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-'Abeir' is a mirror image of Toril that was created long ago, by Ao, to serve as the home of the 'primordials'. One particular group of denizens of 'Abeir', Aberrations, headed by the dreaded 'Aboleth Soverignty', attempted to colonize 'Toril' long ago. At some point, around -31,000 DR, a group of deities pooled together and "flung" these would-be colonizers away, back into 'Abeir'. Now, concerning the Spellplague, the barriers keeping these two worlds separate were weakened, and 'Abeir' and 'Toril' merged, in places. The continent of Maztica was teleported away, and switched places with a landmass on 'Abeir'. Now, Maztica is in 'Abeir', and a landmass that was on 'Abeir' is where Maztica once was. Other plots of land that were on Faerûn, and presumably, plots of land that were on Osse, Anchorome, Kara-Tur and Zakhara, have also swapped places with landmasses on 'Abeir'.
-Any extra commentary...Let's try to keep it pseudointellectual. ;)
-Pseudonatural? Like this?
But i think Osse's still in!
Abeir is a World. Confirmed in Countdown to the Realms: Magic. Hope that clears up the ///// section.
-Nope. Because, what exactly entails a world? ;)
There has also been no mention of Kar-Tur or Zakhara at all, one way or the other thus far as far as I can find. If otherwise, please point out so I can read up on it.
-Yes, which is why I said that, like this got "weird" on Faerûn and Maztica, the same might have happened on other continents.
However, I have it from a reliable source that Semphar is getting two pages, and since that borders kara-Tur, I can't see how it wouldn't at least get a mention in the Semphar entry.
And you forgot one important fact about Abeir LK - the flying monkeys.
It just wouldn't be a weird enough without the flying monkeys. :P
I haven't updated my 4e FR FAQ here or at CK in awhile, but both Zakhara and Kara-Tur are still there. The last thing I heard, both would get a mention in the FRCG, but that was back when Anchorome was getting full coverage, and since that has changed, perhaps we won't be getting anything on the 'other realms' after all.
-I didn't mean in the introductory post that either Kara-Tur, Zakhara, Anchorome and/or Osse would be disappearing, like Matica did. I meant it in the sense that, since 'Abeir' manifested itself on all of Maztica and parts of Faerûn, it is quite possible that it manifested itself on parts (or all, for all we know right now) of Kara-Tur, Zakhara, Osse and/or Anchorome. I'll make that more clear, if it wasn't so already.
-I didn't mean in the introductory post that either Kara-Tur, Zakhara, Anchorome and/or Osse would be disappearing, like Matica did. I meant it in the sense that, since 'Abeir' manifested itself on all of Maztica and parts of Faerûn, it is quite possible that it manifested itself on parts (or all, for all we know right now) of Kara-Tur, Zakhara, Osse and/or Anchorome. I'll make that more clear, if it wasn't so already.
i'm pretty sure someone said Osse was still in. Baker or iakhovas.
And flying monkeys!? Does Abeir have a yellow brick road too? And a portal to Kansas?
LK, thanks for the feedback, there were things I didn't know. In fact, the Sildeyuiran Order of the Cerulean Sign wasn't mentioned in Lords Of Madness? Not as an organization of Star Elves but indeed as one of aberration hunters.
-Correct. Bruce Cordell used it in his novel Stardeep, and thus, illuminated the Faerûnian take on it.
i'm pretty sure someone said Osse was still in. Baker or iakhovas.
-Yes, I know that it's still around. Again, all I said is that just like parts of Faerûn were randomly shunted away, so too could parts of other continents been shunted away.
Thank you, LK, for giving us a FAQ about this travesty. It should be helpful for those not in the know.
-You're welcome.
Toril was the name of Jeff Grubb's home camapign world, they made it Abeir-Toril in the OGBS to ensure it appeared at the start of the cyclopedia.
