Confirmed Chosen
Aerdrie Faenya
Willim Fairfeather
Azuth
Several former Magisters
Bane
Fzoul Chembryl
Beshaba
Walinda (Former Chosen)
Corellon Larethian
Adarc Brightleaf
Elmher Flow
Cyric
Malik el Sami yn Nasser
Deep Sashelas
Ella Wavesdaughter
Deneir
Cadderly Bonaduce
Pertelope (Deceased)
Eilistraee
Qilué Veladorn (Deceased, 1377 DR)
Ingrid Liansdottir
Eldath
Ashenford Torinbow
Lady Shadowmoon Crystalembers
Shinthala Deepcrest
Erevan Illesere
Filane Mantrap
Fenmarel Mestarine
Avery Arrinson
Other Unnamed Individuals
Gilgeam
Shuruppak (Former Chosen)
Gzemnid
Skixtalq
Hanali Celanil
Llewellyn Longleaves
Llyssa Longleaves
Kiaransalee
Rotting Jack
Labelas Enoreth
Vartan Hai Sylver
Lolth
Liriel Baenre (Former Chosen)
Malar
Anth-Malar
Mask
Kesson Rel
Avner of Hartsvale
Erevis Cale
Drasek Riven
Unnamed Fifth Chosen
Merrshaulk/Sseth
Pil'it'ith (Former Chosen)
Mielikki
Jeryth Phaulkon
Ashenford Torinbow
Lady Shadowmoon Crystalembers
Shinthala Deepcrest
Mystra
Embrae Aloevan of Ardeep (Deceased, 308 DR; Undead)
Symrustar Auglamyr (Deceased)
Elminster Aumar
Khelben Arunson (Deceased, 1374 DR)
Azuth (Former Chosen; Deceased 1385+ DR)
Noumea Drathchuld
Dove Falconhand
Nadrathen, the “Rebel Chosen" (Deceased)
Sammaster (Former Chosen, Deceased; Undead; Destroyed, 1373 DR)
Alustriel Silverhand (Deceased, ???? DR)
Storm Silverhand
Laeral Silverhand
Sylune Silverhand (Deceased 1,356 DR; Undead; Destroyed 1375 DR)
The Simbul
The Srinshee
Qilué Veladorn (Deceased, 1377 DR)
Alvaerele Tasundrym
Oghma
Sephris Dweodon
Sehanine Moonbow
Embrae Aloevan of Ardeep (Deceased, 308 DR; Undead)
Moonsilver
The Seldarine
Queen Amlaruil Moonflower
Ilyrana Moonflower
Shar
Unnamed Chosen
Silvanus
Ashenford Torinbow
Lady Shadowmoon Crystalembers
Shinthala Deepcrest
Talona
The Rotting Man
Tiamat
Tchazzar
Ubtao
Alisandra Rayburton
Dhlamass Rayburton
Ras Ni
Fipya
Kwalu
Mainu
Ossaw I
Umberlee
Slarkrathel
Vhaeraun
Allinzir G’Leera
Other Unnamed Individuals
Possible Chosen
Baravar Cloakshadow
Embrel Berrodwyn
Supporting Evidence: http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=7250&whichpage=4
Gruumsh
King Obould Many-Arrows
Supporting Evidence: The Hunters Blade Trilogy
Lolth
Halisstra Melarn, the Lady Penitent
Supporting Evidence: The Lady Penitent trilogy
Qotal
Erix
Supporting Evidence: Feathered Dragon
Sekolah
Iakhovas
Supporting Evidence: The Threat from the Sea Trilogy
Teylas (Akadi)
Yamun Khan
Supporting Evidence: Horselords
-Any others, feel free to mention (though, this is mostly confined to guessing possible Chosen, along with supporting evidence, of course). I started dating things, but it's late, and I'll start tomorrow or whenever, to make the dating more complete.
It's 'Gilgeam', not 'Gilgleam'.
Who is Sephris Dwendon, chosen of Oghma? I thought I knew everything about Oghma, but that's new to me.
sylune: deceased ?? DR
Good reference. Where can I learn about the chosen of Sehanine Moonbow Embrae Aloevan of Ardeep?
See Lost Empires of Faerûn.
Wuld Iakhovas be Sekolah's Chosen, in the Threat from the Sea trilogy?
I don't think that's exactly the case.
Both Cloak & Dagger and the new Waterdeep sourcebook state that Iakhovas was a wereshark. He was also called a wereshark in the trilogy itself, as I recall. Regardless, I would say that he may have actually been a particularly powerful variant of the wereshark race. He was said to have been a former lover of Umberlee -- so it's entirely possible he had some "divine assistance" at some point in his life.
Tom Costa offered some thoughts of his own on how to represent Iakhavos's "special" status through the rules:-
"You might go with a were-dire shark (IMO) wizard, with either some sort of chosen template or perhaps the half-fiend template (though that wouldn't be quite accurate)."
