| Post/Author/DateTime | Post |
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| #1hvulpesDec 09, 2008 9:56:40 | I have been brewing this plot idea for a while and thought I would share and see what develops. A noted historian in religious text, know for his generous donation of texts and letters of importants to churches and libraries, is under attack for his recent find of heretical documents of a goodly faith. These articules seem to point to the fact that early church fathers and even the deity themself were involved with dealings with fiends and dark magic. The PCs have been hired by the same church to escort the historian to a major church so he can sell these records secretly to the fathers of the faith. However, enemies of the faith are looking to capture these documents so they can spread the dark truths of the faith. Unknown to the PC: The 'historian' is a warlock who is faithful both to Asmodeus and Cyric. All the documents he has donated have been forged by him, as this was his plan. For when he sell more controversal and damaging papers to a church, these papers are compared to his own forgeries in the church. Then he makes money from the sell, will tipping off the enemies of the church secretly of their existance. Then foes of the church can steal the papers and spread them across the land. He also forges papers of historical importance whith help of sages who trust his reputation, making goodly kingdoms have false shady pasts. With help of his same tricks for the religious texts. He has also researched a ritual to mask the deception of paper permanently unless a powerful Dispel Magic is used. The character has high skills in bluff, arcana and religion. Best to place character in the Paragon Level. This character hook works best with groups with great divisions. Shar and Selune, Tymora and Beshaba, Netheril and Cormyr, etc. Based on a real person, can you guess who? Thoughts? |
| #2lord_karsusDec 09, 2008 10:04:28 | -I don't know, but that's a pretty cool plot hook, and I, myself, was planning something to that effect in one of my games at some point in the future, though with a secular leader, and not a religious leader, or church. |
| #3hvulpesDec 09, 2008 12:14:27 | -I don't know, but that's a pretty cool plot hook, and I, myself, was planning something to that effect in one of my games at some point in the future, though with a secular leader, and not a religious leader, or church. This is way I had him as both a secular and religious forger like the real-life person. The real person was an atheist who had grown disillusioned with the church he had been raised with, so most of his forgeries had been designed so that this real-life church was placed in a bad, or even foolish light. He also did historical text from famous Americans, including a very famous printed document which was the base of Amercia's Declaration of Independence and Bill of Right. This also reveal hints on the real-life person. So having a person who can flip between one style or the other, in case you need it. Even if he's more into secular then religious. |
| #4rinonalyrna_fathomlinDec 09, 2008 12:43:30 | This is way I had him as both a secular and religious forger like the real-life person. Secular and religious at the same time? The real person was an atheist who had grown disillusioned with the church he had been raised with, so most of his forgeries had been designed so that this real-life church was placed in a bad, or even foolish light. That's a shame. Usually no forgery or deception whatsoever is required for that. Anyway I do like the plot hook. ![]() |
| #5stupidmopDec 09, 2008 15:38:51 | Unless this guy is John Locke, I don't think whatever he wrote was THE basis of both the Declaration of Indpendence and the Bill of Rights . . . |
| #6hvulpesDec 09, 2008 16:17:48 | Unless this guy is John Locke, I don't think whatever he wrote was THE basis of both the Declaration of Indpendence and the Bill of Rights . . . It was Oath of a Freeman, the first printed document in the US. It is consider by some to be inspiration of one or more of the documents. I may have been mistaken by some aspect of it, thought. Of course the Wikipedia page of that document gives the name of the Forger, Mark Hoffman. Please don't reveal it to those on Candlekeep, so we can see how long it takes them to guess. ![]() |
| #7stupidmopDec 09, 2008 17:24:15 | It was Oath of a Freeman, the first printed document in the US. It is consider by some to be inspiration of one or more of the documents. I may have been mistaken by some aspect of it, thought. Interesting bit of history. No need to worry, I won't spoil a thing. ![]() |
| #8hvulpesDec 09, 2008 17:57:20 | Interesting bit of history. No need to worry, I won't spoil a thing. From what I can piece together, the Oath was basically an oath to be loyal to the Commonwealth and not go against the government. But as an ancestor to those two famous writings... it is the first statement of what it means to be a citizen of America with the rights and responibilities of that nation. It basically as the colonist... what is it to be an American? But I might be wrong. I come from a country where it's sub zero for three to four months or more and people chose to come here, while deadbeats who couldn't pay their bills went to a tropical paradise. I'm looking at you, Ozies! |
