I may still only play 3rd Ed rules but I will positively buy the newer books taking place after the spell plague.
With authors like Erik Scott De Bie, Rosemary Jones, Steven Schend, and the others that have written (or are in the process of writing) such fantastic stories
there is no way that the stories could get anything but better.
Story lines I want to see more of
Shadowbane from Erik Scott De Bie's Downshadow book
Tasteful nod to previous, pre spellplague stories and a fantastic, fast paced
thriller.
The Carvers from Rosemary Jones's City of the Dead.
Wonderful description of the graveyard and a sneak peek into all (some) of it's inner workings. Well developed cast of characters that begs for sequels.
The Spell plague wasn't an end to the Realms...just an end of an era...time moves on...and the stories are still rocking.
Blackstaff Tower by Steven Schend..Awesome lore and story line.
Mistshore has also one of the best locations i have read about in a long time
Downshadow has the COOLEST rogue/paladin character concept. Fast paced as well
City of the Dead has a very well told story line and reveals Ed approved lore about the graveyard.
Before I read the series I heard some reviews about they were all "Spellscar this" and "Spellplague that"
NOT true...granted they do have spell plague stuff in them...but how could you not? But in every novels case the author never hits you over the head with the Spell plague or Scaring...it is used as a character defining point or a plot helper...or even a character motivator. But IMHO it is never over used. All the authors were very careful about that.
And after reading them...I sat back and thought to myself...different...but it's still the Realms.
And after reading them...I sat back and thought to myself...different...but it's still the Realms.
-That's where I have trouble mustering the will to read said books, being as though it is still the Forgotten Realms, it's not one that I particularly like, as a whole. Steve Schend and Eric De Bie are both good authors, given their sourcebooks/novel credentials. I was never too interested in Dragonlance, and as such, I never read any Dragonlance novels. Likewise, regardless of the authors, I'm not too keen on the 4e Forgotten Realms, and as such, I don't feel that inner need to read the 4e-oriented Forgotten Realms novels, like I used to feel. Were there a book, or series that, while taking place in the 4e Forgotten Realms, was geared specifically for the past (much like Star of Curserah, one of my favorite Forgotten Realms novels), I'd have a lot more incentive to read.
Were there a book, or series that, while taking place in the 4e Forgotten Realms, was geared specifically for the past (much like Star of Curserah, one of my favorite Forgotten Realms novels), I'd have a lot more incentive to read.
Not sure what you're looking for here--a 4e FR book set in the past? 4e FR only takes over in 1385 . . . before that, you're in different editions.
Just curious.
Oh and @Teneck, thank you sir! Your feedback and praise do me great honor. Part of my Realms writing mission is to stay true to the setting I have grown up with, devoured, and loved. [bows]
Cheers
Not sure what you're looking for here--a 4e FR book set in the past? 4e FR only takes over in 1385 . . . before that, you're in different editions.
-The setting transcends "editions", being a 'world'. The Star of Cursrah was written in the 2e era, and had a central plot that took place in the appropriate time frame, but, at the same time, had a concurrent plot related to the central plot, that took place in the far past, thousands of years before the then present, during the days of when Coramshan was still actively seeking to conquer what would become Calimshan. Cormyr: A Novel used the same style of writing, jumping back and forth between what was then the present, and the past, with central themes tying the two different plot lines together.
-Using a theoretical example, a novel that took place in 1,479 DR, that primarily dealt with some problem in Myth Drannor during that time, that jumped back and forth between that setting, and Myth Drannor during the days leading up to, and during the Weeping War, would appeal to me.
-
-Using a theoretical example, a novel that took place in 1,479 DR, that primarily dealt with some problem in Myth Drannor during that time, that jumped back and forth between that setting, and Myth Drannor during the days leading up to, and during the Weeping War, would appeal to me.
I can see the appeal of this ...there are still lots 1479 DR stories to be told.
But a story is after all a story...now if you only want to read about Mirt, Elminster (who btw is still alive in 4ed), Drizzt (ditto for aliveness) Cadderly..et.al. then you may be out of luck...but I still highly recommend these new ones. I don't think you will be disappointed if you can keep an open mind.
Sir Erik over there in the corner chatting up that cute elf lass...he wrote a GREAT one called Ghostwalker..set BEFORE the plague.
In fact it was Ghostwalker that forced me to read the Ed presents series so that I could read another novel by this lunatic. Since my local bookstore is not carrying Depths of Maddness (I am forced to assume that they are being threatened by the Red wizards to withhold this tome). I picked up Downshadow and the rest of the series...and spent all night Sat and all day Sun reading ...all of them...now I am going back and forcing myself to slow down a bit and really enjoy them...because no matter the setting..these guys (and gals Rosemary and Jaleigh) are at heart Realms loving people that respect how the "old timers " feel. Yes I count myself as an old timer...I have been playing since I was 10...thaqt puts it at 1979...ish.
