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| #1akhenaOct 17, 2009 6:31:56 | I will start soon an Eberron campaign. For once, I would really like to focus the adventures on the characters, instead of running published adventures as such. Sure I intend on plundering materials, but I would really like to come as close as possible to a novel experience. So obviously I'm not looking into extensive dungeon crawls. Novels don't have dungeon crawls. Because I would like to build this campaign for my players, I organize a character creation session where hopefully we will be able to design a coherent group, and not a bunch of 6 unrelated characters. A bit along the lines of DMG2, I will try to have them create links between their characters, and maybe throw on the table a couple of goals they would like to achieve. Then I give myself about 2 months to start my campaign. You will notice that I don't plan on working on anything before I know what their characters are. Maybe I'm wrong, but I believe that it will allow me to put all my energy and ressources on what they would like, instead of designing a whole campaign arc and realize that they don't like to go this way. But ... because there is a but ... I would like to have your opinion on how to design this campaign. I'm hesitating between two approaches, considering I would already know what characters they created and what are the several connections they have with the setting.
The point number 2 is more what I've seen so far when running campaigns. Anyone ever achieved something similar to the number 1 ? With what degree of success ? And how successful were you in using existing published adventures to meet your needs ? My group has of course various tastes, but I know that none of them are big fans of dungeon delves. They would like the idea to recover ancient artifacts or whatever with a good story linked to it (and so to the setting). But they would get bored if it takes 10 encounters (with no story development) to get there. They would love much more to spend some time trying to locate the place, while NPCs are working against them. It might be worth mentioning that we play only twice a month, and that we normally spend 2-3 months playing one game before switching to another one. So the scope is to have some material for about 6 sessions. I want those 6 sessions to be meaningful in terms of story development. Thanks for your input. |
| #2PJammaGodOct 17, 2009 9:48:55 | It's been my humble experience over the last ten years that no matter how much you plan and anticpate what your players may do, any major story-arcs will be a trainwreck within three to five sessions unless you steam-roll them or they are willing to acomodate your finite directions. And this isn't a bad thing (or I'm just a bad DM, probably the latter ;) ). It's probably better to work small and then slowly build up. Give your players a sandbox to work with, so to say. Let them feel in control and actually grant them that control. After you've gone through the first four or five adventures you should have a feel for the general party dynamic and how they work. After that point, let the various hints you've been using in your game thus far start building up towards something, a larger plot arc that culminates in whatever you want. So my advice is give them the world to explore and let them. They all have things to do, politics and intrigue to involve themselves within. Just my 2 cents Australian :P (oh and best of luck on your new campaign) |
| #3tsawickyOct 17, 2009 15:49:58 | I too am about to start an Eberron Campaign, so I feel your pain. It's not that DM's like us are bad DM's, but its that the world of Eberron is full of so many awesome organizations and hooks and intrigue. My suggestion to you for starters is to select two organizations and one government to focus your campaign around. Once you've done that, you may then be able to decide why you did such a thing. The "Love Triangle" you select can aid you in your week-to-week tv series stlye campaign with the same feel of a long drawn out quest that possesses side-treks. The government can provide quests to adventurers week to week and one or both organizations can be the resistances. They can hire mercenary goblins or summon demons/devils (whichever your brain storms with). This is what I feel my Eberron game will have the feel of. I think I may very well use the Adventure in the back of the Eberron Campaign Guide as a starter. This adventure will take place the four years before the start of the campaign and when it actually begins, I can tie the characters together again, as though they now have something in common. But rather than thinking so much about how to start and plan it, You have something that most DM's who run campaigns don't have. That is... you know when it should finish... Six months. You've got 12 games to plan. Think of your ending first! This shouldn't cause a railroading feel, but should instead provide you with options throughout each week to instead guide your party to the goal you already have set. Give them plenty of choices, but you can monitor each choice you give and decide how you will mold them to point back to your ending. What do you think so far? |
| #4akhenaOct 22, 2009 7:00:29 | Thanks for your answers. It's funny you mention having already an ending in mind, because it's been something else I wanted to do. Until now, I always had big plans, with tons of sessions, etc, but it died while running it. This time I would like to reduce the scope of my campaign. Not that I don't want it to be boring. But I would like that after 6 sessions, the players hae a feel of accomplishment. They did what they were supposed to do. The only thing I couldn't know now is how they did it. I did my first session with character creation. Here is what I have so far. Note that my players have never played in Eberron, so I have still many sweet secrets from the campaign that I can use.