And,
"Weresharks were updated in Lost Empires of Faerun as well.
That said, I really like the idea of a dire sharkwere with levels of sorcerer and perhaps some chosen/half-fiend abilities (you could always use powers listed for Sekolah'avatar and clerics in the 2E Monster Mythology and the 2E Sahuagin books for inspiration)."
Would Adon (formerly of Sune) have been made a Chosen of Mystra?
I've never ever heard that he was a Chosen.
Liriel Baenre - chosen of Lolth (briefly)
-I never got the sense that she was a Chosen of Lolth. I viewed that as her being an Avatar of Lolth.
Who is Sephris Dwendon, chosen of Oghma? I thought I knew everything about Oghma, but that's new to me.
-He appears in the Erevis Cale trilogy, books 1 and 2, I believe. Picture a genius savant.
-I never got the sense that she was a Chosen of Lolth. I viewed that as her being an Avatar of Lolth.
Liriel Baenre was referred to in Windwalker as "the Zedriniset, the Chosen of Lolth", as revealed to Shakti by a yochlol of Lolth (and then Shakti told the Baenres). It was brief, as she fell from Lolth's favor at the end of Windwalker. The zedriniset was "something that every Lolth priestess aspired to be" and was a "holy" term for the faith.
It's a little confusing because "Yor'Thae" is also taken to mean "Chosen One" of Lolth, and we have Danifae Yauntyrr revealed as the Yor'Thae. Many have taken Yor'Thae to mean "Chosen" in the same sense as a Chosen of Mystra, but I think Danifae was the one Lolth chose to merge with, rather than be blessed with extra "Chosen" powers. In the sense of "Chosen of Mystra", Lolth's Zedriniset better fits the bill than her Yor'Thae. I'd argue that Halisstra is just the Lady Penitent, not a Chosen or a Chosen One.
Also, Halisstra Melarn as the Lady Penitent doesn't exactly fit either profile above. She's more... transformed, like having a half-demonic template added to her, rather than having extra powers (like Liriel) or being potentially absorbed into Lolth (like Danifae).
That's my logic, anyway, and I'm sticking to it. ;)
spoiler
Wendonai
I'm new to all of this, but wouldn'tspoilerWendonai
Twilight's status has yet to be "fully and officially" confirmed completely in canon -- in other words, it's not actually something stated in sourcebooks or novels. For now, it's just an interpretation the reader picks up from Twilight's published appearances so far.
In some of the Candlekeep Book Club [or was it in Erik's 'Questions' scroll] discussions regarding Twilight's status, Erik tell us that he established a pretty strong connection for the "special" relationship that exists between Twilight and Erevan through several passages in Depths of Madness. And that's mostly what I thought when I read through them myself.
That's enough for me to believe that Twilight does in fact enjoy a unique status of sorts among Erevan's faithful, and that Erik will elaborate further on that status if and when he has the opportunity to do so. And so long as it isn't contradicted by WotC in future FR source material, 'tis likely to remain that way.
Also, we have this from Erik himself on the matter:-
"Yup. It has not been established one way or another, and until it is, I can't comment one way or another.
From many things Twilight has *said*, it's a reasonable assumption. But there isn't any particular reason to trust anything she says. There's also one particular scene in Depths that seems to contradict her "chosen" status."
What about Fox in Twilight? The short story in the Realms of the Elves anthology seems to suggest it. Also a thread on Candlekeep with the writers input has a 3.x write up for her using a newly designed chosen template for Erevan Ilesere (spelling?). Anyway just wondering.
Hmmm... I wonder if that's the Chosen Template I created and posted in one of those threads? I'm Copper elven Vampire on Candlekeep! Can you post a link to that thread perhaps?
. That was one of the more obscure references in the book.Was Allashar (Telamont's wife/lover yadda yadda) a Chosen of Shar or am I confusing names and ranks?
-I couldn't find the old thread, so I had to make up a new one.
Confirmed Chosen
Kiaransalee
Rotting Jack
Who? FR material? How could he if he ain't no drow and apparently a male? 4E?
Lolth
Liriel Baenre (Former Chosen)
Halisstra Melarn, the Lady Penitent.
Neither was a "Chosen" in anything but hearsay by in-novel people or by own imagination, AFAIK. The one real "confirmed" "Chosen of Lolth" known is not given open for the sake of readers of the WotSQ series ...
Show
Danifae Yauntyrr
Who? FR material? How could he if he ain't no drow and apparently a male? 4E?
-Rotting Jack, Orcus' proxy that Kiaransalee took when she slew him. Proxy and Chosen being synonymous, Rotting Jack is/was Kiaransalee's Chosen.
