Will there be psionics in the 4E Eberron books? - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Will there be psionics in the 4E Eberron books?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
goemoe
Dec 03, 2008 10:47:28 I have scanned this and that. I have read hellcows comments about 4E Eberron as far as he dared to tell, but I could not find anything on psionics. Since I read about this Primal Power book, my hope to ever see a 4E psionics book is void.

People I ask do tell me, just make it a wizard, it is about the same. Well, it is not. In 4E every class might have the same amount of powers and such, the point is not, if two classes do similar things, the point is, if they feel the same if you play them. A psionic who plays like a wizard or a warlock is poorly done. No psionics are not like magic, if done right.

So is there any hope for my 4E Eberron campaign to get some psionic input with the release of those two Eberron books? Have there been any news for it?
#2
ieattrollsforbreakfast
Dec 04, 2008 11:59:56 It depends what sort of psionic content you're after. If you're hoping for some class support, or even some psionic paragon paths, I think you're going to be disappointed. Psionics aren't due to be released until at least 2010 in the Player's Handbook III, so support for that power source would be useless until then. They will come eventually, though, you don't have to worry about that. Psionics are listed as a future release in the PHB after all (in the sidebar about power sources).

That said, I think it's pretty likely we'll see kalashtar in the EPG. Since the FRPG includes two races I think the EPG will too, and since warforged are a shoe in and shifters are in the PHB2, we're left with either doppelgangers/changelings or kalashtar. Since kalashtar are more unique to Eberron, I think they're the most likely of the two.
Of course, the kalashtar won't be able to have abilities that tie in the to psionic power source, but that doesn't really matter. It's easy to come up with stats that don't, and since it makes non-psionic kalashtar builds more viable is actually a good thing. See my take on their stats at the Dragon Above (see signature) for an example.

As for designer quotes, take a look here:
http://www.dragon-above.com/index.php?p=4e#kalashtar
#3
ChrisTheS
Dec 05, 2008 9:14:09
Of course, the kalashtar won't be able to have abilities that tie in the to psionic power source

Given that racial powers don't have power source descriptors, this would be the case whether the psionics book was out or not. The power just has to do 'psionic things' and whoop, it's psionic.

I'm envisioning the kesh as something along the lines of a Star Wars jedi battle meld... a psychic network granting a bonus to the kalashtar and their allies for a round.
#4
Arcane_Guyver
Dec 05, 2008 12:57:13 I'm betting psionics will be mentioned, at least, in the Eberron books, but there won't be any mechanics to back them up. Kalashtar don't necessarily need to take psionic classes; besides, the Wizard, Cleric, and Swordmage sort of cover some of the old psy-classes' shticks (think dorje instead of wand). Hell, the guy who wrote 3e psionics (Bruce Cordell) reflavored the Wizard to be a Psion; if he can do it, so can we.

I hope the kalashtar mindlink ability will be at-will or encounter, without any real combat benefit.
#5
skrapsan
Dec 06, 2008 2:55:31
Hell, the guy who wrote 3e psionics (Bruce Cordell) reflavored the Wizard to be a Psion; if he can do it, so can we.

Do you have a link to this, it would fit my campaign perfectly as some of the bad guys need to be psoinics sometime soon.
#6
Fireclave
Dec 06, 2008 5:11:34 I predict there will be very limited psionic support, but nothing in the way of classes. The Kalashtar are the only Eberron race so far that we don't have any stats at all for. Gnomes, Warforged, and Shifters already exist in the monster manual at least, and 4e's PC doppelganger stats are effectively 3.5's Changling stats. Kalashtar will probably have racial features and feats that make them better at using or defending against powers with the psionic keyword, and there currently are a scant few class powers that have it. And likely, if the Kalashtar are included, we should see a few psionic-themed feats, even if they are only Kalashtar racial feats.

If 4e's ECS manual is anything like its predecessor, we might be treated to some updated Quori stats and maybe a few psionic-themed items. If we're really lucky, they might throw in a few new psionic-keyworded class powers or features for existing classes (I wouldn't mind seeing a fighter->psywar option), but I wouldn't hold my breath for that.

