Delta was kind enough to post this:
57195998 wrote:
I thik it happened outside of time.
Youre probably right there, but it's effects were felt on the Prime Material Plane, or Mortal Realms, or what ever you want to call it. So it had to happen at some point at time, or at least started, it may have lasted hundreds of mortal years, possibly creating a sort of ripple effect. It was said that Tyche split as a result of the Dawn Cataclysm, so when exactly is that? That would definitely effect the mortal world.
Theres this bit in the Grand History about the last Chosen of Tyche dying 9 times in the coils of Moander in the year of the Hangman's Noose. 161 DR, so I guess that year has some weight after all.
It also mentions Azouns birthyear as 1307. So yeah I dont know where they get 1282 on the Conspectus timeline, maybe it was prophesised that Rhigaerd II's soon to be born son would become the next king in that year?
Ok so there it is, and no mention at all of the Dawn Cataclysm. So anybody have a clue when exactly it did happen?
Page 64 of the GHotR pretty much states no one( atleast among the mortals) has a clue when it happened.
"After the fall of Netheril and before the founding of Myth Drannor, the gods of the Realms battled in the Dawn Cataclysm, foreshadowing the destruction that would occur as a result of the Fall of the Gods in the Year of Shadows. Gods were slain in battles that shook the Realms, new deities were created, and Tyche was sundered into Tymora and Beshaba. During this time of turmoil, two gods elevated by Mystra at different times to aid her by overseeing the portfolio of wizards battled for supremacy. Azuth defeated Savras the All-Seeing and imprisoned his essence within a powerful artifact he had constructed prior to the conflict."
The fall of Jhaamdath was supposed to play in there somehow too, which happened in -255 DR.
And I still think Jergal giving up his divinity to Bane, Bhaal, and Mykrrul have something to do with it too, dont know when that was, but there is a bit in the Grand History about them killing Borem of the Lake of Boiling Mud in -359 DR.
So im guessing it lasted a while, or had long lasting effects, or perhaps some sort of ripple efect.
Well the Dawn Cataclysm still could have instegated a kind of Clash of the Pantheons.
Unless Umberlee was also part of the Jaamdathi pantheon.
You are very correct. Although, the Dawn Cataclysm may have been more of a symptom of this clash, rather than the cause of it. The fall of Netheril and Jhaamdath displaced large populations of people, and as these folks mixed and mingled, once disparate populations of humans now began to form a greater Faerûnian super-culture. This resulted in the pantheons clashing, combining and merging, and the various ideas and ideals of these peoples (embodied in their gods) fought for supremacy.
Races of Faerûn talks about this to some extent. It's worth a read.
So the question is then, how did the Talfiric pantheon got involved in the Nethrese, Jaamdathi mish-mash?
The Netherese fleeing Nethril after Karsus Folly...?
Homebrewing is fun!
They couldn't tell the difference between Szam Tam and Larloch.
Is he Szass Tam's Marco Volo?
As for how worthwhile it is to work out the history of the Dawn Cataclysm, like Delta said, homebrewing is fun.
Some things Im not sure about though, like ok we know it was a Godswar going on, and Pantheons were merged, altered, and destroyed, but really wouldnt that have happened anyway with the migration of peoples? I dont see how the Dawn Cataclysm necessarily plays into that.
The Fall of Jhaamdath is also attributed to the Dawn Cataclysm, possibly happening indirectly as a result of Lathander/Aumanator's actions. But from what I understand about it, the Fall of Jhaamdath happened because some Elven High Mages didnt like the place or what ever and used High Magic to sink it beneath the waves. So again im not sure how the Dawn Cataclysm plays into that.
And as i mentioned before, Tyche getting split in 2 was supposed to have had something to do with the Dawn Cataclysm as well, but that happened because she was tainted by Moander, and Selune blasted the taint out of her, but in the process split her in two, so again Im not sure how the Dawn Cataclysm, or Lathander/Amaunator could be held responsible for that.
Its not so much the when that I really want to know, its the what, why, and the how? What exactly did Lathander/Amaunator do that caused all this to happen? I understand that Lathander was trying to recreate Faerun in his own image, sounds like what Szass Tam was trying to do as well, but how did that cause Moander to infect Tyche, and the Elves to decide to sink Jhaamdath? Unless the Elves were working for Lathander? Maybe Lathander is just an aspect of one of the Seldarine? Eh, I'll shut up now, Im not really helping just adding more questions!
The High Forest to the north with the High Moor in the way
Cormyr to the east depending on the time frame.
The Weldeath to the south.
The Talfiric peoples were in the present day Western Heartlands/Fields of the Dead.
I also wonder what the Shadowking and the Empire of Ebonfar played in it.
They spoke Talfiric (or Talfir) a language which is now extinct--although I am sure certain words of Talfiric origin have been preserved in successor languages in the Heartlands.
Not much remains of this culture. The people are still around, they are just interbred with other human ethnic groups. It does mention that perhaps the first human to master Shadow Magic was a Talfiric monarch named Verraketh the Shadowking, whose tomb lies beneath the modern city of Iriaebor. Oh, and there is a ruined city by the name of Talis that lies along the banks of the River Reaching in the depths of the Reaching Woods.
Is there anywhere some info on a sun related elven deity?
Labelas Enoreth?
his title is the Sage at Sunset and is one of the sun elven favorite gods, also that would explain why the timeline is messed up, and I think he was worshipped by humans as Chronos, Amaunator could be somehow related to all this too
"No doubt the Vigilant One would be chagrined to learn that Lathander has, since the Time of Troubles, been working on some of the incantations and machinations that brought about that catastrophe so long ago." -pg 38
Hmmmm, you know this has got me thinking, maybe it wasnt Cyric and Shar that started the whole Spellplague thing after all, maybe it was Lathander/Amaunator all along, messing around with forces that even he can not comprehend.
Other than that, what Aegeri said.
Lathander strikes me as bold, and well intentioned, but not necessarily the wisest of deities. In my mind, Lathander's partner in the Dawn Cataclysm was Murdane, Jhaamdathan goddess of reason and pragmatism. I think her keen sense of strategy and wisdom tempered Lathander's boldness and gave him valuable counsel and direction. I see Murdane as Lathander's primary general in prosecuting the war. When Umberlee slew Murdane, Lathander's plan fell apart, turning his Dawn Campaign into a cataclysm.
Now that Lathander has metamorphosed into Amaunator, hopefully he is a more moderate, stable deity.