Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 tufrat Dec 03, 2010 14:53:48	My campaign is about to get a lot more travel-oriented, and the cost/speed of travel are a significant decision for the party, since the campaign is proceeding against a calendar with critical dates attached. The party has also reached a point that they can afford Airship travel and Teleportation circles. The ECS doesn't list docking sites or circle locations, and I can appreciate why that is. But I'm looking to make a few reasonable generalizations based on the map of Khorvaire. Can I say that every capital has a docking tower and an Orien Circle? What about every city, or every city in the five nations and every capital in Khorvaire?  I'm not looking for the answer that says, "you're the DM, so you can do what you need to." I know that. I'm more interested in how other DM's have tackled it or if there's a better indication someplace that I can use as a guide? Also, did I read correctly that the players can pay for the priviledege of using an Orien circle to jump to any circle for which they have the address, or they can pay House Orien to perform the ritual to jump to any other Orien circle, but because House Orien protects their teleportation circles, the players cannot jump to a House Orien circle by themselves? Can anyone tell me how House Orien protects the circles? I've always imagined a teleportation circle as inscribed on the ground in a big room or plaza...
#2 aeryk08 Dec 03, 2010 15:33:31	I ran across this airship route map by MephitJames that seems to make sense, except I don't think Valenar and Aerenal would be that popular.  You might add a few more for convenience that don't travel as regularly, maybe once/week or once/month.  I would also think smaller airships could be chartered, for a substantial fee, to make special trips.  I would think every major city would have a docking tower, but I'm sure other arrangements could be made if needed.  Something as simple as a rope ladder would work in a pinch. mephitjames.wikidot.com/airship-routes
#3 Juums Dec 03, 2010 15:45:19	My rule of thumb, at least with regard to the Five Nations, is that if a settlement is big enough to appear on the map, it's big enough to be serviced by an airship route. (That said, there're bound to be radically different service schedules: Moonwatch might only get an airship once every three weeks, while Sharn probably has an airship departing once every few hours.) I always thought the operations in smaller settlements would be rather ramshackle: Basically two- or three-story affairs that grant just enough clearance for the airship to dock without touching the ground, rather than the high-faluting docks like The Pole from Explorer's Handbook. Beyond the Five Nations, I'd say penetration of equal depth into the Mror Holds and Zilargo is probably appropriate. Beyond that, an airship dock in every capital of the remaining states of Khovaire works well enough, though I have a hard time seeing such a dock existing in Droamm or the Shadow Marches.
#4 tufrat Dec 03, 2010 17:44:43	What about House Orien Teleportation Circles? *Edited, Confused Sivis with Orien*
#5 ranadiel Dec 04, 2010 5:03:25	What about House Sivis Teleportation Circles? I don't think there are any...Now House Orien, they have teleportation circles. As for your questions, you have to remember that Linked Portal is a ritual that was only recently developed by House Orien. So it probably doesn't have the best developed infrastucture supporting it yet. I personally would figure that most places that have a Hosue Orien enclave have a circle as House Orien is trying to move towards teleportation being the next major form of transportation. There might be additonal circles any place where someone has payed to have a circle installed, but other than private retreats I can't imagine this adding too many locations to the teleportation network. For how the circles are protected, that likely depends on how common you want to have the linked protal ritual. As I mentioned earlier, teleportation was recently developed. That could mean that right now it is only protected by the fact that no one outside of the house knows the ritual. On the otherhand they could have House policies require that a House Orien member goes with anyone going through a circle in order to verify that the person has paid any travel fees. I imagine they probably have guards around the circle and you could add magical wards to prevent travel in from any non-approved circle but that might imply teleportation is a bit more advanced than I personally think it should be.
#6 AvonRekaes Dec 04, 2010 15:13:42	I think a lot of people forget the little details of how the Linked Portal ritual actually works. It doesn't require a permanent circle to start the teleport, it only needs one as the destination. With this in mind, it becomes clear that House Orien doesn't protect it's teleportation circles by directing their defenses outward, but rather inward, facing the circle. They charge for use of the circle upon arrival, not departure. The Linked Portal ritual allows you to sketch a temporary circle out of chalks and ink, for a one-use teleport to a permanent circle. So a group of adventurers stuck in Khyber after a cave-in have a one-way ticket to any permanent circle they know the address of. They cast the ritual, move into the temporary circle, and show up in a Orien circle that they know the address of. I imagine a House Orien enclave specifically constructed as the endpoint to Linked Portal teleportation operates much like an airport. Security is visible but courteous, and there are also amenities and comforts readily available. (Bars, Gold Dragon Inns, shopping both adventurous  and luxurious). It's just that unlike an airport, security is facing inward. You're not allowed to leave the enclave (and most likely reach the amenities) until you pay the fare.
