Demi-Humans used to have level restrictions in order to keep humans a better choice, but either most DMs ignored that, or the campaigns never progressed far enough for it to matter. Remember, in earlier editions of the game, ONLY demi-humans got to multi-class.
The 3e rules presented a more elegant solution - while other races got all sorts of nifty bonuses, the human was able to learn things quicker (do to his accelerated 'rate' of living).
An elven wizard of 700 years is usually a VERY powerful archmage or an advanced Elven High Mage (which most elves become around 500 years)
Elves don't take 700 years to become wizards, and humans don't take 40 years either (most of them are wizards at the age of 18), elves become wizards at the early age of 125 (sun elves tend to become wizards earlier), not because they have less skill to learn, but because they have so much time they don't need to hurry.
An elven wizard of 700 years is usually a VERY powerful archmage or an advanced Elven High Mage (which most elves become around 500 years)
Don't get mad because they take longer to learn their ABC's;) . How about I put it in this perspective: A elf caster is 700 years of age, and human caster is 700 years of age. The human will be more powerful almost guaranteed. There have even been novels of elves complaining in a stroy based way that it upsets them humans are able to grasp concepts much faster (not a realms novel if I remember correctly). Oh btw, Rastlin is proof...Elimenster is proof.
18DELTA :P
Don't get mad because they take longer to learn their ABC's;) . How about I put it in this perspective: A elf caster is 700 years of age, and human caster is 700 years of age. The human will be more powerful almost guaranteed. There have even been novels of elves complaining in a stroy based way that it upsets them humans are able to grasp concepts much faster (not a realms novel if I remember correctly)
Not really. Older does not mean more power. A human caster at 700 years of age will be VERY old, yes, but that does not mean he has more spells or as much power as an elven mage of the same age. Elves, also, age slower, it does not mean they learn slower. There is a big difference.
Not really. Older does not mean more power. A human caster at 700 years of age will be VERY old, yes, but that does not mean he has more spells or as much power as an elven mage of the same age. Elves, also, age slower, it does not mean they learn slower. There is a big difference.
Not saying that they will actually learn slower. Just saying from supporting facts, when you have age comparision, humans tend to be more powerful and have more of those spells. The greatest known of caster/meele are usually that of humans. I can start listing characters if you'd like?
Not saying that they will actually learn slower. Just saying from supporting facts, when you have age comparision, humans tend to be more powerful and have more of those spells. The greatest known of caster/meele are usually that of humans. I can start listing characters if you'd like?
Most human casters never live that much if they want to remain humans, liches don't count as humans.
Of those who are still alive a lot of them also have elven blood (all Chosen of Mystra have, the seven and Khelben being 1/4 elves).
There are more living elves of 700 than living humans of that age who are wizards.
It's literally impossible to design a rules-system model for something like this when we don't know the baseline standard. What is normal for an intelligent species? Maybe we'll get out into space and find that humans are considered extraordinarily dumb, or are surprisingly dextrous, who knows.
But until then, humans will have to do as the standard, with simple rules and an adaptable, fast-learning, ever-changing ethos that takes inspiration from the wide-variety of human cultures (versus the fairly homogenous alien ones we see in most fiction). Consider human stats as the basis, from the reference point of the human, and all others vary from there (like how d20 Modern does it).
All non-human and alien races in fantasy and sci-fi are defined in terms of how they are more or less than than human, how they're better or worse at something than humans. This is because humans are the only example of an intelligent race that we know of (so far).
It's literally impossible to design a rules-system model for something like this when we don't know the baseline standard. What is normal for an intelligent species? Maybe we'll get out into space and find that humans are considered extraordinarily dumb, or are surprisingly dextrous, who knows.
But until then, humans will have to do as the standard, with simple rules and an adaptable, fast-learning, ever-changing ethos that takes inspiration from the wide-variety of human cultures (versus the fairly homogenous alien ones we see in most fiction). Consider human stats as the basis, from the reference point of the human, and all others vary from there (like how d20 Modern does it).