In short, I think we will see psionics in Eberron. But until the psionic classes are officially released, probably not much.
#7
Arcane_Guyver
Dec 06, 2008 6:58:46
Do you have a link to this, it would fit my campaign perfectly as some of the bad guys need to be psoinics sometime soon.

There's no link - this is just according to the 4e playtests that were posted about occasionally by the devs before it was published. Right there in the playtest, he was playing a "psion" (I'm guessing a kineticist ;) ).
#8
skrapsan
Dec 06, 2008 8:17:20
There's no link - this is just according to the 4e playtests that were posted about occasionally by the devs before it was published. Right there in the playtest, he was playing a "psion" (I'm guessing a kineticist ;) ).

Well well, then my good old reflawour skill is once more going to be put to the test. New wording and psionic keyword for damage should do wonders ^^
#9
rauric
Dec 07, 2008 10:38:35 Will PH2 have the psionic rules?
#10
balard
Dec 07, 2008 11:37:44 No, lets hope its the PHB3, the will came before ECS
#11
ieattrollsforbreakfast
Dec 07, 2008 13:10:48
No, lets hope its the PHB3, the will came before ECS

The ECS is scheduled for June, the PHB3 is going to be 2010. All the releases up until September are known, so there's no chance that psionics rules will appear before the ECS.
#12
rauric
Dec 07, 2008 15:26:41 Damn, I thought they would bring psionics out at the same times as EB. What will be in the PH2? Perhaps they should just have psionics come out on DDI.
#13
ieattrollsforbreakfast
Dec 07, 2008 18:34:30
Damn, I thought they would bring psionics out at the same times as EB. What will be in the PH2? Perhaps they should just have psionics come out on DDI.

The PHB2 has Primal, Arcane and Divine support. The races are Gnomes, Half-orcs, Devas, Shifters and Goliaths. The classes are Barbarian, Druid, Warden, Shaman, Bard, Sorcerer, Avenger and Invoker.
#14
inkblot
Dec 10, 2008 1:48:36
Of course, the kalashtar won't be able to have abilities that tie in the to psionic power source

Given that racial powers don't have power source descriptors, this would be the case whether the psionics book was out or not. The power just has to do 'psionic things' and whoop, it's psionic.

Very true. There are already two psionic races in the back of the Monster Manual - the githzerai and the githyanki. Their racial powers, just like every other racial power in the game, do not have a power sources. They just "do psionic things."
#15
rauric
Dec 10, 2008 9:11:39 There is an at-will power that an NPC has in a Dungeon adventure that seems like soemthing that will be in the Psionic rules. The NPC/Monster was named Psychic Mage and it at-will power attk was agaisnt will defense and when it hit is did psychic dmg plus the "Mage" could make one ally or himself invisible to the enemy of the power for one round or so. To me this seems like a decent power to use for a "wizard/psion" so it can replace one of the wizards other at-wills. This could give the wiz/psi thing a more psionic feel and is a bit controllerish.
#16
salla
Dec 10, 2008 15:35:34
There is an at-will power that an NPC has in a Dungeon adventure that seems like soemthing that will be in the Psionic rules. The NPC/Monster was named Psychic Mage and it at-will power attk was agaisnt will defense and when it hit is did psychic dmg plus the "Mage" could make one ally or himself invisible to the enemy of the power for one round or so. To me this seems like a decent power to use for a "wizard/psion" so it can replace one of the wizards other at-wills. This could give the wiz/psi thing a more psionic feel and is a bit controllerish.

Fey-based Warlocks also have a fair number of psychic effects (both in terms of keywords and results). I wouldn't blink at you if you scratched out 'warlock, fey pact' on your character sheet and scribbled in 'psion'.
#17
askanipsion
Dec 10, 2008 22:57:15
Fey-based Warlocks also have a fair number of psychic effects (both in terms of keywords and results). I wouldn't blink at you if you scratched out 'warlock, fey pact' on your character sheet and scribbled in 'psion'.