#7 Ogiwan Dec 04, 2010 16:02:38	Actually, thinking about it, if the Linked Portal ritual is a recent innovation, it might represent a concerted effort on the part of Orien to "bring down" the Teleport of the Mark of Syberis. That was poorly worded, but here's my thinking: A lot of rituals in Eberron were developed because people wanted to do the same thing as the guy with the Dragonmark, but without the 'mark. So, they develop rituals to mirror those effects. I think that its safe to say that, magic being magic, 'marks have an advantage performing these rituals too, but the fact is that people without 'marks can perform these feats too. Now, Orien is in kinda a slump because not only is Lyrander taking a lot of the really rich passengers out of Orien coaches and putting them in airships, but the Lightning Rail lines that once crossed Khorvaire have been splintered, and Orien just doesn't have the ability to rebuild something like the White Arch Bridge, or figure out a way to cross Southern Khorvaire. So, they're putting money into research and development. Now, using the 3.5 ECS, the only real long-distance powers the Mark of Passage has are Overland Flight and Teleport.  I'm fairly sure that Teleport is the one the House cares about, because that can bamf 1 Medium creature with gear per three character levels. The downside is that there is a chance the caster will land off-target. Only with Greater Teleport, a Syberis power, do they land on target every time. Well, Linked Portal represents a massive improvement over even Greater Teleport, and if you use a permanent circle as a start point, you reduce the cost to 50gp. For instantaneous transportation. Why is Orien having problems with Lyrander? Hell, its quite possible that, by using Linked Portal, Orien could develop an international postal system the equal of our current one. Linked Portal to move stuff from major node to major node (Sharn to Korth, for example), and then more mundane couriers from there. Plus, combine it with Sivis communications, and you can get documents anywhere in the world within hours. Hmmm. Maybe the Mourning was a botched Orien experiment trying to establish permanent, always-open portals? Anyways. My major concern (I don't know if the OP has this concern as well) is that Linked Portal makes the familiar "red line on a map" travel montage obsolete once the PCs get a few hundred GP.
#8 ranadiel Dec 05, 2010 4:35:06	I think a lot of people forget the little details of how the Linked Portal ritual actually works. It doesn't require a permanent circle to start the teleport, it only needs one as the destination. With this in mind, it becomes clear that House Orien doesn't protect it's teleportation circles by directing their defenses outward, but rather inward, facing the circle. They charge for use of the circle upon arrival, not departure. The Linked Portal ritual allows you to sketch a temporary circle out of chalks and ink, for a one-use teleport to a permanent circle. So a group of adventurers stuck in Khyber after a cave-in have a one-way ticket to any permanent circle they know the address of. They cast the ritual, move into the temporary circle, and show up in a Orien circle that they know the address of. Well I personally was thinking that if you were going from one house to another house, you would pay up front(to make sure that you can afford the travel), then a House Orien member takes a group of people going to the same destination through the portal and verifies that the people have paid. However if show up without the proper paperwork or a House Orien member who can verify that you paid, then they charge you any travel fees at the destination and probably a penalty fee as well.
#9 AvonRekaes Dec 05, 2010 11:09:56	I believe it was stated that they charge for the use of a permanent circle to begin your teleport, as well as the teleport itself. I could see them charging them as two separate transactions, one at the start, one at the end. I really can't see how a penalty for not having proper pre-teleport papers would work. Because you don't need a permanent circle to start, LOTS of people are going to be coming in from wherever. Nobles teleporting directly from the comfort of their own homes, adventurers coming in from the wilderness, etc. EDIT: To add insult to injury, a fine for not using a permanent circle to start with would hit PCs with a double-whammy. You have to consume more components by using a temporary circle and then you're hit with an extra fee? Doesn't seem fair. No, more likely is that if you ARE using a preexisting circle to start, you pay their circle usage fee (50 gp) and receive a voucher-pass for your arrival. When you show up, it's proof you have pre-payed. ("No pass, no exit" could be a common phrase guards use for people showing up from a non-permanent starting circle and trying to weasel their way out of the circle-usage fee, lying about how they must have lost their voucher when they left.)
