Table of Contents
Races of Osse
Major Races
Bullywug
Dream Dwarf
Goliath
Human, Oslander
Kodingobold
Tindrraynggwa
Minor Races
Gargun
Classes of Osse
Classes
…Barbarian
…Bard
…Binder
…Favored Soul
…Ranger
…Rogue
…Scout
…Shadowcaster
…Spirit Shaman
…Sorcerer
…Witchdoctor
Prohibited Classes
…Cleric
…Monk
…Paladin
…Wizard
…A Note About Prohibited Classes
Character Options
New Skills
…Lucid Dreaming
Feats
Prestige Classes
Dream Walker
Kurdaitcha
Tattooed Soldier
Mystic Shaman
Timeline of Osse
Geography of Osse
Notable Flora and Fauna
…Baji Foam Algae
…Wapa-Yandi Flower
…Gariguu Plant
…Jamba Plant
Central Osse
Geographical Overview
Sites
…Lake Biruu’burundi (Big Hole Lake)
…Mlimli Mudlands
…Baranna’nugan
…Mantha Plains
Southeast Osse
Geographical Overview
Sites
…The Majadeem (The Guardians)
…Zurbawunda (Desert Ziggurat)
…Opaleis Desert
…Lake Ngambati
…Wenwolok Canyons
…Ruins of Kella-Thus
Western Osse
Geographical Overview
Sites
…Tolyiwandi Mountains
…Guda N'gepya Volcano
…Baranna’wendanim
…Waatikantri Swamp
…Bulaarri Lakes
…Wugulu Plains
The Forest of Dreams
Geographical Overview
Sites
Beneath Osse
The Seas of Osse
Faiths and Religions of Osse
Bullywug
…Ophisternon
Dream Dwarves
…The Dreamheart
Goliath
...Animism
...Kivaki
Humans
…Animism
…Mother Osse (related to animism)
…The Voidcallers
Kodingobold
…Animism
Tindrraynggwa
Magic of Osse
Dream Weaver Magic
Elementalism
Incarnum
Psionics
Pact Magic
…Alcherin the Dreamer
…Byunjeeli the Traveler
…Daagan the Protector
…Kunjapipi the Life-Giver
…Tunbarum the Entertainer
Specific Spells/Powers
...Illusory Dreamscape
...Illusory Dreamscape (Greater)
...Lucid Dream
Life in Osse
Bullywug
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Dream Dwarves
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Goliath
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Humans
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Kodingobold
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Tindrraynggwa
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Organizations in Osse
The Guardians
Za-Renn
Monsters of Osse
Bunyip
Burrunjor
Con Rit
Dire Animal, Dingo
Dire Animal, Emu
Dire Animal, Monitor Lizard
Globster
Gunni
Marsupial Lion
Whirlwind Devil
Spirit (Animal)
Spirit (Place)
Yowie
Items of Osse
Dizheri
Dreamstone
Oneirium
Races of Osse
Major Races
Bullywug
Dream Dwarf
Goliath
Human, Oslander
Kodingobold
Tindrraynggwa
Minor Races
Gargun
Classes of Osse
Classes
…Barbarian
…Bard
…Binder
…Favored Soul
…Ranger
…Rogue
…Scout
…Shadowcaster
…Spirit Shaman
…Sorcerer
…Witchdoctor
Prohibited Classes
…Cleric
…Monk
…Paladin
…Wizard
…A Note About Prohibited Classes
Character Options
New Skills
…Lucid Dreaming
Feats
Prestige Classes
Dream Walker
Kurdaitcha
Tattooed Soldier
Mystic Shaman
Timeline of Osse
Geography of Osse
Notable Flora and Fauna
…Baji Foam Algae
…Wapa-Yandi Flower
…Gariguu Plant
…Jamba Plant
Central Osse
Geographical Overview
Sites
…Lake Biruu’burundi (Big Hole Lake)
…Mlimli Mudlands
…Baranna’nugan
…Mantha Plains
Southeast Osse
Geographical Overview
Sites
…The Majadeem (The Guardians)
…Zurbawunda (Desert Ziggurat)
…Opaleis Desert
…Lake Ngambati
…Wenwolok Canyons
…Ruins of Kella-Thus
Western Osse
Geographical Overview
Sites
…Tolyiwandi Mountains
…Guda N'gepya Volcano
…Baranna’wendanim
…Waatikantri Swamp
…Bulaarri Lakes
…Wugulu Plains
The Forest of Dreams
Geographical Overview
Sites
Beneath Osse
The Seas of Osse
Faiths and Religions of Osse
Bullywug
…Ophisternon
Dream Dwarves
…The Dreamheart
Goliath
...Animism
...Kivaki
Humans
…Animism
…Mother Osse (related to animism)
…The Voidcallers
Kodingobold
…Animism
Tindrraynggwa
Magic of Osse
Dream Weaver Magic
Elementalism
Incarnum
Psionics
Pact Magic
…Alcherin the Dreamer
…Byunjeeli the Traveler
…Daagan the Protector
…Kunjapipi the Life-Giver
…Tunbarum the Entertainer
Specific Spells/Powers
...Illusory Dreamscape
...Illusory Dreamscape (Greater)
...Lucid Dream
Life in Osse
Bullywug
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Dream Dwarves
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Goliath
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Humans
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Kodingobold
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Tindrraynggwa
…History
…Physical Description
…Outlook
…Society
…Language and Literacy
…Names
…Magic and Lore
…Spells and Spellcasting
…Magic Items
…Deities
…Relations with Other Races
…Equipment
…Arms and Armor
…Animals and Pets
…Abilities and Racial Features
Organizations in Osse
The Guardians
Za-Renn
Monsters of Osse
Bunyip
Burrunjor
Con Rit
Dire Animal, Dingo
Dire Animal, Emu
Dire Animal, Monitor Lizard
Globster
Gunni
Marsupial Lion
Whirlwind Devil
Spirit (Animal)
Spirit (Place)
Yowie
Items of Osse
Dizheri
Dreamstone
Oneirium
It was also briefly mentioned in the Class Chronicles series, for Spirit Shamans and Totemists.
It can also be seen on the "A Scholar's View Of Abeir-Toril" world map in the FRCS 3e. Which one would it be?
The one on the right, past the Eastern Sea and Southern Ocean?Merry Ol' Land of Osse:
Me, obviously. :D (Not that I have the time for such things, but anyway.) What I rambled on about in that other thread was just the tip of the ice-berg of ideas I have an Australia-themed Osse.
-What thread was that? I don't remember, and my subscriptions got erased the other day.
-Or, if you have an actual file, mind copying and pasting some stuff?
I mean, Oz already has Warforged (Tin Men), Shifters (Lion) and Halflings (Munchkins). Do we really want all that, again? :D See the Tin Man miniseries for what it would look like in D&D.
Karsus, it was the 'Continent Names' thread, here:
http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1151827
Oh, yeah, kodingobolds are in FR as well.
Then again, we should all finish what we've started, what with Elves of Faerun, Kara-Tur Redux and the Utter East. :D Osse is pretty much a blank-slate, we'd be starting from scratch.
It got awful reviews, but I did not think it was that bad... it was slightly cheesy, but overall interesting. Azkadellia was my favorite character as I thought she was the most complex and interesting. Also... boob bat-monkeys. Who does not love a female villain with boob bat-monkeys? I am so stealing that someday, mark my words. :P
Also, I laughed when we found out what happened to the Wizard of Oz. I don't want to spoil it for anyone, but it was funny in such an evil and cruel way. It was at that point when I definitely knew that it was something my four year old nephew probably shouldn't see. :P
----
As for doing Osse... please no.
I'm not really a fan of these rip-off cultures (Maztica and Kara-Tur). The last thing we need is one based off of Australia. Didn't the guy in that novel go around talking about his dingo and such? If I am not mistaken people said he was written like a bad Steve Irwin.
Didn't the guy in that novel go around talking about his dingo and such?
-No.
As for the doing Osse, I'd have to agree with BCM - we already have too many projects going on, most of which appear to be dead-ending (a lot of which is my fault).
As for the Tinman series... it BLEW CHUNKS.
The 'Dorothy' was quite possibly the worst actress I have ever seen... EVER (including school plays by Kindergarteners). I don't know who she was doing to get that part, but she must be damn good in the sack. She was truly atrocious.
I thought 'the Tinman' take itself was rather clever (making him a sheriff), but other then that, it came close to being as bad as the Flash Gorden series (which blew bigger chunks, but only because of the 'Star Gate' type of plot).
Battlestar was a rare hit for SciFI Channel - most of their series are utter schlok.
BTW, if and when I map Osse (Goegraphy only, naturally), I DO plan on using the Oz map as a basis... but trust me... you won't recognize it. ;)
And for those of you who insist on doing this project, and also for those of you 'Cat Girl' fans, I present a character class -
The 'Roo Girl', including mandatory boxing-gloves. :D
I've not read Lady Of Poison, so I couldn't comment. Now I want to see how it turned out.
And dingoes don't bark. They've been around long enough that they kind of "count" as an Australian animal anyway. Wikis... Huh, they're not even limited to Australia. Some are even found in America!
I must admit, my cultural cringe is kicking in now (thanks to Markus, mainly). While I think an Australian-themed fantasy would be awesome, filtering it through you Americans would not. :P No offense. :D
I've not read Lady Of Poison, so I couldn't comment. Now I want to see how it turned out.
-I'm actually rereading it, for multiple reasons:
(A) To comb the little bits of information about Osse out of it, which doesn't amount to very much.
(B) To give it a review.
(C) Because it was actually pretty good.
-No, just no.
No, no, no, good gods no. Take your furry nonsense elsewhere.
You guys did realize I was just kidding, right? :P
I know how LK feels about 'Cat Girls', and I just couldn't resist.
Besides, they'd never get along with the WereCrocodiles, Dingopeople (Osse Gnolls), and OwlDropbears. :D
Not to mention the Dire Formian-Eaters.
Also, 3E or 4E?
You guys did realize I was jsust kidding, right? :P
Oh, we know. We still feel like plucking out our eyes and washing our brains with bleach afterwards.
Worse, female kangas are always motherly in the animal cartoons. I'm doubly horrified.'Sides, kangaroos a better at kicking. They can disembowel.
I dunno... it's such a HUGE area... larger than Faerun, larger than Kara-Tur. I think the idea of Spirit Shamans is interesting, but the continent needs something more than just that.
Also, 3E or 4E?
By its very nature, Osse should be huge but empty, just like its source. :D
For my ideas, I was thinking of starting with the native Ossean culture and tribes, then throwing in colonists from across the world: Faerun, Kara-Tur, Zakhara. Then some much better race-relations in a world that doesn't have to suffer racism, religious conflict, eugenics, widespread disease, environmental damage, etc. True multiculturalism.
It'd be a retcon to have so many nations colonizing land half a world away, but it might account for the drop in population figures, either entering 3e or entering 4e. With vague enough flavour, no stats and a few allowances, Osse could feasibly exist in either era, just change the dates,
I'm hard-pressed to think of a source of conflict in Osse though, but this is fitting. Competition and co-operation should be the order of the day (vast distances and harsh environment really prevent warfare). Conflict would be more philosophical: nature vs cities, tribalism vs civilization, stone age primitiveness and wisdom vs modern notions and arrogance. Druids/rangers would help keep the balance and the peace.
The colonies become city-states (in classic FR fashion), separated from their home nations and growing independent. The idea of an alliance appeals (ie Federation) but they can never agree on anything, competing, bickering and jostling for power instead. Enter the PCs, as intrepid explorers, scouts, protectors and mediators.
I dunno... it's such a HUGE area... larger than Faerun, larger than Kara-Tur. I think the idea of Spirit Shamans is interesting, but the continent needs something more than just that.
-If you look at the map, it is smaller than both Faerûn (by a little) and Kara-Tur (by a bit more).
I picture the thing being like a massive version of the Stonelands, and DMs can go with whatever they want from there (Fallen, ancient Empires, weird flora and fauna a'la Athas, perhaps a valley or two were a 'lost civilization' has managed to survive, etc, ec...)
Edit: For some reason, I'm thinking a Xendrik spin (Giants long-gone), but without the Jungle (otherwise we could just take Xendrik and drop it right in!)
In the waters right off of it's Western and North Western coasts, a large kingdom of Sahuagin, a la your "Empire of the Tides", as a rough-but-not-exact-and-interesting analogue for the Great Barrier Reef. Their presence also explains the relative lack of back-and-forth interaction between Osse and other continents.
Eastern and North Eastern Osse is a tropical climate, with a lot of rain, humidity, and wetness. This causes swamps and jungles.
Central Osse is more-or-less scrubland/grassland/prairie, with enough rainfall to not be considered a desert.
Southwest Osse is a real desert, created artificially, as opposed to naturally (reasons to be determined).
Southern Osse is swampy and humid, with a tropical climate.
Western Osse is somewhat mountainous, preventing westward exploration of the seas.
That island off of Southwest Osse ("Tasmania") is a tropical climate.
Celestial Sea:
I never discussed colonies on Osse, but another poster did.
If Osse has it's own civilization (as in NOT primitive), then colonies there should not exist, AT ALL. That would only work if it had an aboriginal culture similar to Australia's, Africa, or the Americas. Also, Shou (an Tu) have only 'discovered' Kozakura in the past couple of centuuries, which makes very little sense, considering they've always known about Wa (and the two are right next to each other!)
You'll note the distance between the two continents is nearly the same as it is between Faerûn and Maztica. Don't know if that matters at all, but it is a decent reference as to how far official FR cultures have explored beyond their continent (something seeming to happen only in recent times for some bizarre reason). I think Sea-travel is a much riskier business on a Fantasy world filled with monsters and intelligent water-Kingdoms.
I also found THIS, which I wish I had found before I did my CKC article, because I would have used Ed's islands instead of making-up my own. Note in that that there seems to have been MUCH more cross-ocean sailing in Ed's home campaign then the official one ever let on - there were CITIES founded by Faerûnians just off the coast of Anchorme (or rather - that WAS Anchorome).
I also found THIS, which I wish I had found before I did my CKC article, because I would have used Ed's islands instead of making-up my own. Note in that that there seems to have been MUCH more cross-ocean sailing in Ed's home campaign then the official one ever let on - there were CITIES founded by Faerûnians just off the coast of Anchorme (or rather - that WAS Anchorome).
Yes, I've always found that lore fascinating, which is why I referenced those uncharted islands in my Age of Sail CKC IX article p.13
- 'Tattooed Soldiers'
- Strange tattoos
- Thick soled leather shoes
- Breech clouts
- Gunggari Ulmarra
- Disdainful of clothing
- Dizheri: Long, stout wooden tube; colorful, warclub and walkingstick
- Osse is "beyond the girdle of the world"
- Person from Osse = Oslander
- Ancestor worship/veneration
Maybe they had 'Spellscars' before the rest of the Realms got 'em. :P
Although it's obviously derived from aboriginal culture, there are a few ways for us to spruce it up and differentiate it. I was thinking make more of a matriarchal society, similar in many ways to the Drow (priestesses in charge), but not evil like the Drow.
The Dream Time is facinating, so I wouldn't want to lose that - perhaps make it a type of spirit Shamen that contacts ancestor spirits by traveling through the Plane of Dreams into the Nightmare Realms (which naturally borders both the Dream Time and the Shadowfel).
Perhaps a type of Druidism coupled with Dance/Chant/trance Magic for Casters (a type of primitive Hedge-Wizard). I'm thinking the MU would have to 'seek-out' his spells in a Dream, similar to the way a Sha'ir has to send his Gen to fetch spells for him.
Boomerangs... gotta have Boomerangs.... :D
- Alcheringa: A philosophy.
- Tattoos speak of strength, skill, and dedication to Alcheringa.
- Tattoos are totems, each one telling of an ancestral hero
- Tattoos can be "called on" when in need.
- Tunbarum: A spirit of music, who plays the dizheri.
"Other nature spirit-channeling totemists exist among the Osse who come from lands to the South of Faerûn."
Southwest Osse is a real desert, created artificially, as opposed to naturally (reasons to be determined).
Another artificial desert? :P No, I want real natural desert, it would make a pleasant change. :D
Dizheri? Is that like a didgeridoo?
Alcheringa? One of the the names for the Dreamtime is Altjeringa. So Bruce Cordell hasn't changed much. At all. The curse of FR's real-world analogues continues.
Magical tattoos? I guess this is where Cordell tried out Spellscars. Tattoos are a bit more original, though surprisingly tame when compared to Aboriginal sand-scarrings. And some tribes used to knock out a tooth or chop off a finger-joint as a coming-of-age ritual to show toughness.
Although it's obviously derived from aboriginal culture, there are a few ways for us to spruce it up and differentiate it. I was thinking make more of a matriarchal society, similar in many ways to the Drow (priestesses in charge), but not evil like the Drow.
Actually, like the Aboriginals, there could easily be a hundred Oslander tribes (we don't need quite that many). Each of them would have very different cultures, practices and beliefs, with only a basic way of life, broad themes and some specifics in common, like the Dreaming/Dream-time, the Rainbow (World?) Serpent and some others.
There'd be matriarchies, patriarchies, and mixed versions (more common, this is FR). Gender-based cultural practices come down to "men's business" and "women's business": initiation, training, education, sacred sites.
In addition to what LK's listed in his first post, Class Chronicles offers this snippet:
"Other nature spirit-channeling totemists exist among the Osse who come from lands to the South of Faerûn."
Which strangely makes it sound like one of the enormous islands to the south, rather then the large continent on the other side of the planet.
Another artificial desert? :P No, I want real natural desert, it would make a pleasant change.
Agreed - I was actually disappointed when I learned the Quoya was also caused my magic (indirectly, but still...)
Alcheringa? One of the the names for the Dreamtime is Altjeringa. So Bruce Cordell hasn't changed much. At all. The curse of FR's real-world analogues continues.
Trying not to say anything ban-worthy, but... did you really expect more at this point?
Magical tattoos? I guess this is where Cordell tried out Spellscars. Tattoos are a bit more original, though surprisingly tame when compared to Aboriginal sand-scarrings.
If the inks used are magical in nature (and they should be), they could cause a combination of scarring and tatooing - the Inks could be somewhat caustic and cause immense pain and burning. That would cover the 'right of passage' pain/test, and make the whole thing a bit more grusesome (I'm picturing them having to pin-down young men as the tattoos 'take', with a lot of moaning and thrashing about - the trick is not to scream ;) )
And some tribes used to knock out a tooth or chop off a finger-joint as a coming-of-age ritual to show toughness.
Now thats just down-right primitive... and makes them look like hicks. :P
Actually, like the Aboriginals, there could easily be a hundred Oslander tribes (we don't need quite that many). Each of them would have very different cultures, practices and beliefs, with only a basic way of life, broad themes and some specifics in common, like the Dreaming/Dream-time, the Rainbow (World?) Serpent and some others.
Certainly wouldn't want to create hundreds of tribes. I'd say just one 'typical' tribal arrangement that most follow, and then perhaps 3-4 'atypical' ones. I'd like to keep an over-alll Matriarchal spin, but we could vary it by overtness. Say, in some tribes the decisions are actyally made by the 'Woman's Council', and in others, the women influence their husbands, thereby indirectly influencing decsions made by the Men's council. Either way, I like that the woman would be in charge of the religous aspects (and be the 'true power'), because this differentiates it quite a bit from many RW primitive cultures (Shamen are always male... and we should try to avoid that).
Shawomen? :D
Of course, you would still have men with power, but they'd follow a different path, and be 'loners' mostly (similar to the Witch Doctors - the name escapes me ATM - of Katra-Tur). Thats where I get the Druyidic angle - they may form groups, but they'd mostly live in the wilderness seperate from the tribe (also similar to witch's covens... perhaps have them be some sort of Duid/Warlock hybrid).
As for the Rainbpw Serpent - we already have Jazirian, who works fine (we could just say he functins under an alias here, or just use Jazirian, since it's not that well-known anyway). I believe he was killed by one of FR's serpent Gods at some point (ToT?), but I can't find that bit in SK.
There'd be matriarchies, patriarchies, and mixed versions (more common, this is FR). Gender-based cultural practices come down to "men's business" and "women's business": initiation, training, education, sacred sites.
Basically what I said above - establish the 'norm' for most tribes, describing one of the more powerful, typical tribes, and then describe a few variant ones (including at least one cannibalistic group that eat the brains of their enemies - gotta have 'laughing sickness' - it's just too weird and creepy to miss out on).
Another artificial desert? :P No, I want real natural desert, it would make a pleasant change. :D
I agree, because I like deserts.:D
Magical tattoos? I guess this is where Cordell tried out Spellscars.
To be fair, didn't the Thayans have magical tattoos long before this novel was published? I'm pretty sure Cordell didn't create those.
PS: The real Tasmania is temperate rather than tropical.
In the waters right off of it's Western and North Western coasts, a large kingdom of Sahuagin, a la your "Empire of the Tides", as a rough-but-not-exact-and-interesting analogue for the Great Barrier Reef. Their presence also explains the relative lack of back-and-forth interaction between Osse and other continents.
A large kingdom of very advanced Sahuagin, strong enough to dissuade even the powerful empires except for the odd high-value mining outpost that's supplied by Spelljammer? Sahuagin that can sink ships with undersea rams propelled by some suitable mount.
Who are the bad guys? Advanced lizard men?
LK's description is too pleasant. Make it meaner.
We don't want to replicate Zakhara's interior - big desert, lots of ruins. I'm thinking environmental extremes - very hot and wet, very dry, very high and cold. Huge foetid tidal swamplands.
Need a pre-history - maybe one of the creator races hung around Osse longer than elsewhere? Maybe they're still there? Maybe they don't like colonisers? Maybe they have glittering ?
"cities" on a continent-wide scale - a couple of towers here and there that look like independent outposts to other races but they think of as a built-up area. The whole continent is a city as far as they're concerned, and they treat it as such - the human and humanoid tribes live below a technology and concentration of population threshold that they even notice, but any substantial foreign colony will attract their notice and be wiped out.
Trying not to say anything ban-worthy, but... did you really expect more at this point?
Sigh. Guess not.
So, I'd assume Cordell wasn't responsible for getting rid of Maztica, Chessenta, Unther, Mulhorand, and the various Arabic and Indian lands - but I can't make the assumption that he's free of hypocrisy.If the inks used are magical in nature (and they should be), they could cause a combination of scarring and tatooing - the Inks could be somewhat caustic and cause immense pain and burning. That would cover the 'right of passage' pain/test, and make the whole thing a bit more grusesome (I'm picturing them having to pin-down young men as the tattoos 'take', with a lot of moaning and thrashing about - the trick is not to scream)
Hmm. The tattoos remind me more of Maori and Polynesian customs - huge and elaborate tattooed designs, full of meaning, and hammered in with a bone needle over the course of a day. Just enduring it is the coming-of-age ritual (because running away in the middle leaves you with a half-a-tattoo that everyone can see and laugh at. :D).
With the way tattoos used to be done, you really don't need to make them more painful.
Certainly wouldn't want to create hundreds of tribes. I'd say just one 'typical' tribal arrangement that most follow, and then perhaps 3-4 'atypical' ones. I'd like to keep an over-alll Matriarchal spin, but we could vary it by overtness. Say, in some tribes the decisions are actyally made by the 'Woman's Council', and in others, the women influence their husbands, thereby indirectly influencing decsions made by the Men's council. Either way, I like that the woman would be in charge of the religous aspects (and be the 'true power'), because this differentiates it quite a bit from many RW primitive cultures (Shamen are always male... and we should try to avoid that).