-The setting transcends "editions", being a 'world'.
Agreed. Not my point, but valid.
I think my difficulty was that I had not read this novel of which you speak, so I didn't necessarily have the frame of reference.
-Using a theoretical example, a novel that took place in 1,479 DR, that primarily dealt with some problem in Myth Drannor during that time, that jumped back and forth between that setting, and Myth Drannor during the days leading up to, and during the Weeping War, would appeal to me.
Ah, that makes sense.
I myself very much like that sort of story, and--being a big fan of the great, rich tapestry that is the lore--I weave it into my own work when possible. Downshadow has a number of allusions to the past and an entire flashback/dream sequence scene at one point to a period shortly after the Spellplague (I would date that scene at around the mid 1390s, actually), and there are a series of events and characters and stories and LOTS of stuff that have to do with pre-4e Realmslore.
And I plan to do more of that when it's appropriate to a story I'm writing and aids understanding--appeal to "old-timers" (as it were) and more info for newbies.
Cheers
Snip
Downshadow has a number of allusions to the past and an entire flashback/dream sequence scene at one point to a period shortly after the Spellplague (I would date that scene at around the mid 1390s, actually), and there are a series of events and characters and stories and LOTS of stuff that have to do with pre-4e Realmslore
/QUOTE]
Yes...and in one instance he referenced his own novel. It took a VERY careful re-read to find the reference but I think I finally did it...The "Old Mage"'s escort at the ball was "Nightingale" ...very subtle and tricky Sir Erik.
And many other references that tickled me...but I do have a question Sir.
Aprox. what age was Cellia when she and Shadow first met...seems in the story she had quite a bit of history behind her before they met. Also in my re-read I noticed a couple times where it seemed she may have other then "Sisterly" interests in Shadow. care to comment Sir?
Recommended book series for me would be:
Netheril trilogy = First book was..I think really good...The plot, even tho' it's very fast is very interesting and a bit unique...It starts off with 2 Netheril archwizards playing with a lowly barbarian...they try throwing all kinds of creatures and quests at him for their own game (Worms, wraiths, seductive undead creatures, lich kings, Pit Lords, etc. All of those, compressed in one single book)
Icewind Dale = A very good read, nice plot...,At the first battle you'll have an impression of this drow protagonist that he is untouchable and unbeatable...you'll keep on reading the book wanting him to have a good match.
Maztica = I really enjoyed reading the series....I just had the newest book on Maztica right now...Maztica book 4 (Ancient Elemental), The plot I think is very nice....altho' the setting and plot has little originality....the plot twisters give you a feeling of wanting to read more
I'm still reading Master of Chains right now from the Fighters series (Altho' I don't think the books are connected to each other).
No they are not connected in any way, other then they are all under the "fighter" series. You are fortunate in that you have the other fighter books available...I went to my local New book store (Borders) and they had NO fighter series there other then Erik's Ghostwalker (they had sold out and not restocked yet) and my local used book store had a few of the Thunder and Master when I went the first time...went back 3 days later and they were all gone
But that suits me just fine...that means that these authors are gaining in popularity and we will (hopefully) see more works coming from them.
Regarding the Fighters series, it was pretty good, but I consider the Rogues and Wizards series much better overall (with no disrespect meant to any of the Fighters authors). If I had to rank the Fighters novels, Ghostwalker clearly comes out on top (good characters/development, wonderful setting, strong plot), followed by Son of Thunder (interesting and unusual plot, nod to Semmemon), then Master of Chains (intriguing setting, nice characters, so-so plot), which just manages to edge out Bladesinger (cool setting and decent characters, but main antagonist was rather disappointing, and plot was choppy in places.) This is all just my opinion, of course. Each novel had its strengths and its room for improvement.
I haven't gotten to see any of the Rogues/Wizards series yet. Any recommendations on which is the one best to start with?
