Qaltiar Drow Weapons - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Qaltiar Drow Weapons

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
tethryn_lahralein_dup
Oct 14, 2008 0:27:25 In the spirit of the Talenta weapons thread (and my own 4e rendition of the Scorrow as a PC race...), I thought I'd post up a few ideas I had for the weapons wielded by the drow living in Xen'Drik. Comments and constructive criticism welcomed

If I can figure out how best to represent the Sand Pipe and its 'ammunition' in 4e (alchemical perhaps?), maybe I'll post that too. But first, a feat or three:

Drow Scorpion Warrior
Prerequisite: Drow, origin Xen'drik
Benefit: You gain proficiency and a +2 feat bonus to damage with all Drow weapons, including the Long Knife, Scorpion Claw Gauntlet, Scorpion Chain, and Boomerang.

Drow Skirmisher
Prerequisite: Drow, origin Xen'drik
Benefit: Gain a +1 feat bonus to Armor Class, Reflex, and attack rolls until the beginning of your next turn, if you move at least three squares away from your starting point before or after making an attack.

Rending Claws
Prerequisite: Clawborn Feat or proficiency with Scorpion Claw Gauntlet, Two-Weapon Fighting
Benefit: If you spend an action point to gain an extra attack when when attacking with your claws as a scorrow, or wielding a pair of scorpion claw gauntlets, you deal extra damage equal to twice your Strength modifier if you hit with both attacks.

And without further ado:

#2
Cyber-Dave
Oct 14, 2008 1:06:14 I take major issue with the boomerang being treated as a sherukin, or the long knife being treated as a dagger.

You don't need the offhand quality for the boomerang. No weapons which can not be used in melee are given than quality.

I'm not sure that the chain is balanced. Is it a two handed or one handed weapon? The chain used to be two handed no? A two handed 1d6 chain, that is also a superior weapon, is very underpowered.

The claw gauntlet seems ok. I think I would just use the katar stats for it though... Still, making it a brutal 2 instead of a high crit works also.

I like the stats on the long knife (other then my issue above).

I almost like the stats on the boomerang. I think it should have a +3 to hit, and be stated as a heavy thrown weapon instead of a light thrown weapon (though it is still a light blade).
#3
tethryn_lahralein_dup
Oct 14, 2008 1:18:32 Good call on the Scorpion Chain as a two-handed weapon; I'll throw that distinction in there. As for representing it as a 1d6 weapon; that's what it originally was in 3.5, along with a 19-20 crit range (compared to the 2d4, crit-on-20 regular spiked chain). To counteract the low roll of a 1, I figured making it a 'Brutal 2' weapon would work as a fair comparison; damage range of 2-6 has an average of 4, just one point under the average of 5 for 2d4. Throwing in 'High Crit' added a little more to it to offset the slightly lower damage with the chance of a nasty strike in there, now and then.

(I'm considering changing it to Flail + Light Blade, and removing one of the other qualities, to allow it to be used as a finesse-type weapon instead, although the original Spiked Chain could be used with Weapon Finesse as well... thoughts?)

The Scorpion Claw Gauntlet could be represented by the Katar, but as an 'unarmed' kind of weapon like the spiked gauntlet, it would be a little off as a 'light blade'. Brutal 2 makes it a little more different as a heavy, grab-you-and-crush-a-body-part type weapon. :D

I'm glad you liked the Long Knife... it was a fairly simple addition, I suppose

Thanks for noticing the off-hand quality for the boomerang; for the life of me I can't recall why I put it in there in the first place. Still in the air about making it a heavy thrown weapon, since it's a light multi-bladed thing instead of a throwing hammer or axe or spear... as for its base stats, the Boomerang a +2, 1d6 weapon represented it as a more damaging, slightly less accurate version of the shuriken's +3/1d4.