The 4E Bard playtest also has alot of psychic effects including Domination.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 goemoe Dec 03, 2008 10:47:28	I have scanned this and that. I have read hellcows comments about 4E Eberron as far as he dared to tell, but I could not find anything on psionics. Since I read about this Primal Power book, my hope to ever see a 4E psionics book is void. People I ask do tell me, just make it a wizard, it is about the same. Well, it is not. In 4E every class might have the same amount of powers and such, the point is not, if two classes do similar things, the point is, if they feel the same if you play them. A psionic who plays like a wizard or a warlock is poorly done. No psionics are not like magic, if done right. So is there any hope for my 4E Eberron campaign to get some psionic input with the release of those two Eberron books? Have there been any news for it?
#2 ieattrollsforbreakfast Dec 04, 2008 11:59:56	It depends what sort of psionic content you're after. If you're hoping for some class support, or even some psionic paragon paths, I think you're going to be disappointed. Psionics aren't due to be released until at least 2010 in the Player's Handbook III, so support for that power source would be useless until then. They will come eventually, though, you don't have to worry about that. Psionics are listed as a future release in the PHB after all (in the sidebar about power sources). That said, I think it's pretty likely we'll see kalashtar in the EPG. Since the FRPG includes two races I think the EPG will too, and since warforged are a shoe in and shifters are in the PHB2, we're left with either doppelgangers/changelings or kalashtar. Since kalashtar are more unique to Eberron, I think they're the most likely of the two. Of course, the kalashtar won't be able to have abilities that tie in the to psionic power source, but that doesn't really matter. It's easy to come up with stats that don't, and since it makes non-psionic kalashtar builds more viable is actually a good thing. See my take on their stats at the Dragon Above (see signature) for an example. As for designer quotes, take a look here: http://www.dragon-above.com/index.php?p=4e#kalashtar
#3 ChrisTheS Dec 05, 2008 9:14:09	Of course, the kalashtar won't be able to have abilities that tie in the to psionic power source Given that racial powers don't have power source descriptors, this would be the case whether the psionics book was out or not. The power just has to do 'psionic things' and whoop, it's psionic. I'm envisioning the kesh as something along the lines of a Star Wars jedi battle meld... a psychic network granting a bonus to the kalashtar and their allies for a round.
#4 Arcane_Guyver Dec 05, 2008 12:57:13	I'm betting psionics will be mentioned, at least, in the Eberron books, but there won't be any mechanics to back them up. Kalashtar don't necessarily need to take psionic classes; besides, the Wizard, Cleric, and Swordmage sort of cover some of the old psy-classes' shticks (think dorje instead of wand). Hell, the guy who wrote 3e psionics (Bruce Cordell) reflavored the Wizard to be a Psion; if he can do it, so can we. I hope the kalashtar mindlink ability will be at-will or encounter, without any real combat benefit.
#5 skrapsan Dec 06, 2008 2:55:31	Hell, the guy who wrote 3e psionics (Bruce Cordell) reflavored the Wizard to be a Psion; if he can do it, so can we. Do you have a link to this, it would fit my campaign perfectly as some of the bad guys need to be psoinics sometime soon.
#6 Fireclave Dec 06, 2008 5:11:34	I predict there will be very limited psionic support, but nothing in the way of classes. The Kalashtar are the only Eberron race so far that we don't have any stats at all for. Gnomes, Warforged, and Shifters already exist in the monster manual at least, and 4e's PC doppelganger stats are effectively 3.5's Changling stats. Kalashtar will probably have racial features and feats that make them better at using or defending against powers with the psionic keyword, and there currently are a scant few class powers that have it. And likely, if the Kalashtar are included, we should see a few psionic-themed feats, even if they are only Kalashtar racial feats. If 4e's ECS manual is anything like its predecessor, we might be treated to some updated Quori stats and maybe a few psionic-themed items. If we're really lucky, they might throw in a few new psionic-keyworded class powers or features for existing classes (I wouldn't mind seeing a fighter->psywar option), but I wouldn't hold my breath for that. In short, I think we will see psionics in Eberron. But until the psionic classes are officially released, probably not much.