Yeah I get what you're saying. All fantasy races are built from human-chararistics. Elves are humans with point-ears. But the reason I wanted to throw this out, is because some people seem to have actual pride for fantasy based races. I had remembered Alediran had even gone as far to say that our world would be better if it was based from Elven ideals. Yet, those elven ideals were made from humans who created those elves. (Not bashing you Alediran, just throwing out problem that's been bugging me)
P.S....Tanis was survived cuz of his half-human side....lol jk ;)
The baseline argument was a very good one, and one I agree with - Until we know about other intelligent species, humans become the baseline, and therefore rather boring, from a rules-perspective (unless we give them some goodies, like excelerated learning).
I believe the Pathfinder rules also gives humans a free +2 to add to ANY stat, to equalize the set bonus Demi-humans get (I haven't checked the Beta, so that may have changed).
Demi-Humans used to have level restrictions in order to keep humans a better choice, but either most DMs ignored that, or the campaigns never progressed far enough for it to matter. Remember, in earlier editions of the game, ONLY demi-humans got to multi-class.
Gygax was always like that. Ttry to coax people into not playing elves, dwarves, etc. I never understood why. It is a fantasy game. People want to play half-orcs, tieflings, etc etc
So was there a point to the post other than to try to bait Alediran?
-NOPE. It looks like he baited a bunch of other poeple too.
18DELTA :P
Gygax was always like that. Ttry to coax people into not playing elves, dwarves, etc. I never understood why. It is a fantasy game. People want to play half-orcs, tieflings, etc etc
I seem to recall the designers of HarnMaster (or at least the edition I purchased) held a similar viewpoint. They explained their reasoning, stating that they believed that non-human races would hold such an alien viewpoint, that it would be difficult if not impossible for any of us to roleplay them properly, and that to attempt to would result in nothing more than what they termed "humans in funny suits."
I don't agree with this, save in the case of the most basic and inexperienced roleplayers perhaps, but it is not an unheard of viewpoint.
-NOPE. It looks like he baited a bunch of other poeple too.
Remember where that internet term comes from -
'Bait' only works when fish are dumb enough to bite. ;)
18DELTA ;)
I seem to recall the designers of HarnMaster (or at least the edition I purchased) held a similar viewpoint. They explained their reasoning, stating that they believed that non-human races would hold such an alien viewpoint, that it would be difficult if not impossible for any of us to roleplay them properly, and that to attempt to would result in nothing more than what they termed "humans in funny suits."
I don't agree with this, save in the case of the most basic and inexperienced roleplayers perhaps, but it is not an unheard of viewpoint.
I actually agree with that line of thought. Non-human races -are- alien. I think the large problem with believing otherwise is that they look too much like Humans. If Elves were insectoid, you'd probably agree. :P
It doesn't mean you can't try to play those races, but they'd always be based on things from a human perspective. Dolphins are extraordinarily smart. Yet do you think you could see the world from a Dolphin’s eyes? The same with cows. What about monkeys - they look a great deal like us, and genetically speaking, are very similar to us - but could you imagine the world from their point of view? Then could you properly role-play it?
The best you could do is act and think in terms of your own experiences, but your own experiences will never ever mirror those of the ones you're portraying. Therefore, you'd always be playing a 'bastardized' form of the race.
From what I been reading, and correct me if I'm wrong. Humans are able to adapt/learn at a increasingly high rate compared to other races. A human will obtain a wizard status by the age of 40 where it will take a elf 700 years (take that Alediran).
Elves, Dwarves, and Humans are all adults by 20. Dragonborn by 15. Elves don't even live to 700 - most die around the age of 200.
I'm contimplating a rule where wizards have to be at least 30, but that's a house-rule.
This would, reasonably speaking, I think put any 'normal' first level Wizard between the ages of twenty to twenty-five, maybe even as old as thirty.
