Not sure if this is the right forum for a general lore question, but I was wondering how wizards cast spells, now that the Weave is gone. As I understand it, Mystra was murdered by Cyric and Shar, and the Weave unraveled as a result, killing many wizards and driving many insane. So I'm wondering how wizards are casting now. Is there some new font of magic? Is it just assumed that the world has enough innate magic to draw upon? Thanks for any info
I don't know; the best place to ask this question is the FR boards, as this is an FR-specific lore question. I requested this moved. Happy hunting!
I'm wondering how wizards are casting now.
Once you purchase the Forgotten Realms Player's Guide (due next month, I believe), all your questions will be answered. However, I have been playing in a Greyhawk world since 1983, and all the wizards there have done just fine without a Weave. :P
I was wondering how wizards cast spells, now that the Weave is gone.
One assumes by waving their hands and chanting.
step 2 - open a daycare & pet spa
step 3 - sacrifice as many babies & puppies you can get away with
step 4 - incantations
step 5 - profit... er MAGIC
step 6 - OMGWFTBBQISTHATTHINGOHGODMYBLARGABABABABABABA
Either Faerunians will have to start drilling to improve the supply of magic immediately, or wizards will have to start inflating their implements to optimal pressure.
They won't be able to, for very much longer.
Either Faerunians will have to start drilling to improve the supply of magic immediately, or wizards will have to start inflating their implements to optimal pressure.
*Please*. Everyone knows that drilling for magic won't have any effect for about 105 years, and even then, doesn't answer the fundamental issue of the missing Weave. What we *really* need to do is turn to nice, renewable gods to power our magic, like Lathandar.
All the FR Wizards are now Cthullu worshipping warlocks
XD
It was believed that the Weave couldn't exist without Mystra, but that was incorrect. Depite Mystra's death, the Weave survived and is no longer under the control of any god.
*Please*. Everyone knows that drilling for magic won't have any effect for about 105 years, and even then, doesn't answer the fundamental issue of the missing Weave. What we *really* need to do is turn to nice, renewable gods to power our magic, like Lathandar.
Except that hoping Lathandar will give us clean, renewable magic is not the same thing as having that magic. If Lathandar were a likely source of magic any time soon, private sector wizards would be all over him by now, not waiting for the Great Federal Council of Wizards to legislate it.
I'm all for alternate sources of magic, but we have to address our power needs in the here and now and recognize that actual wizards in the field will be getting the work done, not ivory tower wizards who don't actually adventure and just like to make pronouncements.
Some of the alternate ideas may help out with an occasional utility power, and that's fine. But for encounters and dailies, we need to increase overall supply in our own campaign setting. There might not even be an Al-Qadim in 4th Edition, after all.
the last source you'll ever need.
Some of the alternate ideas may help out with an occasional utility power, and that's fine. But for encounters and dailies, we need to increase overall supply in our own campaign setting. There might not even be an Al-Qadim in 4th Edition, after all.
4E Realms, the new Dark Sun.
4E Realms, the new Dark Sun.
I don't know about you, but I'm looking forward to it.
I can't wait for my favorite fluff books.
-And, hopefully it will be resuscitated from the inaneness of the D&D General Discussion section...
Show
Elminster took up Mystra's job, he's just being very humble about it.
the issue is that the rokugan casters have more than tripled their magic consumption in the last decade relying primarily from foreign sources of magic (specifically from Al-Qadim), meanwhile the value of Faerun risidium has almost been cut in half!
Requiring that spells have a better effect per mana ratio will not solve long term problems either, neither is the switch to feywild magic an acceptable solution because that too is not a renewable resource.
we need to look into alternative Mana sources such as psionics or true naming, and yes even the feared binding (i assure you the chances of a vistage explosion is basically non-existant) to fuel our magic addiction else we will end up with a Dark Sun scenario within the next 100 years.
we need to look into alternative Mana sources such as psionics or true naming, and yes even the feared binding (i assure you the chances of a vistage explosion is basically non-existant) to fuel our magic addiction else we will end up with a Dark Sun scenario within the next 100 years.
-The fact that Wizards can utilize magic normally (albeit, with the 4e system of magic, officially) demonstrates that your hypothesis is incorrect.
was just rewording some quotes from the most recent energy summit...
i thought i was being cute guess not :/ shoulda gone with "i cast spells just fine myself and i'm bald."
People thought the weave made magic work, but they were wrong.
The weave was something that Mystra made up to mediate magic, and when she died and it was destroyed... magic did not end - it just had all of it's rules changed drastically.
Calling this.ShowElminster took up Mystra's job, he's just being very humble about it.
4E Realms, the new Dark Sun.
Oh yes, better start planting your own supply of trees of life. Those are cool in the way you get healing and a neverending source of wood aswell :P
Like a dozen blueleafs, and i can have my fireplaces bruning with blue flames all day long
Weave was more like a super concentrate of magic.
im not 100% sure you got the joke
was just rewording some quotes from the most recent energy summit...
-Oh, alright, I didn't catch that.
i thought i was being cute guess not :/ shoulda gone with "i cast spells just fine myself and i'm bald."
-Yeah, that would have worked.
To actually give the answer that the Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide gives:
People thought the weave made magic work, but they were wrong.
The weave was something that Mystra made up to mediate magic, and when she died and it was destroyed... magic did not end - it just had all of it's rules changed drastically.
-Of course, previous books, such as Magic of Faerûn, were written in the 3rd party omniscient viewpoint, meaning that they cannot lie, or be wrong.