#10 Hellcow Dec 05, 2010 12:24:32	Re: the postal service, I've always seen Orien as handling the post. Beyond and before teleportation circles, I see the backbone of this being the Kundarak Vault Network - the extra dimensional drawers that can be connected across enclaves. The KVN is a product of the Twelve - created using the combined talents of House Cannith, Orien, and Kundarak - and while it's based in Kundarak enclaves, I've always seen Orien as having a dedicated set of vaults used for the post (creating the same close relationship you see between Kundarak and Sivis)... Receiving delivery at a particular hour, with couriers delivering it beyond that point. So in major cities you could get same-day delivery, while delivery to places without a KVN outpost would take longer. I don't have Dragonmarked on hand, and I didn't write the Kundarak or Orien sections, so I don't know if that's been canonized, but it's how I've always seen it.
#11 Hellcow Dec 05, 2010 12:46:08	From the start, 3.5 Khorvaire was seen as a place where teleportation existed but was NOT widespread or easily available. This is in direct contrast to Riedra, where psionic teleportation circles are a central part of the infrastructure of society. As a result, in 4E what I general do is to make Teleportation Circle one of those things that doesn't actually exist ass a ritual in Khorvaire, but is rather an innate power of the Mark of Passage. It still use components and time, you still have to meet the level req, and you still have to pay the market cost for the initial training to learn to use the mark ithat way, but thereafter the mark is your ritual book, and it can't be taken away. This keeps it limited in the places it's available - as you need a Orien heir of sufficient level - and makes the Mark of Passage potentially worthwhile even if you don't have a lot of shifting/teleporting powers. In any case, by this approach, you can't hack the system without an Orien heir onboard (without having a way to bend the rules, as Drix does in The Fading Dream). With that said, Orien heirs can go rogue, be held hostage, whatever... And with that in mind, I agree with AvonRekaes that defenses would be directed inward. One logical thing would be a heavy airlock-style gate giving more control over access to the circle. In Thorn's case, the Pit circle was lightly secured because the secrecy of the address should have been protection enough.
#12 Gurv Dec 06, 2010 1:38:34	I only own the 4e core books and flipped through some of the others. But I was thinking it would be much like Keith said. Just because something exists in the rules (the Linked Portal ritual) doesn't mean that everybody has access to it. The PCs are exceptional people, and as such, might have a wizard who gains access to Linked Portal. But in the eyes of the setting, that ritual is only known to the house and to whomever they decide to share it with. Furthermore, I seem to remember skimming through a sourcebook that held the ritual used to create the permanant teleportation circles themselves. I don't remember all the details, but it was extremely high level. In my mind that means that the only way the NPCs of Eberron are creating new ones is by "cheating": that is, using eldritch machinery and dragonmarks to duplicate a feat that should be far beyond their capabilities. I would make it work like this. The Linked Portal ritual is pretty much exclusive to House Orien. They consider it their intellectual property and license it to those who want to learn it. Even more exclusive is their ability to create new permanant teleportation circles, which they can do using the dragonmark-powered eldritch machines. Furthermore, I think that the destination sequences would be concealed from clients somehow; a thick fog that covers the floor would be functional and dramatic enough. In this way, only those sanctioned by House Orien are likely to know the Linked Portal Ritual, the only destinations are those the House has created, and they have some control over who can go where. Security at an Orien destination circle is a simple matter. Directed inward, obviously. Checkpoints. Guards, magical traps and passwords, and whatever else you can think of. That way if someone shows up who isn't with House Orien, they can be mercilessly treated like the threat to homeland security that they are. And charged a steep fee for using House Orien's property without authorization. I imagine that there must be some intricate time-management issues at such an arrival point. What if multiple Linked Portal rituals are used to travel to the same location at the same time? Perhaps nothing more than a little chaos and bumped heads. But it takes ten minutes to set up an outgoing ritual, and that must be a pain to do if people are landing in your circle all the time! I suppose the simple solution is to have two circles at each location: one outgoing and one incoming. But I've never known a business to choose simple over cheap, and I kind of like the idea of a complicated schedule... Outside House Orien, other teleportation circles exist. Ancient cultures like the dragons and the giants did have the power to create such things, without dragonmarks. So you would still find them in ruins and dungeons and ancient cities. If your party is using Linked Portal to get from the Depths of Sharn to the Black Pit or a location in the Gloaming, then there isn't much Orien can do about it.