Rogues: The Alabaster Staff = The Black Bouquet = The Yellow Silk > The Crimson Gold
Personally, I found three of the Rogues novels were all around the same place in terms of quality. The Alabaster Staff gives an insightful glimpse into Mulhorandi-controlled Unther, plus a look into Tiamat's church, with a plot regarding different ideas on how to set Unther free from their oppressors (with the main antagonists having what they believe to be the ace in the hole). The main villains in the book are interesting, because they wish to restore Unther's sovereignty, but the idea they have planned is sure to keep Unther miserable were it to succeed. The Black Bouquet was well written, but I must admit I have trouble remembering the exact details of this one. A couple of things stand out in my mind: a Sharran monk was the main antagonist (which in this case worked well), and the main character really captured the idea that a rogue looks out not only for himself, but for those dear to him (especially the very end). The plot is rather Shar-heavy, but this isn't a "Shar will consume all Toril" kind of novel, but rather a "The main enemy is Shar's church. Hope you like it." novel. The Yellow Silk is perhaps my favorite, but I'm biased in favor of anything Shou Lung (though the story takes place in Altumbel). The main characters had personality and charm, even if they were total opposites. I liked the characters' motivation (family and honor); I also enjoyed the glimpse into Spandeliyon (so much so that my current character is a rogue from Spandeliyon, which survived into 1479 DR). As for The Crimson Gold, it was alright, but the main character (who had been featured in previous novels) seemed noticably different from her past incarnation, in terms of ability, and although it took place in Thay and featured Szass Tam, I felt the major battle towards the end was a let-down. The appearance of a well-known demon lord also didn't do him justice, in my opinion.
As for the Wizards:
Frostfell > Bloodwalk = Blackstaff > Darkvision
Frostfell really stands out to me. The characters aren't necessarily incredibly unique, but they are compelling, and that's what counts. The plot was interesting, and the main villains were fantastic. The setting is what really earned my praise, though. Perfect description of the harsh northern lands. Also, Mark Sehestedt got his lore perfectly; he really did take the time to check over the past lore and managed to add it to it without having to really tweak anything. Bloodwalk had an out-of-the-way location, and featured three main characters, each serving a demigod who never really got much limelight (Savras, Hoar, and Gargauth). The main villain was well thought out; she seemed to teeter back and forth between savagery and composure, lawful conquest and chaotic bloodletting (and it wasn't in an inconsistent, bipolar disorder way). I appreciated the whole "how the mighty are fallen" approach, with the decline and folly of Savras' high priestess. Blackstaff is chock-full of lore, and ties in heavily to Blackstaff Tower. The characters aren't particularly amazing (with a few exceptions), but the big name NPCS are worth reading about (since this is kind of a "swan song" thing, where they get to enjoy pleasant, pre-Spellplague days). Darkvision... well, the plot was decent, and I found two characters (Iahn and Kiril) to be quite enjoyable, but everyone else was either dull or poorly described. I didn't have a problem with Pandorym being the main enemy, but they really seemed to best him too easily. Also, the revelation about Ususi's sister left a bad taste in my mouth. Bruce Cordell takes a lot of flak these days for his novels, but it's not like many of the complaints aren't valid.
All in all, you really can't go wrong starting anywhere. I personally read them in the order they were released (which I do for every FR series composed of unrelated books). Also, these are just my opinions, remember. You might pick up Darkvision and think it the greatest FR novel ever written, or find The Yellow Silk terrible. I own and have read 150+ FR novels. Odds are, if you have a question about a novel's quality, I can lend a hand. I hope I was a help.
Yes...and in one instance he referenced his own novel. It took a VERY careful re-read to find the reference but I think I finally did it...The "Old Mage"'s escort at the ball was "Nightingale" ...very subtle and tricky Sir Erik.
Opportunity for lore-giving!
The character "the Nightingale" is a classic figure (ala Cinderella or Sleeping Beauty, though considerably more badass, being that she's a warrior maiden*) from a very popular children's fairytale in the Realms called "Ghost and the Maiden", which is based on a romantic/heroic ballad of the same name by Catalan the Crafty (or Mad, depending), who in turn based his work upon the much more artful and poetic lyrical piece called nysaera leya, which translates from the original elvish as "The Nightingale's Song," a piece of which is cited in Ghostwalker. Indeed.
And yes, there are many, many more references, some of which are to my own work, some of which are not. (And if/when you read Depths of Madness, you might pick out a few more.) I haven't yet seen a comprehensive list . . . excepting the one I made as I wrote it, of course.
Aprox. what age was Cellia when she and Shadow first met...seems in the story she had quite a bit of history behind her before they met. Also in my re-read I noticed a couple times where it seemed she may have other then "Sisterly" interests in Shadow. care to comment Sir?
Cellica is a few years older than Shadowbane--she's probably about in her late 20s/early 30s, so she's definitely an older "little sister" (being that she is a halfling). I don't recall precisely what age Shadowbane said he was when they met, but suffice it to say, they were both children: he prepubescent, she a young teenager. They were about the same size when they met, though he got a lot taller.
And indeed, she does have a sordid history, including one very significant experience involving a demon cult . . .
