Sure looks like one.
It looks like the city of Shade to me.
It's not.
-Spelljammer is the proverbial red-headed stepchild of 3e. It kind of ackowledges Spelljammer every so often, but refuses to outright acknowledge, or give support to it.
Hahah, so very true. We have seen, what.. a few racial updates.. hadooze and giff comes to mind. Oh yeah insectare and scro too :P
But as for actual spelljamming being supported, yeah.
since thats exactly how the dwarven citadels look. Dwarven face, and a fortress behind it, all on a otherwise unworked rock.
are we sure thats a dwarven face
-Spelljammer is the proverbial red-headed stepchild of 3e. It kind of ackowledges Spelljammer every so often, but refuses to outright acknowledge, or give support to it.
The entry for 623 DR in Grand History of the Realms acknowledges the actual existence of the 'Spelljammer' itself.
The entry for 623 DR in Grand History of the Realms acknowledges the actual existence of the 'Spelljammer' itself.
-As it would have to, as the Spelljammer itself is a part of Faerûnian lore, in regards to Queen Amlauril seeing it, the Nelanther Isles, and so on and so on. AGHotR is hardly the normal 3e supplement, however. The mention of the actual Spelljammer isn't exactly lending support to the concept of Spelljamming, either.
I always found it amusing that Netherease Enclaves resembled upside-down Dwarven Citadel-ships. Perhaps thats what lives on the underside, or maybe a lot of the enclaves didn't really hit the ground - they were transported to the Dawrven homeworld and recycled? :D
-That's a Neogi Spidership, or a really small Yuzhaan Vong Worldship, minus some of the 'decration'.
The mention of the actual Spelljammer isn't exactly lending support to the concept of Spelljamming, either.
Actually, it does. Brian once confirmed that the entry was a direct [and deliberate] spelljamming reference in 3e Realmslore. Additionally, it reinforces most of the vague spelljamming references that have been included previously in sources like Serpent Kingdoms for example.
That picture still looks all shadowy and Netherese to me, but I'll bow to those who know more about than myself. Hell, I've never so much as picked up one of those novels. I just read the gaming books.
Actually, it does. Brian once confirmed that the entry was a direct [and deliberate] spelljamming reference in 3e Realmslore.
-Being as that, at any point, the Spelljammer could be retconned into an "Astral Ship", like something the Githyanki/Githzeri use, a special Skyship, like something used in Halruaa, or something else entirely this isn't exactly a direct Spellamming reference. Now, if it said "The Spelljammer, the legendary Spelljamming vessel", then it would be...
Didn't the initial release on the spell-plague talk about how a veil was lifted from Selune showing cities on the moon? If so, that seems to indicate that spell-jamming is back.
-Correct, those illusions are gone. That doesn't exactly indicate that Spelljamming is back, however. Just off the top of my head, it could theoretically be written that people go back and forth via portals. In this situation, there is nothing about Spelljamming.
The absence of evidence is NOT evidence, at least not in this case. :P
I have a feeling they will be drastically changing it in 4e, because I don't believe the Phlogiston exists anymore. It will probably become some form of 'Sailing between worlds' inter-planar travel, through the Astral or perhaps the Shadowfel - there are some demon-made ships that do something similar, so I suppose the concept will be rolled into that.
Well, since it was never retconned out, and the official ruling is that EVERYTHING that was NOT over-written by new lore still exists, Spelljamming does indeed still exist in 3e.
The absence of evidence is NOT evidence, at least not in this case. :P
-No one said that it doesn't exist currently. Pay attention! :P
Helms, with their current prices make no sense.. unless making 125k gp/ adventure is ok? (looted major helm)
Much better to take off 90%.
