Spell Mantles - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Spell Mantles

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
byooki
Feb 17, 2009 22:05:51 So I've been reading over Ed Greenwood's works on Elminster and I have seen a lot of spell mantles (Spell Barriers) being used. Does anyone know the location or have any idea the rules for such a spell?

Thanks,
Byooki
#2
Vatras
Feb 18, 2009 13:19:00 I suppose you talk about the spells from Neverwinter Nights (PC game) for 3E, which had a lesser spell mantle, spell mantle, and greater spell mantle, which absorbed several spell levels before dissolving. The latter absorbed 1d12+10 levels and lasted for 1 round per level. All of these spells are personal.

In 4E, the concept does no longer make sense, but would curtail the divine and arcane classes in favor of all others, since all are now on the same level.
#3
EmpactWB
Feb 21, 2009 23:43:57 Yeah, I can't see this working. I had a thought that maybe treating it as an immediate interrupt daily utility power that negates a power of its level or lower when hit with it, but monster powers don't have levels associated with them. Which makes it fail when used on either side of the screen...

Maybe if it negates a single power from an opponent of the user's level or lower... I dunno, that seems either too good in the case of Solos or useless in the case of most anything else.
#4
Vatras
Feb 22, 2009 5:58:39 I have toyed around with ideas of how to negate attacks, but after some thought I left it alone.
My reasoning was thus: the various powers, especially the dailies, are the core of the characters now, and while it won't matter if I negate an at-will, it will take away fun, if I counter dailies.

There are monsters, though, who can suppress the use of powers, which you can find in H2: Thunderspire (enigma of Vecna), who can serve as guideline to design something in that direction.
#5
byooki
Feb 23, 2009 19:20:00 Thanks for your input. I'll check that out in Thunderspire
#6
keveras
Feb 25, 2009 14:09:54 You can find some 3e rules for Spell Mantles here.
#7
krownhunter07
Feb 25, 2009 18:13:36 There are existing powers in 4e that can simulate spell mantles.

Ex, for SW; Warding, Variable Defense

Wiz; Mage Armor, ele pro,...

There are more, but I'm sick and not really wanting to look.

Check out powers that are in the books, I'm sure you'll find more then enough to work the theme into 4e w/o too much trouble.
#8
faraer
Feb 25, 2009 18:39:00 The Netherese-derived mantle is detailed in Secrets of the Magister, and the Cormanthan mantle in an article in Dragon Annual #2, though both sources are only introductions to a complex area of magical crafting. Lost Empires of Faerûn presents a version of the Netherese mantle for 3E, based on the Spell Mantle and Craft Contingent Spell feats.

Mantles, of course, aren't merely protective, they're also advanced versions of spell trigger magics such as spelltouch, spell trigger, baldrics (see Secrets of the Magister again) and the Halruaan sash of spells.

I tend to doubt something so elaborate is suited for 4E, or that such a height of Art could have been reconstituted in the post-Spellplague century.
#9
markustay63
Feb 26, 2009 0:47:59 Ed gives us some magic-theory in this area in his annotations in the Annotated Elminster. Elven magic appears to have had had several 'levels' of this sort of 'field magic', from personal mantles to Drow Spellwebs to full-blown Mythals.

Basically, what you have here is field you set-up, probably using a defensive spell as a base, and then other spells (with contingencies) are layered on top.

Of course, I have no idea if thats of any help - I'm unfamiliar with 4e's magic system.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 byooki Feb 17, 2009 22:05:51	So I've been reading over Ed Greenwood's works on Elminster and I have seen a lot of spell mantles (Spell Barriers) being used. Does anyone know the location or have any idea the rules for such a spell? Thanks, Byooki
#2 Vatras Feb 18, 2009 13:19:00	I suppose you talk about the spells from Neverwinter Nights (PC game) for 3E, which had a lesser spell mantle, spell mantle, and greater spell mantle, which absorbed several spell levels before dissolving. The latter absorbed 1d12+10 levels and lasted for 1 round per level. All of these spells are personal. In 4E, the concept does no longer make sense, but would curtail the divine and arcane classes in favor of all others, since all are now on the same level.
#3 EmpactWB Feb 21, 2009 23:43:57	Yeah, I can't see this working. I had a thought that maybe treating it as an immediate interrupt daily utility power that negates a power of its level or lower when hit with it, but monster powers don't have levels associated with them. Which makes it fail when used on either side of the screen... Maybe if it negates a single power from an opponent of the user's level or lower... I dunno, that seems either too good in the case of Solos or useless in the case of most anything else.
#4 Vatras Feb 22, 2009 5:58:39	I have toyed around with ideas of how to negate attacks, but after some thought I left it alone. My reasoning was thus: the various powers, especially the dailies, are the core of the characters now, and while it won't matter if I negate an at-will, it will take away fun, if I counter dailies. There are monsters, though, who can suppress the use of powers, which you can find in H2: Thunderspire (enigma of Vecna), who can serve as guideline to design something in that direction.
#5 byooki Feb 23, 2009 19:20:00	Thanks for your input. I'll check that out in Thunderspire
#6 keveras Feb 25, 2009 14:09:54	You can find some 3e rules for Spell Mantles here.
#7 krownhunter07 Feb 25, 2009 18:13:36	There are existing powers in 4e that can simulate spell mantles. Ex, for SW; Warding, Variable Defense Wiz; Mage Armor, ele pro,... There are more, but I'm sick and not really wanting to look. Check out powers that are in the books, I'm sure you'll find more then enough to work the theme into 4e w/o too much trouble.
#8 faraer Feb 25, 2009 18:39:00	The Netherese-derived mantle is detailed in Secrets of the Magister, and the Cormanthan mantle in an article in Dragon Annual #2, though both sources are only introductions to a complex area of magical crafting. Lost Empires of Faerûn presents a version of the Netherese mantle for 3E, based on the Spell Mantle and Craft Contingent Spell feats. Mantles, of course, aren't merely protective, they're also advanced versions of spell trigger magics such as spelltouch, spell trigger, baldrics (see Secrets of the Magister again) and the Halruaan sash of spells. I tend to doubt something so elaborate is suited for 4E, or that such a height of Art could have been reconstituted in the post-Spellplague century.
#9 markustay63 Feb 26, 2009 0:47:59	Ed gives us some magic-theory in this area in his annotations in the Annotated Elminster. Elven magic appears to have had had several 'levels' of this sort of 'field magic', from personal mantles to Drow Spellwebs to full-blown Mythals. Basically, what you have here is field you set-up, probably using a defensive spell as a base, and then other spells (with contingencies) are layered on top. Of course, I have no idea if thats of any help - I'm unfamiliar with 4e's magic system.