...ShowDanifae Yauntyrr
-Rotting Jack, Orcus' proxy that Kiaransalee took when she slew him. Proxy and Chosen being synonymous, Rotting Jack is/was Kiaransalee's Chosen.
Aha. So better placing that name in brackets and add this information, since it reveals that this is simply an assumption and no fact at all. Not least since this is not exactly an FR event or an FR "person".
-Who is not a Chosen of Lolth. She was Lolth's 'Chosen One'.
Well, I leave the answer to this to Resurrection (p.3):
The Yor'thae was Lolth's Chosen and the Spider Queen was summoning her Chosen to her side.
And I for one only read a singular when reading Chosen here, the one who was chosen at the end. The rest merely thought they were ...
Well, I leave the answer to this to Resurrection (p.3):
And I for one only read a singular when reading Chosen here, the one who was chosen at the end. The rest merely thought they were ...
It's a mistake to think of Danifae as a "Chosen" in the same sense as Mystra's Chosen. The Yor'Thae or "Chosen One" had -zero- special powers throughout the entire series. Even the various drow females who thought they might be the Yor'Thae didn't really know which one Lolth would choose to merge with her until the very end.
In contrast, look at Liriel Baenre, who was clearly a Chosen of Lolth in the very same sense that Mystra has Chosen. Liriel had been granted additional powers, and her function was similar in that she used those powers to advance Lolth's grand scheme of the day: removing the degradation of drow magic in sunlight. The other priestesses also referred to her with a different name, the Zedriniset, Chosen of Lolth. Liriel as Lolth's chosen is confirmed by a yochlol, who states this clearly to Shakti (who then reports this to the Baenres). Furthermore, the zedriniset is something that all Lolth priestesses desired greatly to earn or become, per the Liriel series.
Liriel was a Chosen of Lolth.
Danifae was The Chosen One.
As for Halisstra, I think the jury is still out on that one. She might be a Chosen of Lolth, although I'd tend to argue that she was more of a transformed / templated half-demon.
There's precedent with other deities for this difference as well.
Aha. So better placing that name in brackets and add this information, since it reveals that this is simply an assumption and no fact at all. Not least since this is not exactly an FR event or an FR "person".
-I can't be held accountable if you don't follow the extended multiverse, with it being relevant to the Forgotten Realms (in being part of the Great Wheel in the past). Rotting Jack is/was very much Kiaransalee's Proxy, and (ironically, by proxy) Kiaransalee's Chosen. See On Hallowed Ground.
Well, I leave the answer to this to Resurrection (p.3):
And I for one only read a singular when reading Chosen here, the one who was chosen at the end. The rest merely thought they were ...
-See Therise.
As for Liriel and this drow use of magic on the surface ... a great mishap indeed. First, if at all it was not Liriel who did it, but the Windwalker amulet holding faerzress etc.. Carrying the thing about does not make anyone "a Chosen". Second, as everyone should know, the edition change did away with the drow stuff disintegrating in sunlight, but only for a time. Since Underdark we got the drowcraft items back and they go bust much like they did before. In both cases and any edition one has to keep in mind that drow items as such did not disintegrate, but only those made of adamantite or being created with faerzress etc.. Any normally crafted magical item would remain very much like it is and there is or was no rule which said that drow could not use "normal" magical items, be that short swords +1 or cloaks of elvenkind. Just as food for thought ... and what Mrs. Baenre might actually have encountered back then.
I will come back to the zedriniset argument once I have double-checked on the relevant book, but as far as I am concerned, Liriel was only thought of as someone "protected" by Lolth at some stages of her life (if people actually believe this), but hardly being a "Chosen", especially in the sense of the "Chosen of Mystra".
The quotation shows what Yor'thae stands for and we all know by now who was meant. She did not have any powers in her lifetime, like so many other "Chosen", but her role was a far greater one. Halisstra was no "Chosen" either, at least not in the sense implied above, i.e. like the "Chosen of Mystra". Lolth cursed her into a strange half-fiend form and used her as a tool. Full stop. She does that - on a lesser lever - with any drider etc..
LK .. you can be held accountable once you create a list of Chosen of FR deities. If it is a list of Chosen for D&D in general, fair enough. Even though it is still your assumption that "proxy" is synonymous with "Chosen".
Edit: Windwalker does indeed give Zedriniset as "a Chosen of the Goddess" , though in the musings of both Shakti and Triel alone and with an assumption that Liriel was a "Chosen (or rather Favoured of?) of Lolth" because she and not Shakti won the "duel of the priestesses". Whether this was actually the case remains to be seen. In any case, Yor'thae has been given as "Chosen of the Spider Queen" too and in a later publication, with a definite outcome.
LK .. you can be held accountable once you create a list of Chosen of FR deities. If it is a list of Chosen for D&D in general, fair enough. Even though it is still your assumption that "proxy" is synonymous with "Chosen".