With the early talk the human "corruptibility", 4th edition looked like it would make an interesting new twist on the human. Maybe as well as being the most adaptable, varying, learn-new-things race, they would also be the most likely to screw things up or turn to the dark side. However, this didn't eventuate.
You know, I kinda felt the same way - I thought that was a VERY interesting concept, and it seems to have been forgotten by the wayside in development.
There were a lot of things talked about with the new edition and the DDi, and pretty much none of the things I had looked forward to were implimented.
ExtinctionBeta should read The Night Parade set in the FR. The bad guys are bad and sad stuff happens.
Was that any good? It sounds like my tastes.
As an aside, if I remember correctly, in Halruaa anyone who can use magic starts learning at around the age of five. They don't actually get the ability to cast cantrips until sometime around the age of fifteen.
This would, reasonably speaking, I think put any 'normal' first level Wizard between the ages of twenty to twenty-five, maybe even as old as thirty.
I tend to think of Wizards as being the PhDs of the fantasy world. If you want magic quick and dirty, there are ways to do it, such as the Warlock, and a cleric’s ‘schooling’ depends on the god and church they serve.
You know, I kinda felt the same way - I thought that was a VERY interesting concept, and it seems to have been forgotten by the watside in development.
They also said that humans were more corruptable because they had such a short life span, but halflings and dragonborn die as early as humans.
I think the Wizards' Presents books contained a great deal of flavor that hasn't made its way into the PHB, DMG, or any of the pre-made Adventures, and I find that very sad.
The original Arduin Trilogy had rules for playing everything from Gods to Undead, sketchy rules, but they were there. The new edition coming out has 21 playable character races, 5 of which are human, dwarf, elf, hobbitts and gnomes.
Bel
Was that any good? It sounds like my tastes.
it was ok
You know, I kinda felt the same way - I thought that was a VERY interesting concept, and it seems to have been forgotten by the watside in development.
There were a lot of things talked about with the new edition and the DDi, and pretty much none of the things I had looked forward to were implimented.
Was that any good? It sounds like my tastes.
It is about some humans that get turned into monsters and they plague Calimport. The leader of Arabel is the main protaganist and and you find out she is a hero that has many flaws and a shady past.
I think the Wizards' Presents books contained a great deal of flavor that hasn't made its way into the PHB, DMG, or any of the pre-made Adventures, and I find that very sad.
Very True.
The stuff in the preview books sounded like they had a LOT of good ideas...
Then all of it got boiled down into a very dry, uninteresting game.
@Belorin - I used to play a game called Monsters! Monsters! once in a blue moon, back in the day. Basically, it was the Tunnels & Trolls rules, but you got to play the 'bad guys'.
You could pillage a village, raid a cravan, attack a keep, or just lurk in a dungeon until some stupid adventurers came along for you to eat. :D
It is about some humans that get turned into monsters and they plague Calimport.
-This has since elaborated on in 3e to be a group of Netherese who traveled into the Demiplane of Nightmares, got lost and stranded there, and then '(d)evolved' into the creatures of the Night Parade.
Well, I'll have plenty of time now to go back and read all the novels and series I missed.
Very True.
The stuff in the preview books sounded like they had a LOT of good ideas...
Then all of it got boiled down into a very dry, uninteresting game.
@Belorin - I used to play a game called Monsters! Monsters! once in a blue moon, back in the day. Basically, it was the Tunnels & Trolls rules, but you got to play the 'bad guys'.
You could pillage a village, raid a cravan, attack a keep, or just lurk in a dungeon until some stupid adventurers came along for you to eat. :D
I don't remember that one, Back then I played T&T, RQ, C&S, Arduin and D&D.
Plus a little Boot Hill, Gamma World and Bunnies & Burrows. Oh and CoC when it came out. Sounds like it would be cool, I liked the Reverse Dungeon!
Bel
I've never run into anyone else who played C&S!
Where you from, if you don't mind my asking? (I've played all of those, and two of them were made by a company I worked for).
There were about four of us that would get together to play at the USO.
Remember those ponderous skill rules?
