| Post/Author/DateTime | Post |
|---|---|
| #1RUMPLESTIXMar 08, 2009 0:21:44 | This is kind of a narrow topic for a thread but I am hoping to satisfy my curiousity. There have been some FR works that mention the half-orc (3rd ed. FRCs, player's guide to Faerun Races of Faerun, etc), so I am looking for an answer based upon those works. In fourth edition, most races either get a +2 bonus to stats that fit into 2 different pairs of defenses (str & con modify Fort, dex & int modify reflex, wis & cha modify will) or they receive a +2 bonus to two abilities within the same pair and have it coupled to a racial defense bonus to one of the defenses. So, the half-orc is coming out and we now know that it has a +2 bonus in strength and dexterity. ![]() I figured they would not use a +2 bonus to strength and constitution because it would then be a copy of the orc PC stats listed in the monster manual and I believe they would wish to make it different. I thought it should be +2 wisdomm instead of +2 dexterity. Among other things I was under the impression that they would be hard-headed and difficult to sway from something they set their mind to. Also, I think that would go with the fact that some of the 3.5 regions for half-orcs gave them fearless as a regional feat. Also, I think it would fit well with a half-orc taking the orc scout PrC from the Silver Marches supplement. The reason I am bringing this up with respect to 3rd edition and lore is that in discussions elsewhere the subject came up as to how they have been portrayed previously with respect to determining what bonuses they should have received to match the flavor. So, based upon the lore and portrayal of half-orcs in novels and the fluff of splatbooks, do you think the half-orcs should have received a +2 bonus in dexterity or wisdom to go with the +2 bonus in strength and why do you think so? Anyone? ![]() |
| #2markustay63Mar 08, 2009 0:38:57 | I can undestand it - they aren't as hardy as true Orcs, but they are a little better at handling a weapon which they get from their human side. I'm not at all familiar with the 4e rules, but if they work anything like the older editions, that gives them an edge to hit and damage - not bad at all. If I were going with an Eberron Orc (or an FR Ondonti), I'd say Con and Wis - tough, and the Wisdom play into their druidic traditions. |
| #3the_shamanMar 08, 2009 6:32:39 | Pathfinder Beta gives them strength and wisdom - I think it is a good combination for 4E as well, especially as (afaik) no other race gives it. |
| #4borrisMar 08, 2009 6:43:57 | Str and Wis would make perfect sense for gray orcs, but less so for mountain orcs, for which I'd leave the bonus to Str and Con. As for half-orcs, well, they're all known to be stonger than humans, but it's hard to pick the second bonus. How come half-elves are more charismatic or tough than either parents but don't inherit their elven parent's dexterity or wisdom? I guess it all comes down on what classes you want your half-orcs to favor. From the classes in the PHB alone, Str and Dex makes them good brawny rogues, flail or blade fighters, or any type or ranger, all classes typically associated with half-orcs. Str and Wis makes them good battle clerics, melee rangers, and avenging paladins, which don't fit as well with the iconic half-orc character. |
| #5kave99Mar 15, 2009 22:59:27 | I think that it makes perfect sense if you come from a 1st ed head space. The Wis might make more sense to me if I had gotten started with Eberron, but I came from a time when playing a 1/2 Orc was all about the Fighter/ Thief, Fighter/ Assassin wich translats vary well to the 4th ed ranger. The 1/2 Orc Cleric was a nice diversion but not viable in a Campaign play, it was so suboptimal as to be unplayable in all but one shot games and NPC's due to the strangeness of 1st Ed racial / multi class rules. |
| #6BadCatManMar 16, 2009 0:25:56 | Given only a choice between Dex and Wis, I'd go with both according to which type of half-orc we're looking at in FR. The half-orcs born of Grey Orcs would get the Wisdom, like their parents. Same goes for half-orcs of more civilised orcish cultures: the Odonti (sp?), the orcs of Airspur in Chessenta (classic FR). They apply their warrior instincts to trade and politics, and know when someone's trying to trick the "dumb" orc. On the other hand, half-orcs born in traditional orc tribes or alone in the big city, the big dumb ones, would be more combat-focused, or crime-focused, so they should have the Dexterity for it. |
| #7markustay63Mar 16, 2009 12:33:10 | Agreed. Mountain (Green) Orcs are more the stereo-type (Tokienesque), whereas Grey Orcs are the newer, 'wiser' model, which we find in Eberron and Warcraft. Nothing wrong with having both - if other races can have their 'good and bad' versions, it's perfectly natural that Orcs also have various branches. |
| #8lady_rolindinMar 17, 2009 3:28:44 | So what would you make a half-orog (deep orc) then? The Orog have an ecl of 3. |
| #9BadCatManMar 17, 2009 3:58:11 | Orogs have a Charisma bonus and Dexterity penalty, so probably a Charisma bonus then. |
| #10markustay63Mar 17, 2009 12:27:26 | A half of a Half? ![]() AFAIK, something like that falls well beyond the scope of the rules. |