I guess Tyr should be on the title list, since I prefered him to Torm...
i really, really hate Torm. almost as much as I hate THACO.
anyhoo, I'm thinking about running a campaign soon, and if I run it in FR, I'm thinking of making part of the conflict for the campaign involve the return of those three gods, possibly also Tyr(who I think is only dead because he is so close to the norse Tyr.) and if no one in the group strongly objects killing that bastard-pally-god-gone-wrong-thing, Torm.
Any thoughts on creative ways to accomplish all that? Relationships between those gods and others that might help? Maybe Bane could die too, get usurped by...idk Obould. :D
Maybe use Shaundakul's old dislike of Shar, the return of Myth Drannor(of which he was long ago the parton god, IIRC) as the spark for some events that lead to the temporary release of Cyric, who Mask has been whispering to for years...Cyric does some god killing again, in the chaos Obould becomes a greater god because Mask teaches him how to absord the godhood of another god (which is why he let Shar absord him, to learn how to do it, having made a deal with...someone...that let him keep just enough of himself seperate to influence events) in exchange for just enough of that power to regenerate himself...
somewhere in that kelemvor could kill Cyric as Cyric tries to take his pad...
Ao brings back Helm as the greater god of Balance. He is now charged with preventing this kind of crap from happening in the future. It turns out Helm liked not being a god anymore, so he ask Ao to bring back Tyr as a favour for Helm accepting the odious responsibility of keeping the gods in line, and since torm just died a horrible, horrible death, Ao goes with it, cuz he's a nice guy like that...
ok...maybe I should stop. feel free to ignore all but the basic premise of the thread, and offer general advice. :P
btw, the idea was for much of what happens in godland to be revealed indirectly to the pcs as they progress, and try to save the world from the terrifying consequences of an all out war between the gods.
oh, maybe Mask's Chosen get the shadar-kai to start worshiping Mask and funneling power to him...hmmm
I miss Helm and Mask.
Tyr I can do without.( not found of Torm either)
I have heard nothing about Shaundakul's death, I do believe he will show up as a primal spirit instead of a diety.
I miss Helm and Mask.
Tyr I can do without.( not found of Torm either)
curious. why do you think he'd show up as a primal spirit?
Even Lurue think was called both a goddess and a primal spirit...
So I think he became a primal spirit.
( there are also wild rumors that Eilistraee is an archfey......)
Wow Doc, you hate Torm almost as much as THAC0? Thats some serious hate there! I never really liked Torm either, but over the years hes been starting to grow on me, and I do see him as a fitting replacement to Tyr, who i never really liked in the Realms. I dont know he just didnt seem Norse enough to me in the Realms.
But any way I havnt heard anything about Shaundakul being offed, so I'm assuming he's still around. That seems to be the general rule, that if they havnt specifically said that something is gone, that we are to assume that its still there. It is possible that Shaundakul is now considered Primal now. It would be nice if they filled us in more on the Gods. I havnt heard anything about Finder Wyvernspur either. It would of made sense for them to keep Shaundakul around, now that Myth Drannor is back and he was the patron deity of that city.
But yeah you could go about bringing those gods back into your Realms a number of ways. One way would be to say that nothing happened to them in the first place and they're still around doing their thing. Although having the PCs go on some quest to bring these gods back would be a truly epic quest! And if they succeeded they would have a few gods who owed them big time! Always handy to have a god who owes you a favor.
but what about his patronage of myth drannor, and the whole "explore places, and then tell people about them." thing? and the whole not liking Shar because she's too into keeping secrets?
silver: exactly, and I plan on it. I think it would be awesome to see Shaundakul involved in the growing tensions between Netheril and, well, everyone. He doens't like Shar, he is, or was MD's patron, and MD is close with Cormyr, which is basically the US to Netheril's USSR these days. (does that make MD like the UK?)
well, not so much him as his followers.
rangers are always useful in a war, right? :P
also, Torm. sigh...it's just that he actually encourages his church to go out and forcefully bring law to places they decide aren't lawful enough, or flirt with corruption, etc.
He's basically the embodyment of the things I always hated most about the judgemental d-bag interpretation of paladins.
I'm just "Chaotic" enough that the Tormish Church, and Elturgard are up there with Netheril and the sharrans in my book.
and don't get me started on how I feel about Shar...
I miss Bhaal.
I miss Bhaal.
I feel your pain. I had an Assassin character and to have the DM tell me that my character is dead cause my god died!? Man that was a lame way to go. Dont get me wrong though i do dig Cyric. Hes everything an evil good should be, hes diabolical, he plans things out, and hes bat **** crazy! But the Three Dark Lords (Bane, Bhaal, and Myrkul) were awesome in their time. Banes managed to come back...