#13 Ogiwan Dec 06, 2010 9:32:09	Your point about scheduling is an interesting one. The easiest way I can think about going about it would be to use Sivis to schedule with the destination to make sure its clear. I figure that while it may take 10 mins to cast the ritual, they're probably going to leave time at either end, so figure a 15 minute period. Dramatic fog on the floor is a cool idea, though.
#14 Hellcow Dec 06, 2010 10:34:15	Outside House Orien, other teleportation circles exist. Ancient cultures like the dragons and the giants did have the power to create such things, without dragonmarks. So you would still find them in ruins and dungeons and ancient cities. If your party is using Linked Portal to get from the Depths of Sharn to the Black Pit or a location in the Gloaming, then there isn't much Orien can do about it. Actually, I'm tempted to say that Aerenal has it, but specifically as a divine ritual (replace the Arcana check with Religion); this is a sign of the gestalt power of the Undying Court, performed by reaching out to a personal ancestor within the Court, so it's not something other cultures can steal from them. But it would help with the idea that they are a powerful and ancient culture themselves, and that while the innovation of Khorvaire is moving more rapidly than they are, they do possess powers other nations envy. Of course, this would be all the more reason Orien would be prepared to charge arriving people for use of a circle. This would still require knowledge of the circle's "address", but I could see Orien selling these codes to the Aereni for a significant amount of gold (in addition to per-use costs). If you say that it's bad if two people use a circle at the same time, I would see scheduling being set up... but you still have the risk of Aereni/Adventurers/whatever interrupting. Personally, I'd be more inclined to say that the arrival of new people forcibly shoves anyone in the gate out of it - it's disruptive, but not deadly.
#15 Juums Dec 06, 2010 12:26:52	I never really liked the thematics of teleportation circles: They always seemed to smack too much of Netheril for my tastes. Why I'm actually kind of glad my group's still running 3.5, so that I don't have to wring my hands and gnash my teeth about what to do with the Linked Portal ritual. To respond to the original poster, I would think their penetration would depend entirely upon their costs relative to lightning rail trackage. I'm going to ignore the price quoted for a conductor stone in the 3.5 ECS, as I recall it costing something on the order of eight million GP per mile of lightning rail trackage under that price. (Though I don't have ECS handy to confirm that.) The greater the parity between the costs of a teleportation circle and lightning rail branch, the more likely it is that the teleportation circle will not be built. As an example, imagine that you can build a lightning rail line between Fairhaven and Wroat for 1,000gp and construct a teleportation circle for the same cost. The lightning rail probably makes more economic sense, as it can be routed through the population centers of northern Breland and southern Aundair, including Passage, thereby deepening the pool of shippers and riders, and by extension the potential revenue pool. In order to justify the teleportation circle, the benefits of instantaneous travel between two capitals have to outweigh the economic benefits of the deepened revenue pool of the lightning rail. It's ultimately for the DM to decide, but at base the penetration of the teleportation circles is limited by their ability to serve a given area better than the lightning rail. And since House Orien already has an established business model and substantial infrastructure sunk into the lightning rail, it's doubtful they'd undercut it by attempting to improve the market penetration of teleportation circles. Actually, I'm sure there's an adventure seed somewhere in there: Intrahouse conflict as the lightning rail-operating arm of House Orien intrigues against the teleportation circle-operating arm. Or vice versa.
#16 tufrat Dec 07, 2010 10:59:21	So, here's what I've privately decided, n the Five Nations, any city or larger shown on the 4e ECS campaign map has a House Orien teleportation circle, and some other suitable places, like Arcanix. Outside the Five Nations, only Capitals have circles. Only House Orien has the Linked Portal Ritual, and they don't sell it. But, I'm doing some hand-waving that will let my players use a special Linked Portal Scroll that lets them jump to one particular House circle from anywhere in the world (like the good old fashioned Scroll of Town Portal), without the need for the players to learn the sequence, so that they can return quickly form some of their excursions.   I know I'm bending the ritual rules with the scrolls, but aside from that, can anyone suggest thematic, narrative or other consequences of the "rule-of-thumb" I've come up with, that interferes with the integrity of the campaign setting?