-It is fact that proxy = Chosen. Proxy and Seraph were rolled into Chosen at the debut of 3e. That is why individuals who used to be Proxies and Seraphs are Chosen. If you don't follow the Planescape stuff, I can't help that, but Planescape material certainly has/had an impact on Realmslore. The connected multiverse did that. That reminds me, I should comb through On Hallowed Ground, and see what other Forgotten Realms related deities have entries, to see if there's anything relevant.
I think both Zedriniset (Liriel) and Yor'thae (Danifae) are Chosen. Exact translations may be mistaken. Don't forget Yor'thae came from High Drow, and wasn't used for ages.
Well, the priestesses actually use High Drow quite regularly, as has been described e.g. in The Drow of the Underdark.
LK ... don't try to convince me to accept your Planescape'ish look at things when you collect FR related stuff. We both know that some AD&D Planescape material was multispheric, not least when it concerns both Lolth and Kiaransalee. It is simply not true FR stuff if you include other D&D stuff by default and adding a bit of info there wouldn't take much away from the list as such. Nonetheless I doubt that Kiaransalee would have had any sort of Chosen bar one of her priestesses or necromancers on Toril. If she had any at all.
-Kiaransalee is Kiaransalee, all across the multiverse.
As is Corellon and Lolth and whatnot. That is back to the roots discussion stuff that need not be. For you know exactly what we are talking about here ... and actually have done a few times. Add those lines and everyone will be just fine. Keep it as it is and the list simply is not FR.
Well, first, there is a difference between Chosen - the template, which is referred to above when you speak of Mystra. Hardly any bar the Chosen of Mystra had or have any sort of special powers, and surely Liriel had none either...
Liriel did indeed have unique extra powers, specifically granted her by Lolth; these were necessary for her survival as she carried out Lolth's greater plan (whether Liriel knew of it or not). Danifae had no extra powers, nor did Halisstra or Quenthel, other than their original clerical powers and Halisstra's bae'queshel songs which were learned.
The fact that Liriel was observed with these additional powers, by Shakti at the battle of Ruathym, is not the only evidence we have for Liriel being the Zedriniset. The yochlol who meets Shakti in the abyss confirms the reason why Lolth has granted Liriel the special powers of a chosen: because Liriel did not crave Lolth's power and was in fact tormented by it. It's an incredibly cruel and far-sighted plan to have such a person be responsible for making drow magic permanent on the surface - permanent not just for her, but all drow. This latter fact of drow magic having been made non-degradable is also confirmed by the same yochlol. And yes, it was the explanation for this major change from 2E to 3E, but that doesn't alter the fact that this material is canon.
(...)Furthermore, what in-novel characters "think", as I said, does not mean that this is actual game fact - unless it is written in sections clearly not referring to people's thinking or reasoning. Do also keep in mind that many "Chosen" we know for certain these days, like Erevis and Co. draw most of their special "powers" from their high level or certain templates (shade, Dark Speech stuff et al).
I'll refer you to Resurrection, then, and the words of Vhaeraun:
[INDENT]
“Once is enough, ultroloth,” said Vhaeraun. “So you hear the word, but do you know its meaning?”
Inthracis nodded slowly, fear growing in his gut, but Vhaeraun went on as though he had answered in the negative.
“The Yor’thae is the chosen vessel of the Spider *****. (...)[/INDENT]
Inthracis did not know the exact meaning, only a general one. Vhaeraun knew exactly what Yor'thae meant. Until this point in the story, Inthracis knew that it meant "Chosen" something, but not a chosen vessel by which Lolth would finalize her transformation. That's really quite different than the way Chosen are shown to "work" in the Realms. The Yor'thae was unique.
As for Liriel and this drow use of magic on the surface ... a great mishap indeed. First, if at all it was not Liriel who did it, but the Windwalker amulet holding faerzress etc.. Carrying the thing about does not make anyone "a Chosen".
There's no mishap here, although I'll grant it isn't straightforward. As noted before, Liriel had additional powers, granted by Lolth, beyond what the Windwalker amulet let her "store" for later use. This is really quite clear from the books, and Lolth's favor and granting of extra abilities were what made her the Zedriniset, the Chosen of Lolth.
The Windwalker allowed the use of her faerzress-dependent abilities: darkness globes, faerie fire, levitation, and maintenance of her drow-empowered magic items. These abilities were made permanent by the rituals that Liriel completed, not just for her but for all drow that would use them on the surface. Liriel was also a powerful wizard, and a very low level priestess of Lolth. Low level priestesses cannot, without benefit of a deity, open portals to the Abyss, which Liriel did specifically with Lolth's power; and there were other demonstrations of Lolth's power, also unrelated to the Windwalker amulet's abilities. Pushing Shakti into the Abyss is only one example, but a powerful one, and otherwise impossible for a priestess with Liriel's limited training. And importantly, the Windwalker amulet never allowed Liriel to do anything, to store any magic, that was not ordinarily available to her.