Cheers
Damian
Just a minor point in an otherwise fantastic thread about the travesty of Abeir-Toril...........:headexplo
Toril was the name of Jeff Grubb's home camapign world, they made it Abeir-Toril in the OGBS to ensure it appeared at the start of the cyclopedia.
Cheers
Damian
-Yes, I clearly included that bit in the second SBLOCK box.
And flying monkeys!? Does Abeir have a yellow brick road too? And a portal to Kansas?
GIANT flying Monkeys, to be precise.
In fact, they are a very critical part of 4e FR.
Of course, you can't see them, because they are all invisible, and if you bump into one of them by accident, you won't feel them either, becase they are also incorporal.
But they're there... I just know it...
And here I thought Abeir was just something cold I ordered at a ballgame to go with my hotdog. :P
so does this mean that if the traitor were to die, he would be free to summon the Aboleth city of Xxiphu? just curious... it would make for an interesting story in my campaign...
also... when did this happen? i'm currious about the time (year or close approximation of when this happened).
so does this mean that if the traitor were to die, he would be free to summon the Aboleth city of Xxiphu? just curious... it would make for an interesting story in my campaign...
-Correct. This is why The Traitor is kept in constant stasis in Stardeep.
also... when did this happen? i'm currious about the time (year or close approximation of when this happened).
-We don't know. The only clue that we have about all of this "Abeir" stuff right now is that it was seemingly repelled circa -31,000 DR, when the Sarrukh recorded that "changing of the stars". That doesn't necessarily include the "story" of The Traitor, however.
Let's try to keep it pseudointellectual. ;)
Well, I'm out
-Yes. Originally, 'Abeir' was the name of Jeff Grubbs own campaign, that he tacked on to 'Toril' to make Abeir-Toril the first entry in the Cyclopedia of the Realms. It means 'Cradle of Life' in a long forgotten language.
You've got that backwards. Jeff Grubb's campaign world (which used the proto-Dragonlance pantheon, incidentally) was called Toril, and he suggested, as Ed Greenwood had no name for the world that Faerun existed on, that he use the name Toril for his world.
They added the random name Abeir to make it alphabetically first in the Cyclopedia, explaining it meant "Cradle of Life." The word Abeir was invented for this purpose purely because they needed a word that would fit alphabetically before "Adventuring Companies," which otherwise would have been the first entry in the Cyclopedia.
Abeir was never anyone's campaign world.
See this Jeff Grubb interview, among a number of other sources.
The Order of the Cerulean Sign, a secretive order of Star Elves based in Stardeep, located in a remote portion of the Sildeyuir, tasked with protecting and guarding 'The Traitor', seems to be the only current organization that knows of 'Abeir'. Because Mhairshaulk existed on the planet at this point, it is possible that some of the older Sarrukh or Yuan-Ti have knowledge of 'Abeir'.
The events in Stardeep do not touch on or presage Abeir, what happened to Abeir, Abeir's nature, or what will be Abeir's future fate.
From forum.candlekeep.com.
This seems a pretty unequivocal statement that nothing in Stardeep has anything to do with Abeir, which seems to mean that the majority of this FAQ is inaccurate, at least as far as official material goes. Abeir does not contain an Abolethic Sovereignity and the Cerulean Sign has no particular knowledge or relationship with Toril's sister world of Abeir.
Until we have confirmation from Rich Baker, Brian James, or someone similarly placed that Bruce Cordell was lying (or attempting to mislead with tricky wording, which amounts to the same thing), it might be a bit early to write an authoritative-sounding FAQ on the subject.
But (shrug), you're either correct or you aren't. Either way, we'll find out eventually. I thought it worth mentioning that there's reason to doubt the connections you're making.
"Fits with" isn't necessarily the same as "is the same thing." It could be that they're just similar ideas.
-Truthfully speaking, what are the odds of that?
-Truthfully speaking, what are the odds of that?
