Is it possible to be chosen by 2 gods? - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Is it possible to be chosen by 2 gods?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
creyzi4zb12
Apr 02, 2008 9:03:50 I remember reading someguy named Qilue Veladorn who was a chosen of both Elistraee and Mystra...how is that possible? I mean, wouldn't the 2 gods conflict with themselves if they do that? And what are his stats? :D , must be wicked powerful?
#2
phelf_der_zemit
Apr 02, 2008 9:12:41 actually, it's not as powerful as you think. Her actual class levels have suffered from the LA needed to have the templates put into place.

For more information on Quile I'd sugest reading the Seven Sisters, she is also featured in the Lady Peniant Series. She is stated somewhere but for the life of me I can't remember where.

ps. Quiles a she, she is part of the fabled seven sisters, and therefor a female. Also she is chosen by Elistraee so she is a drow. Happy days.
#3
lord_karsus
Apr 02, 2008 10:46:50 -In short, yes, yes it is possible.
#4
old_sage
Apr 02, 2008 11:12:46 Re: Qilué

From Ed:-
". . . her Chosen of Eilistraee title . . . means two things: she's as loyal to Eilistraee as to Mystra (in daily practise, as shown in SILVERFALL, more so), and Eilistraee foresees using her in some great task (i.e. a not-yet-revealed destiny)."

...

Qilué was born to a drow female and prominent worshipper of Eilistraee. Elue Shundar, the mortal host of Mystra, died before Mystra/Shundar could carry the seventh child, Qilué, to full term. And so, a new mother had to be found before Mystra's own power consumed the child. Mystra set about looking for another suitable womb for the unborn Qilué, and found Iliryztara Veladorn. Veladorn was also pregnant but her adventuring ways had resulted in the death of her own unborn child -- she was not aware of this however -- and as a result, her own life was threatened because of it. Mystra decided to replace Iliryztara's dead unborn child with Qilué, thus saving both Qilué's and Iliryztara's lives. However, Eilistraee had plans for Iliryztara and her unborn child. Mystra, thus, sought permission from Eilistraee about whether the Goddess of Mysteries could intervene in Veladorn's life. Eilistraee agreed and Qilué was placed in Iliryztara's womb. When Qilué was born, she was born a drow and servant of both Mystra and Eilistraee.

This is explained fully in The Seven Sisters.
#5
rinonalyrna_fathomlin
Apr 02, 2008 12:24:15 Some guy named Qilue?

But anyway, the answer is, as has been said, yes. And since it's possible to be a cleric of two deities, there's no reason for there to necessarily be "conflict" involved.
#6
sata
Apr 02, 2008 14:20:43 As said, yes. But Qilue is not the only case that exist as proof.

Aloevan is a female moon elf now a ghost, Chosen of Sehanine Moonbow / Chosen of Mystra.
#7
markustay63
Apr 02, 2008 15:57:11 Could have sworn I remember reading about another, possibly in the old 1e material.

I remember several of the priests worshipped more then one god in that stuff as well.
#8
lord_karsus
Apr 02, 2008 16:01:10
Could have sworn I remember reading about another, possibly in the old 1e material.

-The only examples we have of "dual" Chosen are Qilue, Aloevan, and the Druid leaders of the Emerald Enclave.
#9
old_sage
Apr 02, 2008 19:41:38 Note, however, that Ashenford Torinbow, Lady Shadowmoon Crystalembers, and
Shinthala Deepcrest [the Elder Circle of the Emerald Enclave], are the Chosen of Silvanus/Mielikki/Eldath.
#10
faraer
Apr 02, 2008 20:53:11 Not all gods are in conflict.

Remember too that being called 'Chosen' isn't identical with a set of +4 CR powers. Not a few religious people are called 'Chosen' without any game-mechanical status, such as all the Eilistraeeans of the Promenade; and conversely there are many kinds of rare divinely empowered beings, such as children of gods (discussed by Ed recently) and Mystra's spellstaves.
#11
old_sage
Apr 02, 2008 21:41:44 Indeed. There's no exact, consistent definition of what a 'Chosen' is. The gods invest a few of their followers with certain special roles and powers, and folk call some of these 'Chosen'. Some have immortality in various forms, others may not.