Shawomen? :D
Damn, Markus. It's shaman, from the Manchu word saman. Plural is shamans. Gender is irrelevant to the word. Many cultures have male and/or female shamans.
Both exist in Aboriginal culture. Generally they're called "clever men" and "clever women".
Why no colonies? Either it's not worth colonising, or something stops them.
Yeah, I think having colonies would add some variety to the setting, so it's not just all wilderness and tribes. Fantasy needs cities. Plus, it would mirror Australia and its themes better.
I'm rather against Osse having lost cities and fallen empires. Australia is a dead land, and could never support by itself an agricultural revolution to enable the aboriginals to settle (some ruined villages have been found). 40,000 years of history*, and not much happened. Making Osse into a fresh, young civilization that's not built on the ruins of the past would be a new thing for FR. (Then again, oral history and aboriginal habits go back thousands of years - the Oslanders would of course disagree.)
Magic changes this, of course. Maybe a few lost Oslander cities, with one surviving for something completely different.
* Given Abeir-Toril's highly compressed history, this would actually have to be reduced to match.
On the other hand, a lost prehuman civilization would fulfill the requirements of ruins to explore. I'm reminded of a HP Lovecraft that was set in my state; I was so pleased.
LK's description is too pleasant. Make it meaner.
We don't want to replicate Zakhara's interior - big desert, lots of ruins. I'm thinking environmental extremes - very hot and wet, very dry, very high and cold. Huge foetid tidal swamplands.
Yes. Much of my thinking was towards making many of the threats and dangers in Osse be environment: deserts, dangerous animals. Large scale threats would be bushfires and floods and windstorms - personified by elementals perhaps.
Hey! I thought we weren't going to work on this! :D
When colonies were discussed in the K-T thread, I had mentioned the possibility that the east-coast have at least one 'civilized' kingdom (hopefully more), but that the west coast was not settled... which leads one to wonder why the easterners have not bothered with it (some sort of taboo, perhaps?). It could just be as simple as the place beiung very inhospitable (on that side), which is exactly how I was picturing it (and it didn't stop the Shou from attempting a colony/port there... which mysteriously disappeared).
For Kingdoms on the east side, I'm not sure what kind of cultures would be there, if we are using one based on aboriginies for the main part of the continent.
Non-human may be the way to go, so its not just like the rest of Faerûn (or Retrurned Abeir, for that matter). We have more then enough 'classic medieval' style kingdoms to do that again. Perhaps a powerful empire, made-up of a half-dozen seperate (and rebellious) Kingdoms?
Just trying to imagine something completely different for this region - at least different then anything already on Toril. Perhaps even a Romanesque Empire still in the Bronze-Age? That could work....
Hey! I thought we weren't going to work on this!
We're not. We're just talking about what we might say if we were going to work on it.
No colonies because then you are assuming that no-one already lives there, or the culture is just so primitive that it can be ignored (and we already have/had that with maztica, Anchorome, and possibly Katashaka).
When colonies were discussed in the K-T thread, I had mentioned the possibility that the east-coast have at least one 'civilized' kingdom (hopefully more), but that the west coast was not settled... which leads one to wonder why the easterners have not bothered with it (some sort of taboo, perhaps?). It could just be as simple as the place beiung very inhospitable (on that side), which is exactly how I was picturing it (and it didn't stop the Shou from attempting a colony/port there... which mysteriously disappeared).
For Kingdoms on the east side, I'm not sure what kind of cultures would be there, if we are using one based on aboriginies for the main part of the continent.
Non-human may be the way to go, so its not just like the rest of Faerûn (or Abeir, for that matter). We have more then enough 'classic medieva;' style kingdoms to do that once again. Perhaps a powerful empire, made-up of a half-dozen seperate (and rebellious) Kingdoms?
Just trying to imagine something completely different for this region - at least different then anything already on Toril. Perhaps even a Romanesque Empire still in the Bronze-Age? That could work....
if you want to go primitive, i've been thinking of developing a region that is cursed so that "no stone may lay atop another for a day and a night" by a powerful elemental.
what i mean by this is that it is impossible to build anything by human hands that will last a day due to a powerful curse. essentially, civilization is made impossible by powerful magic. while we don't have to apply all of this to Osse, it makes it such that anything beyond hunter-gatherers is impossible.
the region/continent then would be made of monsters, extremely primitive tribes, etc..
just a thought.
Another artificial desert? :P No, I want real natural desert, it would make a pleasant change. :D
-I don't know how a natural desert would be side-by-side with rainforest, swamp, and prairies, so...
We're not. We're just talking about what we might say if we were going to work on it.
LOL :D
Right - we are just 'musing' about how some of us have imagined it. This is just a discussion, not a project.
@Yakman - Thats a pretty cool idea for the 'cursed land' - definately useable for a large portion of it. We could also have Wild Magic/Dead Magic zones as well.
Dinosaurs are cool, but we already have them in several areas. If anything, I would go full-blown 'fantastic' for the flora and fauna for this region. Something closer to Athas, with all its weird critters and plants (and naturally, many egg-laying mammals).
Hmmmm... a small Dragon with a pouch?
Koala Bugbears? :D
Then again, how scarey would those be?
Definately some Thyclacines (Tasmanian Tigers) - nothing like cool extinct species for out little Toril. Maybe even go pleiocene rather then jurassic. Weird animals are not as derivitive as dino's.
-I don't know how a natural desert would be side-by-side with rainforest, swamp, and prairies, so...
The real Australia has all of those things, naturally.
They're called 'mountains'. :P
The real Australia has all of those things, naturally.
-That's what I was thinking while doing some drawing while riding the train. I wasn't sure if that was how things actually worked, though. The eastern coasts are jungle, swampy, hot and humid. They are bordered on their western side by tall, tall mountains. Those mountains disrupt the wind and rain and all of that, causing prairies and desert on the mountains' western side.
@Yakman - Thats a pretty cool ifdea for the 'cursed land' - definately useable for a large portion of it. We could also have Wild Magic/Dead Magic zones as well.
Dinosaurs are cool, but we already have them in several areas. If anything, I would go full-blown 'fantastic' for the flora and fauna for this region. Something closer to Athas, with all its weird critters and plants (and naturally, many egg-laying mammals).
Why not take Athas and put it into an FR context? Standard magic just plain won't work here... or it comes in two sorts: the spirit shamans and their far darker brethren: the DEFILERS.
Defilers never got their fair due. Not wanting to mince words, I'll come out and say it: DEFILERS ARE FRIGGING SWEET.
What does this do? Creates a different magical context for the continent, serves as a means to keep out the Shou and the Zakharans, and also provides for a wealth of role-playing possibilities.
As for the Rainbpw Serpent - we already have Jazirian, who works fine (we could just say he functins under an alias here, or just use Jazirian, since it's not that well-known anyway). I believe he was killed by one of FR's serpent Gods at some point (ToT?), but I can't find that bit in SK.
I like the World Serpent better for the Rainbow Serpent, over Jazirian. If the World Serpent has been sleeping for ages, he might reside in the Plane of Dreams. Osse could have powerful connections with the Plane of Dreams, which they might just call the Dreamtime... or Alcheringa.
Also, if they worship the World Serpent (or Rainbow Serpent) that could imply sarrukh influence in the ancient past. Perhaps the yuan-ti have strong roots in Osse. There maybe copious underground kingdoms of scalyfolk in the underdark below Osse. The humans of Osse might well have some yuan-ti blood running through their bloodlines.
Such a presence might imply that other scalyfolk gods are known in Osse. Sseth and Zehir might well have an interest in fostering worshipers here. Deities such as Laogzed and Shekinester may have some influence as well.
However, I was borrowing heavilly from the Mahasarpa (OA)WE for that, and the humanskill anything 'scaley' on-sight, for the most part. In osee, it could be an excepted thing, and there could be people with scales and snake-features walking around in the open with no problems.
Now I'm starting to see a 'Dinotopia' spin on the continent, if we bring in Sarrukh influence.
Maybe throw in Raptorrans and Bullywug Kingdoms - give the whole place a 'Creator Race' feel. Ergo, it would be like taking RW Australia's known oddities (more 'primitive' flora and fauna) and translating them into Realms terms. The entire place could be a 'throw-back' to an earlier era.
The 'Underground Kingdoms' works very well for my concept of the entire center being a vast plateau. If the surface of the plateau is nothing more then a monster-infested, blasted wasteland, then it makes sense that region below ground would be utilized. Not a true Underdark at all, because those cultures living there would be at 'sea-level' - basically just a massive cave complex (as in, thousands of miles).
A continent with a mostly-subterranean population is rather different, and could prove very cool (everyone becomes a Dwarf! :D ). We could even bring Ed's 'long-lost' albino Elves into this area.
I was goping to say that halfligs would be one of the few groups living near the surface of the plateau (in burrows), and could act as go-betweens for the deeper races and whatever lives on the surface. That may give them too much of an Eberron-Halfling feel, though (socially - living in burrows is NOT Eberron).
And like I said, the plateau is just most of the central portion of Osse - the 'outer rim' would be 1-200 hundred miles wide, and be inhabited by more 'normal' groups.
I've been trying to think of a 'mystical' reason for the plateau, and I keep getting drawn to the Abber nomads of RL and Abeir. Perhaps the wasteland is what was left after a large portion of the world was swapped with Abeir, or was even one of those regions 'left blank' after Ao created Abeir (sending a good portion of the aboriginal peoples along with it to Abeir, some of whom eventually became the Abber Nomads of RL).
This thread got me in the mood. :D
I had to reduce the size to upload, so the res isn't as good as it should be. Also, I've only got the outline done (which is one of the hardest parts - I have to go over everything five times!)
Now we need to just figure out what the hell to fil it with. I also need some Island names, but I suppose that will come with the lore.
And NO, this sill isn't a project... its a fun 'exercise'. ;)
-And, yes, yes this is a project. It became one, anyway. :P
-I was doing plenty of wrighting while on the train. Once I type it all up, I'll share. It's basically about Osse's climate, and the general structure of the people who live on the continent.
-And, here's a rough concept of what I am envisioning right not:
That being said, those areas are far too vast, I think - that swamp would be well over a thousand miles across. I also wanted the massive plateau to sud-divide the continet (which would put the desert area in the middle).
I have to go do some work now (:yuck
, but I'll try to have something up later - I 'colored in' the plains-terrain last night.That being said, those areas are far too vast, I think - that swamp would be well over a thousand miles across.
-Hey, that's why I said 'rough concept', and used MS Paint to draw things! :P
I've provided a 'visual reference'.
-In trying to keep similar to Australia, and the entire Australian motif, a large desert is a must, as is an "outback"-type range. After that, it becomes embellishing for the sake of spicing things up. I do not want to spice things up "too much", where things become something of a fantasy trope. One of my favorite video games, Suikoden, the main location fell pray to this, in a way: In one corner, there were Dragon Knights. In another corner, the place felt heavily influenced by France. In other corner, there were Germanic/Slavic barbarians, complete with stereotypical vampire.
-So, in short, that is to say, right now, I am looking at ways to to "build up" the place without sprinkling "a little of this here, and a little of that there", for the sake of doing so, and including geographic variation. The same thing goes with races, when I move on to that (I want to finalize geography before moving on): I was thinking about including nothing but Humans, or a very small (less than five) amount of races on the island, as not to fall victim to the "little of this, a little of that" theme.
Maybe throw in Raptorrans and Bullywug Kingdoms - give the whole place a 'Creator Race' feel. Ergo, it would be like taking RW Australia's known oddities (more 'primitive' flora and fauna) and translating them into Realms terms. The entire place could be a 'throw-back' to an earlier era.
That sounds like a good theme for it.
I never really cared much for that shape, and unfortunately it was "carried-over" into firm canon when we got a map of Toril on pg. 231 of the FRCS.
I'm really considering playing with that large northern island somewhat - that one in particular sticks in my craw.
I took the liberty of adding a bunch of small islands off the coast all around (they're hard to see on the map because of the lower res), but I'm considering adding in larger ones (but not too large) in that northern bay, and perhaps all along the northern coast. I need to do something with that god-awful shape, without changing it completely from canon.
Also, the larger of the two western island is called Meluria - it's the home of my Beiy'maar (I named it a LONG time ago on another map).
-No, no, I know it's quite large. I estimated that it's about 2,750 miles in "width", and about 2,400 miles in "height". Would you say that's about right, roughly?.
One of the great things about the FRIA is that it has a measuring tool. By that tool, Osse is about 4,400 miles east/west and 3,900 miles north/south at its widest mainland points.
By pasting the scale from the official canon Faerûn Map onto my Osse Map (which is at the same exact scale), I'm getting something around 2700 across by 2500 N. to S.
In fact, you could probably get a good estimate just by looking at that 'visual reference' thingy I did above.
One of the great things about the FRIA is that it has a measuring tool. By that tool, Osse is about 4,400 miles east/west and 3,900 miles north/south at its widest mainland points.
-I need to install that again...
-That seems WAY off, however, given the direct Faerûn/Osse transparison.
One of the few things 4e didn't do that every other edition of FR did was shrink the maps.
-That's too bad, because, with everything shrinking, there'd be an explanation as to why Halflings are taller right there.
-Yes, so, with that out of the way...What other geographic features and biomes do you think fit, going on the idea that I'm not trying to pack in "a little of this, and a little of that", using roughly the same image I included earlier, but with things toned down for size?
-And, animals and plants, as well. Plants, I haven't done any research about, but, with animals, I have a list (that is composed of all of the different included regions, grasslands, mountain, desert, swamp and jungle) that so far includes:
Plains Creatures
Ostrich/Emu, Billby, Brush-tailed possum, Dingo, Echidna, Fluffy Glider, Sugar Glider, Wombat, Tree Kangaroo, Kookaburra , Koala, Lyrebird, Moles, Anteaters, Quokka
Swamp Creatures
Saltwater crocodiles, Eels, Monitor Lizard, Dingo, False Water Rat, Fluffy Glider, Frilled neck lizard, Green Tree Frog, Ornamental Snake, Swamp tortoise, Yabby
Jungle Creatures
Bandicoot, Poison Dart Frog, Green Tree Frog, Cassowary, Dingo, Fluffy Glider, Frilled neck lizard, Tree Kangaroo, King Parrot, Kookaburra, Koala, Pademelon
Desert Creatures
Thorny Devil, Echidna, Frilled neck lizard, Mulgara
Mountain Creatures
Wallaby, Kangaroo, Thorny Devil, Birds, Wallaroo
-Any new terrain suggestions?
Ocean
Bunyip
But then I have to keep coming back to offer my expert opinion on this. Catching up...
No colonies because then you are assuming that no-one already lives there, or the culture is just so primitive that it can be ignored (and we already have/had that with Maztica, Anchorome, and possibly Katashaka).
I think a potential Australia-based campaign setting (and this is what Osse is and will be) would have to include the colonisation period to add some variety to the area. Else it's just tribes and legends and environment - interesting in its own right, but not nothing to really flesh the area out and add options. Colonies are a good way to get PCs in and involved, city-based adventurers, and add in the chance to emulate Australia's growth from nothing, interactions with the natives (better than in reality), our multiculturalism and more modern elements.
And yes, Australia was regarded as terra nullius, meaning "land belonging to no one", "nobody's land", "empty land" or "desolate". Except for everyone living there already, of course.
It's easy enough to imagine some explorers landing on Osse and thinking it's a damn big enough place to put in a few colonies. I think the presence of druids, rangers (I see them as being very important in Osse, like in Australia) and magical language translation could help colonists and natives decide on land use issues. Osse need not be "nobody's land", the colonists can just buy it off the native Oslanders.As I said earlier, Australia is primarily a dead land. It should have little in the way of what know as "civilisation" before the colonists arrive (and it should be doubtful as to whether they can make it; cue PCs). Previously, there should be a lot of nomadic tribes, a few villages, one city for kicks, and maybe some prehistoric monstrous stuff.
Dinosaurs are cool, but we already have them in several areas. If anything, I would go full-blown 'fantastic' for the flora and fauna for this region. Something closer to Athas, with all its weird critters and plants (and naturally, many egg-laying mammals).
I agree, dinosaurs are overused. Australia used to have its own monsters though. Like thylacaleo the marsupial "lion", a kangaroo-related creature that could leap from trees on to its prey. And there's giant wombats. And drop bears!
-That's what I was thinking while doing some drawing while riding the train. I wasn't sure if that was how things actually worked, though. The eastern coasts are jungle, swampy, hot and humid. They are bordered on their western side by tall, tall mountains. Those mountains disrupt the wind and rain and all of that, causing prairies and desert on the mountains' western side.
The rains tend to go around Australia, actually. Rains and hurricanes often come down from south-east Asia, skirting down the upper west and east coasts, while in the south, rain comes from the Indian and Southern Oceans.
I have no idea how this would work on Abeir-Toril however. Kara-Tur's south should be quite tropical, so I imagine hurricanes and monsoons would skid past Malatra and strike the Ossian Top End (equatorial) to create swampy areas, mangroves, then rainforests. The south-western end would be cooler, like our south-east. Then deserts and bush areas would be found in the central and eastern areas. This becomes a rough inverse of Australia.
I like the World Serpent better for the Rainbow Serpent, over Jazirian. If the World Serpent has been sleeping for ages, he might reside in the Plane of Dreams. Osse could have powerful connections with the Plane of Dreams, which they might just call the Dreamtime... or Alcheringa.
Also, if they worship the World Serpent (or Rainbow Serpent) that could imply sarrukh influence in the ancient past. Perhaps the yuan-ti have strong roots in Osse. There maybe copious underground kingdoms of scalyfolk in the underdark below Osse. The humans of Osse might well have some yuan-ti blood running through their bloodlines.
Where can I find out more about the World Serpent? The Rainbow Serpent is a god of water, rivers, waterholes, and rain, so it's a bringer of life but it's also unpredictable and unreliable. The World Serpent sounds like a close concept, but I don't see the RS as Evil, more Chaotic Neutral.
Maybe throw in Raptorrans and Bullywug Kingdoms - give the whole place a 'Creator Race' feel. Ergo, it would be like taking RW Australia's known oddities (more 'primitive' flora and fauna) and translating them into Realms terms. The entire place could be a 'throw-back' to an earlier era.
A prehistoric throw-back.
The 'Underground Kingdoms' works very well for my concept of the entire center being a vast plateau. If the surface of the plateau is nothing more then a monster-infested, blasted wasteland, then it makes sense that region below ground would be utilized. Not a true Underdark at all, because those cultures living there would be at 'sea-level' - basically just a massive cave complex (as in, thousands of miles).
A continent with a mostly-subterranean population is rather different, and could prove very cool (everyone becomes a Dwarf! ).
Australia already has that. :D
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coober_Pedy
That being said, those areas are far too vast, I think - that swamp would be well over a thousand miles across. I also wanted the massive plateau to sud-divide the continet (which would put the desert area in the middle).
Actually, Osse really should be big. Stretched out, wide, huge distances between places. A land that goes on forever. I envision the hardest part of any adventure just being the act of getting to any place, across burning deserts, or endless bushland or swamps. Small colonies and cities and other sites, spread far apart, separated by vast expanses of just nothing.
Australia has farms bigger than some countries. The farmers get around on helicopters. We can spend a week driving across the Nullabor to get from the west to the eastern states.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Australia-climate-map_MJC01.png
Apart from the lakes and mountains, Karsus' drawing isn't far off, though it needs more desert.
Yes, so, with that out of the way...What other geographic features and biomes do you think fit, going on the idea that I'm not trying to pack in "a little of this, and a little of that", using roughly the same image I included earlier, but with things toned down for size?
Geographical features: Desert, Desert, Desert. :D To be more precise: dunes, flat sandy and rocky plains, etc. Red sand desert, yellow sand desert, black sand desert.*
* Black desert is a bit more fantasy, I imagine it in the "Dead Centre", a land where people died from heat and thirst as they walked, and kept walking.
But we do have grey to dark grey sand around my area, though we're not desertified. The stuff still looks pretty bleak though.Also: Bush (dry, warm, foresty area), Rainforests, colder Forests (down south), Mangroves, Salt Lakes, Mountains (actually up past the snow-line), Hills, Rivers, Lakes, gigantic rocks, beaches, coral reefs, islands.
More fantastically: weird land formations like the Bungle Bungles, Wave Rock, Ayer's Rock / Uluru.
We actually have a river that runs with acid. It will burn, as strong as battery acid I think. This was the result of drought leeching chemicals out of the soil or something, but it's damn freaky, and perfectly for a harsh fantasy landscape.
Now, animals and plants, obviously. These tend to get forgotten in FR, particularly with all the monsters (does Faerun have any ecology left?). In Osse, I think the wildlife should be enough of a threat for PCs. :D
You've got animals there I've never heard of.
You need the snakes and spiders, the more poisonous the better. And Tasmanian Devils.
Plants: gum trees and eucalyptus, wattle, blackboys/grass-trees (stupid political correctness).
Monsters: Giant spiders, giant snakes.
Pittrap Spiders: trapdoor spiders made huge - they dig out pit traps, cover with leaves on webbing and wait at the bottom for people to fall in.
Blink Dogs: I still like this, as a kind of animal spirit.
Elementals: as the personifications of natural disaster, fire for bushfires, water for floods, air elementals for willy-willies, cockeyed bobs (small tornadoes) and windstorms, earth for avalanches.
Bunyips and Yowies, and Drop Bears.
I keep hoping this thread would die so we don't have to work on it. :D And yes, yammering on about it counts as working on it.
Agreed.
I think a potential Australia-based campaign setting (and this is what Osse is and will be) would have to include the colonisation period to add some variety to the area. Else it's just tribes and legends and environment - interesting in its own right, but not nothing to really flesh the area out and add options. Colonies are a good way to get PCs in and involved, city-based adventurers, and add in the chance to emulate Australia's growth from nothing, interactions with the natives (better than in reality), our multiculturalism and more modern elements.
While I agree with this in theory, I have trouble with it from a 'derivitive' point-of-view. I don't mind things reminding me of something else (since everything does), but I was hoping Osse's history would be a least a little different.
Here' my thoughts: I would like MOST of the continent to be like Australia (fantastisized, of course) historically, but I'd like there to be at least 2-3 'civilized' kingdoms on the east coast. The rest of the continent could have been colonized by whoever (including the 'eastcoasters'), but I'd like there to ba at least a few people there who already claimed regions and were indegenous. I'd really hate to see another Maztica (where the Amnites basically mowed-over the natives), even though that's pretty-much how our RW history went. Those Kingdoms need-not be at the same technological level as Faerûn, though. I think I mentioned earlier keeping them at a 'Bronze Age' level, so they would be more like ancient greece technologically. As for actual culture, I was thinking of a blend of MesoAmerican-style kingdoms (since we have no Australian model), which means theocracy, but based on Dream-magic, not sacrifice. Something really unique, I'm thinking.
And not something that would just roll-over and die when 'colonists' show up. Their magic should be mysterious and potent, so that they aren't easilly conquered. Did Aboriginies use blowguns? Perhaps some poisons that put people in a deep (and nightmare-ridden) sleep might work.
And yes, Australia was regarded as terra nullius, meaning "land belonging to no one", "nobody's land", "empty land" or "desolate". Except for everyone living there already, of course.
Agreed, up to a point. My concept of a huge Palteau dominating the central area is the same as your 'wastelands', except that I'm including a physical barrier to most of the REALLY scarey beasties in place, while also providing a reason why the entire continent was never settled by the natives. The wasteland would be considered a "no-man's land", or "Forbidden Zone" (by the natives), and that could be the reason why the pre-discovery (by outsiders) cultures didn't didn't really have much to do with each other.
