A commoner's knowledge

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

forse

Jun 22, 2008 18:35:19
A thing I started thinking about is, how much does a commoner know? How much should my PC's know? I've probably been to generous with information in my past DM:ing. I feel that limiting knowledge is important for keeping the mysterious feeling, and the feeling that you are part of an unknown, unexplored world.

How much does a normal inhabitant or PC in Faerun know of the world itself? Of gods, magic, the planes, monsters (anything from the local orc to some rare, gribbly beast of the Underdark) and geography. How much knowledge of the world at large do faerunians have? How common is literacy?

Lots of questions, feel free to answer as you please.
#2

Mr_Miscellany

Jun 22, 2008 18:45:41
Ed Greenwood has often stated that commoners 'know' the gods are real, that magic exists and that there are terrible monsters in the world.

They suspect there are "places beyond" the Realms (after all, the gods must reside somewhere).

Commoners may well know about orcs, goblins and worse, if such things are found at or near where the commoner lives.

Knowledge of places further away then where a commoner lives is a function of what the world brings to the commoner. For example, trade caravans will likely bring new from the next town over, and perhaps places further away.

As I understand it, literacy is a function of region, culture and location.

For example, your typical wandering barbarian from the lands along the Spine of the World may be illiterate, whereas a citizen of the Silver Marches (that also exists near the Spine of the World) may be literate in one or two languages.

You can check the 3E Player’s Guide to Faerûn and the 3E Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting for languages known by region to get a general idea of what a commoner might know.
#3

lord_karsus

Jun 22, 2008 21:21:31
A thing I started thinking about is, how much does a commoner know? How much should my PC's know? I've probably been to generous with information in my past DM:ing. I feel that limiting knowledge is important for keeping the mysterious feeling, and the feeling that you are part of an unknown, unexplored world.

How much does a normal inhabitant or PC in Faerun know of the world itself? Of gods, magic, the planes, monsters (anything from the local orc to some rare, gribbly beast of the Underdark) and geography. How much knowledge of the world at large do faerunians have? How common is literacy?

Lots of questions, feel free to answer as you please.

-This is all going to change depending on the region the character is from, and his/her/its backstory.

-Just like in our world, education differs from place to place, so too does it differ from place to place in the Forgotten Realms.
#4

forse

Jun 23, 2008 12:16:13
Thanks for the replies.

In other words, it's all very individual.

How knowledgeable are ordinary people in the regions of the Sword Coast and the Dalelands? Roughly.
#5

lord_karsus

Jun 23, 2008 13:03:56
In other words, it's all very individual.

-Right.

How knowledgeable are ordinary people in the regions of the Sword Coast and the Dalelands? Roughly.

-Sorry to be ambiguous, again, but...It really depends on the subject, and the person. The Dalelands, for instance, have numerous farmers living there. There are plenty of retired adventurers there as well. And, of course, there is Elminster. Those retired adventurers are likely to be more knowledgeable of the world than the farmers, and Elminster is likely to be more knowledgeable of the world than the adventurers.
#6

forse

Jun 23, 2008 14:59:35
I see.

No problem, I understand how it works. And I think I know how to give my players the right feeling.
#7

lord_karsus

Jun 23, 2008 16:05:27
-Just think in terms of in real life. People from bustling metropolis' are likely to be more well-educated than farmers from backwater villages, and so on, but those farmers might be more knowledgeable than those city-slickers in certain skills.
#8

suin_bahhar_02

Jun 23, 2008 16:36:21
Institutional education is quite rare in the realms. Most parents are tutors as well. Children from the age of ten and up can be quite knowledgable in a streetwise way. A hunters child might already know how to wield a bow, and a wizards child his first cantrip. Local monsters should be quite the common knowledge as they are the subjects of tales to scare children into obedience (just like the superstitious days in the middle ages but then real!).
#9

Therise

Jun 23, 2008 17:49:36
Didn't Ed post something (via Candlekeep) a year or two ago about how the various colleges were organized and run, like the Lady's College in Silverymoon? I have a vague memory of it being something along the lines of students following around lecturers, rather like lyceums of ancient Greece or the Liceo Scientifico of Renaissance Italy. Little brief field trips and the like, as needed. Not quite like the lecture halls and classrooms of modern schools today.
#10

forse

Jun 23, 2008 19:25:29
That made me think of Baldur's Gate I, which begins in Candlekeep. Tutors everywhere, and there's a group of singers being tutored by some sort of chorus leader.
#11

lord_karsus

Jun 23, 2008 21:29:00
Didn't Ed post something (via Candlekeep) a year or two ago about how the various colleges were organized and run, like the Lady's College in Silverymoon? I have a vague memory of it being something along the lines of students following around lecturers, rather like lyceums of ancient Greece or the Liceo Scientifico of Renaissance Italy. Little brief field trips and the like, as needed. Not quite like the lecture halls and classrooms of modern schools today.

-A lot of the "colleges" are geared specifically for Bards. Bardic Colleges. I don't know if this is a universal thing or not, but figured it'd be worth mentioning. Like New Olamm, for instance.
#12

rjfras

Jun 24, 2008 2:33:24
Just a few examples of things Ed has posted about knowledge of folks in the Realms:

- - - - - - - - - -

I see medical knowledge as varying widely across the Realms, but being highest among demi-humans, because tending humans has been one longterm way of being accepted in human-dominated communities. Herb lore is predominant, coupled with "potions" (herbal concoctions, not magic) effective in dealing with minor diseases, allergic reactions, and shock. The organs of all humanoid races are known, plus the general functioning of the body (hence what shock is, and how to treat it), how blood 'works,' and the importance of cleanliness for wounds (though most folks in the Realms have what we modern real-world types would consider bad personal hygiene and BAD teeth, though persons desiring to make a good impression who can't get a chance to bathe properly will work scented oils into their hair and rub scented oils on their bodies to change their strong odour into something less unpleasant).