Bel
I use to work for the guy who put that and B&B out - Scott Bizar of FGU. He moved out to Cally and I lost touch - maybe thats when the game gained a few fans out there.
Bel
Could be, I played two other FGU games, Space Opera and Villians and Vigilantes, both great games.
Bel
Loved both of them.
Played Traveller until Space Opera came out.
Ever try Aftermath, or Bushido? Two more FGU gems.
Gangster was another I playtested - RPGing in the roaring 20's. :D
Whoever was bringing those games around to your group must have found whatever storefront Scott opened up out there.
I miss those days....
There were also a few Dungeon adventures that had the players using monsters as the protagonists.
You know, its weird... I have a lot of Dungeon Magazines, but I've yet to run any of those adventures. I should look back through them - I know there were quite a few I found pretty cool.
ExtinctionBeta should read The Night Parade set in the FR. The bad guys are bad and sad stuff happens.
I bet the good guys still win the end don't they? It's like a curse with wizo, they can't let go of something. They're as bad as japanees developers that can't make anything in a RPG other than turn based or time based.
I bet the good guys still win the end don't they? It's like a curse with wizo, they can't let go of something. They're as bad as japanees developers that can't make anything in a RPG other than turn based or time based.
Yes, sadly we Americans have a tradition that the good guys win. No greek tragedies here, except the rare comic or movie (very rare in movies).
And just out of curiosity, if you think the novels are flawed, why would you buy and read them?
Humans don't actually mature faster than Elves. Elves actually *ARE* for the most part, better at magic than human beings (Nether scrolls aside). Most of the really top ranked spellcasters out there are either Elves, Liches, or people that end their names with "Of Mystra." In other words, you need to be immortal to become a Powerful Mage and there's Potions of Longevity or Pacts with Gods for the humans who want that.
There is the statement though that Elves tend to produce less Raistlin Majeres than Humans. Elves tend to view magic more like a respected trade while a lot of humans become absolute dire crazy fanatics over it. Some Elves do too but most tend to spend 87 years sleeping, having sex with hot other elves, and playing raquetball while spending the remaining 13 years studying while said human probably is a disaffected shut in for the same time.
Yes, sadly we Americans have a tradition that the good guys win. No greek tragedies here, except the rare comic or movie (very rare in movies).
And just out of curiosity, if you think the novels are flawed, why would you buy and read them?
Ok, do I just kill myself out of bordem because I don't get my way? If I am hungry, I am not going to starve myself just because I don't get the meal I want. Do you get my analogy? It has some entertainment, and when I know nothing is perfect, there is easily said to be enough room for improvment. By the way, what makes you think I'm American, not saying I am or not, just curious on your assumption.
Why do the game developers make us versatile? It's our own defininitive trait; universally we take account of how other cultures adapt to their surroundings. Native Americans use every part of the animal, Europeans built hearths in the middle of their hovels and burned what they had in excess; peet.
Other humanoid races are just aspects of us. Elves represent the wise and graceful humans. Dwarves represent our more hands-on artisan side. Gnomes are our curious, inventive sides. But at the core, humans are aware of their own mortality (making us short-lived in fantasy terms), and aware of our wide variety of adaptability and different cultural innovations. It's a big part of humans, and anthropology in general.
Ok, do I just kill myself out of bordem because I don't get my way? If I am hungry, I am not going to starve myself just because I don't get the meal I want. Do you get my analogy? It has some entertainment, and when I know nothing is perfect, there is easily said to be enough room for improvment. By the way, what makes you think I'm American, not saying I am or not, just curious on your assumption.
My actual argument as to why the villains rarely win is because the villains are rarely any interest.
My actual argument as to why the villains rarely win is because the villains are rarely any interest.
I don't understand? Are not of any intrest to whom? You? Is your judgment considered popular consesus?
18DELTA :P
By the way, what makes you think I'm American, not saying I am or not, just curious on your assumption.
You've stated as such with other accounts. ;)
-RW
Hmmmm... I think I'm going to change my name... how does one do that?