Which still leaves some fun maths: (see birthright)
Citadel 50GB
Forge 25GB
Recruiting 2 units of dwarven x-bow & 2 units of dwarven guard 16GB
-> 91GB
Running costs 4*2 = 8 GB for troops
But income.. 5GB (as per 100 smiths, see SJ box)*7 (700 at work) *3 (3 months in a season) =105GB
A nice profit of 97GB/season
Looks like Baruk-Azhik can build another.. with just the profits.
Another two the season after that.. double yet again.. pretty soon ill have hundreds, if not thousands.
Adding in portals at 50k, or 25 GB, and you can start linking the whole empire of citadels.
Funny what 3rd edition does to your mind, never once was getting a citadel a viable idea under 2nd edition, too many dwarves etc.. tough to calculate the finances.. whatnot.. Now with prices in the clear, a whole empire of spacedwarves suddenly looks viable ;)
Oh yeah.. lets have rams on the citadels. Just call them orc and spider -obliterators. And why not a few items of ironwall at will too, helps when you dont risk running out of metal to work ;)
While at it, link portals to various customers, just to ease the trade. A portal to some planet with a athmosphere would be nice too. I mean, we are keeping 800 dwarves on a 700tn ship. Or hell, lets double the crew.. Its not like we couldnt afford the extra troops. Only risk now is running out of dwarves by which to crew the ships :D
I seriously doubt spelljamming is going to be emphasized in the 4E Realms (did Rich mention something to this effect?).
However, they did take back their license for Spelljammer from whoever had it, which seemed weird at the time. Now, with their "one setting per year" plan, it seems pretty obvious they will use it at some point in time - along with RL, which they also took back, and DL, which they were going to take back, but gave Weiss an extension (realizing that it will be two years out, after they do Eberron?)
Looking back over the past three years, you can discern a definate pattern as to what their plans were.
Last night I was reading through Magic of Faerûn (got it for $12 new!), and I came across something that made me think they may have been preparing for an FR overhaul way before they even speculated about 4th edition. I think the Spellplague may have been on on the back burner, and when 4e rolled around they took it out and dusted it off - check out Nchaser's entry on pg. 11.
"The coming Doom"?
That was mentioned back in '01.
Funny what 3rd edition does to your mind...
-Turns it into a well-oiled thinking machine.
Last night I was reading through Magic of Faerûn (got it for $12 new!), and I came across something that made me think they may have been preparing for an FR overhaul way before they even speculated about 4th edition. I think the Spellplague may have been on on the back burner, and when 4e rolled around they took it out and dusted it off - check out Nchaser's entry on pg. 11.
"The coming Doom"?
That was mentioned back in '01.
-Eh, people have been proclaiming doom and gloom for how long now? The Fall of Myth Drannor was supposed to be a harbinger for the end...
Countless others.
Oh yeah.. and that sublich of larloch and its plan for world domination.. sending hundreds of lichies to conquer the world, once more -foiled.
Actually, it does. Brian once confirmed that the entry was a direct [and deliberate] spelljamming reference in 3e Realmslore. Additionally, it reinforces most of the vague spelljamming references that have been included previously in sources like Serpent Kingdoms for example.
Now, if it said "The Spelljammer, the legendary Spelljamming vessel", then it would be...
I seriously doubt spelljamming is going to be emphasized in the 4E Realms (did Rich mention something to this effect?).
The entry in the Grand History for the Year of Nightsilver (623 DR) is a direct reference to *the* Spelljammer, not just any old spelljamming vessel. Sage is correct that this entry was a direct spelljamming reference (from the novel, The Radiant Dragon). Just as the dissolving of Leira's illusion covering the moon is a deliberate reference to spelljamming in the 4E realms.
-Neither are references to Spelljamming: They are references to elements of Spelljammer, (The civilization on Selûne and the mention of Queen Amlauril seeing the Spelljammer) that have become Realmslore, but are not outright references to Spelljammer.
-Your intentions might have been there, I am sure, but one word (A new concept such as "Astraljamming", perhaps) suddenly changes those references from nods at Spelljammer to something else. Which is the point I was making. Just like in the FRCS how the legends of ships traveling in the "Sea of Night" can be altered and construed as something other than Spelljamming, so too can this.