Second, as everyone should know, the edition change did away with the drow stuff disintegrating in sunlight, but only for a time. Since Underdark we got the drowcraft items back and they go bust much like they did before.
Then everyone should also know that drowcraft items in this 3E supplement are also considered uncommon, have luck-based bonuses (not magic, but luck), and are "no longer favored" in most drow cities. Furthermore, they also have an immediate fix of "darkoil" applications which can protect the weapon from direct exposure to sunlight. The only reason to include them in this supplement is for people who didn't like the global change in going from 2E to 3E with respect to drow magic on the surface.
Edit: Windwalker does indeed give Zedriniset as "a Chosen of the Goddess" , though in the musings of both Shakti and Triel alone and with an assumption that Liriel was a "Chosen (or rather Favoured of?) of Lolth" because she and not Shakti won the "duel of the priestesses". Whether this was actually the case remains to be seen. In any case, Yor'thae has been given as "Chosen of the Spider Queen" too and in a later publication, with a definite outcome.
As noted above, Yor'thae clearly means something quite different than "a Chosen" in the sense of Mystra's Chosen. Not just in the opinion of the Baenres and Shakti, but also from Vhaeraun's lips. The Yor'thae is a "Chosen One"... or in Vhaeraun's words "the chosen vessel" of Lolth. The Zedriniset is the term that actually fits "Chosen" as we understand the game term (i.e. templated, with additional powers granted by the deity).
The fact that Danifae is not a Chosen of Lolth but The Chosen One, or the Chosen Vessel of Lolth makes the Yor'thae all the more unique and special and not a Chosen in the same sense as a Chosen of Mystra.
The drow magic thing ... I for one doubt that Liriel - or Elaine for that matter - had been charged with the return of drow magic to the surface, which, as I said, was not reality but Liriel's belief. In-game and in-setting we know that no special item et al was needed for drow items (yet heed my explanation abve about AD&D drow stuff, 3E drow stuff and drowcraft items) to work on the surface. At the time, we were still at the turning point from AD&D to 3E and drow suddenly could walk - against all that we knew - the surface with any stuff they had.* Given the "outcry", not least by the novel-reading gamers, this was changed back to normal, but - to ease the pain for those who loved their new 3E drow - they flair-wise told us that mass producing such stuff became "uncommon" recently(!). Luck bonuses? Well, these are technicalities and since there is something non-in-rulish involved here, i.e. faerzress, they had to come up with something else than enhancement bonuses. That the technical side is flawed can be seen be the "need" to include disintegration in the creation of these items, which would be utter nonsense for a drow wizard or priestess to do - for why would they want their warrior et al without weapons in "sunshine" fighting for their cause?
As I said, there was no rule denying drow at any stage in D&D to use normal magical items either, so there never was a need to bring something to the surface to make them function. Much of what we read in novels concerning this topic is flair stuff and, of course, meant to elevate the protagonist(s) into some special in-novel position. Whether that in-novel position does indeed mean something special in-setting is another matter. Hence I'm being very careful with assuming that certain characters have to be this or that (just check the other thread where people muse about Zaknafein being "good") because of deeds done in a novel, deeds to entertain the readership - no matter whether they relate to in-game possible stuff or not. In the Yor'thae's case we have been given in-setting confirmation that her role was special and important. In Liriel's case, she had a mission which she carried out (if unwittingly) for Lolth. Does that make her "a Chosen" though? In-setting?
Lolth's greater plan for her? Well, it was Liriel who banished Shakti to the Abyss, so that the latter could bring back a certain priestess. (BTW, this actually confirmed that some of Lolth priestesses are indeed turned into yochlol.) I for one see still no "special" powers in Liriel, i.e. none that cannot be explained by a) her class levels, b ) station as House Baenre noble (i.e. access to some special stuff) or c) an odd (author-given!) favour by her then patron. Nor can I remember one. Even if there were, it does not mean that everyone bestowed with such things is be default a "Chosen" (in terms of the list), though he/she/it may indeed be chosen by the deity for some plan.
The out-of character lines in Resurrection, not the musings of Inthracis or Vhaeraun tell us what Yor'thae means ... and as I said, there is no reason to believe that Chosen need to have "special powers" like those of Mystra to be accounted as such. Just take those of Mask or Finder if need be. Obviously, that quote of yours indicated to me that the Yor'thae chosen at the end was for more a true Chosen than any of the others mentioned. An embodiment of what Lolth stands for, no less.
Anyway, it is not my mission to convince you or yours to convince me. If you feel fine with your explanations, fair enough.