#17 Gurv Dec 07, 2010 12:55:59	Actually, I'm tempted to say that Aerenal has it, but specifically as a divine ritual (replace the Arcana check with Religion); this is a sign of the gestalt power of the Undying Court, performed by reaching out to a personal ancestor within the Court, so it's not something other cultures can steal from them. But it would help with the idea that they are a powerful and ancient culture themselves, and that while the innovation of Khorvaire is moving more rapidly than they are, they do possess powers other nations envy. Of course, this would be all the more reason Orien would be prepared to charge arriving people for use of a circle. This would still require knowledge of the circle's "address", but I could see Orien selling these codes to the Aereni for a significant amount of gold (in addition to per-use costs). I envision that several groups outside House Orien have access to Linked Portal and its ilk. Actually, I think that anyone with epic power would still be able to do it. That is the point of the dragonmarked, isn't it? To help explain why groups of low-level NPCs can do amazing things? Its actually fun to think about it in terms of them breaking into an arena that has been around a lot longer than they have. How typical of humans to master FTL and then be fustrated that others have already been there, done that. The Aereni would certainly retain the ability to use Linked Portal and even to create new teleportation circles, whether through the divine might of the Undying Court or simply as a legacy of their escape from Xen'drik. Their city-states would have teleportation circles, and they would guard them and the sequences needed to reach them as their xenophobic nature demands. I like the idea of this being an irritation to the Five Nations; they'd place circles in their embassies, which would be fustrating to say the least. I think that each of the Five Nations would have a few private teleportation circles as well. House Orien might have created them, but they don't use them as destinations. I can only imagine the methods used to keep them secret. These teleportation circles would be overseen by the Royal Eyes, the Dark Lanterns, the Trust, and their ilk and stand ready for state emergencies. That way, the court mage can get the king to safety if the need arises, and spies don't need to explain themselves at Orien enclaves. Getting the top secret sequence to one of these circles could be the focus on an adventure, not to mention finding a way to bypass the ground security in place at the destination. Of course, I figure that powerful organizations would use Linked Portal in troubling ways whenever it fits the plot. No doubt the Aurum has some strongholds that can be accessed via Linked Portal. The Chamber certainly has the power and would know the sequences needed to reach many ancient sites. Any group can claim a newly discovered circle left by some past civilization anyway. I picture the Emerald Claw being quite fond of that method; plus, the Queen of the Dead might even be one of the few who are powerful enough to create new circles. The scariest element to the advancement of teleportation as technology is the Lords of Dust. There can be no argument that they see such magic as trivial. Fiends are not something mentioned to ordinary scions of the House, but Orien leaders know that they're out there. And there isn't much that they can do: mundane security precautions are laughable to the fiends. Its one of the risks you take to reap the rewards; teleportation circles open the door to such dangers. All you can do is hope that if one shows up, it has better things to do than hang around. I don't think that it should be possible for Linked Portal to allow travel to or from the Demon Wastes in normal circumstances. But demons do get out, and how often to PCs get involved in normal circumstances? If you say that it's bad if two people use a circle at the same time, I would see scheduling being set up... but you still have the risk of Aereni/Adventurers/whatever interrupting. Personally, I'd be more inclined to say that the arrival of new people forcibly shoves anyone in the gate out of it - it's disruptive, but not deadly. I don't think it would be deadly. Just another thing to be considered. The logistics involved would be as complicated as running an airport: you want to clear the runway before more new arrivals arrive. If you don't the result is inconvienience for your customers. It goes a little further in explaining why arriving adventurers/aereni/whatever are viewed with such distaste by the workers. Customer service requires that you call powerful adventurers and unexpected dignitaries "Sir". But you don't have to like it.