-Eh, people have been proclaiming doom and gloom for how long now?
I know, just look at how often it happens in the real world.
I know, just look at how often it happens in the real world.
-I don't want to say we have a track record, but...
799: The end is nigh!
899: The end is nigh!
999: The end is nigh!
1099: The end is nigh!
1199: The end is nigh!
1299: The end is nigh!
1399: The end is nigh!
1499: The end is nigh!
1599: The end is nigh!
1699: The end is nigh!
1799: The end is nigh!
1899: The end is nigh!
1999: The end is nigh!
IIRC, The Skeptic's Dictionary website has a page about "End of the World" proclaimations (that of course, did not come true).-Your intentions might have been there, I am sure, but one word (A new concept such as "Astraljamming", perhaps) suddenly changes those references from nods at Spelljammer to something else. Which is the point I was making. Just like in the FRCS how the legends of ships traveling in the "Sea of Night" can be altered and construed as something other than Spelljamming, so too can this.
-The next date the world is supposed to end is 2012, or 2011, I believe. The end of the final Mayan cycle on their calendar. Let's keep our fingers crossed...or uncrossed...Or whatever it's supposed to be. ;)
Fair enough. I can see some form of astraljamming replacing the traditional method of spelljamming through the phlogiston. I'm still a big fan of the crystal spheres though.
-Spelljammer will always live in in my campaigns. My PCs recently got one.
Anyway, that just starts the next cycle. Nothing at all indicating anything will be different from before. Well, aside from hysterics that is, but those are willing to grab any date..
And ofcourse, in the meantime various informed cult leaders milk the easily fooled for contributions. For some reason these religious leaders always need money (see zeitgeist).
As in fact, any religion accepting money, pretty much proves they are fake. Especially if they preach their THING is either allpowerful or deterministic, which means that watever was meant to be would happen anyway and we as mere mortals wont be able to change anything.
As in fact, any religion accepting money, pretty much proves they are fake.
-Not particularly. Everything and everything needs resources to survive. Individuals, with specific nutrients, organizations, with monetary funds...
Especially if they preach their THING is either allpowerful or deterministic, which means that watever was meant to be would happen anyway and we as mere mortals wont be able to change anything.
-That logic has holes large enough to sail the Titanic through. :P
-The next date the world is supposed to end is 2012, or 2011, I believe. The end of the final Mayan cycle on their calendar. Let's keep our fingers crossed...or uncrossed...Or whatever it's supposed to be. ;)
Ah, the prophecy that came from people who couldn't predict the end of their own culture? Sure, I'll get on board with that.;)
For some strange reason people seem to like predicting the "end of the world." It makes sense that such behavior could be found in the Realms, too. I just don't like actually making such things come true, but that's just me.
-Spelljammer will always live in in my campaigns. My PCs recently got one.
I'm jealous.:P
Ah, the prophecy that came from people who couldn't predict the end of their own culture? Sure, I'll get on board with that.;)
-Woo hoo...The end is nigh, the end is nigh!!
I'm jealous.:P
-Would you like a Spelljammer? For you, I'll get a Spelljammer.
--Would you like a Spelljammer? For you, I'll get a Spelljammer.
here we go again
-Is there any specific vessel you prefer?
-Hmm...I'm going to have to scrounge up a Spelljammer...I'll have it for you next time I see you.
-Is there any specific vessel you prefer?
I gotta hand to you, LK, most guys would just bring flowers and chochlate
I gotta hand to you, LK, most guys would just bring flowers and chochlate
-Been there, done that...Now, a Spelljammer...That's not something you see everyday! :D
-Been there, done that...Now, a Spelljammer...That's not something you see everyday! :D
Heck, I'd date ya
-You too!? Weren't you admonishing Magister_Kal for saying that same thing?
um. yeah :embarrass
-Hmm...I'm going to have to scrounge up a Spelljammer...I'll have it for you next time I see you.