Wizards just do now what the Netherese did during the time of Mystryl, they draw on raw magic, which is much more dangerous to use. The Imaskari also used magic this way. Mostly it was the Elven magic and those they taught, or who stole their secrets, that drew upon the weave.
-Netherese True Dweomers were Weave based. As would be Imaskari magic, being as that we have no real information about their specific disciplines and such.
-Of course, previous books, such as Magic of Faerûn, were written in the 3rd party omniscient viewpoint, meaning that they cannot lie, or be wrong.
I never read Magic of Faerun. I was just paraphrasing what I could find in the (relevant) Campaign Guide.
I never read Magic of Faerun. I was just paraphrasing what I could find in the (relevant) Campaign Guide.
-Yeah, I know, I saw that box/sidebar/whatever you'd want to call it. The problem is that it doesn't actually address/answer/explain the problem.
So I guess they would cast much the same as they did before the weave.
I thought the weave was put up after the folly that destroyed Netheril to restrain magic.
-Yeah, I know, I saw that box/sidebar/whatever you'd want to call it. The problem is that it doesn't actually address/answer/explain the problem.
If it doesn't... then, what is the problem? I guess I am confused.
Wizards cast without the weave by having re-learned how, since magic is still magic. I'm trying to think up an analogy, but all I'm getting is kind of... rough....
The weave was like a power tool - you learn the basics of it, and you're good to go. It does most of the hard work for you.
Without the weave, you had to find a new way to cast the spells - like finding a hand tool when the power tool broke.
Personally, I think the weave might very well reknit in enough time time and also incorporate the shadow. If enough spellplague pockets can be purified, perhaps the grid can come back online.
I look at it myself like this: the weave was like a power grid allowing strong magics to be used because it acted like a surge protector. Magic was held in the dam of the weave and buffered. The spellplague burst the dam and magic surged. Now, 4e magic is a pale shadow of prior magic because wizards are running on battery power as opposed to direct current.
Personally, I think the weave might very well reknit in enough time time and also incorporate the shadow. If enough spellplague pockets can be purified, perhaps the grid can come back online.
That's a pretty good way of putting it... except one minor detail. Mystra was the dam, Cyric broke it when he killed her, and the Spellplague was all that "flood water" that issued forth.
In Netheril (and before), there were no limits on what you could accomplish with magic, ie 10+ level spells. When Karssus cast his 12th level spell, 'Karssus' Avatar', he began to assume control of the Weave from Mystryl. His mortal mind could not handle repairing all the damage done to the Weave by the Netherese, and magic began to fail. To prevent the total destruction of magic in Faerun, Mystryl sacrificed herself, ending ALL MAGIC on Toril for a short period of time, stopping Karssus' spell, killing him. In the few minutes it then took Mystryl to reform herself, this time as Mystra, she completely re-wrote the rules on magic. From that point on, no spell above 9th level could exist, except as epic magic. (Of course, in the ORIGINAL FR setting, epic magic didn't exist...but, then, even 9th level spells were beyond many casters...Ah, good ol' AD&D...)
So, based on ALL THE SOURCE INFORMATION EVER PRINTED BY TSR AND WOTC, magic cannot exist without the Weave. The destruction of the weave at the fall of Netheril heralded the end of ALL MAGIC until the Weave was restored. Therefore, there cannot be spellcasters in the new (and terrible) 4E version of the Forgotten Realms.
At this point, all 4E arcane casters should vanish in a puff of logic...
Nah, the red box.. now thats old.. magic-users, fighting men, templars, dwarves etc all different classes ;)
As for ADD, high magic did exist. Which is very close to epic.. infact we are to belive it was THE epic.
...completely re-wrote the rules on magic. ...Therefore, there cannot be spellcasters in the new (and terrible) 4E version of the Forgotten Realms.
At this point, all 4E arcane casters should vanish in a puff of logic...
Interesting how these "completely re-written rules on magic" apparently aren't allowed to be different than the old ones.
GLOBAL WARMING KILLED MYSTRA!!!
Magic from the weave was then diffused into the world (more noticably and violently in the places where the spellplague appeared) and those that survived struggled to tap into the remains of the weave. Many did not but others did though they found themselves 'weakened' because the weave was no longer in place to tap into. Only stronger magics seemed weakened while simpler applications became more powerful (magic missile for example) and no longer had as limited a use.
For some of the lore on this transition read Undead about the fall of Thay to Szass Tam and an initial outburst of Spellplague during one of hte battles and Tam even recognizing that it was caused by Mystra's death. He also checks on both the Weave and Shadow Weave and finds them both destroyed. He's one of the Zulkirs to first get reliable control of magic back probably because he previously tapped into both the Weave and Shadow Weave for power.
Magic exists though the weave is no longer around, at least not in the way it was previously. This has required new ways of working magic and understanding magic. A 4e wizards doesn't cast spells in the same way as a 3e wizard (no material compenents required for most spells now) and some schools of magic seem to no longer work at all or at a greatly reduced capacity.
Mystryl's self-sacrifice didn't destory the weave, it shut it off. Mystra/Midnight's death didn't destroy the weave, it shattered it and scattered the power throughout the cosmology, weakening magic in some ways while strengthening it in others. The weave isn't gone, its just no longer tied to a goddess of magic and no longer a coherent 'weave' like it was. The power it contained is still in the cosmology though and mixed with that of the shadow weave.
ITS ALL LIES!
GLOBAL WARMING KILLED MYSTRA!!!
-Makes sense.