Still, I'm interested in your thoughts on the Rogue Weapon Talent, regarding the Long Knife and Boomerang. I'd personally considered them to be upgunned renditions of the Dagger and Shuriken, and as such a properly skilled Drow Rogue could make the most use out of them under that class feature.
#4
tethryn_lahralein_dup
Oct 14, 2008 1:46:07 Added a couple of extra feats for your consideration, so time to
#5
Cyber-Dave
Oct 14, 2008 1:56:00 I will look at stuff in more detail tomorrow... but, as for why I really don't like the rogue weapon talent deal, its because it doesn't fit in with other areas of the game and leads to potential balance problems.

For example, the katar. A katar is pretty much an upgraded dagger. And yet, a katar DOES NOT benefit from the rogue weapon proficiencies.

As for balance problems, a 1d8 thrown weapon with which you can sneak attack, and use rogue weapon powers, is pretty sick. No other rouge weapon deals more than 1d6 damage. Your boomerang would be 1d8 in the hands of a rogue if it is counted like a sherukin.

P.S. The reason why I think that the boomerang should be a heavy thrown instead of a light thrown is because under the quality descriptions it specifically states that the distinction between the two is this: heavy thrown deal more damage, but pays for this by using strength, and not being usable with certain "throwing multiple light thrown weapon" weapon powers. That boomerang deals 1d6 damage, and so is in the heavy thrown category compared to everything else. Also, I find it very hard to imagine throwing a "cloud of boomerangs," considering that I imagine each of those boomerangs to pretty much have the size and appearance of the "glaive" from dark sector. I just think it looks and feels more like a heavy thrown weapon.
#6
tethryn_lahralein_dup
Oct 14, 2008 2:03:28
as for why I really don't like the rogue weapon talent deal, its because it doesn't fit in with other areas of the game and leads to potential balance problems.

Hmm... I can agree that the basis of the Rogue Weapon Talent is to keep players from using too many other weapons (although the Kukri and Parrying Dagger are both counted as Rogue Weapons, while the Katar is not, is kind of a confusing issue).

I'm unsure as to how I could differentiate the drow boomerang from the shuriken aside from possibly making it a Heavy Thrown weapon or giving it some other quality. Making it a Brutal or High Crit weapon would be one way but I don't want to go crazy with that property. As for the size of the thing, I've seen varying illustrations of size, ranging from about the size of a big frisbee or a Tron disc, to slightly smaller than the Night Elf Glaive (Warcraft III), so it's hard to say whether it could be considered a Heavy Thrown weapon.

Maybe by making it a Light Thrown and Heavy Thrown weapon, perhaps, a la the Two-Bladed sword as a Light/Heavy Blade... but I'm unsure if that would be a reasonable or workable tradeoff...

Still, I'll sleep on it, and if I come up with something, I'll speak up. Feel free to do so as well.
#7
Gilo
Oct 14, 2008 6:54:18 some random thoughts:

Adding the Scorpion Claw Gauntlet (or maybe the knife/chain) a special property which allow poison to be applied to it as a minor-action (instead of the usual standard-action).

or as a feat (maybe change the "Drow Scorpion Warrior") to give scorpion poison immunity (or 5/10 resistance) and the ability to apply poison as a minor/free action (the +2 damage bonus can then be achieved by a low-level poison type that adds a 2 poison damage).

I have another suggestion for the "Drow Skirmisher" feat:
Prerequisite: Drow, origin Xen'drik
Benefit: if you move at least three squares away from your starting point you gain concealment
#8
tethryn_lahralein_dup
Oct 14, 2008 13:04:49 Applying poison as a Minor Action is an interesting idea; however, there's no precedent for it yet, and I was only just comfortable with adding the 'Returning' weapon property. Unfortunately, the cost per dose of poison does not justify adding that sort of special property, IMHO. If it works for your game, though, by all means take it and run with it :]

As for Drow Skirmisher, I don't want to replace an entire Class Feature like the Warlock's 'Shadow Step'. As it is, concealment grants -2 to all attacks against the target, including Fortitude and Will attacks.

Right now, I'm still not too sure if it's not an overpowered feat even if it's only a +1 to three separate abilities, especially since Armor Specialization can override it, along with Lightning Reflexes. It's kind of a borderline issue at the moment...