*Do note that throughout 3E there was no consensus about the drow language, whether it was just a dialect of Elven (able to be understood by all who can speak "Elven"), its own language, whether drow actually spoke Undercommon as their main tongue and "Elven" too etc.pp.. Not even the last drow sourcebook made any definite statements ... and 4E did away with it all again, having the drow back at "Elven". This is just to show how indecisive designers as well as authors where and are. The drow items thing is not disimilar to this.
Also - not entirly connected - probably a completly different topic - assuming a Bhaalspawn and a Chosen of (insert diety here) - would meet in battle, what would most likely be the outcome ?
- Tigrius
I'm just not seeing Yamun as a Chosen - he didn't display any powers other then ferocity in battle and courage... which aren't really all that out-of-the-ordinary for Tuigan. Obould could make a better claim then Yamun.
Who the hell thought that, anyway?
-Rotting Jack, Orcus' proxy that Kiaransalee took when she slew him. Proxy and Chosen being synonymous, Rotting Jack is/was Kiaransalee's Chosen.
-Who is not a Chosen of Lolth. She was Lolth's 'Chosen One'.
Are you making up the rules here?
Shouldn't that mean 'Rotting Jack' was a Chosen of Orcus, NOT Kiaransalee? I'm not arguiing with you - I am unfamiliar with the story behind this - but on the surface it would seem the other way-around.
Also, why are you choosing to differentiate between 'Chosen' and 'Chosen One'? While it is not neccessarily true that one equates to the other, it does NOT preclude it either, so she should go on the list of 'possibles' (although that honor would have been short-lived... what was it? A couple of minutes?)
I noticed both here, and on wikipedia - there isnt listed any chosen of Lathander (my favorite Diety) - has he never had any, or ?
-Lathander has no known Chosen, no.
Also - not entirly connected - probably a completly different topic - assuming a Bhaalspawn and a Chosen of (insert diety here) - would meet in battle, what would most likely be the outcome ?
-There are too many variables to give an answer.
I think that Paladin in Threat from the Sea is a FAR more likely candidate then Yamun Kahan. Can't remember his name ATM, nor which god (maybe the Mrninglord?). I personally was hoping that he would be a Paladin of Umberlee, which would be something surprising and different, but the ending turned out to be the usual snore-fest. Paladins of good gods... they're are a dime-a-dozen, and about as interesting as an old shoe.
I'm just not seeing Yamun as a Chosen - he didn't display any powers other then ferocity in battle and courage... which aren't really all that out-of-the-ordinary for Tuigan. Obould could make a better claim then Yamun.
-Yamun Khahan withstands being struck from a thunderbolt from the sky, after which he replies (to Koja, I believe) that Teylas (Akadi) has chosen him, and that it is his destiny to become the emperor of the entire world.
Are you making up the rules here?
Shouldn't that mean 'Rotting Jack' was a Chosen of Orcus, NOT Kiaransalee? I'm not arguiing with you - I am unfamiliar with the story behind this - but on the surface it would seem the other way-around.
Also, why are you choosing to differentiate between 'Chosen' and 'Chosen One'? While it is not neccessarily true that one equates to the other, it does NOT preclude it either, so she should go on the list of 'possibles' (although that honor would have been short-lived... what was it? A couple of minutes?)
-On Hallowed Ground, page 100: "Kiaransalee has several known Proxies...Rotting Jack is the steward of Kiaransalee's palace in Naratyr, in the City of the Dead, while Anasta of Eight Eyes tends the castle known as the Forbidden Castle."
-Rotting Jack is also featured in the adventures in which Orcus returns. His status, afterwards, is not determined, as far as know.
-Nothing has ever been stated to connect her and Shar, let alone her being a Chosen of Shar. The closest one, in theory, who could be a Chosen of Shar would be her son, Rivalen, but he's just a priest, and there's no indication that he's a Chosen, so...
Perhaps this new information will prove helpful in establishing Rivalen's status as Shar's Chosen. It also may give some indication as to Lady Tanthul's religious alignment:
Spoilers from Shadowrealm
Telamont's wife, whose name I am unfamiliar with, was not presented as being affiliated in any way with Shar in this novel. I'm not sure how this meshes with established sources, but Prince Brennus remembers his mother as a bright, happy, cheerful, and loving person, in contrast with all his other family members. Very "un-Shar-like", indeed.
Brennus was horrified to learn that it had been Rivalen, his favorite brother, who had murdered his beloved mother all those centuries ago. Rivalen had thereby been fully initiated into Shar's faith. This murder was his personal secret shared only with Shar, though afterward learned by others, including Lord Telamont, to whom Shar revealed the truth. I mention this only as interesting background, as it seems fairly common for Shar to have here worshippers murder one another, and it proves nothing as to Lady Tanthul's religious devotions. Again, though, she was presented as anything but a Sharran in this novel.