As for her other-than-sisterly feelings regarding Shadowbane--or, for that matter, *other* characters who appear in the novel--I think I'll leave that one for speculation. If you want specific hints, drop me an email or a PM here at the boards and I'll give you one big one to watch out for.
I think a lot of the meaning in a book depends on what you put into it. If you interpret it the way I mean it, that's great--if you go a different direction or see variable attitudes in the characters, that's equally great.
Cheers
P.S. If there are more questions, come ask in the "Ask the Realms Authors" thread!
I haven't gotten to see any of the Rogues/Wizards series yet. Any recommendations on which is the one best to start with?
-All of the novels in the series are unrelated to each other, and are stand-alone, so you can pick whichever you like in either series and not be lost. I more or less agree with Manshoon's summary of both series. Me, I like saving the best things for last, so if you're planning on reading all of them, read the "lesser" titles first, and save the best ones for last.
BTW: it looks like FR novels already have...
Fighters
Priests
Rogues
Nobles
Wizards
Counselors and Kings
- Now all we need are Bards....or better yet, Entertainers. :P
Reading Master of Chains ryt now....it's very cool...has a nice plot, nice set of characters and setting...The conversations of the characters seemed kinda out-of-date (not appropriate for a medieval setting)....but I prefer it/I kinda like it btw, much easier to understand, and much faster to read...take note that English is not my main language..The author uses simple words and grammar to chalk things up....Less speaking of riddles or rhymes. Most of the time, ull have this impression of a modern setting in the conversation.
BTW: it looks like FR novels already have...
Fighters
Priests
Rogues
Nobles
Wizards
Counselors and Kings
- Now all we need are Bards....or better yet, Entertainers. :P
Still need Paladins, Druids, Rangers, Sorcerors, Avengers, Wardens, Shamans, Barbarians, Warlocks, Warlords, Invokers, Peasants, Corsairs, Assassins, Mercenaries, Merchants, etc.:D
Still need Paladins, Druids, Rangers, Sorcerors, Avengers, Wardens, Shamans, Barbarians, Warlocks, Warlords, Invokers, Peasants, Corsairs, Assassins, Mercenaries, Merchants, etc.:D
I'm all about a Paladin series..and Rangers...or maybe they can do it like the 3.5 books like Races of the Wild...only call it Classes of the Wild...like Druids, Rangers, and Barbarians for a book series.
pity the Escape From Undermountain was so...lacking as Halaster's relam is my fave
The Sword Mage novels ahve been excellent and are the one thing that's prevented me from puking over 4th ed Relams ;)
he wrote the "new" Realms in a MUCH more "fantasy" rough wonderful way!
it also has Spelljammer in them so, hey, it rocks my boat :D
Waterdeep felt very 'dirty' to me, and ruined...
I won't be revisiting New Waterdeep anytime soon...
All things considered, though, I'd have to say Mistshore is in the top five FR novels of all time (and I've read over one hundred-fifty of them). So for those of you who plan on buying the 4E novels, I seriously recommend this one.
It certainly IS NOT the 'City of Splendors' anymore.
More like the City of rotting garbage and open cesspools.
Here's the funny part - the FR fanboi in me HATES the New Waterdeep, and all it's 'griminess'. The DM in me says "Finally! A Waterdeep that I can use!"
Go figure.
I prefeerred the Old Waterdeep because it was part of the Old Setting - the one I fell in love with - but I never used the city... I stayed the hell away from it (except for one adventure set there). I like my campaigns a little more on the 'wild side', and that place was too... urban... for me.
Now that they finally made the city useful, I no longer want to run the Realms. :surrender
Well, yeah... thats my point.
It certainly IS NOT the 'City of Splendors' anymore.
More like the City of rotting garbage and open cesspools.
Sorry, I phrased that poorly. I meant that the changes to Waterdeep in Mistshore strike me as even more stark and surprising than the ones shown in Blackstaff Tower, especially the (figurative) grime.
I prefeerred the Old Waterdeep because it was part of the Old Setting - the one I fell in love with - but I never used the city... I stayed the hell away from it (except for one adventure set there). I like my campaigns a little more on the 'wild side', and that place was too... urban... for me.
Funny enough, I never really used it either. I play in the 4E 1479 DR Realms, but my realms are a great deal different from what is shown in the FRCG. Most of the information presented in 3E's FRCS is still valid in my game, and places like Waterdeep possess the same spirit and identity they had before the Wailing Years.
Like I said, the DM in me likes what they did with it, while the fan in me rails against it. Since I'm also a novel reader, and my game Realms were never much like the canon ones, changing the city in the novels affects me much moreso, because I am a fan of the old setting, in terms of the novels.