In the Realms, almost everyone understands that ill or wounded people need rest, to be covered by a blanket or at least kept out of full sun, that moving or rough handling will do greater harm, and that people should be given much to drink (even in cases where we moderns would say, "No, not even if complaining of thirst should Thrudd be given water or something stronger, because he's hurt inside!"). Stretchers and slings are commonly used, and where a stretcher can't be found, injured who must be carried are usually lashed to felled treetrunks and borne along between the shoulders of two strong carriers.

Scarring is common, because cauterization is well-known. Herbal painkillers (usually liquids that are "brewed" and drunk, but also liquids drizzled into wounds) are widely known and used, especially before someone is "sewn up," and there are herbs known in the Realms but not present in the real-world, including fleshwort (yes, I know we have several plants by that folk name, but I'm postulating a new and different plant) that can be sewn into an internal wound, and slowly absorbed by the body as raw material to build new tissue, blood vessels, and cartilage, bloodstaunch (which thickens blood very quickly upon direct contact, and so can be applied to open wounds to slow or stop bleeding), and bloodpurge (works to neutralize poisons).

Splinting is common, many beings are expert at neatly sewing flesh, and yes, body piercings (especially among goblinkin) and the importance of using flame or alcohol (not together!) to prevent infections related to said piercings are commonplace. (Note that it is not currently the fashion anywhere in the Heartlands to make use of facial piercings except in the nostrils and earlobes.)

Herb lore was another of the things strictly vetoed in the early days of the Realms (along with poisons, my terms of venery article, and my "Dragon Soup" article on using monster byproducts in human Realms cookery; the first two for "we don't want lawsuits if kids try these" reasons despite my promise to use entirely fictional herbs and poisons, the terms of venery because it was "unnecessary fluff," and the last one for the "some of these creatures are intelligent, so your article is in very bad taste"). More recently, the gnome vocabulary and heraldry Volo's articles suffered the same fate, but as they're owned by WotC, I can't put them into print without permission.

So Saith Ed

- - - - - - - - - -

Said common folk all know the general attitudes and interests of the deities and therefore how such clergy are LIKELY to behave, and will be wary of specific clerics if they have “heard things” that dismay them about a specific church, or priest, and to a lesser extent if the holy person is a stranger from afar (not so much if the holy person is a stranger but from the same land, and less wary still if the priest is a person they know, or knew before the person “went away and joined the church”).
In general, one “watches oneself” around clergy, avoids blundering into holy rituals or “private church matters” (if you are an average commoner not alert for war or with a “bee in your bonnet,” and you see two priests talking in the woods, you draw back out of earshot rather than creeping closer to eavesdrop, whereas an adventurer - - such as your dwarven bard - - might instinctively try to overhear), but doesn’t hate or act in a hostile manner towards clergy.


- - - - - - - - - -

The average rural person in Faerûn would know the local language of their region or race (and usually a local dialect of that, too, meaning "a subset of words and speech-pattern mannerisms/sayings understood locally but not elsewhere"), and a smattering of Common (or more, depending on how often they come into contact with travelling merchants).

In other words, almost everyone can say "Yes, No, Friend, Foe, Eat, Need, Water, Help, Hurt, Warning, [names of races, from orcs through humans, plus the "big in legend" monsters like skeletons, dragons], now, soon, tomorrow, sunrise, sunset, cold, hot, danger, safe, trap/hazard, too high, too low, let's dicker, weapon, attack."

A rural person living in a village on a steadily-used trade-road would know far more, whereas one living a village farther away from the road might not - - but anyone who regularly traveled from remote steadings and hamlets to market, or to stop over at a tavern, in that village on the trade-road would know at least a "rough working vocabulary" in Common (though stay-at-homes in his/her same household might not).
#13

rinonalyrna_fathomlin

Jun 24, 2008 10:48:53
That made me think of Baldur's Gate I, which begins in Candlekeep. Tutors everywhere, and there's a group of singers being tutored by some sort of chorus leader.

Actually, those people aren't being tutored, IIRC, they are just doing their role (which is to preserve the prophecies of Alaundo).

You are right though that there are tutors all over the place, many of which were former teachers of the PC.
#14

lord_karsus

Jun 25, 2008 21:30:33
-Rhetorical question: Would a prophecy still be a prophecy if people who know about it work to ensure by whatever means possible that it comes about?
#15

rinonalyrna_fathomlin

Jun 26, 2008 9:05:30
-Rhetorical question: Would a prophecy still be a prophecy if people who know about it work to ensure by whatever means possible that it comes about?

My answer for the real world would be no. Of course, the FR is a fantasy world with gods and magic, so it's harder for me to say.
#16

nymrohd

Jun 26, 2008 11:13:58
-Rhetorical question: Would a prophecy still be a prophecy if people who know about it work to ensure by whatever means possible that it comes about?

Yes, because the prophecy would have expected their actions to come (and may even refer to them in cryptic manners that the meddler himself may not understand until after they come to pass).
#17

lord_karsus

Jun 26, 2008 17:05:46
-Just thinking out loud.
#18

suin_bahhar_02

Jun 27, 2008 10:24:06
So what would be common misunderstandings?
What would cormyrian farmer with a pitchfork #3 have in his mind that blatantly wrong or ignorant?

To add some mystery to a backwater area locals might give some directions wrong, or they might not now enough common and give strange discriptions of monsters in the area, or even let them be outright unfriendly towards adventurers.