Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 sfdragon Dec 02, 2009 16:59:54	anybody have any homegrown reasons on why they used the the core bane symbol?? my reasoning is that after he lost the Black Network to Cyric, it was decided to change it since some concider the Black Hand to be linked with the Zhents...
#2 Mr_Miscellany Dec 02, 2009 17:53:52	That's a pretty good reason.  Very straightforward. Personally I don't like the Bane Symbol in the Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide.  It's ugly, looks like some sort of bone-claw-thing and isn't in the slightest way evocative of what Bane is/represents so far as I can tell. The three claw parts hint at a tri-partite nature to Bane, but this is one time where we don't need any more of that.  Sure there was Bane, Myrkul and Bhaal, but in the intervening years in the setting and in real life Bane has been reborn (literally in the setting) into a purely singular form. So I don't use that symbol for Bane in my campaign. If pressed to render up a reason why the symbol exists.....well I don't know.  Yours is probably the best, SF.  ;)
#3 The_Silversword Dec 02, 2009 21:11:50	Yeah I dont llike Bane's new symbol either, They should of kept with the Black Hand. It really kinda peeves me because they say core Bane and FR Bane are not the same deity, so then why does FR Bane use Core Banes symbol? It makes no sense to me, unless they are the same? Maybe Bane has decided that the Realms are just to small for him now and hes began spreading his influence across the Multiverse. I think the symbol changed because most people saw the hand as a sure sign of evil, and Banes trying to broaden out some, so the new symbol, which is supposed to be eye slits on a helm look more fighterish, that way he can pass himself off as a war god, a very regimented war god to compete with Tempus's chaotic nature. The symbol does look like a dragon claw too, perhaps to reflect his domination over Tiamat?
#4 18DELTA Dec 02, 2009 21:50:55	Thats a valid point about Tiamat. Didn't think out it in that context. Lets see one claw for dominion over Hoar, one for dominion over Tiamat, and one for dominion over Talona. We all know who rules behind closed doors...
#5 Nai_Calus Dec 02, 2009 21:53:18	The same question can be asked about pretty much any deity who had a symbol change that leaves them with the same symbol as a core god. Corellon, for example. The star doesn't make any more sense than the crescent moon did, makes the name of the primary monthly religious celebration for him not make sense to the new people, and it also implies that 1. The elves have no artistic sense anymore, since that thing is both boringly plain and ugly and 2. That the elves for some reason decided to change something they've been using to represent their primary deity, the pinnacle of all things elven, for *tens of thousands of years*. Not to mention that Corellon himself uses the crescent moon symbol, and he's been using it even longer than the elves of Toril. What? Seriously? I mean, fine, they didn't want to pay the artist for the 3.5 rendition of the holy symbol to use it again, but they did new art for the symbol for FR, so why not... Just a new rendition of the old one? Corellon's crescent is sufficiently different from core Sehanine's crescent that the two are not easily confused. Which, there's probably your 'reason', and the reason for Bane's too. Nevermind if it makes sense or not, things are ~new~ so they have to ~change~, and things must *match*, even if the gods involved aren't even the same gods(Then again, what little they've bothered writing about core Corellon they've pretty much stolen unaltered from the original, which leaves us with an 'Unaligned' god who seems suspiciously Good).
#6 The_Silversword Dec 02, 2009 22:07:58	Nai just had to bring Corellon in to this! Valid point though, If were taliking about Banes Symbol change, we might as well talk about all of them. I kinda like Corellons new symbol personly, I think it makes a little more sense than a moon. It should probably be a sun, but them people would get him confused with Amaunator. My main beef with Corellons new symbol is it looks too much like Loths now. Loth should have a spider or something, not a starburst or whatever, that really makes no sense at all.
#7 sfdragon Dec 02, 2009 22:11:13	Banes old FR version was prefered , and the moon of corellon was also preferred. ironically, one of the images in one of the magazines not to long ago had the FR Bane seal on a set of armor
#8 iakhovas Dec 02, 2009 22:25:57	ironically, one of the images in one of the magazines not to long ago had the FR Bane seal on a set of armor You may be thinking of the adventure Monument of the Ancients. I intentionally commissioned the art to use the older symbol of Bane since the Knights of the Black Fist are apostates, having turned away from the orthodox church of Bane headquartered in Mulmaster.
#9 18DELTA Dec 02, 2009 22:30:16	ironically, one of the images in one of the magazines not to long ago had the FR Bane seal on a set of armor You may be thinking of the adventure Monument of the Ancients. I intentionally commissioned the art to use the older symbol of Bane since the Knights of the Black Fist are apostates, having turned away from the orthodox church of Bane headquartered in Mulmaster. Good to know. Can you share anything about this Order?
#10 Nai_Calus Dec 02, 2009 22:40:54	Neither the star or the crescent moon really make any sense for Corellon, since he has no particular association with either other than incidentally. The old crescent, though, particularly the 3e one with all the decoration, felt a lot more elven. Well, I suppose you could say the star is supposed to represent the one Sahandrian was forged from, but that's one hell of a reach and not particularly applicable as a holy symbol either. I've got a 4e Sun Elf(excuse me, Eladrin) cleric of Corellon I'll be starting soon. He's still a youngster, only 159, but he was born in 1320 DR and was trained on Evermeet, and the Holy Symbol he's carrying around is the old silver crescent moon. In fact, he considers the star to be a heresy. >D ...At the same time he tries to spread the faith to non-elves. Ahh, atypical characters. (Atypically of me, he's actually fairly weak in his faith these days. He was on the mainland when the Spellplague hit and thinks Evermeet was destroyed and he partially blames Corellon for it. He blames those damned pesky human gods more though. :P)
#11 sfdragon Dec 02, 2009 22:43:44	I too would like some info on that order, maybe spoil us over at loremaster or candlekeep?? and yes that was the artwork..... cometo think of it, I saw a 4e eldarin or elf somewhere with a crescent moon...... anyway I much prefer the old symbol
#12 amedahast Dec 03, 2009 11:40:15	I've always thought of Bane's symbol as a black jeweled gauntlet or a black unarmored hand with sharp nails. A three-fingered claw seems like a mistake (which does happen), more appropriate for Malar the beastlord, because there's nothing in the old or new lore to suggest such a claw symbol for Bane. If you absolutely had to, or if you prefer the new symbol to the old, I guess you could come up with a little story about Bane coming to dominate a particularly powerful and ancient dragon which he might use now as a mount.  But that's sort of stretching things.  The claw of the dragon could remind his faithful that Bane intends to dominate all species, and that even the most powerful of dragons will bend to his will.  Maybe something like that.