As to Rivalen's being Shar's Chosen, he eventually tested the theory. In the scene when Erevis and Riven defeat Kesson Rel, they are able to claim the divine essence of Mask due to their being his Chosen. Knowing now the connection between Shar and Mask (Mask is in effect a god because of "stealing away" with some of Shar's power), Rivalen gambles that the artifact used by Mask's Chosen could work equally as well for Shar's Chosen.
On page 296 of the paperback we read: "'I am your Chosen, or I am your failure,' Rivalen said to Shar." Rivalen was correct on all counts, and is in fact Shar's Chosen. He is also now a demi-god. I've wondered if this is what the FRCG is referring to where it says "Rivalen's miraculous powers also protect the Princes of Shade from violent death--and he makes sure they know it". Perhaps it's his divinity, and not his divine spells, that allow him to provide such protection?
Brennus was horrified to learn that it had been Rivalen, his favorite brother, who had murdered his beloved mother all those centuries ago. Rivalen had thereby been fully initiated into Shar's faith. This murder was his personal secret shared only with Shar, though afterward learned by others, including Lord Telamont, to whom Shar revealed the truth. I mention this only as interesting background, as it seems fairly common for Shar to have here worshippers murder one another, and it proves nothing as to Lady Tanthul's religious devotions. Again, though, she was presented as anything but a Sharran in this novel.
As to Rivalen's being Shar's Chosen, he eventually tested the theory. In the scene when Erevis and Riven defeat Kesson Rel, they are able to claim the divine essence of Mask due to their being his Chosen. Knowing now the connection between Shar and Mask (Mask is in effect a god because of "stealing away" with some of Shar's power), Rivalen gambles that the artifact used by Mask's Chosen could work equally as well for Shar's Chosen.
On page 296 of the paperback we read: "'I am your Chosen, or I am your failure,' Rivalen said to Shar." Rivalen was correct on all counts, and is in fact Shar's Chosen. He is also now a demi-god. I've wondered if this is what the FRCG is referring to where it says "Rivalen's miraculous powers also protect the Princes of Shade from violent death--and he makes sure they know it". Perhaps it's his divinity, and not his divine spells, that allow him to provide such protection?
-I haven't read the book, so I am not reading that spoiler. That said, I did not receive the book for Christmas/Hanukkah, so I am going to pick it up some time between now and the new year.
Fair enough. Learning to create those SPOILER BLOCKS was one of the most important things this young member learned so many years ago.
I think you'll really enjoy the book. Paul's a very good writer, and he's created quite the story.
I noticed both here, and on wikipedia - there isnt listed any chosen of Lathander (my favorite Diety) - has he never had any, or ?
Some have speculated on this. But as LK notes above, there has been no official Chosen for Lathander.
-Yamun Khahan withstands being struck from a thunderbolt from the sky, after which he replies (to Koja, I believe) that Teylas (Akadi) has chosen him, and that it is his destiny to become the emperor of the entire world.
Yamun is an interesting case. Though, according to the Spellbound boxed set and its associated adventure modules... Yamun is a ghost now -- which may make his possible status as a 'Chosen'... somewhat fickle. It certainly doesn't discount the possibility, but it does make it interesting, as I said.
I think you'll really enjoy the book. Paul's a very good writer, and he's created quite the story.
-Indeed. I was planning to pick it up, I just wanted to wait after the holidays, to make sure that I didn't buy it, and then receive it as a gift.
Yamun is an interesting case. Though, according to the Spellbound boxed set and its associated adventure modules... Yamun is a ghost now -- which may make his possible status as a 'Chosen'... somewhat fickle. It certainly doesn't discount the possibility, but it does make it interesting, as I said.
-Sylûne was a ghost, though, I never realized that Yamun's "fate" was ever given much thought, other than "He's dead".
-Opens interesting possibilities, concerning his son(s), though, that I might bring up in the Kara-Tur project.
-Sylûne was a ghost...
True. Though I've always felt that had more to do with Sylûne's unique relationship with Mystra. As we know, the Chosen of the Lady of Mysteries are somewhat different to most of the Chosen of other deities.
My thinking is based mostly on Ed's theory that Sylûne was, perhaps, "ready" for another step in the progression or 'life-cycle' of a Chosen of Mystra -- ascending to another form of existence more closely bound to the Weave.
As Ed said:- "And that the Weave itself, or Mystra’s innermost self, or Ao or some greater power or intellect, was aware of this, and saw Sylune’s transformation as necessary."
I doubt Yamun would've experienced the same kind of progression. Which adds to the "fickleness" I mentioned earlier when determining his Chosen status while he remains incorporeal.
True. Though I've always felt that had more to do with Sylûne's unique relationship with Mystra. As we know, the Chosen of the Lady of Mysteries are somewhat different to most of the Chosen of other deities.
-And, as we all know, I call that BS, and make no distinction. ;) :P
-Which specific adventures was this?
-Oh, wait. I think I misunderstood. The adventures within the set, we're talking about, or something separate from Spellbound?