As I said earlier, Australia is primarily a dead land. It should have little in the way of what know as "civilisation" before the colonists arrive (and it should be doubtful as to whether they can make it; cue PCs). Previously, there should be a lot of nomadic tribes, a few villages, one city for kicks, and maybe some prehistoric monstrous stuff.
Agreed again. I'm picturing a central 'dead' area, surrounding by mountains and forests, and then a large plains (savannah) 'belt' around the perimeter/coastlands.
I agree, dinosaurs are overused. Australia used to have its own monsters though. Like thylacaleo the marsupial "lion", a kangaroo-related creature that could leap from trees on to its prey. And there's giant wombats. And drop bears!
I'm pretty sure I metioned all of that already. ;)
I have no idea how this would work on Abeir-Toril however. Kara-Tur's south should be quite tropical, so I imagine hurricanes and monsoons would skid past Malatra and strike the Ossian Top End (equatorial) to create swampy areas, mangroves, then rainforests. The south-western end would be cooler, like our south-east. Then deserts and bush areas would be found in the central and eastern areas. This becomes a rough inverse of Australia.
Sounds like a plan.
I was not disagreeing with LK's terrain, so much as I was disagreeing with the sizes - his drawing was more for something the size of a country, when in fact Osse is a massive continent and would have a lot more diversification then that. I am going to work on it today - I was hoping for some feedback; those mountains were a test-run for me (the finished ones will look MUCH better). I need to develop terrain-styles not immediately identifiable with WotC, so I can map stuff for other companies (I've had at least one offer).
Where can I find out more about the World Serpent? The Rainbow Serpent is a god of water, rivers, waterholes, and rain, so it's a bringer of life but it's also unpredictable and unreliable. The World Serpent sounds like a close concept, but I don't see the RS as Evil, more Chaotic Neutral.
I think most of the info is in SK, but hopefully Grey or Rip will be along (or perhaps even Krash or Brian) with other references.
I always pictured the World Serpent as being neutral - in fact, I was going that way when I developed the Lacerial lore for Malatra (which is one the closest canon regions to Osse). The World Serpent was the original Sauroid God (or Overgod), but when the Sarrukh turned on the others, the World Serpent became fragmented. I think Jazirian may have also been part of it, or perhaps Jazirian WAS the World Serpent (which would explain much), and the 'Jazirian' of FR is just the last vestige of the original persona of the World Serpent before fragmentation. Trying to find the bit about him in SK, but I can't seem to locate it.
A prehistoric throw-back.
Exactlly - but NOT Eurasia/American prehistoric, but something a little 'weirder' to suit our fantasy australia. Giant Sloths with pouches, lots of Dire creature-types with oddities (Bills, bone ridges in lieu of teeth, dislocatable jaws, spines, strange or exaggerated appendages, etc...), lots of avians, including many giant versions (like Rocs and Thunderbirds), maybe even some bat-Pteranodon hybrids, etc...
Australia already has that. :D
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coober_Pedy
I'm wondering now if that was one of those weird 'memeory thingies' Karsus is always talking about. I know I've seen a news story on that town.
Still, I love the idea of a massive plateau that is almost like a subterranean country in a way. Osse would have an 'Overdark'. :D
Actually, Osse really should be big. Stretched out, wide, huge distances between places. A land that goes on forever. I envision the hardest part of any adventure just being the act of getting to any place, across burning deserts, or endless bushland or swamps. Small colonies and cities and other sites, spread far apart, separated by vast expanses of just nothing.
Right... see above. I had no problem with the size of the continent, just the scale of the terrain.
Apart from the lakes and mountains, Karsus' drawing isn't far off, though it needs more desert.
I'll try to have a mock-up today.
Geographical features: Desert, Desert, Desert. :D To be more precise: dunes, flat sandy and rocky plains, etc. Red sand desert, yellow sand desert, black sand desert.
Now you have me thinking that the plateau could be the 'high desert', and then we could have 'low desert' around it...
Maybe several large plateaus... like a messa....
* Black desert is a bit more fantasy, I imagine it in the "Dead Centre", a land where people died from heat and thirst as they walked, and kept walking.
I like this a lot - it reminds me of the 'Ash Plains' from Sandstorm. We definately need a BBEG, and this could be where the 'Nightmare Man' lives.
Also: Bush :P (dry, warm, foresty area), Rainforests, colder Forests (down south), Mangroves, Salt Lakes, Mountains (actually up past the snow-line), Hills, Rivers, Lakes, gigantic rocks, beaches, coral reefs, islands.
Ummmm... sounds like a continent to me...
More fantastically: weird land formations like the Bungle Bungles, Wave Rock, Ayer's Rock / Uluru.
Bungle Bungles? Sounds like a primitive tribe....
We actually have a river that runs with acid. It will burn, as strong as battery acid I think. This was the result of drought leeching chemicals out of the soil or something, but it's damn freaky, and perfectly for a harsh fantasy landscape.
Very groovy for the wasteland region - the deeper you get into it, the more inhospitable it becomes. I'm really liking how thats taking shape -a centralized Black desert crawling with Undead and other nasties from Sandstorm.
Now, animals and plants, obviously. These tend to get forgotten in FR, particularly with all the monsters (does Faerun have any ecology left?). In Osse, I think the wildlife should be enough of a threat for PCs.
Right - the only difference between animals and monsters is perception. Osse creatures don't need crazy abilities - they will be tough-enough.
I was also thinking about what I said earlier, about this continent having been one of the last 'bastions' of the Creator Races. If we run with that, we could easilly say that this landmass developed differently because the Giant and Draconic races never rose to prominence here, like elsewhere, which is why the Creators were able to hold-out somewhat longer. It would nice to have at least one continent without the usual standard 'Big Bads'. Ogres and Minotaurs would be okay, but nothing man-like bigger then them, I would think, and the largest reptile should be Dire Komodo Dragons (Note the 'Dire' - these suckers should be HUGE).
You need the snakes and spiders, the more poisonous the better. And Tasmanian Devils.
This is good, because I was going to fill Malatra with giant snakes, insects, and arachnids (K-T has a species of gargantuan spider), and it would make some sense if some of this carried-over to Osse (Reptiles and 'bugs' being more primitive, these types of creatures should be some of the very few that the two continents might have in common). I wouldn't mind adding a few Zaratan into the waters around Osse - I like them a lot, and we could just say they are common to all of Toril's southern waters. Giant Turtle islands are just way cool and fantasy-ish.
Plants: gum trees and eucalyptus, wattle, blackboys/grass-trees (stupid political correctness).
To be honest, for the wasteland region we can take a LOT out of pre-existing books, like many of those things from Athas (Dark Sun). The more normal Australian-like flora should be outside of the wastes, though.
Monsters:
All good - as I said, I've already mentioned a few of those. I've found some good visual aids HERE, although I don't think all of that woman's photos are of animals native to Australia (still, some pretty cool stuff there).
Elementals and spirits (animal, ancestor, Nature, Dreamfiends, etc..) fit this region very well. I want it to have a more primitive feel, and perhaps a few portals between the Elemental planes and Osse are in order.
I read a fantasy novel years ago that took place in Australia, and they used the aboriginal concept of opposites (that EVERYTHING has an opposite) and ran with it, including having 'Black Fire', which 'unburns' things. I recently came across a spell (in PftF, I think) that mimics this effect very well.
Derivitive? Yes.......
Two other things to consider - I initially baulked at the idea of a 'penal colony' scenario for this region, for obvious reasons, but now I think it might be fun to use on a small scale. Perhaps this is where T'u Emperors 'dump' their unwanted (yet well-connected) political prisoners? I had considered at least one Shou colony, and it could be fun to give it a more nefarious spin. Obviously, outright criminals get executed, but this could just be where people who have annoyed the government get 're-assigned'.
The other thing I thought about was a tribe that worshipped a giant grass 'ship'. They basically spotted a Halruaan flying ship (or perhaps some other, like The Lost Ship) many many years ago, and built an effigy of the 'god' they thought they saw. :D
You've got animals there I've never heard of.
-I just went to a website that had an index of 'Australian Animals'.
-Here's a more updated map. Any more suggestions for terrain/geography, or is there a general consensus that there's enough?
So will this place have its own Steve Irwin? :P
Ireve Stwin, master beastlord and animal-tamer for the High Inquesceptor of Sydnosceus, :D
Also, the slang term for Rangers is 'Dundees'.
-Opossums, I already wrote. Platypus, I'm not sure about. On one hand, they're certainly Australian, but at the same time, I don't know- I don't want to be too knock-off about it. But, then again, I already have kangaroos, so...
That's what I was thinking. You already have a bunch of well-known animals that scream "Australia", so I didn't think adding the platypus would make a big difference.
As I said earlier, Australia is primarily a dead land.
Only from an anthropocentric perspective, I think. I hear it's a naturalist's paradise (one reason why I hope to visit someday), and your posts seem to demonstrate that.
-Didn't think so. Would anyone happen to know a good place to find such a resource? I must've been looking for about a half hour, and came back with very little. I found a couple of actual names, of places and of names and such, but I don't know enough to make "authentic sounding" derivatives. I'm trying to assign names for different places and such.
This is NOT Australia! :P
Besides, do aboriginies even speak thier own language anymore? Most Amerinds don't.
Also, try looking at some of the folklore to get a feel for their tongue (eeeew.... that just sounded so wrong...)
Edit: Found THIS site on my first hit. You need to work on your search-fu, Grasshopper.
I've stated this before in other project threads - I love linguistics and tons of languages from a fan point-of-view, but as a DM, they are a nightmare.
There should, at the very least, be an 'Osse common'.
I'm mapping other continents now.
No sense in doing redundant work.
While I agree with this in theory, I have trouble with it from a 'derivitive' point-of-view. I don't mind things reminding me of something else (since everything does), but I was hoping Osse's history would be a least a little different.
Here' my thoughts: I would like MOST of the continent to be like Australia (fantastisized, of course) historically, but I'd like there to be at least 2-3 'civilized' kingdoms on the east coast. The rest of the continent could have been colonized by whoever (including the 'eastcoasters'), but I'd like there to ba at least a few people there who already claimed regions and were indegenous. I'd really hate to see another Maztica (where the Amnites basically mowed-over the natives), even though that's pretty-much how our RW history went. Those Kingdoms need-not be at the same technological level as Faerûn, though. I think I mentioned earlier keeping them at a 'Bronze Age' level, so they would be more like ancient greece technologically. As for actual culture, I was thinking of a blend of MesoAmerican-style kingdoms (since we have no Australian model), which means theocracy, but based on Dream-magic, not sacrifice. Something really unique, I'm thinking.
And not something that would just roll-over and die when 'colonists' show up. Their magic should be mysterious and potent, so that they aren't easilly conquered. Did Aboriginies use blowguns? Perhaps some poisons that put people in a deep (and nightmare-ridden) sleep might work.
I feel that if a setting is going to be real-world imitation, it should be a faithful imitation, with fantasy twists, and taking inspiration from all eras of its history, and its culture. Else it just looks a little half-arsed, like the creator had one idea, but preferred to work on something else.
So what do we really want Osse to be? Australia: The Forgotten Realm, or Something Completely Original (in which case I can thankfully quit right now)?I keep trying not to write an essay on my visions for Osse, but I really really really had no intention of the natives "rolling over and dying". As I said earlier: "Then some much better race-relations in a world that doesn't have to suffer racism, religious conflict, eugenics, widespread disease, environmental damage, etc." Forgotten Realms just doesn't have all that.
I wanted Osse colonisation to start at the point where British red-coats danced with the Aboriginals, then follow a much happier course. The roads not taken. Treaties with the natives, native land rights ensured, druids and rangers regulating land-use to prevent environment damage. Everything that occurs would be very much on the say-so of the natives, who cannily recognize the benefits they can get.
I pictured the native Oslanders moving right into the "western" society, where and how they chose, on their own terms. Like a native Oslander who's become a wealthy merchant in Faerunian style, then strips off and wanders off into the desert to go walkabout.
Following the Australian model, I would like Osse to be all about fresh young kingdoms, not bound by history or tradition, choosing their own way in the world. Hence the colonisation. I do want existing native cities, but I'm not sure how these would look. Mezro in Chult would be a good model: it's a city, but the inhabitants keep their culture.
Also, an Osse campaign setting should probably also include a New Zealand analogue (that strip of islands in the far north of Osse would qualify; the others are far too warm) and Oceania/Polynesia (many other scattered islands).
I don't know about blowguns, but I have heard of a similar weapon that blows a cloud of poison instead, used for assassination. I can't remember the names, so I can't come up with a reference.
Agreed, up to a point. My concept of a huge Palteau dominating the central area is the same as your 'wastelands', except that I'm including a physical barrier to most of the REALLY scarey beasties in place, while also providing a reason why the entire continent was never settled by the natives. The wasteland would be considered a "no-man's land", or "Forbidden Zone" (by the natives), and that could be the reason why the pre-discovery (by outsiders) cultures didn't didn't really have much to do with each other.
It doesn't even need to be a plateau - sheer distance across a desert is enough of a barrier for most purposes. Australia is very flat.
I like this a lot - it reminds me of the 'Ash Plains' from Sandstorm. We definately need a BBEG, and this could be where the 'Nightmare Man' lives.
The Kurdaitcha springs to mind:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurdaitcha
Bungle Bungles? Sounds like a primitive tribe....
Bungle Bungles:
http://travelblog.viator.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/wa-bungle-bungles-aerial.jpg
Osse could have lots of funky geography in places.
Two other things to consider - I initially baulked at the idea of a 'penal colony' scenario for this region, for obvious reasons, but now I think it might be fun to use on a small scale. Perhaps this is where T'u Emperors 'dump' their unwanted (yet well-connected) political prisoners? I had considered at least one Shou colony, and it could be fun to give it a more nefarious spin. Obviously, outright criminals get executed, but this could just be where people who have annoyed the government get 're-assigned'.
To quote me from the other thread:
"I was leaning more towards the fantastic with the convicts angle. Like the old idea of a prison-island where the inmates have taken over, and formed a rough society. A prison-monastery like in Aliens 3 (there's a lot of similarities between austere monks meditating and practicing martial arts and inmates with a lot of time on their hands in between getting into brawls). An Alcatraz-type famously inescapable prison. An asylum for insane spellcasters. None of which we had in Australia, making it more original whilst keeping the society (without a lot of respect for authority) more similar."
Only from an anthropocentric perspective, I think. I hear it's a naturalist's paradise (one reason why I hope to visit someday), and your posts seem to demonstrate that.
I meant the soil. I read somewhere that with very little volcanism, the soil is much much older than elsewhere, and has less nutrients. Stuff still lives there, but there's less to go around.
-So...Is anyone proficient in any of the Australian Aboriginal languages?
-Didn't think so. Would anyone happen to know a good place to find such a resource? I must've been looking for about a half hour, and came back with very little. I found a couple of actual names, of places and of names and such, but I don't know enough to make "authentic sounding" derivatives. I'm trying to assign names for different places and such.
I know one or two words. An -up suffix means 'place', at least in Noongar, so we get place names like Karrinyup, Mandogalup and Bugalup.
Besides, do aboriginies even speak thier own language anymore? Most Amerinds don't.
A few of the older ones. They're dying languages mostly.
There may be up to a hundred tribes and a hundred languages in Osse/Australia, but in practice, Osse really only needs one or two that look enough like any Australian Aboriginal language.
They appear to be mostly dialects and variations on a central base language. Take the spear-thrower device: called a woomera by the Eora people, amirre by the Arrernte, and a mirru by the Pintupi.
So different Osse tribes would have dialects and accents, but anyone with knowledge of one should be capable of communication with a speaker of another.
Interesting fact: some aboriginal languages predate the invention of trade, so they have no counting system. Three would "one and one and one" for example.
I keep trying not to write an essay on my visions for Osse, but I really really really had no intention of the natives "rolling over and dying". As I said earlier: "Then some much better race-relations in a world that doesn't have to suffer racism, religious conflict, eugenics, widespread disease, environmental damage, etc." Forgotten Realms just doesn't have all that.
The Realms has all of that, worse, and more. :P
No racism? I'll just name one organization and let my argument stand: Eldreth Veluuthra.
No religious conflict? Again, I'll name just one instance and let my argument stand: Maztica. (Edited to add: I really can't believe you said the Realms has no religious conflict. Maztica really isn't a good example for Faerûn. The Church of Bane vs Torm, Loviatar vs Ilmater, there is so much to choose from... even inter-faith conflicts.)
No eugenics? It is much worse in the Realms, thanks to magic. In the real world you have to "breed" people. In FR you can use magic. My one example? Thay created the Blooded Ones (the template is found on page 60 of the Unapproachable East). Oh, by the way they started out with selective breeding.
No wide spread disease? What about all the magical plagues and diseases? The first Neverwinter Nights Campaign was largely based around a magical plague. For a canon example: What about the Chilling Death, a plague that tore through the Vilhon Reach, killing more than 50% of the total population in as little as 10 years?
No environmental damage? Ever read an entry on Vaasa?
I could go on. :P The Realms has all of those things and more.
So what do we really want Osse to be? Australia: The Forgotten Realm, or Something Completely Original (in which case I can thankfully quit right now)?
I vote for something completely original. If it was something completely original I might contribute. :P
Then again, we aren't even sure if that landmass is Osse.
I just did maps of the two larger islands off the coast of Katashaka, and either of those could even be Osse.
Issue 1: It is odd that a landmass this size has not been settled by those from Kara-Tur. An explanation is needed.
Solution 1: The entire continent is surrounded by a strange thick fog. Ships that sail into the fog disappear, never to be seen or heard from again. No one knows what lay beyond the fog. (Think Bermuda Triangle times a thousand.)
Issue 2: How do you tie this in with the history and lore of the Realms?
Solution 2: During the time known as the First Flowering, a powerful and mysterious human nation built the Citadel of the Raven. At the same time the Drow had yet to be transformed, their treachery was not yet known. In c. –17600 DR an event known as the Sundering took place, dividing the one land. Most from that ancient human empire were killed or vanished, as well as a sizable nation of Illythiiri.
They found themselves here, on this mysterious continent that was formed from part of their own land, and the rest arose from the sea. It contains the ruins of the ancient human nation that built the Citadel of the Raven, and their descendants. (Who, after appearing here fell into savage barbarism.) It also contained a forgotten Illythiiri Empire, cut off from the rest of the world. The Illythiiri disappeared sometime after the crown wars. None knows what happened to them, and they do not appear to have been transformed into drow. They simply disappeared. The Illythiiri are responsible for the Mist that surrounds the continent, as it was used to protect and shield them from their enemies.
They have been cut off from the rest of the world since the Sundering.
Issue 3: If they've been cut off from the world since the Sundering, how do players from Faerûn or Kara-Tur get there?
Solution 3: A number of ways. First is sailing through the fog. In most cases those who sail through the fog get lost, and crash upon the many small rocky islands surrounding the coast line. The players could survive a shipwreck. The second is through the use of a portal. Although it has been cut off from the rest of the world since the Sundering, it does not mean individual arcanists of power did not travel back and forth. Look for a portal in Illythiiri ruins in the Shaar. The second is through an ancient artifact created by the fallen Human Empire that built the Citadel of the Raven, basically another portal. A strange mirror set in a frame carved of black onyx. The frame has strange runic symbols of an unknown language. During a full moon the runic symbols glow and the portal activates. It leads through to an identical mirror located in some ruins on the continent. The portal mirror was once found in the Citadel of the Raven, but has sense been sold and exchanged many hands. It could be anywhere, but most likely is located in the following places: Waterdeep, Amn, Calimport, Zhentil Keep or the property of some wealthy noble in Cormyr.
Here's what I think (although this is a tiny bit like Maztica, now that I'm actually typing it):
GODS.
Or at least one very powerful nasty god. This hemisphere has a terrible tyrant of the Seas (there is mention of Poseidon in some early Bloodstone books). Perhaps it is Njörðr, Vanir (Norse) god of waters and wind (considering we had Tyr, its not too much of stretch), or perhaps it was hitherto unknown primordial trapped beneath Osse itself since the War of the Gods, but still able to influence the Wind and Waves from the confines of his prison.
Whatever the deal, this mighty and jealous god kept Osse 'all to himself', and didn't allow any ships to enter HIS waters. The closer you got to the mysterious continent, the more the storms and sea would rage. No sane seaman would even make the attempt.
That is, until he ToT.
Talos and Umberlee caught him in a dark alley and beat his ass down... and no more "evil Osse Sea god".
Since the ToT, several peoples have made landfall on the continent, and the start of trade has begun. The people of Osse never built watercraft larger then a 10-man outrigger, and tended to just fish from shore (for such was the wrath of their sea God that he would drown anyone attempting to make it out of eyesight of land.). Since the disappearance of their god, and the arrival of the outlanders, the Osse people have learned the basics of seamanship, and are now building larger and stronger vessels. the few Kingdoms which have sprung-up are all in a race to build their very first navies.
There you go - one ready made explanation, that covers both the lack of contact, and ties it to realms history (the ToT).
No more 'Island-shrouding Fog-banks' - I just used that one for Kozakura. If we do another (especial since its directly north of this place), it would be a bit much.
Plus, that would be one massive friggin' bank of fog!!!
And I am imagining some uber powerful magic that created it and still sustains it. I'd imagine a place littered with ruins of many different cultures and races. Those two wouldn't be the only ones to find themselves here, just the two major groups.
I imagine that the Illythiiri dominated the entire continent for centuries, building a vast empire. The "great mystery" is what happened to them.
If people wanted to go this route, I also have a rather interesting idea on how to incorporate something like Dragonborn into the area. I would give it a flavorful FR spin, not the crap spewed out in the books.
I'd rather not use any gods for explanations. I'm so sick of uber-powerful interventionist deities that I'd like to drown "unnamed evil Osse Sea god" in the ocean.
I wouldn't use some minor event like the ToT, it needs more than that to tie it to the lore and history.
I went the route I did for the following reasons:
1. The Sundering broke the world. All sorts of crazy crap happened, and you could have ended up anywhere.
2. What makes the Realms what it is... is it's ancient history and lore. You need to tie things to the ancient past, and fill a place with ancient and mysterious ruins. That is how you capture the 'essence' of the Realms (IMO).
- What was going on in Southern Kara-Tur? Things going on, like wars, or whatever else, would contribute to Osse's "secrecy", by virtue of the closest powers (Wa, Kozakura, Shou Lung, something in Southern Kara-Tur) not sending the resources out to explore.
- Early attempts to colonize, leading to massive failure, causing whoever it was trying to do the colonization (probably Shou Lung) to stop. Perhaps when they first landed, the locals attacked them savagely? Or, they fell victim to strange, Oslander diseases they did not have immunity of? Perhaps they landed initially on Baranna’alcheringa, the Forest of Dreams, got trapped within due to the spirits and wards in it, causing the entire expedition to be a failure? Something in that vein...
- Sea phenomena, making it hard to get to, and making it equally hard to leave- which would also help explain why the Oslanders never tried to leave and colonize further lands. I was intending on using MT's "Kingdom of the Tides" to be the rough Great Barrier Reef analogue, but if need be, more coral, or things of that nature can be inserted to hamper travel to and from. Or, hey, they are Sahuagin- maybe they were the ones messing with ships going to and from. They are evil after all.
The Realms has all of that, worse, and more. :P
I originally said "...a world that doesn't have to...". So consider the final part corrected to: "Forgotten Realms just doesn't have to have all that." Don't be difficult, you know what I mean.