EDIT: Ultimately I have decided to remove the Rogue Weapon talent qualification for the Long Knife and Boomerang; too many issues crop up.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 tethryn_lahralein_dup Oct 14, 2008 0:27:25	In the spirit of the Talenta weapons thread (and my own 4e rendition of the Scorrow as a PC race...), I thought I'd post up a few ideas I had for the weapons wielded by the drow living in Xen'Drik. Comments and constructive criticism welcomed If I can figure out how best to represent the Sand Pipe and its 'ammunition' in 4e (alchemical perhaps?), maybe I'll post that too. But first, a feat or three: Drow Scorpion Warrior Prerequisite: Drow, origin Xen'drik Benefit: You gain proficiency and a +2 feat bonus to damage with all Drow weapons, including the Long Knife, Scorpion Claw Gauntlet, Scorpion Chain, and Boomerang. Drow Skirmisher Prerequisite: Drow, origin Xen'drik Benefit: Gain a +1 feat bonus to Armor Class, Reflex, and attack rolls until the beginning of your next turn, if you move at least three squares away from your starting point before or after making an attack. Rending Claws Prerequisite: Clawborn Feat or proficiency with Scorpion Claw Gauntlet, Two-Weapon Fighting Benefit: If you spend an action point to gain an extra attack when when attacking with your claws as a scorrow, or wielding a pair of scorpion claw gauntlets, you deal extra damage equal to twice your Strength modifier if you hit with both attacks. And without further ado:
#2 Cyber-Dave Oct 14, 2008 1:06:14	I take major issue with the boomerang being treated as a sherukin, or the long knife being treated as a dagger. You don't need the offhand quality for the boomerang. No weapons which can not be used in melee are given than quality. I'm not sure that the chain is balanced. Is it a two handed or one handed weapon? The chain used to be two handed no? A two handed 1d6 chain, that is also a superior weapon, is very underpowered. The claw gauntlet seems ok. I think I would just use the katar stats for it though... Still, making it a brutal 2 instead of a high crit works also. I like the stats on the long knife (other then my issue above). I almost like the stats on the boomerang. I think it should have a +3 to hit, and be stated as a heavy thrown weapon instead of a light thrown weapon (though it is still a light blade).
#3 tethryn_lahralein_dup Oct 14, 2008 1:18:32	Good call on the Scorpion Chain as a two-handed weapon; I'll throw that distinction in there. As for representing it as a 1d6 weapon; that's what it originally was in 3.5, along with a 19-20 crit range (compared to the 2d4, crit-on-20 regular spiked chain). To counteract the low roll of a 1, I figured making it a 'Brutal 2' weapon would work as a fair comparison; damage range of 2-6 has an average of 4, just one point under the average of 5 for 2d4. Throwing in 'High Crit' added a little more to it to offset the slightly lower damage with the chance of a nasty strike in there, now and then. (I'm considering changing it to Flail + Light Blade, and removing one of the other qualities, to allow it to be used as a finesse-type weapon instead, although the original Spiked Chain could be used with Weapon Finesse as well... thoughts?) The Scorpion Claw Gauntlet could be represented by the Katar, but as an 'unarmed' kind of weapon like the spiked gauntlet, it would be a little off as a 'light blade'. Brutal 2 makes it a little more different as a heavy, grab-you-and-crush-a-body-part type weapon. :D I'm glad you liked the Long Knife... it was a fairly simple addition, I suppose Thanks for noticing the off-hand quality for the boomerang; for the life of me I can't recall why I put it in there in the first place. Still in the air about making it a heavy thrown weapon, since it's a light multi-bladed thing instead of a throwing hammer or axe or spear... as for its base stats, the Boomerang a +2, 1d6 weapon represented it as a more damaging, slightly less accurate version of the shuriken's +3/1d4. Still, I'm interested in your thoughts on the Rogue Weapon Talent, regarding the Long Knife and Boomerang. I'd personally considered them to be upgunned renditions of the Dagger and Shuriken, and as such a properly skilled Drow Rogue could make the most use out of them under that class feature.
#4 tethryn_lahralein_dup Oct 14, 2008 1:46:07	Added a couple of extra feats for your consideration, so time to
