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More educated PCs

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
AvonRekaes
Jun 17, 2009 13:48:41 One of my favorite feats from the 3e ECS was Education . It gave you two knowledge skills to be trained it, and gave you a +1 bonus to each. It really helped me create PCs and NPCs that felt more modern, or helped me broaden their scope easily. A fighter was no longer relegated to being the dumb meat shield. He could have Knowledge History and Knowledge the Planes under his belt and be fairly good at each.

I want to get some of this feel back in 4e. Coupled with the tighter limit on languages, I feel like asking for two feats to learn another language and another skill is a bit much.

I glanced through the Backgrounds in the EPG, and it doesn't sound like they have one for "Graguated from a higher learning institution". Regardless, I'm unsure if I want to assign this to a background.

(Part of me is also mad that Eberron backgrounds are weaker than FR backgrounds, on par with the generic backgrounds in PHB2. I don't particularly mind the absence of esoteric bonii like "+2 saves vs. fear", but I really liked the FR and Scales of War backgrounds that provided bonii to two skills at once. I may houserule that Eberron backgrounds don't make you choose between associated skills, you just get both of them.)

Anyway, I want to do something like...

"Pick 2 benefits from the following list: Learn a language, training in History, training in Arcana, training in Dungeoneering, training in Nature, training in Religion"

As a feat or a background or whatever. Call it "Education", after the 3.5 feat.
#2
ChrisTheS
Jun 17, 2009 19:37:41 I rule that instead of choosing a language associated with your background INSTEAD of getting a benefit, you automatically get any languages associated with your background that you can justify to the GM. Languages are not hard to acquire if one learns them by exposure - and particularly, someone who takes the 'raised among a different race' background should not have to sacrifice their minor skill benefit to gain a language that by all reason should be considered their native tongue.

Sorry if I sound a bit... warm about this, but language is a subject upon which I have strong opinions.

---

Oh, I also agree that PH2 and EPG backgrounds are rather pathetic in comparison to the FRPG and generic SoW ones, which I had lauded as being what the bloody 'background feats' should have been in 3e. I include the option 'gain a +1 in 2 instead of a +2 in one, and add both to your class skill list.'
#3
superdeadsmurf
Jun 17, 2009 20:56:42 There is a general background in the PHB2, Occupation: Scholar, lets you get Arcana or Religion (not history? REALLY?)

But yeah, the background you mentioned, with Language, Nature, Arcana, History or Religion. is completely fair.

My current house rule with backgrounds (because I have a Genasi ported from FR with a FR background) is gain two of the normal benefits (these do no stack so you can't pick +2 to stealth twice) for general backgrounds.

Right now I have a player with a changeling passer bard (being a Half-Elf) with Occupation: Infiltrator (from Dragon Mag), to get the Language (and bonus to bluff); A Drow rogue, raised in Breland and working for the Dark lanterns as a spy, took the Occupation: Hired Killer for Drow Sign language and Stealth; My house phiarlan Elf Wizard Illusionist took occupation Entertainer, he really wants to just be PT Barnum. The Warforged in my group wanted to wait to get the EPG to pick his background, so that will happen this weekend. :D
#4
AvonRekaes
Jun 17, 2009 21:59:50 Yeah, that seems like the best solution. Pick two benefits, they don't stack.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 AvonRekaes Jun 17, 2009 13:48:41	One of my favorite feats from the 3e ECS was Education . It gave you two knowledge skills to be trained it, and gave you a +1 bonus to each. It really helped me create PCs and NPCs that felt more modern, or helped me broaden their scope easily. A fighter was no longer relegated to being the dumb meat shield. He could have Knowledge History and Knowledge the Planes under his belt and be fairly good at each. I want to get some of this feel back in 4e. Coupled with the tighter limit on languages, I feel like asking for two feats to learn another language and another skill is a bit much. I glanced through the Backgrounds in the EPG, and it doesn't sound like they have one for "Graguated from a higher learning institution". Regardless, I'm unsure if I want to assign this to a background. (Part of me is also mad that Eberron backgrounds are weaker than FR backgrounds, on par with the generic backgrounds in PHB2. I don't particularly mind the absence of esoteric bonii like "+2 saves vs. fear", but I really liked the FR and Scales of War backgrounds that provided bonii to two skills at once. I may houserule that Eberron backgrounds don't make you choose between associated skills, you just get both of them.) Anyway, I want to do something like... "Pick 2 benefits from the following list: Learn a language, training in History, training in Arcana, training in Dungeoneering, training in Nature, training in Religion" As a feat or a background or whatever. Call it "Education", after the 3.5 feat.
#2 ChrisTheS Jun 17, 2009 19:37:41	I rule that instead of choosing a language associated with your background INSTEAD of getting a benefit, you automatically get any languages associated with your background that you can justify to the GM. Languages are not hard to acquire if one learns them by exposure - and particularly, someone who takes the 'raised among a different race' background should not have to sacrifice their minor skill benefit to gain a language that by all reason should be considered their native tongue. Sorry if I sound a bit... warm about this, but language is a subject upon which I have strong opinions. --- Oh, I also agree that PH2 and EPG backgrounds are rather pathetic in comparison to the FRPG and generic SoW ones, which I had lauded as being what the bloody 'background feats' should have been in 3e. I include the option 'gain a +1 in 2 instead of a +2 in one, and add both to your class skill list.'
#3 superdeadsmurf Jun 17, 2009 20:56:42	There is a general background in the PHB2, Occupation: Scholar, lets you get Arcana or Religion (not history? REALLY?) But yeah, the background you mentioned, with Language, Nature, Arcana, History or Religion. is completely fair. My current house rule with backgrounds (because I have a Genasi ported from FR with a FR background) is gain two of the normal benefits (these do no stack so you can't pick +2 to stealth twice) for general backgrounds. Right now I have a player with a changeling passer bard (being a Half-Elf) with Occupation: Infiltrator (from Dragon Mag), to get the Language (and bonus to bluff); A Drow rogue, raised in Breland and working for the Dark lanterns as a spy, took the Occupation: Hired Killer for Drow Sign language and Stealth; My house phiarlan Elf Wizard Illusionist took occupation Entertainer, he really wants to just be PT Barnum. The Warforged in my group wanted to wait to get the EPG to pick his background, so that will happen this weekend. :D
#4 AvonRekaes Jun 17, 2009 21:59:50	Yeah, that seems like the best solution. Pick two benefits, they don't stack.