to yours, how do you suggest we handle the "Gith came from another world destroyed by Daelkyr" part? Is the other world Xoriat?

There's stars in the night sky of Eberron - and as such, it's reasonable to assume that there are other worlds in the material plane. What's said in the ECS is that "for the daelkyr, destroying worlds appears to be a form of art." Note "worldS" there, which was no accident; in my opinion, it's something they've been doing since the dawn of time, and there may be dozens of broken worlds out there.

The principle behind this is that the daelkyr created the illithids when they destroyed the Gith world - that illithids are to Gith as dolgaunts are to hobgoblins. As such, the Gith hate the daelkyr for destroying their world - and they despise the illithids because they are the embodiment of their failure and the tool of their destruction. My goal with this was to keep the Gith-flayer rivalry, but true to the general principles of Eberron, to explore a new direction with it (just as the Aereni are different from elves of other settings). The flayers serve the daelkyr. The daelkyr destroy worlds and transform the inhabitants. The Gith hate the flayers. And so it goes.

By comparison, the ExH simply says "The mind flayers invaded created the gith as slaves." First, this shows a flawed understanding of the setting; the flayers were the lieutenants of the invading force, not its commanders. Second, it gives very little depth to the Gith, and essentially just makes them additional Dolgaunts (even suggesting that they might have been created from goblin stock). My version takes the idea that the Gith have a culture far older than that of Galifar, but that they have seen their world destroyed and are now refugees clinging to their planar sanctums... and gives them an interesting motivation, as they hate Xoriat most of all, but at the same time have to feel bitter jealousy towards the world that survived when theirs fell. Beyond this, it does mean that there are broken worlds waiting to be found; perhaps a scholar at the Arcane Congress will hire players to test an eldritch machine that teleports people to other worlds (Stargate!) - only to discover that the world in question is the devastated homeworld of the Gith.

#11

rekko

Sep 06, 2008 16:34:00

Wow, this is deep thought design.

What could be the goal of the Gith society? Finding some deserted world in the Astral Sea and make it their new home? Stealing one for their own, and make innocent suffer their curse in their place? Trying to protect other worlds from suffering like them? Trying to regain their home world and, if possible, reestablish it the way it was? Make the Daelkyrs pay, eliminate them?

What is the Gith reaction towards the Kalashtar and the Dreaming Dark?

What could be the Gith reaction in front of Cyran refugees? True, their world wasn't destroyed, but they did lost everything, or almost.

Aside from the Gith, what other creature would you see as having their own world (destroyed or not by Daelkyrs)? Or what other creatures were living with the Gith?

Rekko

#12

Hellcow

Sep 06, 2008 17:03:13

What could be the goal of the Gith society? Finding some deserted world in the Astral Sea and make it their new home? Stealing one for their own, and make innocent suffer their curse in their place? Trying to protect other worlds from suffering like them? Trying to regain their home world and, if possible, reestablish it the way it was? Make the Daelkyrs pay, eliminate them?

This could easily be the subject of an article in its own right, as I'd want to give them depth and a strong role in the campaign. I would personally maintain the philosophical divide between the Githyanki and the Githzerai, making the Githyanki the militant force who seek to conquer others - regaining their own sense of strength and power by dominating others. The Githzerai remain more philosophical, looking at the destruction of their world as a stage in the evolution of their race and culture - In this, I could actually see them following the Traveler and being agents of change and disruption in the world, spreading chaos not for personal gain or out of malice but to force their victims to rise to new challenges (of course, while they might be agents of change, I'd see their actions as less brutal and absolute than the daelkyr). I would thus see the Githzerai as believing that planar exploration and colonization is part of the destiny of mortals - with the Githyanki conversely being more interested in the conquest of new worlds within the material plane. With that said, I'd see both as still harboring a bitter hatred for Xoriat and its creatures. The Githzerai might embrace change and evolution - but not the pure horror and madness of Xoriat.

As such, I'd expect the Githzerai to encourage the kalashtar or Cyran to draw strength from their hardship, to create something new and stronger than what came before... and for the Githyanki to see them as failed weaklings who must either learn to fight or be crushed.

Aside from the Gith, what other creature would you see as having their own world (destroyed or not by Daelkyrs)? Or what other creatures were living with the Gith?