So I have still a few gaps to be filled in. But I see already a lot of story potential here. I'll post when I have some more info and some idea for the final goal of this first part of the campaign. Edit : Most stories have been updated. |
| #5OgiwanOct 24, 2009 22:43:10 | Dude, nice. All their stories are developed enough for you to run with them, but raw enough for you to work with them. |
| #6tsawickyOct 24, 2009 22:51:14 | Can't wait to hear what your do with those spaces that need filled. Keep me posted. |
| #7akhenaNov 12, 2009 2:50:15 | So here are some ideas I've had concerning the characters.
Any great idea out there is very much appreciated. My main problem right now is to find what is the first couple of ideas that I want to use for my first adventure. I cannot use them all at once. But the first one I will chose will set the initial tone of the campaign. I have to keep in mind that that players told me that they would enjoy the geo-politic situation of Khorvaire, see what makes Eberron special (halflins on dinosaurs, warforged, dragonmarks). One of them said also that the corruption in Breland could be a good starting point, and Thronehold would be a grat place for political intrigues. Indeed it is. I still have to see how to get all these elements together. |
| #8amulanNov 12, 2009 13:16:48 | I love the idea of Eberron and hope/expect to run my own campaign in this world some day soon.So here are some ideas I've had concerning the characters. Don't give up on the Cyran Human. He could find connections to his brethren in New Cyre (also located in Breland). Perhaps they knew he was a spy and want to expose him or maybe they were old friends that did not know the other had survived the Mourning. Maybe you need him to elaborate more on his background to get your creative juices flowing.
If you're crafting adventures around the PC's backgrounds, you can save those PC with less developed backgrounds for last or at least latter in the campaign. That'll give him more time to develop things (or maybe you). Also, are you asking them about the Last War, the way the ECG recommends? What have they done since the Day of Mourning, how did it impact their family and friends, etc.?
My plans are to start out with a rather straight forward goal (in my case it's obvious as they are escaping from a prison) sprinkled with lots of Eberron flava (suggestions about the prophecy, references to some of the Houses, religions and influential organizations). I think of that first adventure as their first major quest. Keep it short and sweet, just to test the waters. The individual PC stories are the minor quests that crop up during the adventure. It is tough tying the major quest to all the PC's, as you can only please "some of the people," but do they all want to be heroic (save the kidnaped heiress) or more materialistic (recover the valueable artifact). Try to play to their interests in these general terms. You can use any one of those major/minor quests to lead toward your Arc. You may need to start a blog on your campaign, so we can follow along. Sounds great so far. |
| #9johnnyslickNov 15, 2009 1:38:37 | My general advice here, gleaned more from writing than from DMing, is to *not* focus on the big picture so much. All the pre-planning is a little like writing your outline, whereas the gaming sessions themselves are like actually sitting down to write stuff. IME a lot of writers back themselves into a corner by actually outlining *too much* and then when the characters in their head want to say and do their own thing they find themselves either having to throw out large chunks of their plot or shoehorn the characters' responses into what was already planned. If the characters in your head won't respond the way your outline says they should respond, how can you expect players who are *not* in your head to respond the same way? No, what you really want to do if you want this to be like a novel IMO is you *don't* have a gigantic write-up for what's going to happen from one adventure to the next. What I do in my writing is I plan out a big climactic set-piece and then let the characters figure out how to get there. For the most part, you want your planning to be from session to session. Now, if you're really trying to make this feel like a novel, you'll want to make sure it's paced correctly too. Try and work in a minor set-piece about halfway through, and maybe some other, smaller, ones a quarter and three-quarters of the way in as well. Also, don't disparage subplotting. Real novels can spend pages and pages on stuff that has little to nothing to do with the primary plot. Ultimately, the biggest issue you're going to have with running a game like a novel is that with a novel you get to go back and rewrite the whole mess when you're done. Expect it to get messy, expect there to be loose ends that you may not be able to wrap up, even expect some plot discontinuity and retconning. Real, actual novel-writing can be really, really sloppy with the first draft. You simply cannot expect 6 people collaborating on a piece of literature - because, ultimately, that's what a good game is - to be as taut and to the point as a single person running through the same set of scenarios for the 6th or 7th time. |
| #10akhenaNov 15, 2009 7:04:45 |
I had a raw idea in my mind. I might want to include the Aurum to the story. So one Aurum member is the brother (or even sister) of a noble who is part of the Brelish Parliament. The character already met this Aurum member years ago, while advising the minister. Of course he doesn' know he's an Aurum member. He just knows he's a successful buisnessman. Today, the character is only the shadow of himslef. It could be interesting for him to meet this Aurum member, who could initially help him getting back into his saddle, but of course plans to use him for his own future plans. So the character could have the tough choice of either paying back his debt or walk away once he realize what kind of person this guy is. I still have to find out what the member could ask for...