Mystra's are a unique case: they exist primarily to hold parts of her divine power as a precaution against the catastrophe of her death. It is only one mortal theory that Ao ordered this. [In Ed Greenwood's original conception, Mystra's were the only Chosen. Other authors added additional ones, misunderstanding Ed's purpose and starting something of an arms race.]
#12
lord_karsus
Apr 02, 2008 23:01:19 -I disagree that Mystra's Chosen are unique, specifically. 2e Planescape Proxies have been retconned into being Chosen in 3e, and Proxies, by definition, are mortals who have recieved a portion of a deities' power, to be used for a specific goal. Mystra's Chosen exist to do this as well, and, in my own opinion, should a deity die, it makes more sense that these Chosen house the remaining power of these deities, a la the Chosen of Mystra, rather than it simply fade away. The only canon example that we have of a deity dying with a Chosen, that I can think of, would be Gilgeam, and Sharrupak (Sp?), but there is nothing that states that the divine energy within the Chosen faded away, instead of becoming dormant, or what have you, within him.
#13
alkasyn
Apr 12, 2008 16:16:29 In the Epic level Handbook, Shurrupak is said to have gone insane after his God's death, but theres no mention of him loosing or retaining his Chosen abilities. He is said to still be a power to be reckoned with, though.

In his statline he also isn't named a Chosen of Gilgeam, too.
#14
lord_karsus
Apr 12, 2008 16:20:13
In the Epic level Handbook, Shurrupak is said to have gone insane after his God's death, but theres no mention of him loosing or retaining his Chosen abilities. He is said to still be a power to be reckoned with, though.

In his statline he also isn't named a Chosen of Gilgeam, too.

-The specific power granted to Sharrupak as a Chosen of Gilgeam have never been elaborated on, as far as I know.