I've never gone through the Monster Manuals and made a list. I'm sure there's others that fit the category. I don't know that there need to have been other (sentient) creatures living with the Gith; while Eberron may be a Mos Eisley cantina of sentient races, I don't see why GithWorld couldn't be more like our world, with Gith in the role of humanity.

With that said, an interesting option would be to say that there were dragons on GithWorld - that there are, in fact, dragons on ALL worlds in the material plane. If this is the case, the Githyanki-red dragon alliance could be maintained, but based on the idea that the dragons in question are not from Eberron at all, but rather from GithWorld - raising the interesting question of how they interact with their distant cousins of Argonnessen, and if you could have a crazy Gith/Dragon infiltration of the Chamber.

And, it further raises the question of what happens when you let a daelkyr play with a hundred dragons...

#13

rekko

Sep 06, 2008 17:43:33

And, it further raises the question of what happens when you let a daelkyr play with a hundred dragons...

Why do I think of Tiamat all of a sudden?

With that said, an interesting option would be to say that there were dragons on GithWorld - that there are, in fact, dragons on ALL worlds in the material plane. If this is the case, the Githyanki-red dragon alliance could be maintained, but based on the idea that the dragons in question are not from Eberron at all, but rather from GithWorld - raising the interesting question of how they interact with their distant cousins of Argonnessen, and if you could have a crazy Gith/Dragon infiltration of the Chamber.

Well, first, there isn't very much info on the Red Dragon Githyanki path beside that the dragons tend to agree more easily to let the Githyanki ride them. Did the pact was made when the Gith races were still one unique race? If so, do the Githzerai get to ride red dragons too? Or only the Githyankis continued to honor the pact? What was the pact for? Was it made before, during or after the Daelkyr GithWorld invasion-destruction?

If the Dragons were on GithWorld, does it mean the Prophecy reaches that far? Did the Dragons of Argonnessen discover the other worlds and travelled to them to fully understand the Prophecy. Or did Siberys created Dragons in all worlds somehow connected with each other. Or are the dragon of other world not interested in the Prophecy at all?

Githyanki the militant force who seek to conquer others - regaining their own sense of strength and power by dominating others.

I like this. It reminds me of V for Vendetta. "What they've done to me was monstrous. -And you've become a monster" Without wanting it, the Githyanki are become more like their hatred malefactor. Might be a good adventure/campaign for PCs to reason the Githyanki society and putting all this military force to better use.

All of this while Githzerai are serious and dedicated trainers for the innocents in front of change. However, some Githzerai could be more violent than others and put their victims in scenarios similar to those found in the Saw movies.

Rekko

#14

Gilo

Sep 06, 2008 18:34:20

Did the Dragons of Argonnessen discover the other worlds and travelled to them to fully understand the Prophecy.

I remember an old Dragonlance novel in which the heroes travel to one of the moons using a gnomish airship and find a Dragon living there. The idea was that there is breathable air in "space" - so if you have flying capabilities you can at least get to the moons and possibly other planets (distance will probably be an issue)
- is Eberron space similar?

I like this. It reminds me of V for Vendetta.

For a second there I thought you where going to refer to the 1983 t.v series "V".

V spoiler

A seemingly benevolent alien race forces Earth into fascist rule. In Los Angeles, a brilliant medical student unintentionally becomes the leader of one of the world's most effective resistance movements against the invaders. With the help of an intrepid journalist and a motley group of people from different walks of life united in the cause, they help to reveal the secret of the Visitors--who turn out to be a reptilian race--and aid in the global effort to save Earth for future generations.

#15

Hellcow

Sep 06, 2008 18:42:04

Is Eberron space similar?

I doubt that you'll ever see any official source stating that it is, but nothing's stopping you from making it that way if you want it to be.

#16

Gilo

Sep 07, 2008 3:15:35

I don't think I'll be sending my PCs to space anytime soon - there is still allot to do on the surface of Eberron (and the planes) before that.
tho a hook like: "House Lyrandar have lost contact with his (geosynchronous) mining complex on the Siberys ring. the last report mentioned something about winged Kobolds.

"
sounds tempting (and those ancient Druid observatories can come in handy).