#18 Hellcow Dec 07, 2010 16:02:52	The Aereni would certainly retain the ability to use Linked Portal and even to create new teleportation circles, whether through the divine might of the Undying Court or simply as a legacy of their escape from Xen'drik. I prefer to give it to the Undying Court for a few reasons. First, it emphasizes the power of the Undying Court. Aerenal is the only nation on Eberron that truly has its gods walking among it (even if they are only "gods" as a gestalt entity). Their arcane power is significant, but given how old their civilization is they haven't made remarkable innovation in comparison to the houses and people of the Five Nations. By comparison, the Undying Court represents a divine innovation that is unmatched by any other civilization... unless you count the Silver Flame, and the creators of that have passed beyond the world. As a result, I'm inclined to toss the Aereni a few divine rituals that other nations don't have access to... though I may say that those rituals truly do require the approval of the Court. Because that's the thing other religions don't have. The Silver Flame is an impersonal entity. The Blood of Vol draws on the Divinity Within. The Vassals call on the Sovereigns, but you can't actually go and talk to a Sovereign; we don't know if they exist. You CAN go talk to the UC. I don't believe that they approve every single act of divine magic. But I think they do have the ability to excomunicate characters and cut them off from the divine power source if they are given reason... and alone of the faiths, they COULD be personally involved in major rituals. Of course, thinking about it now, I think the better answer is to come up with a few rituals that are locked to specific faiths... not unlike the Domains of 3E. A simple option would be to link this to 4E domains, but I think it would be more interesting to base it on the full story of the faith as opposed to the simplified classifications of the domains... and as with the houses, there are probably a few logical rituals waiting to be created to help with this customization. I'll have to think about it in my copious free time. I think that each of the Five Nations would have a few private teleportation circles as well. House Orien might have created them, but they don't use them as destinations. I can only imagine the methods used to keep them secret. These teleportation circles would be overseen by the Royal Eyes, the Dark Lanterns, the Trust, and their ilk and stand ready for state emergencies. That way, the court mage can get the king to safety if the need arises, and spies don't need to explain themselves at Orien enclaves. Personally, I prefer the idea that every nation has its private circles, but still requires operators with the Mark of Passage. This provides two options. The first is that the nations need to work with the houses to gain the benefit of teleportation. They will pay for absolute privacy, and evidence of betrayal would devastate Orien's reputation. It's the same with Sivis and communication. The Citadel won't go to a normal message station for its secret communications. But I like the idea that if they want swift communication, there's still no better way than Sivis... meaning that they have their own Sivis station with a dedicated operator inside the Citadel itself. This requires absolute trust, but the houses need that to operate. Phiarlan, Medani, and Thuranni are all in the professional wetworks business; how can you do business with kings if they can't trust your neutrality? Ditto for Deneith mercs and bodyguards. In any case, in my campaigns and novels, this is what gives the houses the power they have in The Son of Khyber - the fact that the modern culture of Khorvaire doesn't have easy alternatives for those cutting-edge services. Rather than say "The Citadel has its own message stations and teleportation circles" - I think it's more interesting to consider what happens if they don't, and either have to work with the houses or make do with inerior alternatives. And, of course, I expect that under certain circumstances they WILL make do with inferior alternatives. Even with Sivis' thousand-year reputation for neutrality, I'm sure the Citadel has other ways to send messages that they want to be absolutely certain are secret... it's just that these methods aren't as convenient or efficient as Sivis. Which leaves one more obvious option... acquiring agents who possess the dragonmark required to operate the equipment without actually being loyal to the house. I think there's a lucrative life to be led by scions willing to play this role; criminals, spies, and others would be happy to have you in their employ. There's potential here for PCs, either as background or future. The Citadel doesn't like the power of the Twelve... so can it recruit its own secret force of dragonmarked agents? How would the Twelve respond if these agents are discovered? Whether you have adventurers working for an agency as representatives of their house (as Lei was working for Cyre during the Last War) or as independent operators, I think that forcing the Five Nations to work with the dragonmarked to get the most cutting-edge effects opens more interesting possibilities than just giving them existing, equally efficient options (unless those options are also just as interesting... such as a nation forming a secret alliance with Aerenal for this purpose). Of course, I think every nation would be working to develop such tools... and success could change the balance of power and create its own interesting stories. What happens if Aundair cracks the Portal ritual before anyone else does? Creating "national schools" of arcane magic is in many ways just as logical as tying certain rituals to religions, and would likewise add flavor. This may be something PCs can bypass or overcome by virute of being PCs, but it would certainly add flavor to the world. No doubt the Aurum has some strongholds that can be accessed via Linked Portal. Absolutely! But IMC (In My Campaign) I'd see them as either working with the houses (that's what money is for, after all) or likewise buying the services of independent heirs.  Plus, the Queen of the Dead might even be one of the few who are powerful enough to create new circles. Certainly. I agree that all rules are made to be broken, and that the point of limitations would be to highlight how awesome the people who can bypass them are. I've always said that Erandis should have access to rituals no one else knows - or likely, could perform if they acquired them, at least without years of study. The scariest element to the advancement of teleportation as technology is the Lords of Dust. There can be no argument that they see such magic as trivial. No argument there. A big question is the interaction between Inspired circles and normal circles. I'm inclined to say that the permanent circles used by the Inspired are essentially an entirely different thing - a form of Eldritch (well, psionic) Machine, essentially - and don't connect at all with portals.