I propose that Zehir be revealed as an aspect of Bhaal! Who the hell is Zehir anyway? Ive heard of alot of different god before, but i dont ever remember him being in the Forgotten Realms.
Zehir got in the 4e realms becuase someone in the line of things goofed, either atari or hasbro.
makes no diffirence who. Zehir was forced into the realms via storms of Zehir by Obsidian, the 2nd expansion pack to nwn2.
they told OEI to put him in as he was a 4e god..... and soz was and still is a 3.5 game.
well thats how I heard it.
He's an upstart, say he's bhaal so we can get rid of him.
Yeah I think Bhaal would make for a better god of poison, and I've actually heard of Bhaal so thats definitely points in his favor.
So Zehir got in there because of a video game!? Lame!
Yeah I think Bhaal would make for a better god of poison, and I've actually heard of Bhaal so thats definitely points in his favor.
no, he was put in the Realms becuase someone who does paper work, messed up.
at that point, I enjoyed Storms of Zehir.
had Volo in it
you start out on a doomed boat ride to chult.
Umberlee wracks your boatride...
you wake up on shore...
you are forced to go to some city, you get a job,
do this, do that.
yeah It fits in the FR rather well.
does it explain how he came to the realms... well been while isnce I played it last, I was playing dragon age and fallout III recently
The only gods I miss. and honestly there are still some around I'd like to see offed. violently.
I guess Tyr should be on the title list, since I prefered him to Torm...
i really, really hate Torm. almost as much as I hate THACO.
I don't suppose you've read this Dungeon article?
www.wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd/d...
I know the author, too. Really tall. Kind of a nerd, really, but hey--he likes Helm.
Cheers
Not an article by Erik Scott de Bie, man, I hate that guy!
I know, right? Always shamelessly plugging his own stuff and all.
Cheers
Re: Original Post . . .The only gods I miss. and honestly there are still some around I'd like to see offed. violently.
I guess Tyr should be on the title list, since I prefered him to Torm...
i really, really hate Torm. almost as much as I hate THACO.
I don't suppose you've read this Dungeon article? www.wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd/d... I know the author, too. Really tall. Kind of a nerd, really, but hey--he likes Helm.
I love this guy!
upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/57/L...
pic related.
also, I really need to re-sub to DDI.
edit: looks like a great article. from a storytelling perspective, I greatly appreciate the "fanatical holy order who, while technically good, could very easily be the antagonists." thing. Like the Children in wheel of time. Dig it.
and it gives me an opportunity to lay a beat down on some followers of Torm. Possibly as a faithful of another lawful good deity.
Heck, I'd love to have a character play a pally or avenger of Torm who is opposed to such an organization, as he believes that iron fisted control is exclusively the ballywick of evil tyrants, and will eventually corrupt even the most well intentioned servant of Torm.
and it will be enough of what I've been asking for that I'll just have to have it.
cuz that's how my luck runs.
currently its not
I'd consider it if I thought itwas worth it.
currently its not
once phb3 comes out, it will be worth it for me. Once i can find work again, I'll probably pay for a month every three or four months, unless i'm being paid well enough, in which case I'll save up and buy a year.
Mask and Sharndarkul I can't help you with these as I don't know how they died. Sorry...if you could sum it up I might get a idea.
Helm: His death never sat well with me. I would probably have it involved Baldur's Gate and the Flaming Fist Mercenary company(are they still around?). As previously this was the center of Helm worship. Probably have somebody send the adventures to collect Relics and such to resurect him...probably in the end the NPC giving up his life force to do so.
Tyr: hehehe...I actualy came up with a idea previously and you'll like it because it mean killing or reducing Torms strength and could be tied in fairly well with the above idea. Pretty much when back in the Times of Trouble when Torm fought Bane ans both died Torm gained a trait that slowly corrupted him...ambition. He was the one who set up the duel between Helm and Tyr using his position of trust to remove the God who sees all...he was the one who back stabbed Tyr as he was defeating the army of demons...so he will be the one in charge. The PCs are working for god from the start to gather evidence of Torms...evil. The god is Illmater. Since this realy epic type of campaign there is alot of ways to bring back both gods. The mere fact that Torm is discredited could meran a sudden influx of worship for Helm and Tyr that could revive them. And well Torm does not have to die at the end...he just ends up being a servant of Bane.
Just a couple of thoughts...
Interesting thoughts on Torm becoming ambitious and corrupted, but I think I'd personally rather play with the idea of Torm worshipers becoming so overzealous that they are as much a threat as the worshipers of evil gods. that and Erik Scott De Bie's Eye of Justice bit, which is made of pure, pharmaceutical grade win.