-Is there any specific vessel you prefer?
One with a sea creature motif.
One with a sea creature motif.
nice.
-The next date the world is supposed to end is 2012, or 2011, I believe. The end of the final Mayan cycle on their calendar. Let's keep our fingers crossed...or uncrossed...Or whatever it's supposed to be. ;)
2012, and I'm hoping its accurate this time out.
What could be cooler then witnessing the Apocalypse? :D
One with a sea creature motif.
-Right. I'll have it for you next time I see you.
What could be cooler then witnessing the Apocalypse? :D
-Not witnessing the Apocalypse?
-Right. I'll have it for you next time I see you.
Thank you!
-Right. I'll have it for you next time I see you.
no need to ask 'cause he's a smooth operator, he's a smooth operator, smooth operator, smoooooth op-er-a-tor
-Not witnessing the Apocalypse?
But I love Fireworks!
And besides, think of all the people (in those dates you mentioned) that looked forward too it and didn't get to see it - we're the lucky ones!
If you gotta go, you might as well go out in a big way. :D
But I love Fireworks!
And besides, think of all the people (in those dates you mentioned) that looked forward too it and didn't get to see it - we're the lucky ones!
If you gotta go, you might as well go out in a big way. :D
-Yeah, well, I'm kinda looking forward to not going out just this moment, you know?
-Anyway, back to Spelljammers...Is there anything left in that topic, or are we done?
-Yeah, well, I'm kinda looking forward to not going out just this moment, you know?
better to go out in all your glory (like the Beatles or Marilyn Monroe) then grow old and decrepit in front of everyone (like the Rolling Stones or Delta Burke).
Like Neil Young said, "It's better to burn out, then fade away".
-Anyway, back to Spelljammers...Is there anything left in that topic, or are we done?
I thought the concept behind Spelljammers was great (stolen from the then #1 rated RPG Space: 1889), but I think a lot of the material produced for it was an example of TSR at their worst - silly, derivitive non-sensical lore that was just slapped together without rhyme or reason.
I'd have to say I liked Spelljamming, but hated Spelljammer, if that makes any sense. I use it, but WAY differently, and I hope that if WotC re-visits the setting, they do it the way I imagined it (like in the Elric novel - Sailor on the Seas of Fate). Flying from world to world throught he Astral (Arcane Space?) or the Shadow (Phlogiston?) would be very cool, ad would tie Planescape and Spelljammer together in a unique way.
Of course, neither of those settings will be exactly the same, but perhaps with the right team (the guys that did Beyond Countless Doorways?) we could actually get something that is more then the sum of its parts.
The existance of Planar travel in PS made SJ redundant and rather silly. If the two could be brought together, I think WotC could have a real winner there.
With a smattering of Ravenloft thrown in, of course - there's always a chance when cruising the Shadow Seas of coming out in the Plane of Horrors.
better to go out in all your glory (like the Beatles or Marilyn Monroe) then grow old and decrepit in front of everyone (like the Rolling Stones or Delta Burke).
-Don't know who Delta Burke is, but notice how the Stones are still out there, jamming? And, the Beatles hardly went out at the top of their game.
-Were it anything other than death, I'd agree. Hell, in the past, I would have agreed with you. After high school, when I began college, my dream in life was to be killed in the line of duty, doing something heroic. Circumstances in my life have changed such that I don't feel so nihilistic, so...
Like Neil Young said, "It's better to burn out, then fade away".
-Neil Young has also said plenty of questionable things, too. ;)
I'd have to say I liked Spelljamming, but hated Spelljammer, if that makes any sense.
-I understand, and agree. I like the concept behind Spelljamming, and a bunch of elements (IEN, Neogi, Crystal Spheres, some ship blueprints), but that's all. The way I've adapted it into my own game is simply stuff I've made up off the top of my head.