#5 Cyber-Dave Oct 14, 2008 1:56:00	I will look at stuff in more detail tomorrow... but, as for why I really don't like the rogue weapon talent deal, its because it doesn't fit in with other areas of the game and leads to potential balance problems. For example, the katar. A katar is pretty much an upgraded dagger. And yet, a katar DOES NOT benefit from the rogue weapon proficiencies. As for balance problems, a 1d8 thrown weapon with which you can sneak attack, and use rogue weapon powers, is pretty sick. No other rouge weapon deals more than 1d6 damage. Your boomerang would be 1d8 in the hands of a rogue if it is counted like a sherukin. P.S. The reason why I think that the boomerang should be a heavy thrown instead of a light thrown is because under the quality descriptions it specifically states that the distinction between the two is this: heavy thrown deal more damage, but pays for this by using strength, and not being usable with certain "throwing multiple light thrown weapon" weapon powers. That boomerang deals 1d6 damage, and so is in the heavy thrown category compared to everything else. Also, I find it very hard to imagine throwing a "cloud of boomerangs," considering that I imagine each of those boomerangs to pretty much have the size and appearance of the "glaive" from dark sector. I just think it looks and feels more like a heavy thrown weapon.
#6 tethryn_lahralein_dup Oct 14, 2008 2:03:28	as for why I really don't like the rogue weapon talent deal, its because it doesn't fit in with other areas of the game and leads to potential balance problems. Hmm... I can agree that the basis of the Rogue Weapon Talent is to keep players from using too many other weapons (although the Kukri and Parrying Dagger are both counted as Rogue Weapons, while the Katar is not, is kind of a confusing issue). I'm unsure as to how I could differentiate the drow boomerang from the shuriken aside from possibly making it a Heavy Thrown weapon or giving it some other quality. Making it a Brutal or High Crit weapon would be one way but I don't want to go crazy with that property. As for the size of the thing, I've seen varying illustrations of size, ranging from about the size of a big frisbee or a Tron disc, to slightly smaller than the Night Elf Glaive (Warcraft III), so it's hard to say whether it could be considered a Heavy Thrown weapon. Maybe by making it a Light Thrown and Heavy Thrown weapon, perhaps, a la the Two-Bladed sword as a Light/Heavy Blade... but I'm unsure if that would be a reasonable or workable tradeoff... Still, I'll sleep on it, and if I come up with something, I'll speak up. Feel free to do so as well.
#7 Gilo Oct 14, 2008 6:54:18	some random thoughts: Adding the Scorpion Claw Gauntlet (or maybe the knife/chain) a special property which allow poison to be applied to it as a minor-action (instead of the usual standard-action). or as a feat (maybe change the "Drow Scorpion Warrior") to give scorpion poison immunity (or 5/10 resistance) and the ability to apply poison as a minor/free action (the +2 damage bonus can then be achieved by a low-level poison type that adds a 2 poison damage). I have another suggestion for the "Drow Skirmisher" feat: Prerequisite: Drow, origin Xen'drik Benefit: if you move at least three squares away from your starting point you gain concealment
#8 tethryn_lahralein_dup Oct 14, 2008 13:04:49	Applying poison as a Minor Action is an interesting idea; however, there's no precedent for it yet, and I was only just comfortable with adding the 'Returning' weapon property. Unfortunately, the cost per dose of poison does not justify adding that sort of special property, IMHO. If it works for your game, though, by all means take it and run with it :] As for Drow Skirmisher, I don't want to replace an entire Class Feature like the Warlock's 'Shadow Step'. As it is, concealment grants -2 to all attacks against the target, including Fortitude and Will attacks. Right now, I'm still not too sure if it's not an overpowered feat even if it's only a +1 to three separate abilities, especially since Armor Specialization can override it, along with Lightning Reflexes. It's kind of a borderline issue at the moment... EDIT: Ultimately I have decided to remove the Rogue Weapon talent qualification for the Long Knife and Boomerang; too many issues crop up.