Any shaman or cleric can cure smallpox. Any druid or ranger can stop cattle messing up waterholes, thereby saving the native way of life.
A cleric of, I dunno, Chauntea is hardly going to call a native religious practices devil-worship, nor bully them to converting. Children aren't going to be taken from their parents in an effort to phase out black-ness, nor will they be abused. Native Oslander society doesn't have be crippled for generations to come.
So yes, please, let's avoid the such unpleasantness from the Real World and Maztica and have a better Osse.
The only word I want to hear less then 'Drow' is 'Shadow' (or Shar).
Also, I say the ToT because it's recent, and would be a good reason why things are just starting to 'pop' now. Blaming stuff on the distant past is fine... but then why did it take so long for everyone to come around?
No dark elves - PLEASE. They are way over-used. No Dragons either - they are also used ad-nauseum.
I was really hoping we could do something original here, but this is starting to look like a cheap Australia knock-off with all the stereo-typical fantasy tropes attached.
Maybe we should have just left it a mystery.
Fog bank is cool, Barrier reef works... but all of that could be attributed to the trapped Primordial (or whatever) - those could just be differnt things he has used over the millenia to keep others away (and Ossies inside).
I would even throw-in a massive sargasso with a huge ship graveyard at it's middle (with ships from EVERYWHERE - Elven, Oriental, Zakharan, Faerûnian, strange and other-worldy, etc, etc).
The Sargasso could even be alive (think that 'seaweed' that was in that lake in that Steven King movie). A giant sentient seaweed... hey! We found Araumycos a girlfriend! :D
-That gave me a pretty awesome idea, though. I was going to suggest a giant natural whirlpool, but if we put those two together, we have a giant seaweed-like Araummycos creature that can create giant whirlpools. I was thinking, originally, that it had evil intent, but took a step back from that. Instead, it is simply very "lonely", and by using it's abilities to create whirlpools and drag ships underwater, it "meets" the sailors on the boats, and learns about the world. It's a massive "cosmic entity" that doesn't fully understand that it's "not nice" to make boats sink, and bring sailors to their dooms for the sake of curiosity and the like.
I'm not really interested in creating a HappyHappyShinyFunPlace. :P IMO, I think the Realms has far too much of that already in Cormyr and the Dalelands. Of course, I -STILL- think 4E FR is too "HappyHappyShinyFunPlace." :P
I want to create a place whose cultures are somewhat semi-realistic. Avoid overt uses of magic, and yet still keep it present. A place that verges on primitiveness and darkness. Where you -can- die from the pox. Where the gods exist, but are distant and unknown - nothing like what exists with the gods in Faerûn.
But the place is so large it can literally fit at least twenty different nations and cultures on it.
MarkusTay63-
I killed all the dark elves. :P
All that is left from the ancient cultures is ruins. I am imagining that the entire continent is something like 98% human. Not including "monsters." But that doesn't include anything like Dragonborn either, if we don't want to go that route.
Lord Karsus-
That doesn't work. You have to define when the continent first came into existence. Was it there before or after the Sundering? In either event, you have roughly 20,000 (or more) years to cover. There is no way people from Kara-Tur could not have populated it in that time frame.
You -have- to literally have a barrier preventing people from coming or going for over 10,000 years at least.
If people hate the fog idea, the entire continent could have been shifted into another plane. Perhaps it is from another world. Perhaps it was created and shifted into Faerûn. Or perhaps it was originally from Faerûn, shifted somewhere else, and then brought back. Perhaps it existed "between the planes." It was ethereal in nature, and those from Kara-Tur could see it, but could never physically touch it or set foot on it. They called it the Ghost Land. Then after the ToT it shifted fully into Toril.
However, each of those things bring up problems and consequences.
Another thing to consider - since I preferred putting the kingdoms on the east side, and LK obliged with a barrier reef, it makes some sense that the few folks there who have become advanced enough for Ocean-going vessels would not have bothered (because of the reef).
We need to keep the 'primitives' facing K-T, because that makes more sense culturally. Any Shou that may have gotten through should not have found anything worth bothering with (perhaps the T'u have a map that allows them to navigate yet another reaf on that side, which is how they established a penal colony?) Either way, whatever explorers were brave-enough to get to Osse (K-Ters have Spelljammers, you know, but I'd rather leave them out of this), they would have found a bunch of 'primitive savages' who didn't even understand the concept of trade, didn't have anything worth trading for, and the land was so crappy it wasn't even worth taking from them (see BCM's statements about the nutrient content of Australia's soil).
Ergo, it might not have been anything 'mystical' at all, but rather a series of natural barriers surrounding a large landmass not worth the trouble.
I also like the 'Sea Monster' angle, and that could be one more reason to stay away - Sahuagin, Bunyips, Sea Serpents, Lung Wang (Dragon Turtles), etc...
Sargasso...Sargasso...What's that?
Its taken from THIS. I thought everyone heard of sargasso's - they've been used in D&D before (notably Spelljammer).
Another idea can be stolen from Pirates of Darkwater (coolest cartoon EVA!) - if we go with the 'big ugly creeping doom', we could use the PoD plot and say that this thing goes around Osse and no-one knows where it will strike next... and it keeps getting bigger. We could even possibly tie this to Panzuriel (a vestage?), or even The Dark God (that unnamed primordial?) - both of those are from MM and would work here.
That gave me a pretty awesome idea, though. I was going to suggest a giant natural whirlpool, but if we put those two together, we have a giant seaweed-like Araummycos creature that can create giant whirlpools.
I'm sticking a massive Maelstrom (whirlpool) in the Yellow sea, to help explain some of the migration anomalies and a couple of other things (that entire sea has an extremely powerful clockwise current). I mentioned over in the K-T thread I've been meaning to write the piece on the Yellow Sea (to help with BCM's Koryo stuff).
BTW, that sounds like the first appearance of the Kraken in tPotC movies. If you recall, the first time it 'took' a ship, it merely sucked it under.
I want to create a place whose cultures are somewhat semi-realistic. Avoid overt uses of magic, and yet still keep it present. A place that verges on primitiveness and darkness. Where you -can- die from the pox. Where the gods exist, but are distant and unknown - nothing like what exists with the gods in Faerûn.
I can get behind all this.
All that still fits my aloof 'bully-god' scenario - no-one worshipped him, they just talked about him in hushed whispers (and did not mention him by name... hence, NO NAME).
Anyhow, I'll stop pushing that for a sec... the rest of what you said has merit as well. I want their magic to be powerful, but subtle, and basing it around sleep and dreams ('sendings') gives us our Aussie connection and is still cool and original (as far as FR is cncerned). Out-breaks of disease make sense as well - tribes usually have only one Shaman, and one guy couldn't handle it if the whole tribe fell ill. So its not that they don't have the means to cure disease - they just lack the 'numbers' (tribes don't usually help each other, and certainly wouldn't lend-out their Shaman).
All that is left from the ancient cultures is ruins. I am imagining that the entire continent is something like 98% human. Not including "monsters." But that doesn't include anything like Dragonborn either, if we don't want to go that route.
One of the largest continents on the planet and you want it 'all-human'?
Are you sure you actually want to play in FR?I don't mean to be insulting - I'm a big fan of all-human (or nearly so) settings, but FR isn't that. Toril has more sentient species then any othe rplanet I know of, and it just seems a bit far-fetched to say the second largest landmass doesn't follow suit with the rest.
I like 'ancient ruins', though, but I'd rather go elsewhere with that (a lost human culture, as you proposed?). Sadly, Using Drow as 'the Ancients' was already done in Maztica, so it would be redundant here. Perhaps an ancient Fey (Le'Shay?) civilization, before they left (entered the 'Spirit World', which=Feywild). I like the idea of 'remnants' of the creator races surviving here (in a debased form), but I'd avoid any hint of Aeriee, Batrachi, or Sarrukh ruins because it's all been done before (well.. maybe not Aeriee.. but how much could be left of giant nests? :P)
That doesn't work. You have to define when the continent first came into existence. Was it there before or after the Sundering? In either event, you have roughly 20,000 (or more) years to cover. There is no way people from Kara-Tur could not have populated it in that time frame.
This continent should be the only major landmass that was NOT part of the Pangea (Merro-whateverthehell), to keep it consistent with the "weird & different" Australian-angle.
You -have- to literally have a barrier preventing people from coming or going for over 10,000 years at least.
Until recently (last couple of centuries), most cultures on Toril only produced 'coasters' (vessels that could only travel in sight of land).
If people hate the fog idea, the entire continent could have been shifted into another plane. Perhaps it is from another world. Perhaps it was created and shifted into Faerûn. Or perhaps it was originally from Faerûn, shifted somewhere else, and then brought back. Perhaps it existed "between the planes." It was ethereal in nature, and those from Kara-Tur could see it, but could never physically touch it or set foot on it. They called it the Ghost Land. Then after the ToT it shifted fully into Toril.
Ugh... too 'Abeir' for my tastes...
I don't hate the fog idea - I just want it to be less 'static'. Rather then an actual barrier, have it be something that comes and goes and is entirely unpredictable. A wall of vapor thousands upon thousands of miles across is a little much, IMHO, but a smaller 'Fog Bank' that can appear anywhere that ships disappear into would be cool, and still accomplish the same exact thing.
Yet another 'spin'
We could also tie it into Ravenloft (those are RL's mists). In fact, I think that would be a pretty awesome idea, considering the Nightmare Realm exists in RL, and the tribesmen who live there - Abber Nomads - are similar to Australian Aboriginies. If the mists of RL are constantly snatching people and ships to the 'Dream World', it would tie into our theme of 'Dream time' and sleep magic, and would be a very strong reason for outsiders to stay the hell away.
No-one liked the Plateau idea? Too 'Thay' for everyone? I was thinking that desolate wasteland could have been the region where Abber(?) used to be, before it was pulled into Ravenloft. Maybe RL even 'stole' it as Ao was shunting stuff around, creating Abeir (or some such nonsense, for those of you who want it to have 4e lore).
How about a "reverse plateau"? A massive valley (depression, really) with a 1000 enscarpment around it? Then that huge 'bowl' could have a bank of fog above it. That could be the 'lost world' where all sorts of pleiocene animals live, and perhaps some of those Creator-offshoots (Bullywugs, Raptorans, Lizardmen/Lacerials, Fey (Dream spirits?).
Then I could tie that to my above idea, and say that is where a large piece of land was torn from Toril in the distant past.
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A large desert categorizes southwestern Osse. Called the Opaleis Desert by the Oslanders, this region of Osse is sparely inhabited, and has very few living creatures living in this climate, let along thriving in it. Temperatures during the day are regularly in excess of ninety degrees, and during the nights, temperatures flirt with the freezing temperature.
The great desert on Osse receives less than ten inches of rainfall per year. This is due to the presence of mountains to the desert’s east, preventing the flow of rainfall and moisture into the region. Because the land lies high above sea level, moisture from the east has to climb treacherous cliff faces that in some places can be in excess of 100 feet. The desert landscape is mostly made of sand and rock formations, including large, immobile formations, such as rock arches, and smaller, mobile sediment, made of pebbles, salt, and arid desert soil. A large lake does indeed exist in the desert, named Lake Ngambati, but the lake does nobody and good, being a salt lake with an extremely high salt content, to the point that it is said that creatures that enter it receive harsh burns and skin irritations.
Unlike many other deserts across Abeir-Toril, the Opaleis Desert supports very little vegetable matter. The few species that live there are sand, drought, and salt resistant, however. The desert’s western regions are more likely to receive rainfall, due to the proximity of the ocean, just below the great cliffs, and as such, most living creatures in the desert live in its western portions. Its eastern portions are nearly barren and lifeless, because of the harsh terrain, lack of precipitation, and high temperatures. Opuntias are the most common desert plant, as are desert holly and brittlebush. Other cacti and succulents are not found there.
Because of the harsh terrain, very few living creatures live in this region of Osse. Mulgara, armadillo and echidna are the only animals hardy enough to survive in this climate. Primarily, lizards, such as the thorny devil, and the frilled-neck lizard, inhabit the desert. The sandgrouse is the only bird that makes it’s home the desert.
Humans, for the most part, have avoided the Opaleis Desert. There is one particular tribe of Oslanders that lives in the desert, however. These people, the Siakdia Tribe, inhabit a ziggurat that is located in the desert’s roughest terrain, on the border of the Opaleis Desert and the Tolwaydi Mountains, along the Wenwolok Canyons.
The ziggurat was built by the Siakdia, and is one of the few permanent settlements on the island-nation. The stepped structure stands 75 feet tall, and on its roof is a large telescope-like device. In the center of the ziggurat is a chapel of sorts, housing a throne of foreign design, made of exotic metals. The Siakdia, unlike the other animistic tribes of Oslanders, worship a formal pantheon, made of specific entities. The creatures that they worship, they call ‘The Voidcallers’. Using the telescope housed at the top of their ziggurat, they speak directly to their deities, massive stars and constellations that hang in the night skies of Osse, that sometimes take the shapes of different animals. Elders empowered by the Voidcallers, the de facto rulers of the Siakdia Tribe, claim that, long ago, the Voidcallers came to Osse, but left, for whatever reason. Seeking to once again reconnect their association with the planet, they have chosen the Siakdia as their chosen representatives.
A large desert categorizes southwestern Osse. Called the Opaleis Desert by the Oslanders, this region of Osse is sparely inhabited, and has very few living creatures living in this climate, let along thriving in it. Temperatures during the day are regularly in excess of ninety degrees, and during the nights, temperatures flirt with the freezing temperature.
The great desert on Osse receives less than ten inches of rainfall per year. This is due to the presence of mountains to the desert’s east, preventing the flow of rainfall and moisture into the region. Because the land lies high above sea level, moisture from the east has to climb treacherous cliff faces that in some places can be in excess of 100 feet. The desert landscape is mostly made of sand and rock formations, including large, immobile formations, such as rock arches, and smaller, mobile sediment, made of pebbles, salt, and arid desert soil. A large lake does indeed exist in the desert, named Lake Ngambati, but the lake does nobody and good, being a salt lake with an extremely high salt content, to the point that it is said that creatures that enter it receive harsh burns and skin irritations.
Unlike many other deserts across Abeir-Toril, the Opaleis Desert supports very little vegetable matter. The few species that live there are sand, drought, and salt resistant, however. The desert’s western regions are more likely to receive rainfall, due to the proximity of the ocean, just below the great cliffs, and as such, most living creatures in the desert live in its western portions. Its eastern portions are nearly barren and lifeless, because of the harsh terrain, lack of precipitation, and high temperatures. Opuntias are the most common desert plant, as are desert holly and brittlebush. Other cacti and succulents are not found there.
Because of the harsh terrain, very few living creatures live in this region of Osse. Mulgara, armadillo and echidna are the only animals hardy enough to survive in this climate. Primarily, lizards, such as the thorny devil, and the frilled-neck lizard, inhabit the desert. The sandgrouse is the only bird that makes it’s home the desert.
Humans, for the most part, have avoided the Opaleis Desert. There is one particular tribe of Oslanders that lives in the desert, however. These people, the Siakdia Tribe, inhabit a ziggurat that is located in the desert’s roughest terrain, on the border of the Opaleis Desert and the Tolwaydi Mountains, along the Wenwolok Canyons.
The ziggurat was built by the Siakdia, and is one of the few permanent settlements on the island-nation. The stepped structure stands 75 feet tall, and on its roof is a large telescope-like device. In the center of the ziggurat is a chapel of sorts, housing a throne of foreign design, made of exotic metals. The Siakdia, unlike the other animistic tribes of Oslanders, worship a formal pantheon, made of specific entities. The creatures that they worship, they call ‘The Voidcallers’. Using the telescope housed at the top of their ziggurat, they speak directly to their deities, massive stars and constellations that hang in the night skies of Osse, that sometimes take the shapes of different animals. Elders empowered by the Voidcallers, the de facto rulers of the Siakdia Tribe, claim that, long ago, the Voidcallers came to Osse, but left, for whatever reason. Seeking to once again reconnect their association with the planet, they have chosen the Siakdia as their chosen representatives.
I still like the idea of having the landmass created during the Sundering. The Sundering was a huge event that literally reshaped the face of Toril.
Kara-Tur could have heard of it, and made several (failed) colonization attempts. They'd call it the "Twisted Lands", the "Blasted Waste" and the "Land of a Thousand Teeth."
The majority of it's coastline would be surrounded by a patchy coral reef, the largest in the world. (A nod to the Great Barrier Reef off the coast of Queensland in northeast Australia.)
This reef would be sentient in nature, with the ability to grow more rapidly than a non-sentient reef, ensuring that if part of it is destroyed (for whatever reason) it grows back within roughly a decade. A large number of different species, many unique to the region, live among the reef. Some of the more familiar would include: Dragon Turtles (Lung Wang to the Kara-Turan's) and various species of Leviathans. Additionally, a few of these. Think of these as Tarrasque-like creatures (and oh, how I want one so badly). I'd limit them to three or four in number.
It should also be pointed out that many islands surround the continent, large and small, but mostly small. Many are rocky and mostly desolate, some no larger than a ship, disappearing and reappearing with the tides, but the smaller more habitable islands should have some type of island hopping tribal people. It is due to these islands that the land is sometimes called the "Land of a Thousand Teeth."
In addition to the islands, there are the island spirits, or at least the spirits that seem to inhabit the coastal regions. Various tribal groups worship the spirits, as well as some Naga / Yuan-ti like race that lives among the reefs. (Add these in place of the Sahuagin.) They'd appear as humanoid water serpents.
The spirits (either when called upon by the primitive shamans or on their own) can appear as a thick blanket of fog. This fog can appear very rapidly, surrounding a ship, leading to confusion, often directing the ship to crash into the more dangerous parts of the reef, or toward the primitive tribals who may lay in wait.
The human tribals would revere and perhaps worship the humanoid water serpents, and it would be those water serpent peoples who taught the human tribals how to communicate with the spirits. (So they would more or less have a subservient relationship. The naga-like water serpent people would live below the sea, among the reef, while the humans lived upon the islands.)
Finally, on the main land, virtually the entire coastline facing Kara-Tur would be a barren twisted wasteland. Unsuitable for agriculture, unsuitable for any large scale settlements, more-or-less unsuitable for anything aside from the indigenous people who are nomadic hunter gatherers.
There is also virtually no real resources to be found (iron, gold, copper, gemstones, etc.) along this place.
It is this virtually bleak and barren wasteland for a couple of hundred miles inland. Then there should be a large nearly impassible mountain range dividing the wasteland with more lush like jungles and more temperate climates. (Think something like the Spine of the World.)
The great coral reef is sentient, but it may also be a living deity (due to, perhaps, being worshiped by generations of the Water Serpentine people). The spirits would be connected to the reef, virtually everything when it comes to the islands should be connected to the reef. The Serpentine people, who live among the reef, care for these creatures. Despite their size and power, they are shockingly docile and passive. They live among the reef, and act primarily as guardians to the reef.
So, to put things in prospective: If you are trying to colonize the islands or the mainland you're going to face a number of challenges. First is dealing with the primitives who are going to be aggressive toward you. Second is dealing with the Water Serpentine people who are going to assault your ships. Third you would face the spirits, who would use massive fog banks and other subtle magics to get you killed. Fourth you'd face the natural barriers, meaning that even if you were successful in establishing a colony you'd still have to deal with resource issues. Fifth and finally, if all of the previous methods fail you're going to find one of these creatures coming your way. I'd limit their number to roughly four, with no more than one being seen at any one time (unless absolutely necessary.)
Your naga sound like WoW's naga - Perhaps we can give them a differnt name, like Nagra. Here's a pic -
Naga was just the closest thing I could think of in a description. Basically, they'd be scaled like a fish, with serpentine bodies. They'd have humanoid arms and heads that resemble something between a snake and a human. Their tails would end in a fin, and they may have smaller 'fins' along their body (below their arms). Their bodies would get larger the closer you get to their torso's. They'd likely have gills somewhere along their waist.
They would also be amphibious, obviously.
Their bodies would be designed for fast swimming. Basically, a ship isn't going to out sail them. They move very fast, perhaps as fast as a dolphin. They'd have crappy movement on land, as they'd kinda flail about a bit and slither like snakes. So you really wouldn't see them but periodically – most of their life would be below the sea, tending the reef, hunting for food, and other such activities.
Their favored weapons would either be a spear or trident. Maybe also some type of net made of some special type of extra-strong sea weed.
They would be roughly twelve feet long if stretched out completely (from the tops of their heads to the tip of their tail fins). However, when on land standing upright holding a weapon they'd be between five feet to six feet tall, roughly the height of a human.
I'm not kidding - they swim like Eels, and move VERY fast in water.
In that 'group shot' I posted, I have no idea what those two strange ones are - I just wanted to show the two 'normal' ones (those others must be unique elites or something). They also all use tridents as well.
I could live with the one in the sketch though... I just have to have it make logical sense anatomically.
Among those from Kara-Tur they have become known as the Jahat Lautaja, which loosely translated means "evil / demonic sea snakes."
However, they call themselves the Tindrraynggwa (Tin-drain-gwa). There is no direct or loose translation, although the name they give themselves refers to their connection to the great reef. It is greatly spiritual in origin, somewhat similar to a 'oneness.'
Other Information: The tribal peoples who inhabit the islands, who worship the reef as a deity, interpret these creatures of the sea to be somewhat akin to a minor avatar. They are always treated with respect and reverence. In turn for this respect (and some would say worship) the Tindrraynggwa protect the tribal peoples, teach them about the sea, and other such friendly exchanges.
When a Tindrraynggan (singular form - pronounced Tin-drain-gan) visits the tribal people a sacrifice is made. This sacrifice could be a individual from the tribe or an animal from the livestock. It is always best to offer a human, particularly a young female of child baring age. However, if animals are offered it should be from the weakest (oldest or ill) of the livestock. It is insulting to offer them something strong and healthy from among the animals. The Tindrraynggan has the ability to make a request for what it desires as a sacrifice, and may request anything or anyone of any amount.
On the surface this sacrifice may appear evil or cruel, but there is a greater point to it. There is a limited amount of resources among the sandy islands, and the Tindrraynggan are ensuring that the humans do not over populate themselves (either through allowing their livestock to overrun the island or the people). Should they not do this, the humans could quickly (within the matter of several generations) run out of resources and die. (Think Easter Island.) The Tindrraynggwa are acting much like a druid striving to keep the balance.
When a sacrifice is called for they are always taken to the water and drown. The remains are then taken, cleaned, cooked and ritually eaten by the tribe. This includes human sacrifices. The tribals eat their dead, believing that their strongest attributes will be infused into all who consume them. (For example, consuming an aged wise woman might grant wisdom, or consuming a young female might grant either youth or fertility, or a strong male warrior might grant strength or courage, etc.) The bones are given to the sea. Even if the remains cannot be eaten (due to some type of disease or sickness) the body is still given to the sea. They believe that in doing so, the souls of their dead rejoin the reef and the sea.
A commonly held view of the afterlife is that all in death return to the sea and become a part of the reef. They view it as a natural cycle. Death is not to be feared (for it is common enough). For those that protect and defend the tribe, dying in battle, they believe that their souls are reincarnated as a Tindrraynggwa / Yerlopaia.
-Being as that the Oslanders seem to be very animistic, I have been going with a "Maztica/Earthmother" idea with Osse- the deity is the land incarnate, supposedly. Thus, most Oslanders are animistic, and worship spirits and such, along with Mother Osse, the female fertility/life/protection archetype goddess, with specific spirits being "patrons" of different things, such as music, or warfare, or whatever else.