I want to call myself Really_Hate_4eFR, but I won't tell anyone its me...
Aren't I clever? :D
Ok, do I just kill myself out of bordem because I don't get my way? If I am hungry, I am not going to starve myself just because I don't get the meal I want. Do you get my analogy? It has some entertainment, and when I know nothing is perfect, there is easily said to be enough room for improvment. By the way, what makes you think I'm American, not saying I am or not, just curious on your assumption.
Well if all they have at the bookstores is FR books then I could understand that, but at any bookstore I have been in, there are many more books than I could ever read in one lifetime, and I could easily avoid ones I don't enjoy. I have even stopped reading a book after a few chapters because I discovered that it just wasn't that good a book. So if you are starving while surrounded by food, that is your choice.
My actual argument as to why the villains rarely win is because the villains are rarely any interest.
Yet I find the most interesting stories have the most interesting villains. The Joker in The Dark Knight is a charismatic, fascinating character and the movie benefits far more for it than if it was just Batman fighting some evil but boring guy.
I think the best villains are far more interesting than the best heroes -- but that's difficult to translate to a role-playing game.
I think the best villains are far more interesting than the best heroes -- but that's difficult to translate to a role-playing game.
-I disagree. It's because so many heroes are "stereotypical", while so many villains attempt to "break the mold" that I think so many people become attracted to villains. There are just as many complex, intriguing heroes out there. For example, who would you consider more complex and interesting: Khelben Arunson, or Scyllua Darkhope? There's a reversal of the "one dimensional hero" and the "three dimensional villain". Khelben is quite complex, whereas Scyllua is fairly dull and one-dimensional.
-I disagree. It's because so many heroes are "stereotypical", while so many villains attempt to "break the mold" that I think so many people become attracted to villains. There are just as many complex, intriguing heroes out there. For example, who would you consider more complex and interesting: Khelben Arunson, or Scyllua Darkhope? There's a reversal of the "one dimensional hero" and the "three dimensional villain". Khelben is quite complex, whereas Scyllua is fairly dull and one-dimensional.
Who and what? I have no idea who those people are.
If Scyllua is 'fairly dull and one-dimensional' than he or she couldn't be one of 'the best' villains.
Who and what? I have no idea who those people are.
-Look them up, then.
If Scyllua is 'fairly dull and one-dimensional' than he or she couldn't be one of 'the best' villains.
-Hence my point that villains aren't always more "in-depth" than heroes. There are an equal number of "boring" villains and an equal number of "complex" heroes.
He's the only NPC I know of with a presence in THREE D&D worlds.
-So your name is 'GUN SMOKED KISS' now extinction/warning?
18DELTA :P
Just a back up account for when LK feels the need to harras me and I have a 1-2 day temporary ban. Thankfully for him I don't report, even though this is getting annoying and considered harrasement. For something as small as a diagreement for Drizzt being a bad character.
You've stated as such with other accounts. ;)
-RW
My location says "die", I have not stated to anyone where I am currently located within this forum. You, LK, GothicDan know from aim, but never, not once have I stated on this specific account that I am American.
Maybe if he shied away from the multiple-word names, it would be harder for us to figure out?
Hmmmm... I think I'm going to change my name... how does one do that?
I want to call myself Really_Hate_4eFR, but I won't tell anyone its me...
Aren't I clever? :D
It was not my intention to be "hidden" as you pressume much. Just a back up when things aren't going my way. All my names are from bands/songs, thus having a youtube link underneath all of them potraying the band/song itself. If you think I honestly cared about someone knowing me or not, I'd just make a new account called "Drizzt748x" or something stupid like that. I would appreciate you not making assumptions and sarcastic remarks that you stand corrected on as of now. (By the way, I do have one account that no one knows of, that is very mannered and FR name related..."aren't I clever?" :D
Well if all they have at the bookstores is FR books then I could understand that, but at any bookstore I have been in, there are many more books than I could ever read in one lifetime, and I could easily avoid ones I don't enjoy. I have even stopped reading a book after a few chapters because I discovered that it just wasn't that good a book. So if you are starving while surrounded by food, that is your choice.