1) helms, way too valuable. You dont want to add 125k in loot for every boarded and taken ship.. Unless players with 20million gp in cash are ok at level 12.
2) gravity planes.. like wtf.. I made down, stay down.
3) smokepowder guns.. why bother? Lousier than a nixies smallbow. Either quintuple damage or terror (damage*2 as will DC or run away?) and minimum double damage. And the price.. maybe everyone was supposed to have a dozen bombards, so they wouldnt drown in wealth from the helms?
4) gnomes
5) spelljamming left a spellslinger sitting in the corner, like a leatherheaded berk, no partcipation. Nada, zero.
no need to ask 'cause he's a smooth operator, he's a smooth operator, smooth operator, smoooooth op-er-a-tor
http://youtube.com/watch?v=wVjJ0TQx2zE WITH music on. Without, dont bother ;)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=wVjJ0TQx2zE WITH music on. Without, dont bother ;)
-I'd be lying if I said I didn't have that song on my iPod.
I try not to listen to music that is less then ten years old. :P
So your the guy on that car commercial that has Michael Bolton set on his radio? :D
-No.
I try not to listen to music that is less then ten years old. :P
-Meaning your collection goes back to '98. Hmm...Not a lot of good stuff, there. :P
Most of the stuff I listen to is from 60's, with some from the 70's and quite a bit from the 50's as well...
and I wasn't even born when that earlier stuff came out. :embarrass
I also got into a brief period of 'crooner music' love, when I first got my hands on Mob Hits...
For an entire year, I talked like a bad gangster-movie wannabe. :P
"You wanna piece a' me? Doowie look like a clown to yous? Shut yer trap"
and here's the kicker - I HATE Mob movies - I've only seen a single episode of Sopranos, and have never seen the Godfather in it's entirety.
I think it was after I saw Analyze This that made me a little crazy for awhile.
'98 I consider 'newfangled' music. :D
Most of the stuff I listen to is from 60's, with some from the 70's and quite a bit from the 50's as well...
and I wasn't even born when that earlier stuff came out. :embarrass
-Never mind. I read that wrong. I read it as your "collection" includes nothing made before 1998, not that it includes nothing made after 1998.
- And, the Beatles hardly went out at the top of their game.
Whaddya MEAN they didn't?!
Whaddya MEAN they didn't?!
Yeah, I have to agree with your lady LK. Abbey Road was a great album
-Well, what I meant by that was that the band broke up due to some bitter in-fighting (Lennon-McCartney, primarily), among other things, such as the emergence of George as a songwriter in his own right, and Ringo being Ringo. I wouldn't consider that kind of conduct "at the top of their game".
Nah, I'm sure it was the Mario-parasite inside Ringo's drum.;) :P
:D
Not me, I just hate that whole period of music... to use the word 'music' very loosely. :P ;)
-But, it's agreed by music critics to have been one of the most important eras of musical development in Human history.
Nah, I'm sure it was the Mario-parasite inside Ringo's drum.;) :P
-Good point.
As to saying that anything recent was 'one of the most important eras of musical development in human history' is hyperbole at its finest, and fairly reeks of a strong bias based on personal taste rather than true historical perspective. Its not had enough time to see if it truly withstands the test of time the way something like Baroque or Opera has. That would be true to just about any musical form 'invented' in the last century in my opinion.
And I care what music critics think why? Oh, wait, I don't... :P ;)
As to saying that anything recent was 'one of the most important eras of musical development in human history' is hyperbole at its finest, and fairly reeks of a strong bias based on personal taste rather than true historical perspective. Its not had enough time to see if it truly withstands the test of time the way something like Baroque or Opera has. That would be true to just about any musical form 'invented' in the last century in my opinion.
-Not particularly, no. Take into account the counterculture of the 1960s, the impact that the counterculture of the 1960s had on the era, and on today, and how much music influenced the counterculture of the 1960s. And then, of course, mix in the influences that music today draws from the songs and song writers of the era...