| #9rinonalyrna_fathomlinDec 09, 2008 18:07:50 | Interesting bit of history. The word I would use is ironic. |
| #10HobbitFanDec 09, 2008 19:28:18 | very interesting idea for some reason I thought of the david Irving trial when you posted first. |
| #11lord_karsusDec 11, 2008 11:19:02 | -I just introduced a similar plothook in my own game, that the PCs are just starting. I'll admit, it was based heavily off your ideas, here. What I did, basically, a Harper like organization that exists in my setting discovered that a Candlekeep like library was recently sacked by Goblin from the Underdark, and that the Goblins took with them as loot a tome that has the true location of a powerful Demilich that was sealed away, and how to bypass the wards that seal him in. The greater world doesn't know that he still exists, and believe the Lich to be dead. |
| #12markustay_dupDec 11, 2008 12:34:59 | Interesting. I've made my comments on this over at CK, but I would like to thank the OP for making me look up the RW case - it was good reading. ![]() |
| #13hvulpesDec 15, 2008 13:45:45 | Possible false documents: The Elfspell affair -- The kingdom of Cormyr was built on a lie. They elves didn't grant the land to the royal family, but were bewitched by their secret sorcerers using the blackest of magics. This not only makes the royal family (forget how to spell their name) look bad and brings up the question of their rightful rule... but it gives a banner for human hating elves and eladrin (like say a certain secret group nearby) to attack this tyrannical rule. The Duality letters -- A certain pair of dueling gods are not as they appear. They are not foes but two sides of the same god, driven to the maddening point where the deity split in personality in opposition. Examples would be Shar and Selune, Tymora and Beshaba or more interesting Torm and Bane (would live to see the churches reaction to the last one). Thoughts? |
| #14StiggerDec 15, 2008 13:53:36 | Those Duality letters are interesting... might have to swipe that one from you, that could be deliciously fun to play with. Would make for some interesting heresies. As to the ones I'd use... Lliira and Bane would be kind of neat, better contrast for Bane than Torm I think, at least in terms of portfolio. Power levels are a bit disparate, but that's besides the point. Torm would be more dramatic though, I'd agree there. As to the Elfspell Affair idea... I like it on the surface, but feel kinda bad for the Obarskyr's lately, they've been taking it on the chin of late, so I'm not too sure about it. Sympathy level is too high at the moment I guess. |
| #15lord_karsusDec 15, 2008 13:59:47 | -I also like the Elfspell Affair. It certain seems like an interesting plot. -The former, I think is a bit unrealistic. While churches can certainly preach any heretical information they want, I'd envision deities acting when heresies are "far out there", or are not in their best interests. For example, when a heresy arose that Shar and Lolth were one and the same being, by a cult beneath Thay, both Lolth and Shar prevented these cultists from receiving spells, and made it known that, in no certain terms, these cultists were charlatans. |
| #16StiggerDec 15, 2008 14:12:03 | Under 4e it could work very well however... ;) |
| #17hvulpesDec 15, 2008 14:38:10 | How about... The Shar's spellplague letters -- Shar knew that killing Mystra would cause the spellplague, but tricked Cyric into carrying it out as it would bring despair to many causing them to turn to her faith. Selunites would use it as a proof of a holy war against Shar for all of the pain and the other goodly gods would use it to slam Shar. Yet the Darkmaiden's worshipers might want it as well as they might embrace the message that their goddess could shatter the world at will, at any moment. So worship her and you may yet survive to taste the sweet betrayal and misery. Thoughts? |
| #18lord_karsusDec 15, 2008 15:30:17 | -That's good stuff, there. Need a more "awesome" name than 'Spellplague Letters', though. :P |
| #19hvulpesDec 15, 2008 16:49:50 | -That's good stuff, there. Need a more "awesome" name than 'Spellplague Letters', though. :P I like the aspect that the worshippers of Selune and Shar would both love to gain it to support their cause... even if it's a lie. For Selune it proves the depths of the evil of her sister which needs to be destroyed once and for all. While Shar's children would see it as absolute proof that their goddess if more powerful then all the gods combine, and they exist at her bitter mercy. For the name... True Despair articles or letters -- from the fact that all you have left is despair in a world at Shar's mercy. |
| #20markustay_dupDec 15, 2008 17:19:35 | The Shadow Protocols The Darness Missives Dispatches of the Damned ;) |
| #21lord_karsusDec 15, 2008 17:27:47 | -"The Shadow Protocols", I like. Reminds me of the Xavier Protocols. |
| #22markustay_dupDec 15, 2008 17:30:06 | Yeah, I had that one by itself at first, and then added the other two as they came to me. It may be a bit modern-sounding for some people's tastes, hence the alternatives. ![]() |