-But, regardless, mechanically speaking, there is nothing particular that would reflect housing the vestigal powers of a fallen deity that a Chosen of a slain deity would be carrying within him/her/it.
#15
Stigger
Apr 12, 2008 18:08:35 Nothing says the template should be removed either though... so... DM's fiat until we know one way or another (and I'm sure we will come 4e if El's still around).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 creyzi4zb12 Apr 02, 2008 9:03:50	I remember reading someguy named Qilue Veladorn who was a chosen of both Elistraee and Mystra...how is that possible? I mean, wouldn't the 2 gods conflict with themselves if they do that? And what are his stats? :D , must be wicked powerful?
#2 phelf_der_zemit Apr 02, 2008 9:12:41	actually, it's not as powerful as you think. Her actual class levels have suffered from the LA needed to have the templates put into place. For more information on Quile I'd sugest reading the Seven Sisters, she is also featured in the Lady Peniant Series. She is stated somewhere but for the life of me I can't remember where. ps. Quiles a she, she is part of the fabled seven sisters, and therefor a female. Also she is chosen by Elistraee so she is a drow. Happy days.
#3 lord_karsus Apr 02, 2008 10:46:50	-In short, yes, yes it is possible.
#4 old_sage Apr 02, 2008 11:12:46	Re: Qilué From Ed:- ". . . her Chosen of Eilistraee title . . . means two things: she's as loyal to Eilistraee as to Mystra (in daily practise, as shown in SILVERFALL, more so), and Eilistraee foresees using her in some great task (i.e. a not-yet-revealed destiny)." ... Qilué was born to a drow female and prominent worshipper of Eilistraee. Elue Shundar, the mortal host of Mystra, died before Mystra/Shundar could carry the seventh child, Qilué, to full term. And so, a new mother had to be found before Mystra's own power consumed the child. Mystra set about looking for another suitable womb for the unborn Qilué, and found Iliryztara Veladorn. Veladorn was also pregnant but her adventuring ways had resulted in the death of her own unborn child -- she was not aware of this however -- and as a result, her own life was threatened because of it. Mystra decided to replace Iliryztara's dead unborn child with Qilué, thus saving both Qilué's and Iliryztara's lives. However, Eilistraee had plans for Iliryztara and her unborn child. Mystra, thus, sought permission from Eilistraee about whether the Goddess of Mysteries could intervene in Veladorn's life. Eilistraee agreed and Qilué was placed in Iliryztara's womb. When Qilué was born, she was born a drow and servant of both Mystra and Eilistraee. This is explained fully in The Seven Sisters.
#5 rinonalyrna_fathomlin Apr 02, 2008 12:24:15	Some guy named Qilue? But anyway, the answer is, as has been said, yes. And since it's possible to be a cleric of two deities, there's no reason for there to necessarily be "conflict" involved.
#6 sata Apr 02, 2008 14:20:43	As said, yes. But Qilue is not the only case that exist as proof. Aloevan is a female moon elf now a ghost, Chosen of Sehanine Moonbow / Chosen of Mystra.
#7 markustay63 Apr 02, 2008 15:57:11	Could have sworn I remember reading about another, possibly in the old 1e material. I remember several of the priests worshipped more then one god in that stuff as well.
#8 lord_karsus Apr 02, 2008 16:01:10	Could have sworn I remember reading about another, possibly in the old 1e material. -The only examples we have of "dual" Chosen are Qilue, Aloevan, and the Druid leaders of the Emerald Enclave.
#9 old_sage Apr 02, 2008 19:41:38	Note, however, that Ashenford Torinbow, Lady Shadowmoon Crystalembers, and Shinthala Deepcrest [the Elder Circle of the Emerald Enclave], are the Chosen of Silvanus/Mielikki/Eldath.
#10 faraer Apr 02, 2008 20:53:11	Not all gods are in conflict. Remember too that being called 'Chosen' isn't identical with a set of +4 CR powers. Not a few religious people are called 'Chosen' without any game-mechanical status, such as all the Eilistraeeans of the Promenade; and conversely there are many kinds of rare divinely empowered beings, such as children of gods (discussed by Ed recently) and Mystra's spellstaves.
#11 old_sage Apr 02, 2008 21:41:44	Indeed. There's no exact, consistent definition of what a 'Chosen' is. The gods invest a few of their followers with certain special roles and powers, and folk call some of these 'Chosen'. Some have immortality in various forms, others may not. Mystra's are a unique case: they exist primarily to hold parts of her divine power as a precaution against the catastrophe of her death. It is only one mortal theory that Ao ordered this. [In Ed Greenwood's original conception, Mystra's were the only Chosen. Other authors added additional ones, misunderstanding Ed's purpose and starting something of an arms race.]
#12 lord_karsus Apr 02, 2008 23:01:19	-I disagree that Mystra's Chosen are unique, specifically. 2e Planescape Proxies have been retconned into being Chosen in 3e, and Proxies, by definition, are mortals who have recieved a portion of a deities' power, to be used for a specific goal. Mystra's Chosen exist to do this as well, and, in my own opinion, should a deity die, it makes more sense that these Chosen house the remaining power of these deities, a la the Chosen of Mystra, rather than it simply fade away. The only canon example that we have of a deity dying with a Chosen, that I can think of, would be Gilgeam, and Sharrupak (Sp?), but there is nothing that states that the divine energy within the Chosen faded away, instead of becoming dormant, or what have you, within him.
#13 alkasyn Apr 12, 2008 16:16:29	In the Epic level Handbook, Shurrupak is said to have gone insane after his God's death, but theres no mention of him loosing or retaining his Chosen abilities. He is said to still be a power to be reckoned with, though. In his statline he also isn't named a Chosen of Gilgeam, too.
#14 lord_karsus Apr 12, 2008 16:20:13	In the Epic level Handbook, Shurrupak is said to have gone insane after his God's death, but theres no mention of him loosing or retaining his Chosen abilities. He is said to still be a power to be reckoned with, though. In his statline he also isn't named a Chosen of Gilgeam, too. -The specific power granted to Sharrupak as a Chosen of Gilgeam have never been elaborated on, as far as I know. -But, regardless, mechanically speaking, there is nothing particular that would reflect housing the vestigal powers of a fallen deity that a Chosen of a slain deity would be carrying within him/her/it.
#15 Stigger Apr 12, 2008 18:08:35	Nothing says the template should be removed either though... so... DM's fiat until we know one way or another (and I'm sure we will come 4e if El's still around).