I would strongly urge fans of Helm to check out the Eye of Justice article on DDI and/or my novel, Downshadow.
And that's all for the shameless pluggage. :D
Cheers
Glad you approve, DBW.
I would strongly urge fans of Helm to check out the Eye of Justice article on DDI and/or my novel, Downshadow.
And that's all for the shameless pluggage. :D
Cheers
I only admit this because I've known enough writers to know that it's important for you guys to hear stuff like this.
I'm sick right now, but when I'm not, I'm going to do my friend's epicly horrible kitchen full of dishes for him for 15 bucks, 7 dollars or that is going to the purchase of downshadow.
Yeah. Because I has no cash, and I read the sample chapter, I think on your website, and I gotta read the rest.
Which is frustrating because I also need to read the third book of the Erevis Cale Trilogy, and the other trilogy by Kemp. The two of you are costing me too much damn money! :D
Also, don't feel pressured--by me or by anyone--to spend your hard-earned bucks on anything in particular. Make your own purchasing decisions!
Also, have you tried used bookstores? Or perhaps the public library?
Cheers
no nothing, nothing of the wanderer...
I'm just hoping that if I mention it often enough he'll get some attention somewhere.
At this point, I'd be happy with a ddi article.
Dude, good luck with the no cash thing. I know what that's like, and it sucks.
Also, don't feel pressured--by me or by anyone--to spend your hard-earned bucks on anything in particular. Make your own purchasing decisions!
Also, have you tried used bookstores? Or perhaps the public library?
Cheers
Hah. No worries, man. I haven't checked the library yet, thanks for the reminder. Used bookstore didn't have them last time I checked. Well, last time I checked I was just looking for your stuff, and some non dnd related stuff, I suppose they might have Kemp's stuff, and it's been long enough that it's worth a recheck anyway, since used bookstore stock tends to be fairly fluid.
My only request is that if you like it, you post a review (like here on the boards or on Amazon, or both) to get more people to read it.
Cheers
Yeah, some authors don't push people toward libraries and used bookstores. Personally, I'd rather you be reading my stuff than getting bummed because you aren't able/willing to front the cash for a purchase.
My only request is that if you like it, you post a review (like here on the boards or on Amazon, or both) to get more people to read it.
Cheers
Fair enough.
Are you, by any chance, familiar with Cory Doctorow?
for some reason, I think you'd like his novel "Little Brother."
Cheers
No Wizards ?
Meanwhile, until he does, Mask is dead, but his (surviving) Chosen are still hanging out in his pad in the shadowfell...baking shadowcookies or something. :P
And the rapier wielding Eric Scott De Bie (is "de" capitolised?) gave us some Helm love in the articles he mentioned above, and in Downshadow. (all I'll say is, he didn't change continuity or anything, but they're worthy reads for anyone who liked Helm.)
As for Shandakul, I'm just hoping that some author will get inspired. I'd really love to see something involving a follower/some followers of Shaundakul working with Myth Drannor, Cormyr and/or the Dalelands against Netheril and Sembia. (You may remember that Shaundakul wasn't a fan of Shar, and Myth Drannor is allied with Cormyr again, and Cormyr at least is actively opposing Netheril, where Shar is much loved. Shaundakul, being the one time patron of Myth Drannor, is a great god for characters fighting the Netherese incursion.
I'm working on some kind of monk assassin rogue gone wrong thing, with Ghost of Eventide PP, who will worship Shaundakul, if allowed by the DM. basically an infiltrator striker/controller with a history as a second story man is very displeased with the Netherese influence on his homeland, and as a follower of Shaundakul, really doesn't like the idea of a Sharran state gaining prominence.
OT: Never heard of him--I'll check that out when the opportunity arises!
If it helps, he offers all his works as free pdf downloads from his website. You can also get fan made transitions of his works into other formats, like audio, etc at his site.
craphound.com/littlebrother/download/
worth checking out both for the books, since you can check them out without a purchase, and then decide if they're worth paying for a physical copy (i think he still also has a donation program that sends money to educators groups and/or sends physical copies of Little Brother or other of his works to teachers who want them in their classrooms), and if you're interested at all in digital copyright issues and all that jazz, he's pretty much the technology and freedom guy.
When you want to talk about BS history vs truthful history in the US, you bring up Howard Zinn. Someday, Cory Doctorow will be that guy for the history of copyright law, digital speach/assembly freedom, and the interaction of digital technology and freedom in general in the early 21st century, and will probably be referenced long after he's dead.
Heh, I sound like a fricken publishing company goon talking up one of my guys, don't I? :P