#19 AvonRekaes Dec 07, 2010 19:05:47	I've been thinking about this, and I think I've come up with a houserule. Linked Portal is available to everyone (for purchase), but only Mark of Passage'd invidivudals can create the temporary circle to start the teleport from anywhere. Everyone else must use a permanent circle, and pay for the usage fee from Orien if they use one of theirs. I think that helps a lot with the logistics, and makes the ritual more of a traveling aid and not a get-out-of-carefully-planed-DM-Scenario-almost-free card. Also, TufRat's idea of using Diablo-style Scroll of Town Portal works well with this. If you WANT to give the PCs a get-out-of-Hell-free card, you can have a Orien or generally well-connected patron provide them with "pre-loaded" scrolls for opening a portal back to a specific teleportation circle.
#20 Gurv Dec 08, 2010 19:48:37	A lot of my thoughts are based on trying to shoehorn the "what the rules say we can do" crunch into a more "how it works in the setting" fluff. I know that it is up to the DM to draw the line between enforcing the rules for the PCs and adjucating what the NPCs can do. But it has been my experience that the more handwaving the DM does, the harder it is for the players to comprehend the setting. The players tend to see the campaign world and its inhabitants through the filter of the rules and sometimes have a hard time figuring out what is going on if others have limits (or capabilities) that they themselves do not. But I agree with you completely. The fewer people who have access to the Linked Portal ritual, the better. It should always be assumed that House Orien is needed if you want to teleport somewhere. The ability of the PCs to do otherwise is evidence of their amazing natures. As a result, I'm inclined to toss the Aereni a few divine rituals that other nations don't have access to... though I may say that those rituals truly do require the approval of the Court. I've never liked the way this has been handled, in any edition of the rules! I've always seen it as the perfect way to showcase the difference between religions, but the rules have always fallen flat. 3.x domains and domain powers didn't go far enough: the spells granted by domains are almost always available to someone else and thus never unique to the religion. At the very least, domain spells should have been arcane spells clerics otherwise wouldn't have access to. Preferably granted at a lower level than even an arcane caster would have access to. I think some religion specific rituals would be a good idea. They should have details that tie them directly to a specific faith, like requiring the approval of the UC. And they should do things that others cannot duplicate- what better way to demonstrate the power of faith than to do what no one else can do? Which leaves one more obvious option... acquiring agents who possess the dragonmark required to operate the equipment without actually being loyal to the house. I think there's a lucrative life to be led by scions willing to play this role; criminals, spies, and others would be happy to have you in their employ. There's potential here for PCs, either as background or future. The Citadel doesn't like the power of the Twelve... so can it recruit its own secret force of dragonmarked agents? How would the Twelve respond if these agents are discovered? I would have thought that this would be a serious legal issue, blocked by some part of the Korth Edicts. If excoriates and independant dragonmarks are free to work for the government without any kind of restriction, then the power of the Edict is lost. The Houses have enough to worry about with those dragonmarks roaming around doing freelance work; they have to lean on them just to make sure they're not endangering the monopolies. But if excoriates and independants are being backed by the government...well, I can't see the Twelve standing for that. The nations would naturally protect their assets, thus creating a tempting alternative for excoriates and other rebels. Social evolution would lead to a growth in government affiliated dragonmarked groups, and there have to be laws against that. I'm sure it happens anyway. A few agents who secretly have dragonmarks. The government quietly hiring a desperate excoriate whose reputation is otherwise ruined. Exceptions to every rule and all that. But the Twelve would have to make sure that it remains exceptional. If a government were caught with any number of rogue dragonmarked, I think the Twelve would sanction them harshly. The legal method would have to be as you say: paying for absolute secrecy. But the nations would always know that the loyalty of the agents they hire is to the House. Each House would make sure of it. With that being the case, covert ops who use those agents would always have to consider their actions to be less than top secret. A big question is the interaction between Inspired circles and normal circles. I'm inclined to say that the permanent circles used by the Inspired are essentially an entirely different thing - a form of Eldritch (well, psionic) Machine, essentially - and don't connect at all with portals. Better yet. What if the Inspired say they don't connect. But they've found a way to make them connect when it suits them? Kind of a psionic hack, and one more reason to be paranoid about them. A big question of mine is this: do Planar Portal rituals make use of the same teleporation circles that Linked Portal does? It seems to me that they do (I'm just not well versed in 4e). That means that every circle that House Orien has could be used as a destination by extraplanar travelers. Although I am sure such travel must be rare, it makes an interesting plot hook if some otherworldly organization discovers the key to visiting Passage.