#7 Arcane_Guyver Dec 06, 2008 6:58:46	Do you have a link to this, it would fit my campaign perfectly as some of the bad guys need to be psoinics sometime soon. There's no link - this is just according to the 4e playtests that were posted about occasionally by the devs before it was published. Right there in the playtest, he was playing a "psion" (I'm guessing a kineticist ;) ).
#8 skrapsan Dec 06, 2008 8:17:20	There's no link - this is just according to the 4e playtests that were posted about occasionally by the devs before it was published. Right there in the playtest, he was playing a "psion" (I'm guessing a kineticist ;) ). Well well, then my good old reflawour skill is once more going to be put to the test. New wording and psionic keyword for damage should do wonders ^^
#9 rauric Dec 07, 2008 10:38:35	Will PH2 have the psionic rules?
#10 balard Dec 07, 2008 11:37:44	No, lets hope its the PHB3, the will came before ECS
#11 ieattrollsforbreakfast Dec 07, 2008 13:10:48	No, lets hope its the PHB3, the will came before ECS The ECS is scheduled for June, the PHB3 is going to be 2010. All the releases up until September are known, so there's no chance that psionics rules will appear before the ECS.
#12 rauric Dec 07, 2008 15:26:41	Damn, I thought they would bring psionics out at the same times as EB. What will be in the PH2? Perhaps they should just have psionics come out on DDI.
#13 ieattrollsforbreakfast Dec 07, 2008 18:34:30	Damn, I thought they would bring psionics out at the same times as EB. What will be in the PH2? Perhaps they should just have psionics come out on DDI. The PHB2 has Primal, Arcane and Divine support. The races are Gnomes, Half-orcs, Devas, Shifters and Goliaths. The classes are Barbarian, Druid, Warden, Shaman, Bard, Sorcerer, Avenger and Invoker.
#14 inkblot Dec 10, 2008 1:48:36	Of course, the kalashtar won't be able to have abilities that tie in the to psionic power source Given that racial powers don't have power source descriptors, this would be the case whether the psionics book was out or not. The power just has to do 'psionic things' and whoop, it's psionic. Very true. There are already two psionic races in the back of the Monster Manual - the githzerai and the githyanki. Their racial powers, just like every other racial power in the game, do not have a power sources. They just "do psionic things."
#15 rauric Dec 10, 2008 9:11:39	There is an at-will power that an NPC has in a Dungeon adventure that seems like soemthing that will be in the Psionic rules. The NPC/Monster was named Psychic Mage and it at-will power attk was agaisnt will defense and when it hit is did psychic dmg plus the "Mage" could make one ally or himself invisible to the enemy of the power for one round or so. To me this seems like a decent power to use for a "wizard/psion" so it can replace one of the wizards other at-wills. This could give the wiz/psi thing a more psionic feel and is a bit controllerish.
#16 salla Dec 10, 2008 15:35:34	There is an at-will power that an NPC has in a Dungeon adventure that seems like soemthing that will be in the Psionic rules. The NPC/Monster was named Psychic Mage and it at-will power attk was agaisnt will defense and when it hit is did psychic dmg plus the "Mage" could make one ally or himself invisible to the enemy of the power for one round or so. To me this seems like a decent power to use for a "wizard/psion" so it can replace one of the wizards other at-wills. This could give the wiz/psi thing a more psionic feel and is a bit controllerish. Fey-based Warlocks also have a fair number of psychic effects (both in terms of keywords and results). I wouldn't blink at you if you scratched out 'warlock, fey pact' on your character sheet and scribbled in 'psion'.
#17 askanipsion Dec 10, 2008 22:57:15	Fey-based Warlocks also have a fair number of psychic effects (both in terms of keywords and results). I wouldn't blink at you if you scratched out 'warlock, fey pact' on your character sheet and scribbled in 'psion'. The 4E Bard playtest also has alot of psychic effects including Domination.