Perhaps pockets of spellplague represent remnants of the corrupted weave and the corruption drove them mad? Would then purifying the spellplague pockets partly restore the weave and clear the sharn's mind?
Just looking for thoughts on this thanks
-Being as that the Sharn were the "guardians" of the Weave, the disruption to it, via the Spellplague, is certainly to blame. It is likely that originated in the Sharnlands, in the Underdark. Perhaps the Sharnlands are now "Plaguelands", or whatever they're being called. To "fix" them, though, you'd definitely have to travel to the source of the Sharn hivemind.
I was wondering if it had anything to do with the developments among drow... didn't the sharn have a connection with the drow race of old? With Corellon's curse being changed, I would not be surprised if the elves managed to mess up again ;)
According to Blackstaff, some of them did - and they chose to remain sharn because they would have reverted to drow forms if they'd regained their individuality.
I was wondering if it had anything to do with the developments among drow... didn't the sharn have a connection with the drow race of old?
-Certain Dark Elves turned into Sharn to avoid being transformed into Drow, and to protect the secrets of Miyeritar, yes.
I like the spin on them... It makes sense (in a spellplague killing the weave and corrupting things kind of way) that something like this would happen to them.
I don't, really. The spellplague-infected Sharn and their new mysterious plans have the "feel" of a secret thing the developers will release at some point, either in DDI or a future novel. It's one of those things where, as a DM, I'd dislike running an adventure (fleshing out their secret plans myself) only to have it be radically contradicted by something released the next day in DDI.
It's a little "too" pregnant for my tastes. Not at all like the clear indications in the beloved Old Gray box 1E Realms where they delineated exactly what would and what wouldn't get updated by later novels and source manuals.
It isn't hard. however, to ignore what comes out, but I like the bits they gave us here. I agree that it seems to good to be left alone.
Wasn't Rhymanthin, the hidden city of hope, made up of Sharn stuff, where the Sharn could easily reach through to attack wrongdoers in the city? If so, then this new hidden city may have a large spellplague problem.
-No, no it was not. It was a "normal 'ol" Elven city. The Sharn do have the natural ability to "reach" through things and places. Monsters of Faerûn has their stats. I don't have it with me at this moment to elaborate. If you want me to, just let me know, and I'll run upstairs and get the book.
I like the spin on them... It makes sense (in a spellplague killing the weave and corrupting things kind of way) that something like this would happen to them.
-Yeah, I'm going to have to agree with Therise, and cast my 'Nay' vote concerning the Sharn. Going from preserving magical treasures and secrets to wanting to trash everything is a little too drastic, for my appreciation. At least, as it stands now, anyway. Perhaps, if we are told a little bit more as to why they are doing what they are doing, as opposed to just "the Spellplague made them go crazy".
-Like, for instance, if we find out that in Plaguelands areas, the Weave is slowly knitting itself back together, and only once the entire planet is engulfed in Plaguelands can the Weave return, thus making the actions of the Sharn a lot more consistent.
I can understand how that could be a drag, I had to blow canon and wing it when I ran through finding the Elf Blades... big mess on my part because I actually got my wife to read the books and play in FR. She wasn't happy...
It isn't hard. however, to ignore what comes out, but I like the bits they gave us here. I agree that it seems to good to be left alone.
Oh, definitely. I ignored a lot of weird things from the novels in my version of the Realms, don't get me wrong. Not only during the 2E but also the 3E period. Time of Troubles for one.
But with 4E it's a lot harder. If I use 4E rules and incorporate the Sharn as is, the crunch for their abilities needs to be explained in some way (that is, if I change it such that there's no Spellplague, then I have to come up with reasons why they have spellplague-ish abilities and I have to concoct something else explaining why they're working with goblins... it's a ton of stuff to alter, if I want to use the crunch "as is" in 4E rules). Then, later, when the designers follow through with their own explanation of the Sharn and their motives, I have to deal with that junk too. Bleah.
"While much of the building material came from the Moor itself, Tsarra watched some Sharn shed their oily black skins as the returned to their original forms, the nude Art-workers weaving their former skins into their new city."
So not the original city, just built in it's image, with a few pieces of architecture from those involved in the ritual.
From Blackstaff pg 340
"While much of the building material came from the Moor itself, Tsarra watched some Sharn shed their oily black skins as the returned to their original forms, the nude Art-workers weaving their former skins into their new city."
So not the original city, just built in it's image, with a few pieces of architecture from those involved in the ritual.
-I am not reading that as the city being made up of "Sharn juice".
-I am not reading that as the city being made up of "Sharn juice".
Pg 340... "The streets and defensive walls kept the black-as-pitch hue of the Sharn, and Tsarra knew that malefactors on those streets would face the three-mawed avengers that could form from any wall or street."
They left their very essence embedded in the city and are linked to it, at least that is how I interpret the books ending. But if the Sharn are CE and bear the spellplague, then this becomes a liability more than a defense.
I will agree that it is not made up entirely of Sharn, but they are bound to it in some arcane way, so if they can be corrupted, then the city itself could be as well. Not trying to start an argument over the make-up, but pointing out a vulnerability and a continuity/cannon issue.
I dunno... "weaving their former skins" into the buildings is very lyrical. Like casting off energy that has to go somewhere. It could be anything, really.