Thanks Keith for taking the time and gives us this insight into Gith ecology (especially with all those deadlines you mentioned having).

#17

rauric

Sep 07, 2008 6:04:56

I like the idea about Eldritch devices that send players to different planets.
I want to play a Githyanki now also from reading this. :D

#18

That_Blasted_Somoflange

Sep 09, 2008 11:25:05

I know it flies in the face of what was written, but how I treat the Githyanki and Githzerai is similar, to those who are familiar with it, to the Ur-Quan Kzer-Za and Khor-Ah. These races from star control 2 were enslaved but threw off the shackles of slavery but had divergent ideas. One wanted to wipe out all sentient life, while the other wanted to enslave it.

So, I use the Githyanki coming to the world to wipe out all life, so the daelkyr have nothing to corrupt. The Githzerai seeking to cut off all planar travel, which has devastating effects on the world - no access to the other planes, such as Dal Quar, Thelanis, etc. Magic is altered, and the world saved, though stuck in their own little 'dimension' Trapped forever.

#19

davethebrave371

Sep 12, 2008 20:28:38

All this has sparked some interesting thoughts...is Eberron just one world that interacts with the myriad planes, or is it the current world interacting with the 13 planes? If every star has planets that all interact with the planes, that's a lot different from a sort of..."chosen" planet. It also begs the question...if lycanthropes retreated to Lammania on Eberron, what creatures might have retreated to other planes from other worlds before the birth of Siberys, Eberron and Khyber? Or, if all the planes are in various states of coterminousity (it's a word now) with every planet at every star, are there constantly new species and what have you being introduced to the inter-planar milieu?

And most fascinating to me, what does all this have to do with the Progenitor myths, the Draconic deities as constellations, the Sovereign Host, and for that matter any form of religion centered around Dolurrh? The Silver Flame would obviously be pretty Eberron unique. And what about the concepts of a creating force...is every planet a draconic creation, or is Eberron special in that regard? How far-reaching was the influence of the Progenitors prior to the creation of Eberron?

This is especially interesting to ponder vis a vis this thread and others like it.

#20

Hellcow

Sep 12, 2008 23:01:19

And most fascinating to me, what does all this have to do with the Progenitor myths...

The Progenitors are said to have created the planes. I'd likewise assume that they are commonly held to have created the stars... and presumably the other planets that might be out there. However, it is Eberron that actually has the Ring of Siberys, said to be the actual remains of Siberys; and where you are said to actually have Eberron containing Khyber, and beings such as Tiamat, the Daughter of Khyber.

So, I'd say that ONE interpretation of this is exactly that. Eberron IS the chosen planet, because among other things it is the LAST planet - it's not simply created BY the Progenitors, as the other worlds were, but rather created FROM the Progenitors. As such, I'd expect Eberron to have a stronger tie to the Prophecy, and also say that this justifies the incredible diversity of life found on Eberron - both the natural creatures (gnolls, orcs, goblins, humans, elves, dwarves, dragonborn, etc, etc, etc) and rakshasas and the like. Which is why I'd suggest that Githworld would actually be much closer to OUR world - with the Gith as the dominant species taking the place of humanity, and few other intelligent species challenging them. Essentially, these "created worlds" would have a tighter focus - while Eberron's diversity is in part due to the fact that it is the actual world OF Eberron - the source of life itself.

But all of this, of course, assumes that you take the view that the Progenitors actually existed in a literal sense, and aren't simply a metaphor for creation.

#21

davethebrave371

Sep 12, 2008 23:16:12

Of course, that metaphor might still hold true in terms of what is chosen by prophecy and why there is diversity. For example, if these forces of creation are only symbolic, they still all converged on the single point of Eberron after creating everything else. So even if they were just some triune of cosmic energies, mindless and accidentally creating things, I think your version can still hold true.

Oh, and an aside, these archived threads are good too: http://forums.gleemax.com/archive/index.php/t-1056248.html and http://forums.gleemax.com/wotc_archive/index.php/t-968227 are just as good as my original link to http://forums.gleemax.com/wotc_archive/index.php/t-984802

I wish these were still active, they are truly shining examples of the Eberron boards coming together and making some AMAZING.