Beyond that, there was very little of the music in the 60's that was not ultimately derivative from what had come before it. Evolutionary certainly, but very little that was really revolutionary (not including politically) as a musical concept. Refined perhaps, but not truly inventive.
-Oh yeah. Spelljammers.
And yes, those damned spelljammers. I've been contemplating introducing that into my campaign, though not with giant dwarf/wizard heads riding out front.
50's probably had more influence in terms of modern musical styles...
-Much of which influenced the musical counterculture of the 1960s. Much of what went on in the 1960s went "against the grain" of what was established in the 1950s. I recently saw an excellent documentary on the internet: John Lennon's Jukebox. I recommend it.
And yes, those damned spelljammers. I've been contemplating introducing that into my campaign, though not with giant dwarf/wizard heads riding out front.
-Agreed, that's probably not the best way to go about it.
-In my own campaign, the PCs have a boat that doubles as a Spelljammer (or a Spelljammer that doubles as a boat?). It doesn't look..."wacky", it sails, it flies. Sweet and simple.
The 60's gave us Roger Dean
Someone high-up at WotC was obviously a Yes fan
Now we have Yes album covers inserted into our Realms, some 40 years after the fact.
The 60's revolution is still going on, unfortuately, in some people's minds.
We also had the introduction and widespread use of the Electric Guitar in the 60's, which completely changed the sound of popular music, and music and culture are entwined together, so that in the end the culture itself is changed by the music it helped create.
The 'Free Thinking' inspired by the music of the era trickled down into other forms of media, so that JRR Tolkien became popular once again (refrences to his works are in many Led Zeppelin songs, amongst others), along with several TV series depicting Sci-Fi and Fantasy elements (Bewitched, I Dream of Genie, Star Trek, U.F.O., Lost in space, The Munsters, etc...)
I doubt Gygax would have came up with D&D, if he wasn't smokin' dope and listening to some psychedlic album with his buds.
Don't dis the 60's, kiddies... I was there. You owe it a lot. ;)
Don't dis the 60's, kiddies... I was there. You owe it a lot. ;)
-Sure, but you can claim to be there just like my mother can claim to be there: About three or four memories...;)
I have an excellent memory. ;)
:P :P :P
My earliest memory is being locked in a Graveyard at the end of my block (literally - a DEAD end) by my older brother. I distinctly remember him and his friends laughing at me, and it was starting to get dark and I was having a panic attack. I have no idea how old I was at that time, but I did move from Queens when I was three, and I confirmed YEARS LATER that my street did indeed have a cemetary at the end of it.
The IQ thing - I was tested when I was nine, and that was a LONG time ago. The tests have changed, and the 80's were VERY good (bad?) to me, so I would probably test VERY differently today. I was PURE nerd in the 70's, and quite a different person. My memory still blows people away, but its nothing like it used to be.
Anyway, about Spelljamming, music, and whatever...
If we talk about the 50's song Purple People Eater, we can give him stats and use him for the Spelljammer setting (its plenty silly enough to fit right in). In case you were all wondering where I pulled that one out of - that was my mandatory nod to the thread title. ;)
@Stigger - Chuck Mangione's Live at the Hollywood Bowl was the very first 'adult' album I ever bought, and Chase the Clouds Away is still one of my favorite pieces.
My wife's Uncle was ranked as the #2 Jazz Harmonica Player on Long Island, and we used to go to see him perform at least one weekend a month.
He never let the fact that there was only one other professional Jazz harmonica player on Long Island bother him either. :P
Ah, the prophecy that came from people who couldn't predict the end of their own culture? Sure, I'll get on board with that.;)
For some strange reason people seem to like predicting the "end of the world."
Actually they sort of did predict there own downfall... read the history of their calendar, it predicts a lot of the changes and events in history. Also the Hopi have the same date Dec of 2012.