-A massive coral-type psionic entity (I have a weakness for Psionics, what can I say?), I like. I'd see it very much like the Earthmother and her "children"- Guardians to protect the island. A massive psionic coral entity, coupled with your massive Tindrraynggwa (these are the large beasts, and not the smaller seeming bipeds, yes?) seem like very good "children" to protect Mother Osse with.
-I will not include anglerfish, however. I have a phobia of those things, along with blobfish and tripod fish, and can't bring myself to do it...
When someone dies, they eat their remains. As I explained, they believe that in doing so they gain the strongest aspects of the dead.
There are practical aspects as well, aside from ritualistic. There is only so much food to be found on the islands, and it would be wasteful to let good meat go to rot. This practice likely began when they first settled the islands.
Their ancestors are likely from Kara-Tur, shipwrecked upon the islands. Survival was difficult, resources few, and as what happened on Easter Island in the real world, they turned to cannibalism. However, before they could die out completely, the Tindrraynggwa began to help them. The reasons for this are unknown. (Although I theorize that the humans must have aided them in some way, perhaps tending one of their injured. Something to prove themselves to the Tindrraynggwa. However, I am sure there are some mystical stories surrounding it.)
After two generations of eating their dead before getting aid from the Tindrraynggwa there was no longer a taboo, and since meat is never in large supply it only made sense to carry on the custom. It may have even been encouraged by the Tindrraynggwa.
The tribals, who I am thinking about naming Pindipaia (pronounced: Pindi paia), which loosely translates to "people of the sea" believe that when the bodies are cooked, the souls are released (in the smoke). The bones (or entire cooked body if it is diseased) are then tossed into the ocean. The soul follows the bones, to the bottom of the sea.
Over time the ocean grinds the bones to dust, which becomes part of the reef and the islands. The soul joins with the land and the reef.
The Pindipaia also believe in reincarnation, but only for the worthy, typically strong warriors. Those who are reincarnated always come back as Tindrraynggwa, which they view to be a more perfect near-divine form.
In addition to showing reverence and respect to the Tindrraynggwa they also worship the reef itself. All things that they depend on come from the reef, even their islands.
As I explained earlier, most of the islands are cays, and the reef is a sentient entity. The spirits (most likely dead Tindrraynggwa and Pindipaia) have the ability to do any number of things. First, they have the ability to lure food (typically fish) to the islands. Second, they have the ability to grant dream visions. Such visions typically warn them of impending danger, or alternatively show them a new place to migrate to that has enough food. Third, they have the power to alter the ocean currents. This has any number of consequences, as that can both create and destroy a island. Those of the Pindipaia who neglect the traditions could find that happen to them – the very island under their feet could begin to erode. Fourth, they can create wind. Fifth, they can create a magical fog that can confound people, causing them to get lost.
Those are the things the spirits can do on their own. The spirits are an extension of the reef. There are shaman like individuals who can (through the use of ritualistic magic) use the spirits to do even more fantastical things.
In addition to worshiping the reef itself, the Pindipaia worship their ancestors. Their ancestral worship is done in the most broad of senses basically, "all who have passed on before me" type of worship. Although an individual spirit could be focused on, such a powerful warrior or a dead relative.
-A massive coral-type psionic entity (I have a weakness for Psionics, what can I say?), I like. I'd see it very much like the Earthmother and her "children"- Guardians to protect the island. A massive psionic coral entity, coupled with your massive Tindrraynggwa (these are the large beasts, and not the smaller seeming bipeds, yes?) seem like very good "children" to protect Mother Osse with.
I wouldn't go with the coral reef having insane psionic abilities. I think it's best to keep things fairly subtle. I mean, its "mind" is totally and completely alien. :P
I imagine it has the ability to communicate with those who have a strong connection with it. It has the ability to control the spirits as well. The Tindrraynggwa (the naga like creatures) likely also have the ability to communicate with it directly. They are effectively guardians and stewards of the reef, more-or-less druidic types without tons of magical powers.
In my mind lots of wizbang magical power is associated with the Weave. Look at Maztica. Look at the other types of non-Weave based FR specific magic. It is all weaker, dramatically.
So I am trying to keep with that theme, and go more with rituals and the like, keeping magic rather subtle and more supernatural.
However, yes I do imagine that the reef has some psionic abilities. Both as defenses and ways to communicate, but I imagine that the Tindrraynggwa and the huge freakin' beasts that I mentioned earlier are the only ones that can understand it. The humans most likely interpret it via dream visions and attribute it to spirits.
Sorry if everything is so disjointed. Everything I write here is completely stream-of-consciousness.
-I will not include anglerfish, however. I have a phobia of those things, along with blobfish and tripod fish, and can't bring myself to do it...
Ha. Yes, those fish are crazy scary. Although in real life they are anywhere from two inches to eight inches long... lol... I'd hate to meet one. They totally look like something you'd find in some D&D source book, but they are real.
I've never seen them before, I just happened to stumble upon the image while doing searches about fish and fish anatomy on Wikipedia.
I had some ideas on what to do with them. Mostly they'd live deep down near the bottom of the sea, around the reef, and then appear during a full moon near the surface to spawn their young. Something like that, so that there would be the potential to be swarmed by them in large numbers. Imagine three to five of them each about two feet in size. :P
The 'earth mother' thing I think has been over-done in FR, between the Moonshaes and Maztica. I'd change it up and make it more like the Amerind 'Great Spirit', and give the Earth deity a male persona instead (perhaps make the male deities for the region 'nurturing', and the females antagonistic and destructive?)
You know, just to give it something to differentiate it from other pantheons, and it isn't really far-fetched; that sounds like the Celtic or Finnish Pantheons. You can even give them Umberlee, Talona, Loviatar, Morrigan (War), Hel (Death), Tlazolteotl (vice), etc... (with some name-changes, I'm thinking).
To be honest with you guys, I really hate the whole idea of creating new gods for anywhere. I'd rather just give new names to old ones. Maybe one or two new ones, but then fill-in the rest with FR deities with aliases.
Besides, my concept of deities is that they can actually change based on worship. If we ported over deities from Faerûn, we'd have to have a Faerûn like culture, or essentially radically alter the deities all together... which could have repercussions elsewhere.
I mean, I am not against deities having aliases (because I think it makes sense.) It's just that I feel that when a deity begins to drift too far from its current incarnation that it either changes or divides into a new aspect.
I look at it this way: Kara-Tur has its own gods, Mulhorand has its own gods, Maztica has its own gods, the Giants have their own gods, the Elves have their own gods, the Halflings have their own gods, the Dwarves have their own gods, the Drow have their own gods, the Humans of Faerûn have their own gods, the Orcs have their own gods, the Dragons have their own gods, and Zakhara has its own gods... and I am probably leaving some out... so why wouldn't a land with its own unique and separate culture have its own deities as well?
Let us not forget that the Faerûnian Pantheon is nothing more than a uber pantheon, made up of many different deities that merged from many individual human pantheons.
I'd like for the faiths of this place to be more mystical, their "deities" (I use the term loosely) less well defined, or different from what you'd find elsewhere in the world. After all, Markus you're the one who keeps saying that you don't want a medieval culture. :P
Pretty much one of the ways we can ensure that it does not devolve into something like Faerûn is the various types of religion.
I'd rather create new gods. Otherwise, we'd be going the 4E route, and saying stuff like, 'Selûne is really Sehanine Moonbow!'.
I actually don't have a problem with that.
I was using a few Faerûnian gods under different names for K-T anyway. I'd rather they retcon gods to having always been the same, then just killing them outright.
BTW, when a god takes on an alias, they can have completely different personalities and portfolios, believe it or not. For instance, the God Grumbar is female and is called Etugen in the Hordelands, and has a portfolio very similar to Chauntea's. For all intents and purposes it is a completely different god... and yet it is still Grumbar underneath.
Deities are sluts - they take worship any way they can get it. :D
Also, going back to your 'less defined' comment: This is what I was thinking as well, and why I offerred 'Great Spirit' as a substitute for an Earthmother figure. I wouldn't mind going the Amerind route all the way (which really does suit ANY primitive shamanistic/animism culture.
We could have beings (Exarchs?) like Running Wolf, Strong Bear, Soaring Eagle, and Coyote (I love that guy!). Maybe even a few named after elemental forces, like 'North Wind' and 'Angry Waters'.
Give them descriptions rather then regular names, to make them sound more mystical and 'naturish'.
BTW, when a god takes on an aloas, they can have completely different personalities and portfolios, believe it or not. For instance, the God Grumbar is female and is called Etugen in the Hordelands, and has a portfolio very similar to Chauntea's. For all intents and purposes it is a completely diffrent god... and ye it is still Grumbar underneath.
Deities are sluts - they take worship any way they can get it. :D
You're confusing alias with aspect. They are two very different things. An example of an alias is Selune as Lucha. When under an alias the deity is more or less the same, with a few possible differences, typically with one or two portfolios emphasized more greatly, or very similar but with slightly modified roles in local customs. They are more-or-less the same.
An aspect is a completely separate entity apart from the main deity. It is very much like the splitting of Tyche into Tymora and Beshaba. Although it need not be that dramatic. The original deity can remain the same, but a separate aspect seems to form when people worshiping a certain deity, often under an alias, begin to (over time) radically change from the original.
Some deities seem to have the ability to form separate aspects, others may be pulled apart unwillingly, it varies, though it generally seems to happen when a deity is unwilling to accept a certain group of worshipers any longer. I've theorized in the past that Mask was perhaps part of Shar, based upon her portfolios during the time of Netheril.
This is also very similar to how worshipers could potentially influence two deities merging together. Sometimes such heresies may be encouraged by a deity. (Example: A heresy could spread among the followers of Red Knight that the deities true identity is really that of Bane, acting secretly.... and then claiming that it was a recently revealed 'divine revelation.' Of course, such a heresy would not be supported by Red Knight, but by Bane in an attempt to steal one or more of Red Knight's portfolios and / or force her into merging with him. To accomplish this the bulk of Red Knight's worshipers would have to embrace the heresy, either through having them all killed off or having them convert.)
Also, going back tyour 'less defined' comment: This is what I was thinking as well, and why I offerred 'Great Spirit' as a substitute for an Earthmother figure. I wouldn't mind going the Amerid route all the way (which really does suit ANY primitive shamanistic/animism culture.
We could have beings (Exarchs?) like Running Wolf, Strong Bear, Soaring Eagle, and Coyote (I love that guy!). Maybe even a few named after elemental forces, like 'North Wind' and 'Angry Waters'.
Give them descriptions rather then regular names, to make them sound more mystical and 'naturish'.
That is the route I was going. Basically, you'd have mostly spirit-like beings existing. They may not even have ethereal or material bodies. A good example could be the coral reef. It is sentient, worshipable, and has a physical body. Another example could be weather spirits, of which there could be many - some with names, others nameless. So if you were outside and a thunderstorm started to roll in... you'd assume that the storm spirit is angry. However, if you were from Faerûn you -still- might assume it was Talos (even if it wasn't).
So, lets say a cleric of Talos was to appear over here on this continent. He's claim their "angry weather spirits" is Talos. Essentially, if they converted they'd just be acknowledging Talos as the name of the angry weather spirits... but in doing so they have really invited Talos over into the domain of the spirits. As Talos worship spreads, and the spirits worship dwindles, the spirits would fade away and die to be replaced by Talos (just as a god would).
That is how I envision handling it.
Also, on the note of religion, I'd like to step away from the standard polytheistic model.
-It wasn't until recently that I began thinking of "Mother Osse" as a "living thing", a entity who the Oslanders venerate. The continent, without a doubt, is fully animistic. With the exception of one small tribe living in the desert, that I already touched on, the Oslanders venerate spirits and such. "Mother Osse" 'herself' doesn't necessarily have to be a deity, either, in so much as she can be a a very powerful spirit guardian for the continent that receives veneration nonetheless.
-Being as that Osse has a very loose connection to the rest of the planet- by virtue of it being introduced very recently- and the fact that I don't have any intention of creating huge links between Osse and other places, be it Kata-Tur (which would have the most links, but would still be fairly few in number), Faerûn, and Zakhara, I have no intention of mixing, matching and inserting Faerûnian deities (or Kara-Turan entities) into Osse, and simply changing names and so on and so forth.
We could have beings (Exarchs?) like Running Wolf, Strong Bear, Soaring Eagle, and Coyote (I love that guy!). Maybe even a few named after elemental forces, like 'North Wind' and 'Angry Waters'.
Give them descriptions rather then regular names, to make them sound more mystical and 'naturish'.
-The only Oslander spirit entity we know of has a (more or less) normal name: Tunbarum, a spirit of music, who plays the dizheri (which, by proxy, would make him[?] humanoid, or anthropomorphic at the very least).
Somewhere on the interior of the continent, in a more temperate zone, exists a number of gnoll-like farming communities primarily based around herding sheep. However, instead of the gnoll being hyena-like, they'd be more based off the Australian Koolie.
Here is the basis of their religion (I call them Koolie, but the name is going to change).
1. The Koolie believe in a remote, supreme pantheistic divinity, a figure known as the Great Shepard.
2. The Great Shepard is believed to be the source of all life and creation. All creatures and objects have a spirit, which is an aspect of the Great Shepard, with some closer to the "true" source and others further away.
3. The Koolie believe that mortals somehow failed or betrayed the Great Shepherd. (What happened varies greatly depending on who is telling.) This is why they exist in the physical world instead of the spirit world. Their physical existence is a punishment.
4. There exists greater and lesser spirits, which have the potential to confound or aid mortals. The goal of a mortal is to trust in their own spirit, protect it, and seek a deeper truth (from within themselves).
5. They believe that the physical world is an inferior simulation of the spirit world, filled with flaws and imperfections. It could be compared to the inferiority of a painting, sculpture, or other such things which are supposed to be representation. However, there are some extremists who view materiality, and the physical body, as evil and constrictive, a deliberate prison for its inhabitants for their crimes against the Great Shepard.
6. Though the crime against the Great Shepard is unknown, it is possible for the spirit to return to the spirit world through a process of awakening (a form of gnosis). The gradual process of awakening of the individual brings them closer and closer to the truth, and upon the death of their material form their spirit will be allowed back into the spirit world. Failure to achieve full awakening dooms the spirit to endless reincarnation.
The Koolie would be divided up into clans, with each clan worshiping a number of powerful tribal spirits, typically nature or animal related. Each spirit is viewed as an imperfect emanation of the Great Shepard. It is commonly held that a being of physical form is incapable of understanding the Great Shepard as a whole, and thus can only understand aspects of it.
The tribal spirits they worship influence the clan dramatically. Each clan is effectively led by its druidic-like shaman, who base themselves and their clan around sacred groves tied or linked to their tribal spirits.
Some clans have developed forms of agriculture and have established small farming communities. They also possess primitive writing abilities.
However, I do really want to base one or two clans off the Way of the Leaf philosophy from the wheel of time. They'd worship the tribal spirits of leaves, autumn and peaceful water. Through gnosis they have come to believe that violence in all forms is wrong.
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'The leaf lives its appointed time, and does not struggle against the wind that carries it away. The leaf does no harm, and finally falls to nourish new leaves. So it should be with all people.'
'Violence does harm to the one who does it as much as the one who receives it. You could cut down a tree with an axe, the unawakened believe that the axe does violence to the tree, and escapes unharmed. We have learned better. Wood may be soft compared to iron, but no matter how sharp the iron it is dulled as it chops, and the sap of the tree eventually rusts and pits it. The mighty axe does violence to the helpless tree, and is harmed by it. So it is with us, though the harm is in the spirit.'
'Violence does harm to the one who does it as much as the one who receives it. You could cut down a tree with an axe, the unawakened believe that the axe does violence to the tree, and escapes unharmed. We have learned better. Wood may be soft compared to iron, but no matter how sharp the iron it is dulled as it chops, and the sap of the tree eventually rusts and pits it. The mighty axe does violence to the helpless tree, and is harmed by it. So it is with us, though the harm is in the spirit.'
Or would they be called Dingnolls?
-The only Oslander spirit entity we know of has a (more or less) normal name: Tunbarum, a spirit of music, who plays the dizheri (which, by proxy, would make him[?] humanoid, or anthropomorphic at the very least).
You found Flute Boy!!!
for anyone who gets that Zelda reference. ;)
Even though I only started using PS and mapping about three years ago, I had thirty years of experience painting miniatures, and about the same number of years in construction, part of which is design and layout (including landscaping).
So even though I'm relatively new at mapping, I had lots of time to 'work-out' my aesthetics muscles.
That has nothing to do with taste, BTW, so don't take that wrong. Its more of a knack concerning 'flow', color, positioning, etc...
I should apply my Blueprint skills to designing building layouts for gaming, but I think I'd try too hard for realism (I've yet to see an artistically rendered floorplan in an RPG product that would actually be functional in the RW).
Also, there are certain RW tropes that would need to be applied to fantasy architecture. For instance, did you know that in Ireland back and front doors were purposely placed directly across from each other, so 'spirits' (Fey, ghosts, demons, etc) who happened to accidently wander into a structure would pass right through and not get 'trapped'? It made the homes very cold (bad cross-breezes), but 'evil spirits' were a larger concern back then.
Thats the kind of useless knowledge one picks-up when they are a fantasy fan and a Builder. ;)
Some questions for some direction:
So does the land have any darker threats? An underdark?
Any conflicts going on?
Is Osse a more stable area because of the general subsistance level is pretty low and survival is the main concern?
How are those naga-men organised and ruled?
Do any of those cannibalistic tribes actively appease the naga-men with additional bounties for the coral overmind by hunting other tribes?
From what little we have here, Osse is a mostly-stable region, with cultures primarily developing along coastal regions and having very little inter-action. The interior is more 'wild', and is giving over to animals, monsters, and 'savage species'.
There is probbaly at least one 'lost civilization', because we need some ruins. My vote is for Creator-Race decendents (A fallen lizard-man empire, decadent Bullywugs, Raptorns left over from advanced Aeriee, etc), but that, too, was ignored.
There should be (AFAIK) about 2-5 Kingdoms, but those are all relatively new, and haven't had enough time to really establish animosities (but those are building). This is due to the recent influx of outsiders, now that the 'mystical barriers' have begun to lessen in power and frequency.
If I had any say, I would make each of the kingdoms a native-ruled land, with each group 'imitating' cultural features from different areas of Toril (Faerûnian, Shou, Zakharan, perhaps Malatran/Vedic). No direct analogs, but rather amalgams of those cultures and the native ones, so that people in one might dress like Zakharans, and people in another might develop martial arts, while in yet another they've taken to wearing armor...
So that each of the fledging kingdoms would be 'allied' with a different Torillian continent, and have ambassadors from there to "help things along".
:surrender _________________________
-Does Osse have an Underdark? No, I wasn't planning on including one, but I was planning on using parts of a jungle to mimic, partially, an Underdark of sorts, with sunlight never actually reaching the ground, causing darkness and interesting flora and fauna evolving as a result.
-Any conflicts going on? I'm not planning on going into any sort of history of Osse very much. Rather, I'm looking to make a general, broad overview of the place, for people to use if they want (I know I will, in future material and whatever else). There is, of course, tribal fighting- not everyone likes everyone else- and the Bullywug are the "main antagonists", but with Osse, I see the environment, the land itself, as the biggest hurdle towards living and all of that. It's a harsh, harsh place. I do envision troubles, in the past and possibly in the present, with Kara-Turans wanting/having colonies.
-Why is Osse so stable? Most because, as you said, people's main concern is on survival. The place is very large, with a tribal population on the smaller side. People aren't centrally organized to the degree that Faerûn is, so there are no real political boundaries, which prompt war, there aren't really religious differences, with everyone being mostly animistic...All of that will cut down on conflict a great deal. Tribes roam the plains, mostly try to stay away from the places where predators lie (certain jungles and the swamp), or where survival is difficult (the mountains and desert). No one likes conflict, so they try to not get into conflicts with each other. Tribal conflicts certainly do happen, but again, since they are on the smaller scale, when they do happen, there aren't massive sociopolitical changes.
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-In the Waatikantri Swamp, where the Bullywug live, I already have mentions of ancient ruins of unidentified origins. There are also the Majadeem (Guardians), large carvings built into the southeastern cliffsides that built by unidentified entities. I have a few mentions of some sort of ancient entities living on the island-nation that no longer exist, but I don't really have any intent of going into any detail about who they actually are/were.
Sounds good - I really like the idea of the sentient Coral (gives the place a surreal psionic feel).
I like it too. Compare Araumycos, the “oldest living being on Toril” — at least people think. in RW, the title of oldest living being is given to an algae colony, but they are not one and only creature —*the oldest single-being is a tree.
While the rest of the world's history was re-made by the Elves, this continent was left untouched by the magic, making it the sole-survivor of the now defunct alternate timeline.
I like it too. But what about Katashaka/Lapono/Numibia? Did the Elves also changed Zakhara and Kara-Tur? I do not know much about the Sundering.
Another neat idea might be to say that instead of being 'gone', the land that was ripped from Osse to create 'The Bowl' is still there, but it is floating above the continent now. Thats a bit too fantastical, maybe, but it sure would fit with 4e (perhaps it 'came back' after the Spellplague?)
I am not much into it, but definitely, a high fantasy world like Toril deserves cloud cities, or even a cloud realm (as well as a hollow one, btw but maybe not the preserve-like of Mystara)
When I look at your prototype map of Osse (http://Markustay.deviantart.com/art/Osse-WIP2-120041580), I can't help but think the central mountain is the Toril version of Uluru :-)
I actually had a MUCH cooler idea for the 'Overdark' concept, based in-part on the 'reverse plateau' idea, but adding-in some other cool aspects, like an eternal 'fog cover' for the valley, with several large plateaus, mesa, and buttes that rise above the 'cloud level' and are approximately level with the rest of Osse.
However, it is SO cool (that was just the basic premise), that I've decided to save it for my own homebrew campaign world. :D
Although no geological formation like this exists on earth, or may even be physically possible, this is a world of magic... so what the hell. :P
You guys know what a super volcano is, right? Okay, imagine that when Osse formed that one of those things erupted. It's massive. I am not sure how large, due to the scale on the map, but it should be a prominent feature, maybe not as large or big as the Sea of Fallen Stars is on Faerûn, but using that as a guide. It'd also be deep, most likely below sea level.
The crust would be thin, so the bottom of the caldera would have lava flows bubbling up occasionally. You'd have tons of fissure vents on the floor of the caldera, as well as mud volcano's.
You'd also find cinder cone's, lava dome's, and all sorts of related activity.
You'd find all sorts of lava and ash related creatures there, such as elementals. Maybe some type of lava-lizard that looks like a kimodo dragon.
The entire volcano is actually some type of living god or spirit (or several of them), similar to Borem the Lake of Boiling Mud, of the infamous Seven Lost Gods.
As a result the entire area would be under this beings control, and it would be capable of controlling the various eruptions and lava flows that take place. That would include their intensity.
I am imagining traveling through this place to be truly hellish. The land itself would seemingly be trying to kill you. As you walk across black-charred ground, a minor quake would erupt, and a fissure would open up nearby, spewing lava several feet into the air. Clouds and fogs of sulfuric ash that burn the lungs and eyes. Pools of lava that may appear like solid ground... but if you are not careful and step on them...
Visibility could be low in some areas (from clouds of smoke or ash), so getting lost would be easy... and this is the last place you'd want to get lost in.
-It still seems like it's missing something, geography wise. Anyone thing Osse should have a volcano? I figure, in a treacherous land, a "fire mountain" would certain make parts of it even more treacherous.
The reason why I gave up mapping is that your scale is way off, and I tried to point that out, but you just ignored me.