I will agree that it is not made up entirely of Sharn, but they are bound to it in some arcane way, so if they can be corrupted, then the city itself could be as well. Not trying to start an argument over the make-up, but pointing out a vulnerability and a continuity/cannon issue.
-If I recall, the city is not even mentioned in the FRCG. I know it's not on the map.
I dunno... "weaving their former skins" into the buildings is very lyrical.
-Right, that's how I saw it. Symbolism.
Personally I am glad they are at least still around, and at least in this context they are much more ominous, mysterious, and have more potential to act as PC antagonists.
Also, the (short) description for Rhymanthiin in the campaign guide mentions nothing about the Sharn and/or any harm they can or might potentially bring to it. In fact it states that the city holds secret power against corrupt magic, and that those with malice in their heart cannot find it. So judging from that I would say that if there were Sharn guarding the city, that they either:
A) remain benevolent and were untouched by the spellplague
B) their planar connections to the realm were severed during the chaos inflicted on the cosmology, and thus can no longer reach the realm, nor find it.
Also--perhaps I recall incorrectly--but I was under the impression that the Sharn who participated in the ritual disjoined into their individual selves, either before or afterwards, and thus in their non-sharn forms they became much of the population of the city.
My point is that the Sharn have a tie to the city and given their current behavior that leaves a question in my mind.
If you were out to spread chaos and spellplague, wouldn't you start with those you knew best, who's minds and thoughts you shared for centuries?
Also, perhaps I recall incorrectly, but I thought the Sharn who participated in the ritual disjoined into their individual selves, and thus formed much of the population of the city.
Most did, but some chose to remain as Sharn (with the reason being stated that they would have reverted into drow forms).
Also, perhaps I recall incorrectly, but I thought the Sharn who participated in the ritual disjoined into their individual selves, and thus formed much of the population of the city.
-Only those residents who were not originally Miyeritari Dark Elves, who chose not to revert to their original forms, as not to transform into Drow upon that initial transformation.
Viva la Erevan Ilesere! Maybe he'll have something to do with this spellplague, for good or just for kicks. ;)
That said, I have not read the trilogy, and would prefer to avoid further details, beyond those major death spoilers that were trumpeted on these forums and elsewhere--many without regard for those who have not yet read them.
I would assume the redemption in Ascendancy of the Last would negate any self loathing or guilt that good natured drow have towards themselves, and thus in turn allow those remaining drow-sharns to revert back to their humanoid forms.
-The events of said novel takes place four years after the events of Blackstaff, so there's plenty of time for added characterization and complexity to the "plot", in theory. That said, I did not detect self-loathing or guilt as the reasons for the Dark Elf-Sharn choosing not to revert to their original forms. I saw it more as fear, as in they'd be transforming back into their native forms, only to be inherently changed forever more (again, keeping in mind that the events of AotL take place in the future, and climax in something that I don't think anyone would have foreseen). By staying in their Sharn forms, there was the possibility that, perhaps someday, they could revert to their original, actual forms, not Drow forms.
Do I laugh or cry?
I wonder if Crossroads and Fey Mounds will, or have been affected by the spellplague?
-With the Plane of Faerie being "closer" to the Prime Material Plane, Fey Crossroads and all of those things are even more common than before. They're still hard to find, though.
-Like, for instance, if we find out that in Plaguelands areas, the Weave is slowly knitting itself back together, and only once the entire planet is engulfed in Plaguelands can the Weave return, thus making the actions of the Sharn a lot more consistent.
I had a similar thought :P The Plaguelands are necessary to resurrect the Weave -- at the expense of life as it exists on Toril.
The heroes have to fight against the reconstruction of the Weave in order to save the world! Oh the irony.
Also, there could just be different factions of Sharn, some got all broken in the head 'cause of the 'plague and are working at odds to each other. Sounds like a neat campaign...
I included it in this NPC/PC description.
...and thus in turn allow those remaining drow-sharns to revert back to their humanoid forms.
Yes, after AotL it's quite likely that the (after Blackstaff) remaining Sharn transformed back to dark elves, since from that time it would have been possible to do so.
Also, there could just be different factions of Sharn, some got all broken in the head 'cause of the 'plague and are working at odds to each other. Sounds like a neat campaign...
This is the path I follow in my upcoming Dragon article, Ecology of the Sharn.
This is the path I follow in my upcoming Dragon article, Ecology of the Sharn.
That would imply that some Sharn are not infected by Spellplague energy. Yes? No?
This is the path I follow in my upcoming Dragon article, Ecology of the Sharn.
I'm looking forward to
I had a similar thought :P The Plaguelands are necessary to resurrect the Weave -- at the expense of life as it exists on Toril.
-I wasn't thinking necessarily at the expense of life...More along the lines of, it just happens to be a side-effect that it creates some funky effects in the areas that are "contaminated", and where the Weave would be reknitting itself. Just like lightning isn't inherently harmful, in and of itself. It just is, but it certainly can be damaging.
Did they just replace their old enemies, the Phaerimm?
It just seems to be another heavy-handed way of offing high-level do-gooders.
Did they just replace their old enemies, the Phaerimm?
-When you look at it in a very basic fashion, sure.