GEV
Where are the Chosen of Erevan Ilesere and Corellon Larethian stated? I would like to read these sources. Are they novels or accessories? Thanks!
GEV
Euzaebus the Sly proxy of Erevan Ilesere - On Hallowed Ground, p26.
-On Hallowed Ground, page 100: "Kiaransalee has several known Proxies...Rotting Jack is the steward of Kiaransalee's palace in Naratyr, in the City of the Dead, while Anasta of Eight Eyes tends the castle known as the Forbidden Castle."
-Rotting Jack is also featured in the adventures in which Orcus returns. His status, afterwards, is not determined, as far as know.
And still it is all but Core and Planescape stuff, nothing to do with the Chosen of the FR deities. Else, much of the info on the Demonweb Pits and - say - Eclavdra and other Lolthite high-ups in there would have a say into FR affairs or made e.g. an appearance in the WotSQ series et al?! They did not and for a reason.
And still it is all but Core and Planescape stuff, nothing to do with the Chosen of the FR deities. Else, much of the info on the Demonweb Pits and - say - Eclavdra and other Lolthite high-ups in there would have a say into FR affairs or made e.g. an appearance in the WotSQ series et al?! They did not and for a reason.
Hmmm don't know about that, I've not read the novels of WotSQ. Did the characters in this story go to Thanatos?
Hmmm don't know about that, I've not read the novels of WotSQ. Did the characters in this story go to Thanatos?
No, absolutely not. They only ventured through the Demonweb Pits, who - by LK's reasoning - would also be stuffed with all the high-up's of Lolth's faith (like said Eclavdra, Laveth and others (see FC I or Expedition to the Demonweb Pits), but it wasn't. Even AD&D - Planescape made a strict distinction between the various settings, even though some material was used by e.g. Greyhawk or the Realms. There is a co-existing Kiaransalee in Greyhawk ("Core") as well as the Realms in AD&D and 3E, much like Lolth. The story of her quarrels with Orcus extends to both worlds or rather settings too, as it apparently happens in Planescape lands "above" both settings. Yet, by default, the death of the Faerûnian Kia (LP II) will have no effects on the "other" Kia. That has AFAIK always been the case, unless a deity is being slain in its ("Planescape") homeworld. This did not happen here though. Anyway, with regard to this "Chosen of Kiaransalee", who is but a proxy and nothing more, he never made an appearance in anything FR-ish and LK is actually doing quite a bit of conjecture to get him into a Realmspace position of a Chosen.
If you subscribe to the view proxies and the like are chosen, you'll need to add Khamallan Teken proxie of Malar, found hunting across Colothys, fourth layer of Carceri - On Hallowed Ground p26.
-I need to go through the book again. There's quite a few I missed. I primarily mined it for Demihuman deities.
And still it is all but Core and Planescape stuff, nothing to do with the Chosen of the FR deities.
-Planescape, materials published in the 2e era, when settings were interconnected, and thus, official and having an impact on the Forgotten Realms. Again.
Is it safe to say that Mister Cale's son is Mask's fifth Chosen?
-No, not really, unless something else is revealed in the last book, which I am in the process of reading.
-Planescape, materials published in the 2e era, when settings were interconnected, and thus, official and having an impact on the Forgotten Realms. Again.
In your Realms, at least. We have, of course, moved on to 3,xE and disconnected cosmology et al. Debated a hundred times or so.
Anyway, hope you enjoyed Shadowstorm. One of the finest FR novels (series) and a really satisfying end to this story, IMHO.
Would it be too much if I ask for information on Ilyrana Moonflower?
-The novel Evermeet: Island of the Elves.
Anyway, hope you enjoyed Shadowstorm. One of the finest FR novels (series) and a really satisfying end to this story, IMHO.
Cross posted from Candlekeep: The next trilogy will build off of the events of the Twilight War. Some characters will recur, others will be entirely new. The new trilogy is entitled, "The Cycle of Night," and the individual book titles are: Godborn, Godbound, and Godslayer.
Paul
Sounds very interesting.
Cross posted from Candlekeep: The next trilogy will build off of the events of the Twilight War. Some characters will recur, others will be entirely new. The new trilogy is entitled, "The Cycle of Night," and the individual book titles are: Godborn, Godbound, and Godslayer.
Paul
Sounds very interesting.
Anything that includes god and slayer does not eaxctly ring well in my ears these days.
BTW, I beg your pardon folks, I was referring to Shadowrealm!
Have you finished that third book yet, LK?
-No, not yet. I'm working on it.
Nope. I think thats for individual DM's to decide for their games.
Nay, that's not Eberron, after all! I would assume that Ed only agreed to the disappearance of the Seven Sisters if he was given the right to tell us about their fates in person.
I'd add Drizzt to the chosen of mielikki evidince in companions and neverwinter .....