What you have there is a very nice, perhaps large, ISLAND.
The terrain is not varied-enough to be a continent.
Look at my overlay again and note how many FR mountain ranges fit into Osse. You can have just one, but it should cut-across the entire continent then, and have lots of 'spurs' going off in other directions. The only problem with that is that the Yehimals are supposed to be the biggest range on the planet, but the Osse Range would make that look small by comparison.
You need more variation, plain and simple.
And volcanos are ALWAYS cool - I try to stick them in lots of places. :D
In a fantasy world, the 'smoking mountain' doesn't always have to be geothermal in nature. ;)
-Did I do the math wrong somewhere?
Continents should have more varied terrain. While it may be true that a primitive world (or even a primitive continent on an established world) could have just two or three types of terrain, thats fairly boring, especially for a fantasy world designed to host games.
Once again, you are showing that you are a Realms novel fan, and not a fan of the gamer-setting.
You really expect PCs to trudge through 2 or 3 thousand miles to "get to the good stuff"? Jungles are cool. Thousands of miles of them are very uncool (from a game perspective).
You just need to 'mix it up a little', is all. I'm not critiquing what you have done, so much as how you're looking at things. Instead a massive jungle, how about lots and lots little jungles, with mountains and river valleys and wastelands and all sorts of other, smaller terrain to divide it up a little?
This is what I was intending - I was going to wait until you were done, and then take that as a 'world map projection' light on details, and then add-in all the details later when you were finished with the 'broad strokes'.
What you have there is fine... for a 4e game. ;)
I've been trying to find a map of Australia that looks more like a fantasy map, but I can't seem to locate one. I did find this rather cool site, which does give some detail. It apears that Aussie is mostly wasteland, which makes it rather dull from an adventurer's point of view (unless those wastes are filled with ruins). Here's another one -
Pretty boring... it needs more 'stuff'. :P
The Charr
I would change that name, but the concept is a cool one (no pun intended). I like their fluff a lot, and their look is off the shiz.
Almost like a combination of Fire Elementals (or Efreeti) and Rakshasa.
Edit:
Trying to find a better pic for a female Naga from WoW. Still haven't located a decent one, but I came across this guy's site, which has some pretty cool concept-art (his own, personal WoW 'wish list'). That first one on the link I gave is so bizarre its pretty damn cool.
As for the area I was describing, like Markus I was worried about the 'boring wasteland' thing. The area I was describing would be interesting because it'd literally be alive and sentient. It'd be trying to kill you. And of course you'd have the Charr (we wouldn't call them that, of course) likely following you down from the mountains and into the volcanic valley.
Also, for the Charr (or whatever we'd call them), the volcanic valley would be like a holy land to them. All the fire they get would come from down there. I am also envisioning a pilgrimage type of event for them... like a coming of age type thing where they force their soon-to-be adult children to live down there for a week or something.
-After geography, then we'll be up to races. And then specific sites. And then, done, maybe.
-I'm going to use the existence of "Guda N'gepya", the massive stratovolcano, as the reason why Osse has no Underdark. What would be it's Underdark is filled with lava. If we're going to inhabit the canyons and surrounding area with "Fire Rakshasa", there needs to be a keep, or something built into the volcano itself a lot like Castle Greyskull. It's almost a given, you know? :P
-Instead of making up a whole new race, I think that Rakshasas would be a good fit. At some point, they came over from Southern Kara-Tur, tapped into the power of the Volcano, and likely evil, malevolent spirits inhabiting it, and voila.
-That said, I don't give a damn if a person playing D&D doesn't like the layout of things, or if they have to walk thousands of miles to get to specific sites or locales. The world doesn't cater to D&D- it's a world first, and a D&D setting second.
Thats why TSR bought it. :P
If no-one is going to use what you propose, then this whole thing just becomes a mental excercise. The idea is make people want to go there - thats what a good fantasy map does.
With your permission (of course) I would like to move ahead and start detailing some sections, so you can see what I mean. I'm not talking about changing anything you've done, just adding in some interesting bits here, there, and everywhere. I find its easier sometimes to create the terrain first, and then figure-out what goes there, at least for me.
I like the Super-Volcano angle - the whole continent becomes a giant volcano!
That would mean that all the terrain gradually slopes upward toward 'the middle', and then it quickly reduces in elevation (perhaps not shear cliffs, like I had pictured for my 'reverse plateau', since this volcano would be milions of years old (or just 50,000, because this is FR :P ). Basically take an Uber-volcano, make it dormant for about gajillion years, and then weather the heck out of it so it would be nearly unrecognizable as such, except from space.
Edit: Just another quick mock-up a what something like that might look like -
What would a goal for such an entity be? How did it come to be? It's "feel" makes me classify it as a primal spirit with a past forged in the fires of the elemental plane of fire. On first contact it might be interpreted by feaunians as an aspect of Kossuth the Firelord (just as the Earthmother is in the Moonsheas) or a fiery version of Boram of the Boiling Mud.
As to a raised plateau that houses dire threats. A sentient vulcano has a unique power to shape the land in mere hours into the shapes he desires, so he could have easily raised sheer cliffs from Osse's mainland to form an isolated elevated area for a select group of druidic fire worshippers. These could spread choking cloads of smoke across the lands and control the weather from those elevated earthen pillars.
They could call him the Ashen Lord (or some-such), and perhaps he is really a Para-Elemental being, like Ehkahk (Smoke). Although this is supposed to be long-dormant, so perhaps one of the Lords of Steam, Ash, or even Magma would fit better.
I had pictured a type of Stone Giant/Fire Giant crossbreed (a Magma Giant?) as some sort of 'Waste Giant'. I tried to find something like that in Sandstorm (a valuable resource for this project), but no such luck. I know there are two different types of desert giant (Sand & Desert), but I'm not sure where to find them, or if they were even covered in 3e. I'll search more during the day (IIRC, the desert variant was very Zakharan, so the Sand variant would probably be our best bet).
Another option would be to just use all fof the oddities found in the Races of... series, like the Raptorans and Goliaths. I've already mentioned the raptorans before, as an Aeriee-throwback, but not the Goliaths. I had intended to use those in Kara-Tur for the Coomb Giants, but they may be a better fit here (Osse could be their native land, from wence they spread). I hate Illumians (one of the stupidest things 3e ever did), and Dragonborn are now cliche'... the other Draconic race - Spellscales - might work. I dislike the name, but the flavor and look is not bad. They're a like the sorceror-fluff taken to the extreme (Dragon-blooded=magical prowess). Some of the minor races from those books could work as well, like the Killoren or the Sea Kin.
There's also the races from the environmental books (most notably the Sandstorm tome mentioned earlier). The Bhuka would make a kinda-cool Jawa knock-off with a fantasy desert-goblin twist. I've also been looking for a home for the Marruspawn, but because they require an entire 'lost civilization' type region they were a tough retro-fit for FR. Osse is certainly big enough - they might be just what we've been looking for. Sandstorm has a lot of information about their culture, history, and several racial sub-types. Their feralness lends itself well to a 'lost world' environment.
Anyhow, just bouncing ideas off of everyone, like usual. Take what you like, and toss-out the rest. ;)
If no-one is going to use what you propose, then this whole thing just becomes a mental excercise. The idea is make people want to go there - thats what a good fantasy map does.
-That's all I'm doing it for. I don't give a damn if someone wants to set their D&D campaign on Osse or not. I want to give Osse an identity, of sorts. The D&D aspect means little in terms of making it "good". It'll be "good" whether or not someone plays D&D on it or not. Middle-Earth is a place I'd consider "good", and it was created as a "mental exercise", rather than to set a D&D game. My setting is a place I'd consider "good", and it was created as a "mental exercise", rather than to set a D&D game in.
With your permission (of course) I would like to move ahead and start detailing some sections, so you can see what I mean. I'm not talking about changing anything you've done, just adding in some interesting bits here, there, and everywhere. I find its easier sometimes to create the terrain first, and then figure-out what goes there, at least for me.
-Like I said before, we're not done making up the geography.
Edit: Just another quick mock-up a what something like that might look like -
Ooh! A sentient storm would work for an elemental worldspirit of Air! Have a permanent mother tornado circle the island, guarding Osse's coasts and occasionally have some "sons" of the mother storm wreck the inlands.
Mayhaps sentient shifting sands for the Earthen spirit manifestation. Or perhaps a giant crystalline outcropping in a mountaineous area that shines the suns early and late rays through a surrounding valley might work too. During dawn or dusk the crests of sunlight would shower the valleys mountainsides with a blaze of fractured colors. Such a thing could easily awe the Osslander shaman that hoped to settle that valley.
The worldspirits of Osse could also claim the souls of the dead the Osslanders bury or leave to the elements, and depending on their environment empower the primal spirit closest to them with their ancestor spirits. This way most of Osse's afterlife would hold strong elemental themes because each primal spirit guards Osse there aswell. In the 15th century timeline this would be the shadowfell around that part of Toril and the ghostly or ethereal pathway to the Fugue plane in the 14th century Realms...
-A sentient storm (like a hurricane or something), although that is something air related, with it being over the water, and strengthening itself with water, I see it too tied to water. What else would work good for air? I am thinking, a bird, maybe? A Bird of Paradise, perhaps?
-I am also going to try to put together an index in the first post, much like MT's index from the K-T R-D. It'll be evolving, since this all is still evolving, but it'll give a measure of what exists thus far.
The 2e Monstrous Manual has both that and the Black Cloud of Vengeance written-up (for reference if we go that way).
Personally, I really want Osse to stand-out, not so much for being 'epic' (quit the contrary, actually), but rather just for being very different then everywhere else.
That means. to me, instead of Uber-Elementals for Osse, we should go with the Para-Elementals,; Smoke, Ice, Ooze, and Magma.
Magma's and easy one, but strangely enough Ooze is a good fit for the coral. Ooze is a combination of Earth and Water - and Coral is silicate-like creature that lives in the sea.
That could live smoke for the 'Black Cloud of Vengeance', and we'd only need to find a home for Ice (I'm thinking that southern island probably gets pretty cold).
-Like I said before, we're not done making up the geography.
Which means you missed my point. I get inspired as I go along, and sometimes draw something and say "wow... I want to place something there... that little thingy is pretty cool".
The design elements come form the art, not the other way around (for me, anyway). Stuff can be changed as we go along (as you well know, everything I do becomes an ever-lasting WIP). Sometimes I'll moves something around and change it up several times, and accidently hit upon something I hadn't thought-of (bodies of water, clearings, marshes and swamps, rivers, forests, etc, etc..). I just start pasting stuff in and nudging it and resizing it things 'just happen'. A weird way to work, but it gives me my basis, and from there I get a lot more ideas, and then I fine-tune it to the new ideas the map gave me.
However, I thought about this some more, and I don't even know why I would want to do this, considering how many other unfinished things I have going on. So take all the time you need hammering-out the details. I think it might be best for everyone if I just do a piece at a time as it develops (lore-wise) in this thread. A continent is a HUGE undertaking, and if I tried to take it on all at once I'd get overwhelmed and probably lose interest.
-I'd, personally, move the volcano down just a little bit, giving the northern quadrant more room for roaming, unbroken plains. With it moved down a bit, it can then be merged into the mountains roaming down there. Perhaps the mountains would form a 'V' shape around the volcano.
No problem - I wasn't really placing it at this time - I was just trying to give us away of picturing what the island would like like (or rather, amount to). Naturally, there would be a series of ridges in a circular pattern terminating with the central caldera, so that we would be able to visually see how the entire continent very gradually slopes up (making the rim of the caldera rather cold due to altitude, even though the rim will be so time-worn that it would be nearly unrecognizable as such).
I love the idea of incorporating the mountain-ranges. They could actually BE the rim. Due to its incredible size, the caldera wouldn't even be able to be discerned by land-bound peoples (you wouldn't able to even see acrooss it - it would look like the world just ends in a chasm filled with mists*). So what the natives take for mountain ranges would really be massive basalt ridges that have been eroded by passing millenia, and covered with a few yards (meters) of soil deposits (allowing growth, but also re-producing the mineral-poor soil of RW Australia).
It would also mean the mountains are filled with volcanic lava tunes (cave complexes!), which gives us a nice alternative to an Underdark (which isn't feasable in a such a geothermallly unstable region).
*Edit: This gives me an idea for an interesting side-project, and doing something I really ever attempted before. There was an old map of an Edgar Rice Boroughs world wherein the inhabitants avtually envisioned the world backwards, and drew their maps accordingly. Applying this to our natives, a 'native map' would like a big body of water in the center, surroiunded by a ring of land, and finally a massive land-drop (the end of the world) theat just lead into dark mists.
The natives would imagine that the caldera was really the outer rim of the continet (they have no technology to tell them otherwise), and it would make sense to them, because they consider the caldera a mystical and fiend-ridden place, and one that they can't see the ends of (the caldra is SO huge, they wouldn't even be able to discern a curviture - they would think it was a straight-running clidff that went on forever).
It would also be very confusing to outsiderers and natives alike, since the aboriginies would think the coral is in the center of a big lake... and somehow the 'outsiders' were able to travel from the center of the coral (which also helps explain why they never travelled far from shore - they though the coral was solid and in the center). They may even think of outsiders as 'gods' (as the Aussies did - another cool tie-in to the RW), sent to them by 'the mighty coral' (or whatever you guys name it).
What about such a massively big gorge that walking on its dried riverfloor sometimes crosses a miles and miles of crystalline "forests" of clear diamond, quartz, rubie and emeralds? Shattering such branches can be lethal as the fragments scatter. Perhaps the crystal trees are defended by crystalline spiders or in some parts even gemdragons.
This gorge could also have exposed massive empty magma tunnels, which make perfect lairs for all kinds of subterranean monsters. Some might even expose ruins to forgotten subterranean civilisations or other strange sights.
A petrified forest or jungle could house stone eating organisms of a large variety. Might be nice to include a stony treant who remembered when he and his place were still green.
I didn't even bother to get the sizing 100% (I'd go a bit smaller). I'd also go a bit south with it as well.
Good idea about the water-on-magma; you've just given an excellent reason why the entire caldera is filled with a misty shroud (some parts just steam, other parts more sulpherous).
I'd make the water body smaller, but definately go with it as a source of vapors.
Caldera's don't have to be circular in nature, per-say. Especially if it is decided to run with the idea that this volcano is sentient.
I was thinking of something more along the lines of LK's mountain range separating east from west, but in between the mountain range adding a volcanic like gorge between the mountains... similar to a Caldera, to make traveling from east to west more difficult.
My reason for suggesting the idea was to create a buffer zone to prohibit migration. It allows for more cultural diversity, and less worry of two cultures clashing. As well it'd be a major impediment to colonization.
It would also allow us to create a more civilized culture that simply has not explored the continent completely due to natural and supernatural impediments.
(A) A crater that was once a supervolcano, that erupted sometime in Osse's past, causing massive cataclysm and whatnot, that is not a large hole, more or less, that has been filled in with water, and is now a large lake. Volcanoes will still be present, in the chain of mountains that runs north-south nearby.
(B) A supervolcano that is still active, surrounded (more or less) by a chain of mountains that runs north-south nearby. Over the years, through residual..."runoff", a river have formed linking it, somewhat, with the western coast, that perpetuated a petrified forest.
-Here's also a work off of the map provided by MT above, incorporating more stuff:
I am trying to mentally and logically create reasons for the huge landmass not yet being fully and completely colonized. That was the reason I suggested the giant sentient coral reef, the naga-like creatures, and the super volcano idea.
They are all meant in large part to be natural and supernatural barriers to colonization. Therefore, if PC's wanted to colonize the landmass they'd have to find a way to deal with those issues, which would of course have consequences.
To that same end, I think the desert wasteland should be on the other side, facing Kara-Tur.
Use the following website for a detailed look at the most studied supervolcano on earth: Yellowstone Supervolcano
It has several notable features that can be very usable in a fantasy setting: geysers, mudpots, hot springs, etc.
I'm not trying to change your mind (yes, I am
), but just showing you that a dormant supervolcano is more than just a crater and a lake.What I was imagining is a supernatural version, times a thousand, and more sexed up for fantasy. :P
Since that time, erosion how leveled-off much off the original enormous crater ridge (still leaving relatively large mountains). I like the idea of the lake, but combined with Suin Bahhar's suggestion - that there is still a large amount of vulcanism taking place below the continent, so that the lake becomes 'steamy' and even sulpherous (posionous) in places. That leaves that entire central area shrouded in mists, and would probably be a source of much local legend and taboos. I'm picturing a bayou-like marsh around it, with various 'things' living in huts on stilts, and also lots of scaley things living in the water (Giant Crocs, Huge Snakes, some pleisaurs, etc, etc...).
Although the main caldera from the original eruption is no longer 'active', geysers, both in the water and out, erupt in the region. Also, the entire mountain chain (and beneath the continent) are riddled with lava-tubes, some of which are still active from time-to-time. Occassionally, a pocket of magma reaches the surfaces, and lots of smaller volcanos are born - some oozing lava, some just smoking, and others having gone dormant long-ago like the super one.
That gives us all the seismic activity and still able to fill the ancient caldera with water (or whatever).
I was actually working on the southern island for about two hours today - I wanted one thing completed to give everyone a better idea of the scale involved. The map I posted here was greatly reduced in size so I could fit the whole thing on this page.
I should have the island done tomorrow and I'll post it.
-The volcano exploding in the past can also explain why the people of Osse are fairly 'backwards', in terms of how advanced the rest of Kara-Tur, Maztica, Zakhara, and Faerûn are. Something in the recent past would have cleared the table, prompting civilization and whatnot to have to start over. Something in the recent past would also explain the lack of outside influence in Osse. Perhaps the Kara-Turans, or the Zakharans settled the continent long ago, and then catastrophe occurred, and because of that, ties were broken, allowing Osse to develop more or less on it's own. Being as that the information is new, in terms of world building, Oslander ties can be written into other Kara-Turan or Zakharan places, and nothing gets messed up.
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-Originally, I placed the desert on the western coast. It was then moved to the eastern coast, reason being was that the prevailing weather patterns and climates would be moving cyclones/hurricanes and less dangerous tropical rainfalls down from Southeast Kara-Tur to the western side of Osse. Putting a desert there, an explanation would be needed to explain why tropical desert exists on that coast, and nearby, a desert. Moving it to the opposite coast moves it away from the southern moving storms, and places a barrier of mountains, to mostly prevent the storms from providing rainfall over the area.
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-The seismic and magmal (I like that made-up word) activity beneath Osse is still ongoing. That is why Osse has no traditional Underdark- there is lava under there, poisonous gasses, and constantly collapsing caves and cave complexes because of earthquakes. The island, as a whole, is more or less stable, and isn't in danger of collapsing itself, or whatever else, but the same can't be said for it's "innards".
In 1038 DR, Toril experienced a slight rotational shift (The Great Glacier, pg. 7). I have therorized that this was the result of a rather large meteor strike somewhere on the planet, but considering their were no direct effects (other then global warming and general glacier-melting) it would make sense that it had to have happened on the other side of the planet.
What if that is a meteor crater of a strike that happened a mere 337 years ago?
Perhaps there was a powerful civilization (a'la Netheril, or Imaskar) controlling this land and keeping outsiders out, and these aboriginies are whats left of those once-great peoples.
Ergo, instead being primitive because their backwards, they are primitive because they were nuked into the stoneage.
This will also help differentiate Osse from Malatra, where there are already very primitive, stone-age level people dwelling.
Thoughts?
We could still have everything currently exactly as we imagined it - their would still be a lot of tectonic upheaval (perhaps the 'plate' was cracked by the strike?) and a thermal basin. All that would change is the back-story (and tie it into an aberrant piece of FR history).
Question: What keeps Kara-Tur from settling the continent currently, and what keeps the various groups separated so that they do not begin developing a shared culture.
Which has all quited-down in the past twenty years or so, allowing Kara-Turrans to finally have enogh nerve to try again.
Secondly, Shou Lung and T'u Lung hate each other. T'u doesn't have the central organizartion to mount an effective colonization. Shou certainly does... but T'u would do anything to prevent that. Being unable to use Osse themselves, I can see them using their navy to keep all Shou explorers from reaching the mainland.
Things changed, however... maybe Wa and/or Kozakura have discovered Osse, and are trying to settle it. This may have caused a change in the status quo, and T'u has finally decided to get its crap together and try colonization (putting aside its war with Shou and it's internal disorganization for once).
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* The reason from the past will effect which way we go with the recent change. If we go with the ToT for the change, then we will have to say some sort of deity-level power was keeping others from reaching Osse (and keeping the Ossies from 'escaping'). If we use the Meteor strike/super-volcano, then we could say that the former Empire(s) of Osse were incredible powerful, and had some sort of Magic and/or techhnology that allowed them to hold-off 'barbarian invasions'. If we go that route, we have to establish some sort of cultural reason why they didn't bother to invade others (which could mean their power was derived from Osse itself). However, that option allows us to go full-tilt ruins all over the place, making it a much more interesting gaming environment then just a continent full of 'savages'.
I'm leaning heavilly toward the meteor/Volcano angle, and having Osse 'wiped clean' three centuries past. I like the idea the Ossies would have legends from their mighty past, and now they are a downtrodden people who have lost much of their hope (having to concentrate just on survival for all this time). Culturally, we can play-up the whole "the gods were angry at us" angle. I see a lot of potential in that.
A continent and people just climbing back up from a great cosmic thwacking.
Edit: I'm beginning to see that the ideas are not mutuallly exclusive - if the 'mighty power' that was holding sway over Osse since the beginning were the thing responsible for the Ossies incredible power (at their height), that would have also meant that they wouldn't have that power while away from Osse. By the same token, foreigners (and their beliefs) would have been a threat to this powwr, and thats why it would have blocked others from interferring with the 'paradise' it had created.
Which means the 'cosmic thwacking' could have been caused by outside gods (Faerûnian, Maztican, Kara-Turran, ect..), who felt it was about time the Ossies were free from their 'benevolent' (yet despotic) ruler. However, the power (a Primordial?) managed to stay alive and protect it's people from dying-out altogether, mitigating the worst of the cataclysm (we sort of need that, otherwise it should have been global). After three centuries of constantly exerting it's power to the fullest, it fell into a deep coma (those 'sleeps' that god-like beings are always falling into). This means it is now in a 'recovery phase', and healing, which means it can come back... which is exactly what the natives pray for.
The only way the natives can still communicate with their 'god' is through it's dreams. :D
There's an old 2e supplement that could be used: Chronomancer. Maybe the meteor strike was from somebody playing with time magics they did not understand. Since then, the magic of time travel was abolished/forbidden by the deity of Osse (or even Mystra before the Spellplague, because time travel can create all sorts of trouble). Now, due to the disruption caused by the Spellplague, certain objects/creatures have been showing up that is not of the present. They are either from the distant past or distant future. Right now its just isolated incidents. Or, maybe somebody has rediscovered chronomancy and has been performing experiments, possibly under the guidance of a creature from the Far Realm.
Just a couple of ideas. Take them or leave them.
That would be a truely awesome adventuring site. Definately like a temporal rift in the 15th century Osse near the crater site. You could use oldskool Gammaworld like adventures, or that Fearun one with the crashed spelljammer.
On the other hand, if this 'project' (I still consider it a mental excercise :P) ends at 1375 DR, there is no reason that fans of 4e can't join-in with their own 1479 version (which could be very gamma-worldish).
I think it sounds cool, but then again, I'm a fan of Thundarr. :D
Does it have to be a volcano?