Not having read the book in question, I'm not sure. It doesn't seem hard to credit that two different people got the idea of another world being separated from Toril sometime in the past, and that these worlds were not intended by the authors to be the same thing. After all, this is essentially what happened between Toril and Earth in Ed Greenwood's original campaign, and we can probably assume that Abeir isn't Earth. Is the similarity more specific than that? The FAQ would be more helpful if you separated what we know from what you assume. What did Stardeep say, and what did James and Baker say, and what leads you to believe they were talking about the same thing?
I'm not trying to be difficult here; I'm just trying to be cautious.
Having read the novel Stardeep, I can say that it is the first novel (or perhaps the first Realms product, period) that discussed Abeir as a separate place, rather than simply a part of the planet's name.
I agree with Rino. Its clearly a part of the novel and I believe she is correct in that its the first such reference
Is Abeir in any way related with the plane of Faerie?
We don't know yet.
"How do you pronounce it?"
I vote for "A beer". As in "Hey, get me 'a beer', would you?".
I'm not challenging them or anything but there is a lot of 'Abeir' info in the three Countdown to the Realms articles.
Such as the Dragonborn realm of Tymanther replacing Unther, large sections of Chondath and western Chessenta replaced by the the Abeiran land of Shyr the Genasi population quickly set about creating a kingdom of their own, Akanûl.
And stuff like that there.
Bel
Is Abeir in any way related with the plane of Faerie? I think it would have been best if Faerun did not get too many returning planes at once and Abeir could easily serve as both.
-So far, there is nothing that shows any connections between the two. In fact, personally speaking, I think the chances of this theory being correct are nil. No offense, of course.
New question:
"How do you pronounce it?"
I vote for "A beer". As in "Hey, get me 'a beer', would you?".
-I also pronounce it "A Beer".
What are your sources for your FAQ?
-Stardeep, AGHotR, the "Countdown to the Realms" articles, and a response or two clearing things up from Rich Baker, and Brian.
Not having read the book in question, I'm not sure. It doesn't seem hard to credit that two different people got the idea of another world being separated from Toril sometime in the past, and that these worlds were not intended by the authors to be the same thing. After all, this is essentially what happened between Toril and Earth in Ed Greenwood's original campaign, and we can probably assume that Abeir isn't Earth. Is the similarity more specific than that? The FAQ would be more helpful if you separated what we know from what you assume. What did Stardeep say, and what did James and Baker say, and what leads you to believe they were talking about the same thing?
I'm not trying to be difficult here; I'm just trying to be cautious.
-Being as that the novel line and the sourcebook line are interconnected- to the point where Bruce Cordell is one of the primary designers working on the 4-Gotten Realms, I find that extremely unlikely.
"How do you pronounce it?"
"flar-ee-dah"
"How do you pronounce it?"
The proper pronunciation is, "Ai-BEER", per the 1E Cyclopedia of the Realms.
-Being as that the novel line and the sourcebook line are interconnected- to the point where Bruce Cordell is one of the primary designers working on the 4-Gotten Realms, I find that extremely unlikely.
Someone deciding to use a similar idea twice doesn't seem unlikely at all to me; most authors end up doing that from time to time. But we'll find out soon enough.
18DELTA
-Post #14 should interest you. Its by BRJ.
18DELTA
The events in Stardeep do not touch on or presage Abeir, what happened to Abeir, Abeir's nature, or what will be Abeir's future fate.
Have we figured out how to reconcile this statement of Bruce's with the material in this FAQ yet?
Have we figured out how to reconcile this statement of Bruce's with the material in this FAQ yet?
-The bit in Stardeep, not particularly, no. No information on the topic has since been mentioned, and it is likely that nothing will be mentioned on the topic, given the depth of information released for the setting. I haven't decided if I am going to pick up Bruce Cordell's next book in the Abolethic Sovereignty trilogy. While I doubt that in it, any new information will be shed on the "prehistory" (of sorts) of the planet during so long ago, or of the Abolethic Sovereignty, if there is a source that might shed light, it'd be in one of Bruce's books, given that that plotline is his work.