And somewhere in one of the 4e core books, I saw a direct reference to ships on the astral sea.
And somewhere in one of the 4e core books, I saw a direct reference to ships on the astral sea.
-And...a reference to the end of the world in December, 2012? Odd...
-But, about that. What did I say? I'm good.
-Just making fun of you, MT, that's all.
-And...a reference to the end of the world in December, 2012? Odd...
-But, about that. What did I say? I'm good.
actually I think this is their planned release date of 5e :D
-Four years? That's a bit early, isn't it? That might be 4.5, though.
will they travel back in time 100 years?
Actually they sort of did predict there own downfall... read the history of their calendar, it predicts a lot of the changes and events in history.
Such as?
Also the Hopi have the same date Dec of 2012.
So what?
They predicted such eras of turmoil as WW2 and the Flower Power movement of the 60's to name 2 events, many others, can't remember them all.
Well, my answer to that is that those "prophecies" were most likely vaguely worded. It wouldn't be too hard to say they predicted certain events after the fact. With enough effort, you can make a bunch of vague statements mean almost anything.
Their calender was based on a series of cycles within cycles and at certain points events are supposed to occur. The 2012 date is really just a marking of the end of many cycles at one time, not so much the end of the world as a major time of change. As far as the Hopi using the same date... just an oddity that two different cultures came up with the same date. I don't know if it is really significant, but there it is.
I don't want to comment too much about this because I don't have all the facts about it (same goes for above, really). But never overlook the possibility of coincidence, or some other more mundane explanation.
I don't want to comment too much about this because I don't have all the facts about it (same goes for above, really). But never overlook the possibility of coincidence, or some other more mundane explanation.
I tend to agree, but more than a few instances are usually more than a coincidence, and it does not predict the end of the world, just a major change as several cycles of the world end and new ones begin. And when someone gives a specific date based on a very accurate (and very pre-Gregorian) calender, it doesn't hurt to at least consider it. Events in society seem to be building to a crescendo and while it may not amount to anything, it seems to be in the right time frame.
here is a link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayan_calender
I tend to agree, but more than a few instances are usually more than a coincidence, and it does not predict the end of the world, just a major change as several cycles of the world end and new ones begin. And when someone gives a specific date based on a very accurate (and very pre-Gregorian) calender, it doesn't hurt to at least consider it. Events in society seem to be building to a crescendo and while it may not amount to anything, it seems to be in the right time frame.
Meh, I've more or less said my piece about that.;)
The #1 coincidence is that "the Dead shall walk the Earth". Read the book The Hot Zone - it's non-fiction, and both Clive Barker and Steven King have said it was the most frightening thing they've ever read (and it's all true!)
I can go on and on - there is another prophecy about "the White man" arriving in American, some years before it happened and by a medicine man on the West Coast (3500 miles from where his prediction took place). That one's particularly intersting... it says that "the People" (persons with Indian blood) would take back their land eventually from 'the White Devils'.
Hispanic People are 90% Amerind, and by 2012, "persons of color" will out-number caucasions in this country.
Food for thought....
Agreed, enough of the doom and gloom that will probably not happen.
Sorry - you posted this before I replied - my bad.
I'll stop. :embarrass
-Spelljammers...
Are you implying that we went a bit off topic?
Ok then... Spelljamming was a great concept, except it doesn't work, especially after it was decided that the connection between the various worlds was through the shadow plane. I don't know what the planned link is now. Maybe, since the planes are more synced between the worlds, that you could use any plane that was shared by either world to cross? But it would far more effective to built a portal than to build and equip a ship with a spelljammer helm. Astral craft might be fun, but portals are still going to be the preferred method.
-Like I said at page 1, Astraljamming!
-If they wanted to be real "sneaky", they could really develop this process using a lot of the old Spelljammer stuff, of course adapting things here and there, and changing names and terms.
WizO_Unicorn