In 1038 DR, Toril experienced a slight rotational shift (The Great Glacier, pg. 7). I have therorized that this was the result of a rather large meteor strike somewhere on the planet, but considering their were no direct effects (other then global warming and general glacier-melting) it would make sense that it had to have happened on the other side of the planet.
What if that is a meteor crater of a strike that happened a mere 337 years ago?
-You've sold me on the idea. I like it, and that's a nice way to tie Osse to existing Realmslore. A meteor striking the continent can also agitate the thermal vents and tubes beneath the continent that were once mostly dormant, causing the volcanoes to become active, the mudpots to start bubbling, the geysers to start erupting, etc...
Perhaps there was a powerful civilization (a'la Netheril, or Imaskar) controlling this land and keeping outsiders out, and these aboriginies are whats left of those once-great peoples.
Ergo, instead being primitive because their backwards, they are primitive because they were nuked into the stoneage.
This will also help differentiate Osse from Malatra, where there are already very primitive, stone-age level people dwelling.
Thoughts?
-I'm not really digging the concept that a powerful civilization existed on the continent. I see no real reason for it, other than to have another powerful Abeir-Torillian fallen civilization. In a few places, I've made mentions of ancient ruins (the swamps and cliffs, most notably), but I've never had any intentions of actually saying who made the ruins, or why, much like the alien culture from Beast Wars.
Question: What keeps Kara-Tur from settling the continent currently, and what keeps the various groups separated so that they do not begin developing a shared culture.
-Malatra is not a factor in colonization. Shou Lung and T'u Lung have been at each other's throats for a long time, and would counter any move made by the other. Wa and Kozakura, until fairly recently, have been mostly isolated and concerned about themselves, as opposed to doing world exploration. There goes anyone in Kara-Tur who has the ability/interest to colonize the continent, at nearly any point in time, recent or past.
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-Heh, on TV, I was watching Bizarre Foods with Andrew Zimmern, and the episode featured the Australian Outback, and right after that show was over, there was a show about volcanoes.
On the other topic, I'm not a big fan of using a giant meteor to wipe people out. I'm not against the human tribal's being descendants of an ancient and fallen empire (it thematically fits in with FR), but anyone who knows anything about such events knows that the effects would have been felt globally. If a comet or asteroid large enough to create that crater hit Toril, then virtually all sentient life would have been threatened with extinction.
As for my example promised above...
The Za-Renn
The Za-Renn, formerly known as the Trade Alliance Federation, is a continent-spanning business comprised of a number of independent coasters and trading consortium's. They are primarily based in Kara-Tur, but also span into Thay and Thesk.
History
Over the course of the last seven decades, the Za-Renn have emerged as a formidable force within Kara-Tur. They emerged from a small Shou merchant consortium that focused on the trade of weapons and mercenaries. Since then they have expanded to include additional markets, but always they have been known for their public neutrality and anti-competitive practices.
The Za-Renn work to gain influence with anyone with power, primarily through the use of bribery and highly favorable trade deals. They then use their clout to encourage their political allies to establish unfair trade policies toward their competition. In most cases, they strive to absorb the competition into their organization, thereby allowing themselves even more control over additional markets.
Because of these practices they have gained a reputation as unethical opportunists by their rivals. However, most are more than happy to do business with them as they are also well known for honoring their agreements and obligations.
The following is a list of the primary business done with Za-Renn: weapons, mercenaries, mining, agriculture, and "domesticated servants" (aka slaves).
Most recently, however, they have decided to make an attempt to colonize the hostile continent to the south east of Kara-Tur known as Osse.
Organizational Structure
The Za-Renn is comprised of a number of partially self-governing businesses, which are in turn governed by the Federation Council. The Council leaders are elected every six years by democratic vote among the participating businesses. Only owners of participating businesses may sit upon the Council. Additionally, those who wish to be elected as members of the Council must meet certain criteria, ranging from length of time within the Federation, to success of the candidates business, all the way to the amount of money contributed to the Federation. The Za-Renn strive to ensure that their leaders are goal oriented and can achieve results. A Councilor may only sit on the Council for two consecutive terms, upon which the Councilor must wait two more terms until he is eligible to run again.
The Council is empowered to be the executive, legislative and judicial head for the organization. They settle disputes between member organizations, establish regulations and rules, and punish those organizations who violate them. They also appoint various individuals to serve the Za-Renn, typically as negotiators and ambassadors.
The Za-Renn in Faerûn
The Za-Renn are not very influential in Faerûn, as most of their focus is in Kara-Tur. However, there has been a push in the East to expand toward the West. They have agreements with some in Thesk and Thay. The Shou government has been selling criminals to the Za-Renn to be used as they see fit, and they have in turn been selling many of these criminals to Thay as slaves. Weapons and other arms from the east travel along the Golden Way and find themselves in Thesk.
There has also been a slow encroachment toward Zakhara and the Shining South, though their presence there is still extremely minimal.
The Za-Renn in Osse
Osse has been known to those in Kara-Tur for some time. However, due to the many formidable challenges of colonizing the continent most attempts have been abandoned. For the past five years the Za-Renn have been sending ships to a small colony they have established just off the main coast. The island is lush with jungle, and obviously formed through volcanic activity.
Illness and the disappearance of ships have plagued the colony since it was established, and it was on the verge of failure. However, the current Council will not allow it. They are redoubling their efforts to colonize the land, in order to exploit it for its natural resources. They also hope to enslave, civilize, or exploit the native peoples.
To this end they have decided to create a portal within the colony linking to multiple destinations, which in turn would allow them to avoid the loss of ships and to be able to ensure that the colony has all the necessary resources. All of this has come at a considerable expense, but the efforts of the Za-Renn have finally begun to pay off.
Hooks
- The players encounter a Theskian Merchant associated with the Za-Renn. He owns a small mercenary group, and attempts to recruit the players to assist in the Za-Renn colonization efforts.
- The players encounter a Red Wizard slave trader and break up his operations. However, many of the slaves (who have learned the common tongue) come from a strange land. They then inform the players of their homeland, and of the Za-Renn enslaving their people.
- A merchant group the players are associated with decides to join the Za-Renn Trade Federation.
But the reason I want some sort "lost civilisation" is only to enable places that can be looted by PC's. A place where they can port those goods back to Kara-Tur for the Za-Renn's profit makes the disconnection of the party to an economy no problem. So the portal hub of the Za-Rennis certainly a good way to keep the players connected to a flow of gold. I think the best way to make Osse a playable area is to actually already have competing settlers in place that both have to race for the resources of the continent.
But talking about economies...
How would one envision trade on Osse, does it exist at all? Would they even mint gold and silver? What could work as a exchange for debts among the Charr for example?
The low subsistence level hints to hardly any trade between the scattered and divided Osslanders. I think it might be interesting if some of the native Osslanders are made into hardy, wary and pessimistic folk who have learned through competition with the Charr, those Nagafolk and other monstrous humanoids of Osse that they have to strike fear into your neighbours and actively aquire their resources.
I got the impression the Osslander seem to fit the goblin niche in fantasy literature on the continent, scurrying between the more warlike and naturally adapted races of the inlands of Osse. Being the opportunistic kind of hunters that prefer to steal the spoils of war of another.
I imagine Osslander reaction to the foreigners will run the gambit. It largely depends on the individual culture. The majority, I think, would view them with some degree of hostility, and most would at best view them with distrust and possibly fear. On the other hand, some of them may even view them as divine agents or deities.
As for trade on Osse, I see it as largely being a barter system. I also think, though, that there could be a handful of established communities on Osse that are more civilized.
The problem facing foreigners is that the Osslanders do not speak the common tongue. Thus, communication is difficult or impossible in most cases. That would be one of the major reasons for the Za-Renn to exploit them, take their land, and harvest their resources.
I envision the Za-Renn as running the gambit on alignment. They are Cronie Capitalists, looking out for themselves and their allies first and foremost, but they are not an evil organization. When it comes to issues of slavery, just remember that Mulhorand engaged in slavery and was considered a good aligned country. Slavery typically falls along the law / chaos axis, rather than the good / evil axis.
See this post I created in the past dealing with the many different forms of slavery.
The loot from Charr encounters could for example be their enchanted obsidian weapons, fire protection wards in the forms of bone jewelry or armor, new fire spells or power components relating to fire. We could look to old Dark Sun level weaponry for the more primitive Osslanders.
But who would make longswords for the party fighter? Perhaps we should introduce a fiendish sponsored militaristic tribe of Osslanders in the past who we're known for delivering warriors as bloodwar mercenaries to an Archdevil who introduced steel weapons and forgecraft to Osse. We could use the fall of a tribe after a faustian pact as the more ancient civilisation. Their descendants are then easy to fit into the new tiefling race and we could steal hooks from Bhael Thuras lore.
Slavery would be a distant second or third. I'd like to make clear that Za-Renn is a federation of aligned businessmen and women. I'd like to avoid having them viewed as the Zhents or Red Wizards of Kara-Tur. While you could find parallels with the Zhents within the organization, it is highly democratic in nature. If an individual were to stand up and say, "I don't agree with this, and want no part in it." That would, for the most part, be acceptable. You can have people within the organization actively opposed to any policy. Just like in any democracy there are politics, and when elections come if you are unpopular enough you'll be removed.
I think when people use the word slavery, we immediately conjure up images of chattel slavery in our minds. Essentially that is a type of slavery which individuals are treated like animals (or worse). That's not likely what is going on in this case.
When I use the term slavery, I am referring to an individual who is forced into servitude, and is therefore considered unfree. This definition ranges from feudalism, a system in which an individual is a serf and tied to the land, all the way to conscription into a military organization.
When the Za-Renn engage in slavery, I don't envision it being similar to chattel slavery, although there is certainly room for that to take place. I envision the Za-Renn to view slaves as a valuable property, very similar to how you might view a peasant or a serf in feudalism.
When the Za-Renn get their hands on an individual who is destined for slavery, they almost certainly undergo a "domestication" process. I somewhat eluded to this in my original post, when I first brought it up. (I called them "domesticated servants (aka slaves).")
These "domesticated servants" are then likely viewed as unskilled labor. They're likely taught enough of the common tongue to communicate with individuals, taught proper etiquette when dealing with "non-domesticated servants", and then given enough skills to carry out some basic duties. The duties may range from working on a farm, working in a mine, how to provide pleasure in a brothel, trained as gladiators, or trained to be mercenaries. Some may even be treated as indentured servants, and be required to work off a certain "debt" after which they'd be allowed to go free.
In the end, it really runs the gambit and depends on the individual business. My point is I think it is a mistake to simply immediately jump to the conclusion that all slavery engaged in by the Za-Renn is chattel slavery (and therefore evil). You can be good aligned and still own slaves, the primary example of this is Mulhorand and the Church of Horus-Re. Slavery (the state of being unfree) is determined by law / chaos. The good / evil aspect of slavery comes into play based on how you treat them. You can have a slave, and still be good aligned, so long as you treat them very well.
For example, I love my cat dearly, and treat her very well, but by definition she is a slave because she is unfree and I dictate how she may live her life. The same can be true in the case of the Osslanders and the Za-Renn. From the prospective of some within the Za-Renn they could view their actions as highly benevolent. After all, the Osslanders are by their standards savages, and endure difficult primitive lives. Stepping in and "enforcing" civilization upon them could be seen as a kind thing to do from their prospective, especially if a system develops that is very similar to feudalism.
It is no different for a lord in feudalism. You have an individual who is a peasant or serf. He or she is tied to the land, and owned by a lord. The serf is considered part of the land, and if the land were to be sold the individual would be sold with it. They live their entire lives under the rule of their lord, who for all intents and purposes has the potential to control every aspect of their life from picking their mate, to what skills they'd be trained in. However, the good or evil aspect only comes into play when the lord is either kind or cruel. If the lord is generous to his serfs, treating them well and takes care of them, then he is considered good. If he is harsh, treats them badly, and frequently punishes them harshly for little or no reason he is considered evil.
The same is true in this case.
Some sort 'thing' that allows one to access the 'Dreamtime' more easily. At first I thought about crytstals... but thats a little too 'psionic' for this.
Then I thought about siome sort of rare, native plant that would work in the same way as Spice from the Dune trilogy. A poppy, or maybe some sort of bamboo shoots, or even a type of algae that only grows in the steamy, sulpherous swamps. However we spin it, the 'Dreamtoxin' (Oneirium?) should be something fairly rare, valuable, and onlt avaialble in Osse, and would make a suitable currency for both the natives and the various humanoids.
Perhaps the algae (I'm leaning toward that one because I'm unaware of any similar usage) is package in small bags, and the all rates of exchange would be based on the algae amount.
In other words, suppose one 'dose' = 1 ounce of the substance. Now if we say that 1 ounce = GP elsewhere, we have a very easy cross-rate to work with for pricing.
Now, natives don't have to always exchange the actuial substance - if 2 chickens are worth one ounce, but five ounces is worth one cow, then one native knows that he can get 10 chickens for his one cow in trade.
Capiche? :D
It also gives us a unique 'magical' substance we can play around with and create some rules for (for sleep and dream enhancement, naturally). It would work similar to Soma in Vedic traditions, but would be more about dreaming then sleeping, and it would be inhaled, rather then drunk (making it more 'druglike', and also having addictive properties over time. In fact, Oneira-snorters can be recognized by the tell-tale rings of green around their nostrils.
-Concerning money, I figure that Oslander Humans are fairly communistic in nature, when it comes to taking care of their own tribes. Tribe members look out for each other, share what they need to share and do what they need to do, for the good of the tribe. When different tribes meet, that's where money and such comes in. I figured that commerce was mainly based on trade, like what MT said- this is worth a this, two of these is worth this, blah, blah, blah. I wasn't going to make a static list, because there'd be plenty of differentiation (for example, a tribe living in the desert would "pay" more for animal hides, where such animals are nonexistent, than a tribe living where such animals are plentiful), but I guess handling things on a case-by-case basis would be a pretty big pain in the ass.
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-Has a final name for the sea race been determined? I am putting together an index, and "Naga-like sea creatures" isn't going to do it. :P
I am totally in favor of the idea of such a substance existing.
Allow me to add to it: Oneirium is a special toxin found in certain Ossland plants, similar to how Omega 3 is often found in fish. Oneirium has an addictive quality, similar to nicotine. The source of this strange toxin seems to be the various spirits native to Ossland. (As in certain spirits seem to favor certain plants, and those plants seem to have the highest traces of Oneirium.)
When an individual consumes enough Oneirium, either through eating a plant containing the substance, or burning it as incense (inhaling), they enter into a comatose state. This state allows them to slip into Dreamtime. However, Oneirium is only required for those without the ability to access Dreamtime naturally, some individuals seem more predisposed to entering Dreamtime at will.
I would treat Dreamtime as something very similar to Tel'aran'rhiod in the Wheel of Time, which in turn seems to be loosely based off similar concepts drawn from Australia's Aborigines.
Dreamtime: Known as the "Unseen World" is a world or place, glimpsed in dreams, which is believed by the peoples of Osseland to permeate and surround all places, times and peoples of the world. Many can enter the Dreamtime for a few moments in their normal dreams, but few have ever had the ability to enter it at will. However, it is widely known that certain plants and substances allow one to do so easily at will. Unlike normal dreams, what happens to living things in Dreamtime is real; a wound taken there still exists on awakening, and one who dies there does not wake at all. Otherwise, though, nothing done there affects the waking world in any way.
The geographical reality in Dreamtime is dependent on the waking world, but its contents can be and are altered by the worlds of non-sleeping people. Those things which are sedentary in the waking world - buildings, furniture, mountains, forests - tend to stay put in the Dreamtime, but things that move or see regular use - weapons, tools, clothing - are much harder to find, and may disappear from the hand even if discovered. All reality is mutable in the Dreamtime; those inside it can alter themselves and the world around them, achieving such tricks as instant wardrobe changes, creation of scenery, objects, flight, levitation, instant travel across huge distances, and so forth. These tweaks are often subconscious, and it takes a certain amount of concentration to control them and prevent them. Skilled Dreamwalkers (those who regularly enter the Dreamtime) can also impose their creations upon other people, often with frightening and, if desired, lethal results: injuries taken in the Dreamtime are reflected in the waking world. Also, only wild animals (and humans) can enter this world - if the animal was wild but later domesticated, they can no longer enter.
Normal people occasionally visit the Dreamtime through their dreams, generally flitting in and out in only a few seconds without ever realizing it. most of them come to no harm, but those few who do fall off a building, or drown in a river, never wake up. Others, specifically Dreamwalkers, can enter Dreamtime at will and are far more adept at manipulating its nature.
There are also secret rituals that allow an individual to enter into the Dreamtime in the flesh. This is considered an abomination by most, as those who enter in the flesh apparently experience a massive increase in the power over Dreamtime and the waking world; with the ability to accomplish such feats as gravity manipulation and even unraveling reality.
It is widely believed that souls that are not reincarnated become part of the Dreamtime by many Osslanders.
Has a final name for the sea race been determined? I am putting together an index, and "Naga-like sea creatures" isn't going to do it. :P
Tindrraynggwa (Tin-drain-gwa)
(Click the name for the link.)
-On Dreamtime: The Region of Dreams (Plane of Dreams) exists in the Manual of the Planes, and will have to be read about (by myself) and incorporated.
-On the major races: Right now, I have listed four major races living on Osse- Bullywug, Humans, Kodingobold, and Tindrraynggwa. I am thinking of adding in one more race, to insert in the mountains/volcanoes. Goliaths, I am tenativley thinking, because they already exist, which means less work creating things from scratch. Anyone else object to their vehemently existence and/or can think of something better? Including them, we would also be able to give Goliath actual Realmsian origins, as opposed to the large skirting of the issue in 3e and 4e.
In large deals, or inter-tribal (or inter-racial) exchanges, some Oneirium may be used, but its usually considered to valuable for actual trade.
Think of it as the fantasy equivalent of our 'Gold Standard'.
If tribe 'A' has 30 bushels of barley (worth 1 ounce of Oneirium each, or one 'Oneir'), and tribe 'B' has 6 cows to trade them for it, then it would be a fair rate of exchange. Its just a common standard used to figure-out relative costs - everything goes by it's worth in Oneirs (ounces of Oneirium).
The reason for this (rather then straight barter) is that in some areas certain things are worth more, while in other areas (perhaps where the Bullywugs live) Oneirium is available (although not common) but other resources are hard to come by.
Hence, over time, a substance that is considered valuable by all becomes the standard (just as gold has on our modern earth, even though people very rarely exchange any gold).
I don't like the idea of it being in several differnt plants. perhaps there could be a weaker, toxic version (the one that causes the addiction), but the 'pure' form is the one in the Algae from the Sulpher swamps (or wherever). Thats the one that is super-valuable, and the one that most dream-Shamans would keep to themselves (common folks have tom use the more dangerous variety).
There could be entire tribes of 'druggees' (Algae-eaters) that babble and halucinate and have taken to raiding other tribes (Fantasy dirt-bags... or Somalian Pirates? :P)
I think it also needs a 'street name'. Oneirium (which I made-up after doing a search of 'Greek word for Dream') sounds like the technical term, and we need a more... lowlife... sounding name for it.
Something like 'grach' (after the hacking noise made by those with a bad addiction - their windpipes have become damaged). I was going through some fantasy-drug names in my head, along with slang-terms for pot, and I really couldn't think of any good ones.
-Hmm...Looking up some street nicknames for marijuana...All of these sound somewhat "Osseish":
Bo Bo Bush
Dinkie Dow
Djamba
Doradilla
Juja
Zambi
Anyhow, looking at other fantasy and SciFi drugs, I think I prefer something monosyllabic (especially considering the primitiveness of the people). Two syllables at most (we also have to type this over and over again, mind you, and as a map-maker I've learned an appreciation for small names).
For some reason 'Troma' (like 'coma', or 'Soma') keeps popping into my head, but considering thats a craptastic film company's name I don't know if we'd want the affiliation.
Then again, Surf Nazis must Die! was a classic. :D
Of those you have there, I think just 'Jamba' is best (dropping the that first 'D').
'Jamba Root' sounds real.
I'm starting to mentally put-togther the economics and chemical associations of this stuff (based on my real-world expertise....... don't ask). I'm leaning toward Meldread's suggestion now, with some tweaking. It can be gotten from a couple of different plants, but the process of 'refining' it (and making it much less toxic) is a secret held by the Dreamwalkers (Osse Shaman). It would be a long and 'mystical' process, including much nonsense that really doesn't have much effect at all on the refinement (meant to confuse those trying to learn the secret.) However, the final ritual of 'cleansing' should be held under a full moon, when the veil between the waking world and that of sleep is at it's thinnest (thats just a flavor-bit for us, but should be the only non-alchemical part of the processing that is real).
Refined Oneirium could be fairly safe in moderate doses, which is why the Shaman tend to last longer then the casual users (who usually just chew on the poisonous plant leaves).
The Algae would be the purest natural form, and why the Bullywug swamps are much sought-after (much to the disamay of the Bullywugs).
Running with this, it starts to become obvious that this substance is actually something in the soil of Osse. It could be something that was thrown into the air from the bowels of Osse centuries past when the volcano(s) exploded, and has since seeped into the ground. Taking it from the ground would be an impossible task (except for certain plants), but the back-story is a good plothook - there could be a Humongous supply of this stuff somewhere deep below ground (at least, that will be the rumour - DMs can decide if such is true in their games).
Running even further with this concept, we can easilly connect it to the 'Osse God' (Earth-mother/father figure). Perhaps this Oneirium is actually the ash left from their burning god when he was destroyed/wounded by the meteor?
At this point, it's sounding a little like the what the Warlock Knighs of Vassa have going on, but going the 'drug' route rather then 'magical metal' route. That makes me think that the Osse God (I'm really leaning toward 'Earthfather' just to be different, or perhaps even 'Dreamfather'?) is/was a primordial. On the other hand, it could be the meteor itself was the primordial (now it's REALLY sounding like the WKoV), which slammed into Osse and damaged it's 'consciousness'. Then the coral could be what's left of the continents 'mind'.
Either way. the Oneirium then becomes an organic component - literally the remnants of their god's body (A Dream Primordial? That has possibilites).
Anyhow, just more 'musings' on my part.
If the vulcanic acitivity on Osse has cycles of activity on a frequency determined by the sentience, its better for a colonisation project that the continent's center lies dormant at the present. The scale of the catastrofy for a settlement on the furtile vulcanic areas only to be actively wiped away with fiery earth and searing duststorms would be massive.
Excellent - I like the cyclic idea; very "we're all doomed anyway", so fitting. I like the concept that the natives are fatalistic.
But the reason I want some sort "lost civilisation" is only to enable places that can be looted by PC's. A place where they can port those goods back to Kara-Tur for the Za-Renn's profit makes the disconnection of the party to an economy no problem. So the portal hub of the Za-Rennis certainly a good way to keep the players connected to a flow of gold. I think the best way to make Osse a playable area is to actually already have competing settlers in place that both have to race for the resources of the continent.
Dead-on.
Ruins are essential for a gaming environment. We don't need to have some prior 'Uber-civilization' - the creator races (or rather, their creations) we discussed originally work just as well. The port of Stromreach in Xen'Drik makes a most-excellent template for what we need here. An unknown continent is all well and good for adventurers, but they need a place to recover and buy supplies (nothing as extensive as Stormreach, of course - more like Stormreach meets Port Royal :D ).
How would one envision trade on Osse, does it exist at all? Would they even mint gold and silver? What could work as a exchange for debts among the Charr for example?