As I have stated before, I love the universe, which I wish they would fix up. It has such rich potential, if only they would converse more with one another (the authors) instead of having 1 unique drow with 2 swords to take on soloey the area around him, never losing, and always having his cape torn for that bad ass factor..
never moving beyond his authors jurisdiction. Imagine a world where all these "unique" heros and villans interact with one another. Why can't they pull off a justice league? Or s.h.i.e.l.d from marvel? You see, I'm just eating a burger cooked rare, when I'm waiting for it to be made well-done.The Nightparade had interesting intelligent shapeshifters as the main villains. I can't remember but were they actually ageless in their Demiplane? They didn't get that much in depth page coverage, but that was made up by Miss Lhal's charactergrowth, which was tangible and more pronounced.
Later novels shifted focus more and more on "monster" stories (i.e. Drizzt) or edgy heroes (Cale). These have tremendous appeal because the heroes show traits of vilains. I hope the former style of writing is still there (Elaine, do come back!) for the ride in the 15th century realms novels to come.
Just a back up account for when LK feels the need to harras me and I have a 1-2 day temporary ban. Thankfully for him I don't report, even though this is getting annoying and considered harrasement. For something as small as a diagreement for Drizzt being a bad character.
-I like that a man with a plan. ;)
18DELTA :P
-Look them up, then.
Apparently they’re Realms people.
Hey, you know what would be cool? If there was a forum on the Dungeons and Dragons board where if you had questions about lore in the Forgotten Realms, such as ‘Who are Khelben Arunson and Scyllua Darkhope?’ you could ask and people would help you find information on them.
You’re a FL aren’t you? Next time you have one of those meetings, I think you should suggest that, cause, you know, I’ve been told the Realms has a great deal of information.
-Hence my point that villains aren't always more "in-depth" than heroes. There are an equal number of "boring" villains and an equal number of "complex" heroes.
I didn't say that heroes were less complex than villains. (In fact, I didn't mention complexity at all) I said I find the best villains are more interesting than the best heroes.
I find it simply amazing someone on the FR boards doesn't know who Khelben is.
I am one of those mythical ‘joining because of 4e Realms’ people. It’s not so amazing that someone new doesn’t have what you view as common knowledge.
Hey, you know what would be cool? If there was a forum on the Dungeons and Dragons board where if you had questions about lore in the Forgotten Realms, such as ‘Who are Khelben Arunson and Scyllua Darkhope?’ you could ask and people would help you find information on them.
-Go ahead and post the thread, then.
I didn't say that heroes were less complex than villains. (In fact, I didn't mention complexity at all) I said I find the best villains are more interesting than the best heroes.
-Which returns us to my original post of "I disagree. It's because so many heroes are "stereotypical", while so many villains attempt to "break the mold"...There are just as many complex, intriguing heroes out there."
-Complexity and intrigue are just two factors that make characters interesting.
-Go ahead and post the thread, then.
-Which returns us to my original post of "I disagree. It's because so many heroes are "stereotypical", while so many villains attempt to "break the mold"...There are just as many complex, intriguing heroes out there."
-Complexity and intrigue are just two factors that make characters interesting.
He was right about the batman thing, the Joker stole that movie away. Look at it this way LK, most Versus movies, are villans vs villans: Freddy vs Jason, Alien Vs Preditor, and so on. The shinning, Jack Nicholson made that movie good with his insanity role.
-Go ahead and post the thread, then.
Are you going to post in that thread? I only want my questions answered by an EXPERT.
It’s okay. I wiki’ed, and am now reading about Khelben “Blackstaff” Arunsun. The ‘Blackstaff’ sounds familiar.
He was right about the batman thing, the Joker stole that movie away.
He is not a he.
Khelben is the Realms version of Dr. Strange, if you know comics at all, with a bit more of a 'master manipulator, behind-the-scenes' thing going for him.