Very good point. I'll press him a bit more about details. I also had a vague idea. The reference is from Matrix. You know when this "rebel" meet the agent Smith to betray Neo if he can go back into the Matrix like everybody else. I could imagine a Kalashtar who is wondering if it was really that clever to flee Dal Quor. He's basically homesick... He could be a close friend of the character and could become a great ennemy, helping the Dreaming Dark to buy his ticket back to Dal Quor.
I plan on doing the opposite, I'm afraid : using directly their backgrounds as the major quest(s). But you're right on a couple of things. 1) I will not be able to tie all their backgrounds into one single major quest. 2) I don't know how they want to play their characters and what will be their motivations. But my plan is to outline roughly the ideas (understand the secrets) behind a few parts of their backgrounds. I try to tie together one or two ideas. And I throw it at them and react depending on how they deal with it. JohnnySlick, I found your comments highly interesting !!! Because this is exactly the angle from where I'm trying to prepare my campaign. You're talking about writing the outline but keeping it very simple and not going too specific. Well right now, I don't know yet where I want to start, and even less where I want to end. Right now, I'm creating some nice and sweet secrets in every player's background. As said above, if possible I try to tie those secrets with other player's secrets. But not too much, otherwise I'll have problems if one PC dies later on. When I'll have all these secrets, I'll try then to find out what theme I want to explore first, and I'll pick maybe two secrets. As you advised, I'll design then a good climatic scene linked to these secrets. Once I have that, I'll work from session to session, preparing only what I need for those 4 hours. In my experience, combats take 1h30. So I'll try to have one planned but not more. The rest will be about the story (and probably including some skill challenges). I had one last idea for the Valenar avenger character. His father is not a Valenar elf. He's a Phiarlan elf, and more exactly from the Paellion line. So when in 972 the line has been almost exterminated, he fled to the Valenar where he had a previous mission for the Dragonmarked House. He hid in a Valenar tribe, fell in love with one elf, and had 2 sons. Only recently, his secret has been discovered (I still have to find out how) and the Thuranni organised an ambush to assassinate him. I thought : what if the Paellion line had been manipulated by the Dreaming Dark ? The Thuranni don't know this, but it's because of the DD that the Thuranni launched their terrible attack. Today, I imagine 2 last membres of this line hidden in Sharn. They still dream a lot. They dream about their ancestor asking them to come back to this world. So they are busy building an arcane device which will allow them to bring back their ancestors, or so they think. Because the truth is obviously that the Quori want to bring Dal Quor closer to Khorvaire. This arcane device will allow them to take roots in Sharn. Thanks everyone for sharing your thoughts. |
| #11amulanNov 15, 2009 14:07:44 |
I certainly don't have a problem tying the major quests to the backgrounds, but just don't make some of your players wait 4 or 5 levels before having the campaign story focus on them, unless you're sure those players really don't mind. That's why I recommend using the minor quests to focus on them along the way. Keep us posted on how things go. |
| #12akhenaNov 16, 2009 6:01:59 | Ok , I see your point here ! And you're right, they would get frustrated if we spent 6 sessions on the backgrounds of 2 characters only. It's a reason why I might try to throw at them from time to time hooks to other "secrets" from their background. I hope I can create a situation where they have many options available to them, and they have to decide what they what to do first (or in what order to deal with those informations). But I don't know if that's going to work that well... I'll certainly keep you posted. But the first session is not due before next year. So I (hopefully) still have time for some narrative preparation. |