They idea of Obsidian weapons and an Athas-like tech for the Charr is just awesome. between the ruins, the Charr stuff, and the new, 'mystical drug' (which is becoming fashionable elsewhere), I think we have our economy covered without having to go full-bore into slavery. I can see 'Jamba Plantations' using local labor, but more like a 'sharecropper' arrangement (which works-out being similar to slavery, but certainly not the same).
The low subsistence level hints to hardly any trade between the scattered and divided Osslanders. I think it might be interesting if some of the native Osslanders are made into hardy, wary and pessimistic folk who have learned through competition with the Charr, those Nagafolk and other monstrous humanoids of Osse that they have to strike fear into your neighbours and actively aquire their resources.
This is where I got my concept for the people - I really like this take and just have to give you credit for it. Some tribes will try to rise to the challenge, while others succumb to the pointlessness of it all (proably those tribes with bad drug problems). Either way, they all have that 'doom & gloom' thing going on.
I got the impression the Osslander seem to fit the goblin niche in fantasy literature on the continent, scurrying between the more warlike and naturally adapted races of the inlands of Osse. Being the opportunistic kind of hunters that prefer to steal the spoils of war of another.
This is where I must give you the most credit - it was this one paragraph that really got my mind working down this path, and how I came-up with the whole 'Dream-Drug Addiction'.
Up until the point when 'the Outsiders' arrived, humans WERE the goblins of Osse. No real threat to the others - just a nuisance that needed to be 'chased-off' time to time. At first Ossie Humans would have looked at the foriegners as 'gods' because of their tech and intelligence, but in the past twenty years (give-or-take) many of the coastal tribes (especially in the west) have learned a measure of self-respect, and are no longer allowing the other peoples of Osse to look down their noses at them.
The Osselanders are finally geting pride (something they may have had in the distant past, if we decide humans once had a more-advanced civilization).
I see the "money making" Osslander shaman would likely be the leaders of their respective tribes, and be of the more aggresive type always seeking more ways to aquire more Jamba plants.
This is what I picture the shaman look like. Notice the greenish skin, perhaps causes by extended dreamwalking and large and prolonged Jamba use. They would use dreamwalk powers in combination with their knowledge on poisons to enhance their warparties and confound their enemies, and would likely pack a punch with (stolen) charr-enchanted obsidian weapons.
We have moved away from the whole 'Aussie clone' and are taking the theme to exciting and extreme new directions. Love that picture, and the idea that the skin will eventually take-on the coloration.
The following is a drug-retrieval chart by weight. Listed is the source, which part is used, and how much is needed to distill one gram of Oneirium. Also listed in order with rarest first.
Baji Foam, entire Algae, 28 grams (1 ounce) makes 7 grams
Wapa-Yandi, flower, 28 ounces makes 1 gram
Gariguu, stalks of plant, 1 lb (16 ounces) makes 1 gram
Jamba, leaves of plant, 2.2 lbs (1 Kilo) makes 1 gram
1 gram = 1 dose. Doses required (subject to future modification):
1 = light headedness and mild feelings of euphoria
2 = disorientation and heavy feelings of euphoria
3 = mild halucinations
4 = heavy halucinations and possible unconsciusness
5 = passes-out during halucinations (dream-visions), enters dream-state
Higher doses in a 24-hour periosd could mean coma (stuck in Dream-world) or even death. For Shaman (and others), ritualistic dancing and chanting allows the user to fall into a meditative-state and then enter the dreamtime. This should require a Feat (although I'm not sure of the beenfits yet) or class ability, and would be required for any of the more powerful dream-magic. Obviously, going by the above, you can see why most outsiders would want to hire adventurers to 'steal' the stuff from inland sources, rather then create the far-less profitable Jamba plantations (Jamba is the only one of the four that grows easilly on the coasts). Other sources are possible (all plant-life on Osse contains trace amounts), but the amount required to produce just a single dose is just too inefficient to be worth the trouble. However, that means that anyone staying on Osse for a prolonged period would start experiencing lucid dreaming that seems very real - much more so then when dreaming elsewhere.
I'm thinking that the Dream magic is based on Illusions (which are real to the victim, or 'dreamer'). While the most common magic of this sort enter's into the victime's dreams, more potent (higher level) spells will be able to reach into the Dreamtime and pull 'Nightmares' into the real world at the command of the caster. These will still be illusions, but completely real unless dis-believed, and the chance to disbelieve will be based on the sender's level (much harder to disbelieve a dream-creature then a regular illusion).
This is a VERY basic premise, and needs a lot of work. Basically, 1 gram goes for 1 GP on the open market (which makesit ideal as a trade-medium). Prices will fluctuate, of course, depending on source and where purchased. You may be able to procure some fairly cheap from an inland tribe who isn't used to the concept of trade yet. Coinversely, the stuff could go for 3-5 GP a gram in K-T, and as much as 10 GP in Faerûn!
The very small size makes it easy to transport, and well-worth the travel and effort to those trying to make a business out of the 'latest craze in the North'. Carrying just one pound of this stuff back to Waterdeep will net you 4500 GP!
Of course, that is... IF you make it back.
Was even thinking the more powerful shaman can mentally dominate whole villages by spiking their watersupplies with soluble jamba. With the population addicted to the oneirium he can more easily mentally direct them. Some villages have lived for so long in such a Dreamstate that the inhabitants merely walk about their business in a euforic drone like state. When agitated a whole village seems to go beserk at the same time, each tribe member old, young and infirm practically lusting for the blood of an intruder.
Some shaman might have devised some sort of ritual that creates massive dreamstones (Yap money circles) made from the stuff of nightmares. Such circles enhance the dreamwalk powers of shaman a bit like a hallow or unhallow effect. Perhaps even whole nightmarestone cities used to exist but most were wiped by some great catastrofy in the dreamworld after the "death" of the primordial.
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Which creator race would have had a hand on this remote continent? Very interesting question which could be answered in a several ways.
The orginal online copy of the Grand History of the Realms had the mega continent Merrouroboros seperated from the proto continent of Osse. This might indicate the Sarruhk could have had technology to cross seas to have colonised Osse, which I see as highly likely. Dragons can have settled this remote place sometime after the Dragonfall Wars.
Perhaps there where no Creator Races for a long time and only the scouts that got sent to Osse were stranded. This might have created the Tindrayngwa of the mixing of the struggling yuanti and naga scouts over in Osse.
Humans might are likely to have been through the same, being stranded ancient Karaturans or Zakharans.
Just going through RotW last night again (my newest aquistion), and I really think the Raptorrans work well here - better then they would have in Malatra or Kara-Tur.
Since we are avoiding the normal demi-human races, the Raptorrans fit the 'Elf' niche pretty well, especially considering their back-story and their language (which is based on Elven).
I'm thinking, perhaps, Derro for Osse. Duergar are used pretty heavilly in Faerûn, and the Derro are are weird-enough to go here. Besides, those big, saucer-like eyes practically scream 'drugee'. :D
However, the Osse Derro should be 'tainted' (moreso then usual), and perhaps give them dream-powers over psionic (Dream-Derro?).
There is also the possibility of some of those variant races (I can't seem to find what book they were in - weren't there some type of 'dreaming gnome', or some such?)
To the Osslanders, the land is alive and sentient. The spirits protect or punish those who do harm to it, and are the voice and heralds of the land. To them the spirits are gods.
The truth is that many millennia ago Osse was an unsettled wilderness with very little intelligent life. It was discovered by a mysterious sect of druids who hated civilization. They viewed civilization as an abomination, something that allowed intelligent species to develop ways to unnaturally prolong their lives, **** the land, and create artificial environments that protected them from their natural predators.
These druids, much like the Witches of Rashemen, awoke the spirits of the land. This cult of druids was led by four immortal and extremely powerful arch-druids. The arch-druids foresaw a time when civilization would overrun the world, and resolved to become the protectors of Osse, to preserve it from the taint of civilization for all time.
And so, they created the Dreamtime, a strange place that borders the sleeping and spirit world. They wove themselves into the fabric of this Dreamtime, and it is there they lay dormant for hundreds or thousands of years.
The trap created by the druids was simple. When an intelligent race would settle upon Osse, they'd eventually stumble upon the Oneirium plants. The addictive quality of the plants ensured a dependence, and as such, continued use. This allows the druids to monitor the progress of the intelligent species of Osse.
There is also a darker side to the Oneirium plants. Over time, as one begins to use it more and more, they begin to hear a subtle whisper that they can't ignore, and it compels them to do things without knowing why. Over weeks, perhaps months, the subject stops thinking for themselves and just obeys, eventually becoming a mindless servant, seemingly showing signs of extreme addiction to the drug. In reality the whispers heard are the arch-druids.
Once the whispers are heard, the mental damage is severe and permanent. Only people with immense mental strength are able to resist, and even then, only for a short time.
All of this is part of a scheme to keep intelligent life on Osse in a constant primitive or "natural" state. It is part of a cycle that has been repeating itself for millennia. At the point intelligent life is deemed too far advanced to continue on is unclear, but once the Arch-Druids decide the time is right, the subsequent destruction is of biblical proportions.
While the druids cannot leave the Dreamtime, they are still capable of influencing the waking world. The sentient coral reef, volcano, and sandstorm are all minor displays of their power. They are effectively invincible in the waking world, and are capable of unleashing any sort of natural horror on truly massive scales. In order to defeat the druids, and end the cycle, one would have to enter Dreamtime physically and stop them there. When the last druid is killed, Dreamtime itself will also be destroyed. The Oneirium plant will be reduced to nothing more than an addictive drug.
There have been many attempts to colonize Osse throughout its long history. All have failed because of the Druids. Once civilization has been thrown back into the Stone Age, all evidence of what happened is erased, until the cycle repeats itself again.
The ruins that are found littered throughout Osse are the ancestral remnants of those who once tried to establish civilization there.
As well, the widespread belief in reincarnation is likely tied to this cyclical cleansing of the continent.
As for those races I was looking for - they were in Races of Stone. The Dream Dwarf practically forces itself on us, and the whisper-gnome also fits with the nihilistic attitudes of the local humans - they're all about stealth and suspician.
One other from that tome worth mentioning is the Stonechild (hate the name, although Stonedchild sounds like it belongs here :P ). Because they are creatures that are part human, part earth-elemental, they could be a good fit. Since they're made of stone, they could make an interesting 'Basalt Warrior'. I'd definately give them some aboriginal-sounding name instead (use 'Stonechild' as the nickname coined by foreigners).
Just a few stray thoughts : I don't really like putting the normal demi-humans here, but those Dream Dwarfs are just too perfect flavor-wise.
Just a few stray thoughts : I don't really like putting the normal demi-humans here, but those Dream Dwarfs are just too perfect flavor-wise.
-Perhaps I'll use them instead of Goliath.
Evil Dream Dwarves* enslaving Goliath
Evil Goliath enslaving Dream Dwarves
*They are mentioned as being usually NG, but when Derro were mentioned earlier, I now can get out of my head the concept of amoral Dwarves using mysical/psionic powers to 'force' the secrets of dreaming and all of that out of the minds of others, to better understand it themselves.
Basically, anyone who is not a dwarf is considered a 'lesser being', and therefore aren't given the same treatment as as a Dwarf. Not evil for evil's sake, but more along the lines of self-serving jerks.
I like Goliaths for here... they are just weird-enough to be a good fit (Goatball?)
Perhaps those Basalt Warriors (Stonechildren) are a tribe of humans that have be gifted with 'Earthpowers' and are trying to hep the Goliaths?
I wouldn't want a whole lot of them, but a single tribe that believe they have been 'divinely changed' for some greater purpose would be cool (even if their change was really just a magical accident.
In fact... I'm now considering giving them a really different spin... one similar to the Bloodgaurd of the Thomas Covenant novels. A sort-of fraternal order with a set number, who have been 'tasked' with some greater purpose. When one dies, some of them travel into a village (or to a nomadic tribe) and choose a child (they are never refused, not even by evil tribes), and then the child is taken to some 'holy site' within the caldera and 'changed'.
They would travel about Osse seeking to keep the order of things, similar to how Druids or rangers behave in other settings (basically, by merging with Osse itself, they become it's care-takers).
Watcha think?
I like Goliaths for here... they are just weird-enough to be a good fit (Goatball?)
-I got Garokk in my head. (Garokk, for those who don't know.) He looks like how always envision Goliath. The entire evil spirit volcano made me think Garokk, and then thinking Goliath who, instead of bleeding, have lava inside of them, also made me think Garokk.
Here's a pic of those, for reference:
-As for the air element, it was some kind of storm. And, for the earth, we've got nothing, really. I'm still kinda wishy-washy on that both, though, so if you can think of anything else, be my guest. A sandstorm would be mixing earth and air, but for now, I want to keep the two separate- that's also very reminiscent of Calim's disembodied sentience in the Calim Desert.
-Actually, for the earth manifestation now, I am thinking something in the mudpots, a la Borem.
I wouldn't get into the quasi-planes, and Magma just seems to fit our model well.
The entire concept of 'Elder Evils' comes from the ParaElemental Planes, originally.
I really like the concept, but can you imagine the carnage an evil cleric of Bane or Cyric would bring when encountering such pacificsts?
I really like the concept, but can you imagine the carnage an evil cleric of Bane or Cyric would bring when encountering such pacificsts?
-That's why the island they inhabit, the Island of Dreams, is heavily warded against intruders. Those who do not possess the knowledge to bypass the wards placed by the spirits, or tokens allowing them to freely pass become hopelessly lost, and can only find what they are looking for, or a way out, at the whim of the spirits.
-Have you ever played Final Fantasy VII? Think Sleeping Forest (which, unintentionally, sounds like the Forest of Dreams).
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-Meldred, since you created those Tindrraynggwa, I'm not even going to touch them. I'm going to get working on those Dream Dwarves, next. I'm looking for some ideas...Basically, the concept I have in mind right now is that the Dream Dwarves were once Duergar. At some point after the Duergar were created, a specific individual (or group of individuals) made "contact" with the Plane of Dreams. Using their psionic powers to "contact" it once more, they became "addicted" with it, losing themselves in the Plane of Dreams. This was very unDuergar like, however, so they fled whatever Duergar bastion they originally came from. For years, they wandered the Underdark, using their Psionic powers to make "contact" with the Plane of Dreams. At some point, one among them discovered something about Osse, and how the mountains (having some kind of "dreamstone mineral") there made it easier to "contact" the Plane of Dreams (maybe something like how crystal helps with divinations, or whatever), prompting them to go to Osse. The mountains were already inhabited by Goliath, that the Dream Dwarves used their Psionic powers to enslave and put into bondage, for the purpose of mining "dreamstones" and such from the mountains. The Dream Dwarves aren't evil, per se, but are amoral. They, as a society, seek to forever lose themselves in the Plane of Dreams, becoming lucid dreams, of sorts, and see enslaving the Goliath and such as something that simply needs to be done.
-Very jumbled, I know, but...It's a working concept, right now.
-I'm actually just want to leave that island "blank", with just forest canopy and jungle. It's a very mysterious place, that, because of the wards, is constantly changing in appearance, that has no set locations or anything, other than the boundaries of the island. The Kodingobold have a village in there somewhere, but only they know. People have tried going in to explore, but they only find what the Kodingobold want them to find, if anything. It's probably larger on the inside than it's physical size allows, due to magic. Who's to say? Only them, and they're not telling.
-Though, as not to let the work you've done go to waste, that can certainly be the geography of the island before the Kodingobold arrived, and warded it and altered it and all of that.
-I hadn't named the island yet, and calling it 'Kodingobold Island' hadn't ever even occurred to me. It's simple, to the point, and works.
-What is that font, by the way? I like it.
The names of everything were just place-holders (and I did mention that in the notes at deviantART).
I started that island first, before you even metioned the Forest of Dreams, and only just added the last few details this morning. Rather then trying to complete any part of the continent, I meant to use THAT as an example of how much more detail the map would need.
Once you started talking about the Forest and Kodingobolds, I was going to switch to the northern island, and then just said F-it and figured I'd do that next (which I am).
I can make any changes you want - thats just a WIP.
-With the map, you already have a rough sense of what the place is going to look like. The little embellishments, like rivers, or (smallish) lakes, or hills, or whatever else, feel free to throw in to get that 'realistic' effect. Just, with the Forest of Dreams, and the forest on Osse's northeast tip, leave those 'blank', with jungle, but no fillers. With the Forest of Dreams, it's supposed to be all mysterious, and with the one at the top, it's supposed to be extremely thick, dark, and savage. With the other jungles, go ahead and add embellishments, if you see fit, that's fine.
Nice write-up though.
). Then you could have a variant of the Longtooth Shifter that has the weredevil as an ancester.
I was thinking to make use of mesozoic mammals as inspiration for the animal life on Osse. These proto mammals would have grown to large and huge sizes on the abundant vulcanic plantlife. There would also be a lack of dire animals, whose niche would have been taken by soot, magma, crystalline or sand variant of the canodonts and mastodonts. These would have some sort of (para-)elemental traits and be on the top of the (mammalian) foodchain in the more inhospitable locations of Osse. Traits such as being able to consume and contain some parts of the landscapes such as superheated mudpools, cystalline forests, plains of molten sand or windswept obsidian plateaus.
Huge flightless birds on Osse might have evolved because the avian animals are likely to have existed the longest on the difficult to settle continent of Osse. Such a place is easier to reach by flight but the subsequent abundancy of plantlife of the furtile grounds of Osse might have grown the avians to great sizes and even degenerated their wings to vestigial state. Some might have become quite cunning and would not have the typical flight bahaviour as fearunian birds but have a healthy respect for magic using humanoids.
How about a variant of werewolf called a weredevil, as in tasmanian devil (no, not the Bugs Bunny kind
The Ossian demon sounds better, if only to bring it a little further away from the RW derivation.
Great idea, though.
I'm thinking a Barghest was brought-over from the Realm of Nightmares (which has several connections to the Abyss), and the resulting tieflings have become their own group in Osse (the place sure as hell is big enough for this many intelligent creatures). Ergo the 'Ossian Demon' is a fiendish type of Shifter.
Other Stuff:
I'm fond of Dire Animals, but I plan on using quite a few in the Taan and Ama Basin (northern K-T) regions, so going a different route here is something I can easilly agree on.
Like the giant, angry Dodo Bird idea as well.
Suin: Already got emu (and dire emu!), but I can't believe I didn't include dodo. Hell, one of the small little islands around Osse could be "Dodo Island", or something like that...Though, we'll need a new name, other than 'dodo'. Concerning large animals, I am thinking, why would creatures evolve like that? The larger the animal, the more it needs to eat to sustain itself. A lot of Osse is barren, or flat grassland. Things that can eat grass don't need to grow large in order to find foodstuff. Things that can't eat grass, but eat other plants don't have the capacity to, with food (trees, et al.) being few and far between in some spots of the savannah.
MT: The Plane of Nightmares, I didn't even think of incorporating parts of it. It only makes sense, with the Plane of Dreams being so important to various cultures living on the island continent. I don't have any of the sources, and relying only on THIS. Anyone who has the sources, is there more to it than what is described at Planewalker? All in all, it doesn't sound like a hard place to imagine, but...Just want to be careful and make sure.
The reason why I think that is a perfect fit for Osse (and perhaps that region actually came from FR originally?) is because there is a group of aboriginie-like people that live there called the Abber Nomads.
The name for of those people is 'lost in time', but I have theorized (in other threads) that they were the Ossians that became part of Abeir's reality when the worlds were split, and at some point there land was pulled into Ravenloft. The fact that that particular domain is a shifting-landscape lends itself well to the whole 'Earthmote thing' that Abeir is famous for.
And c'mon... Aberr Nomads... Abier Nomads... that just too easy.... ;)
Making them available in FR. Think Wolverine, or some of his more feral kinfolk (Wildchild, Sabertooth, Wolfsbane, Feral, etc...)
Your basic athletic barbarian taking to an extreme (wherein the 'rage' actually turns you into an animal).
Its a pretty cool... and OLD... concept.
Edit: Any ideads for a centaurian race? Tauroid Aboriginies sound kinda cool, but the man/horse thing has been beaten to death in FR already (we have both desert and tundra variants in Zakhara and the Taan). I was thinking 'Roo-girls' again, but that is a bit silly.
Considering the prevalance of crocs in the RW version, the followers of Sebek (Were-Crocodiles) should be a given, but they are not Tauric 9and a versin like that is a little too weird... even for here. I'm trying to find Equine's unique to Aussie, but all I've come-up with thus far is the African Wild Ass... and thats just not usable...
Edit2: I just found something called a Tomb Bat! We have SO got to use those...
Edit3: There's also a Ghost Bat!!!
Aside from that - something 'primal' for the body of water between Katshaka and Osse.
Did you read my last post in the Utter East thread? :D
SAME thing - I decided that these projects become overly ambitious, and perhaps the '4e method' would work best.
Excrutiating detail is all well and good, but becomes a bit of a bear (as you well know with the Elves of Faerûn project), and winds-up turning the project(s) into a never-ending quest for completeion.
Ergo, a small guide-book, like an atlas with a few FRCG-style entries would be the best way to go.
Once 'published', these netbooks can be added-to with items, NPCs, Feats, PrCs, etc, etc... but at least people will have something to work with for now. For instance, I'm thinking the Utter East one will be only about twenty pages (of text) or so, to start.
-Does anyone have anything to expand on specific items, or want to introduce a couple of new things (since listed only are like three or four things)?
this thread. I was thinking on suggesting using locatah as a native race to Osses lakes and seas. Need to collect my thoughts on rereading this excellent thread though.
Diaboli are a peaceful and philosophical fiendish race that migrated from a distant world that was close to the Plane of Dreams and the Far Realm to the Plane of Nightmares. During the pre-spellplagued era the Far Realm was ever more encroaching on the Plane of Dreams, which caused the Diaboli homeworld to become increasingly unstable. Most of the Diaboli subsequently became settlers on other Prime Material planes.
This huge migration could have resulted in the Diaboli finding permanent residence in Toril on Osse. Their appearance as demons is a cool twist for most games, as this will confuse most players on first contact. Their role as a more peaceful but magicly potent race can be usefull for DM's to include some "Points of Shade" and civilsation in the mostly barren and hostile environment of Osse.
Their chaotic mindset would serve them well on the dangerous continent that scours civilisations every once or twice in a millenia, as their technological and martial advancement is naturally slow which leads to them not needing much resources to sustain their villages. They can easily be recent immigrants aswell, coming to refill a niche left from an earlier settling race.
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Locatah are perhaps a bit too docile to have settled the dangerous continent of Osse. They lack the aggresive traits to outcompete those Naga-men and Tlrindraxils (sp.) Meldread suggested earlier.
I was thinking that Osse would also be a wonderful location to introduce therapsids (mammal-like reptiles) to Abeir-Tirol. The world continent of Pangaea had an arid desert in its interior during the Permian period making me think of the Australian Outback.
In this arid desert, we might find the following creatures in Osse:
Gorgonops, a gigantic carnivorous therapsid about the size of a rhinoceros, but with a sleek wolf-like body and long, sharp teeth that permitted it to chase and bring down animals that were much larger than itself.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gorgonops
Scutosauras, a therapsid plant eater that lived in semi-arid climates. Its bulky body was covered in bony lumps and protrusions. It had short, elephant-like legs, and a solid, muscular body.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scutosaurus
Australian Broadcasting Company website tie-in to the BBC "Walking With Beasts" documentary listing Australian beasts:
"Australian Beasts"
www.abc.net.au/science/ausbeasts/factfil...
Was there a PDF file that was generated for the final draft of "Project: Osse"? Or was this project just abandoned?
Abandoned.
And there was a thread like this on Candlekeep, also abandoned.