People here are VERY helpful, IF you ask questions. Just telling us you don't know who someone is - in a sarcastic way - isn't going to get you any information, I'm afraid.
If you want, I can come over to your house right now and talk to you all about the Realms for the next three weeks straight. That should about cover the basics. ;)
It was not my intention to be "hidden" as you pressume much. Just a back up when things aren't going my way. All my names are from bands/songs, thus having a youtube link underneath all of them potraying the band/song itself. If you think I honestly cared about someone knowing me or not, I'd just make a new account called "Drizzt748x" or something stupid like that. I would appreciate you not making assumptions and sarcastic remarks that you stand corrected on as of now. (By the way, I do have one account that no one knows of, that is very mannered and FR name related..."aren't I clever?" :D
Chillax, Dude.
I was crackin' a joke - at MY expense, BTW, NOT yours.
I think you ar so used to be attacked on these boards, you automatically assume one.
And I poke fun of everyone - just ask Delta. :P
”Sorry if I came off a bit 'snarky', but Khelben is one the 'Heavy Hitters' in the setting (he's even been on the cover of Campaign Guides). Scyllua I can undrstand - I know almost nothing about her myself (nor wish to - Zhents don't interst me much).
I didn’t find you to be snarky at all. You were surprised that someone didn’t know a Realm personality. If you could come to my house and talk about the Realms for three weeks, it makes sense that Khelben is as knowable to you as Spider-Man is to me.
I don’t know what a Zhent is either, other then they’re bad.
” Khelben is the Realms version of Dr. Strange, if you know comics at all, with a bit more of a 'master manipulator, behind-the-scenes' thing going for him.”
Dr. Strange I know, and sometimes like.
” People here are VERY helpful, IF you ask questions. Just telling us you don't know who someone is - in a sarcastic way - isn't going to get you any information, I'm afraid.”
I’d argue that “Who and what? I have no idea who those people are” both includes a question and isn’t sarcastic being as it’s a sincere expression of my ignorance on the subject.
I think you may be flavoring my initial question with my post after Karsus told me to look it up, which was deep fried in sarcasm.
” If you want, I can come over to your house right now and talk to you al about the Realms for the next three weeks straight. That should about cover the basics. ;)”
I absorb things much better if I take them piecemeal. I’d ask more about Khelban but he’s dead right now. As I hope to run a FR game soon, I need to focus a bit. Then again, if he’s a master manipulator, he should have planned for his death and his band of ex-Harpers might be roaming the land doing more good than the real ones.
Are you going to post in that thread? I only want my questions answered by an EXPERT.
-I post in most threads. People who are not 'EXPERTS' probably have answers too.
It’s okay. I wiki’ed, and am now reading about Khelben “Blackstaff” Arunsun. The ‘Blackstaff’ sounds familiar.
-One of the more popular and intriguing characters in the setting. The Blackstaff part is both a spell, an item, and a book, so you could have picked that up in a lot of places.
And I poke fun of everyone - just ask Delta. :P
-Yeah, he is a real
. :P :D Markus is the Bevis and Butthead combined of this forum. :embarrass 18DELTA :P :P :P :P
Of course, I ran out of my meds weeks ago.
@Hippocrene: Khelben did indeed plan for his death - centuries in advance! If any death could be called "a good death", his most certainly was.
@Everyone: I just realized something, and I'm going to need to go run over to CK right now and ask Steven Schend something...
The whole point of Khelben's life was to 'measure up' to a certain group's standards (don't want to give away any spoilers). Now, since 4e has decided that group doesn't really exist, where the hell did Khelben go?!
His death, in my eyes, just became completely pointless because of the 4e retcons.
Now, since 4e has decided that group doesn't really exist, where the hell did Khelben go?!
-Arvandor itself still exists.
The whole point of Khelben's life was to 'measure up' to a certain group's standards (don't want to give away any spoilers). Now, since 4e has decided that group doesn't really exist, where the hell did Khelben go?!
Boise