I may have to try Mistshore, and that Shadowbred one... I should at least mine them for ideas for my homebrew.
I may have to try Mistshore, and that Shadowbred one... I should at least mine them for ideas for my homebrew.
-Shadowbred is not set in Waterdeep, nor does it take place in the post-Spellplague Forgotten Realms. It is set primarily in Sembia, in 1,374/1,375 DR. A very good series, but you're not going to find information about Waterdeep in there, if you start looking.
There you go! Too many damn authors using the friggin' word 'Shadow' and confusing the hell out of me and everyone else....
Yes, I meant Downshadow... it sounds intriguing (I can enjoy a novel, and still HATE the world/time period it is set in).
Ack!
There you go! Too many damn authors using the friggin' word 'Sahdow' and confusing the hell out of me and everyone else....
Yes, I meant Downshadow... it sounds intriguing (I can enjoy a novel, and still HATE the world/time period it is set in).
[/i]
I've been singing Downshadow's praises since I finished it. Some of the best character development I've ever seen in an FR novel. Seriously; it's in the top ten with Mistshore. The plot's even heavily tied into the old realms and the Wailing Years, too. Interestingly, if you do happen to read it, let me know what you think of Fayne.
I'll make it up by not buying my kids any Hasbro toys this Christmas. :P
Yep; the EGPW series has gone 4 for 4. I'm not too surprised, though, when you consider they lined up four talented authors to spearhead the Waterdeep of the new era. They knew the series would do well; just hope they haven't put all their eggs in one basket.
Exactly my point at the beginning of the thread, the whole series so far is fantastic.
@ Mark Give the rest of the series a try, I am sure you will enjoy them. City of the Dead is one that won't mess with your "Old Waterdeep" thinking too much but it is still a great story...funny too.
I'm all about a Paladin series..and Rangers...or maybe they can do it like the 3.5 books like Races of the Wild...only call it Classes of the Wild...like Druids, Rangers, and Barbarians for a book series.
I thought they already have "The Wilds" series? Maybe they have Rangers/Barbarians/Druids in it. Anyway...that was a rare one (I think), since it's one of the FR novel series that I don't have.
I thought they already have "The Wilds" series? Maybe they have Rangers/Barbarians/Druids in it. Anyway...that was a rare one (I think), since it's one of the FR novel series that I don't have.
I've read the first two Wilds novels. The Fanged Crown does feature a druid, and The Restless Shore features a ranger, but the feature of the series is a location untethered by civilization. It just so happens each features these characters.
-I'm a fan of the [Class/Race/Place] series'.
As am I. I enjoy the fact that these kinds of series avoid RSEs like the plague (mostly).
As am I. I enjoy the fact that these kinds of series avoid RSEs like the plague (mostly).
-It's not necessarily completely avoiding the issue as it is handling it "tastefully". Take the recent Rage of the Dragons, in 1,373 DR. There was the Year of the Rogue Dragon trilogy, which was 'meh', that dealt with the Dragon Rage, and then there was Realms of the Dragons I & II, which dealt with the very same subject matter, but because of what the book was (a collection of short stories), the stories contained within were much more local in impact.
-It's not necessarily completely avoiding the issue as it is handling it "tastefully". Take the recent Rage of the Dragons, in 1,373 DR. There was the Year of the Rogue Dragon trilogy, which was 'meh', that dealt with the Dragon Rage, and then there was Realms of the Dragons I & II, which dealt with the very same subject matter, but because of what the book was (a collection of short stories), the stories contained within were much more local in impact.
Realms of the Dragons II. One of the few in-print FR novels I don't own. Was it any good (compared to the first, at least)? The stories in the first one were rather hit or miss for me (but then again, that seems to be my opinion for every FR anthology).
There were less "relevant" stories to ongoing plots, as opposed to the tie-ins to various plots and places that were in the first.
IMO, that's perhaps a function of most of us NOT having WotC novels on the shelves or in the pipeline at the time. And since one doesn't use another author's story as a spring-board, we were kind of put in the position of writing mostly stand-alone stories. (Some of our later stuff has, indeed, connected back to those stories, however.)
Perfect for those who like reading stand-alone stories (complete in and of themselves, without referring to another ongoing saga).
Cheers
-I remember there was this one story in Realms of the Dragons II, "The Hunting Game", or something like that, that was almost unreadable. At one point, shortly after throwing up from the sheer weight that turning each page was putting on my shoulders, I was like, "What kind of person wrote this?"
-I kid, I kid. :P
-I liked that one. Either the best or second best in that particular anthology. ;)