#21 Hellcow Dec 08, 2010 22:43:42	I think some religion specific rituals would be a good idea. Rituals are one of my favorite and least favorite things about 4E. I like the way that they play into the world. I like the versatility. But I feel that as it stands they are too generic. It's too easy to have one character that can cast any ritual, and tying everything to a physical object (the ritual book) loses flavor. When I get some time, I think I'll come up with some alternative things for religions and arcane schools and put it up on Bossy the Cow. A few house rules I play with already... Magewrights. The idea of the Magewright was that you had magical professionals who learned how to cast a few specific spells that they used to perform their jobs. They didn't need spellbooks, but also couldn't use spellbooks to memorize new spells. In essence, the idea is that the versatility of a PC wizard reflects a brilliant understanding of the principles of magic; the lamplighter spends a few years learning to cast Continual Flame (something a PC wizard could do with a night of study from a spellbook), but thereafter he casts it from memory. To this end, in 4E I've added a feat called "Magewright", that lets you learn three rituals which you can thereafter cast without a spellbook. You need to meet the prereqs and pay the market cost to learn them... but thereafter you don't need a book. This isn't a great feat for a PC... but it's the principle of saying "This is a thing that is mechanically in the world, and it's what most NPCs have; the versatile Ritual Caster feat you have is part of what makes you remarkable." Thus, the Locksmith knows Arcane Lock, Alarm, and Knock; but he can't just grab a spellbook and cast Continual Light. Dragonmarks. I treat the rituals associated with Dragonmarks in the same way. Having a dragonmark doesn't somehow let you understand how to use a ritual book (except for the Mark of Scribing). Instead, those ritual powers are part of the mark itself; the mark IS your ritual book. You have to meet the prereqs of the ritual (level and skill), and you then have to undergo training that costs the same as the market cost of the ritual, but thereafter you can use the ritual without a book (though it still requires the time and components). The critical point here is that you need to get that training from someone who already knows how to do it. Which makes full membership in the house VERY valuable to foundlings; that mark on your skin may have the POTENTIAL to control the weather, but on your own you can't figure out how to use it. This is especially relevant if some elf was to develop the Mark of Death, because there's only one person out there who could train you in its use... Another thing I've used but haven't developed in full detail are war rituals... rituals used in the Last War. For example, you might have a ritual that takes ten minutes, but products a Burst 150 effect in which you have to make a save at -5 or suffer 5 points of fire damage. There's your magic artillery - something that is devastating to an army of minions, but won't take out the heroes. In the future I'm going to have to develop this in more detail... and then consider exactly what different rituals each of the nations had in their arsenal. I'd really like to look at the difference between Aundair's arcane-heavy forces and Thrane's strong divine support. I would have thought that this would be a serious legal issue, blocked by some part of the Korth Edicts. And you'd have thought right. The Korth Edicts allow the houses to maintain monopolies in their fields. My point was that these agents would be secret, and it would be a dangerous job. Your employers would disavow you and likely get rid of you themselves if necessary to maintain their relationship with the houses, and if they wouldn't the houses would if they found you... witness Breland's disavowed aberrant task force that went on to found House Tarkanan. Furthermore, if you follow my house rule above, if these agents were foundlings - the easiest path to recruitment, as the houses wouldn't know about them - they wouldn't necessarily be able to perform all the rituals an employer might want. Again, the ritual training gives a very strong benefit to house membership.  Better yet. What if the Inspired say they don't connect. But they've found a way to make them connect when it suits them? Kind of a psionic hack, and one more reason to be paranoid about them. Certainly.
#22 tallric_kruush Dec 27, 2010 13:52:00	Keith, I like the way you handle the rituals associated with dragonmarks. The crunch is succinct, and the logic fits perfectly into the world. I'll be sharing this approach with our DM, as we've been discussing this looming issue of late. Our party has four marked characters, so we're bound to run into this very soon. Thanks.