Now I'm not an expert. But, I figure that with the help of the fine, fine people on the boards that have those books and a good grasp of the 4e Realms (and it's history), we might be able to make a comprehensive collection of where they could be if people wished to use them.
You can feel free to change the names of people and places, but fitting them in with the least amount of changes is preferable.
Also, it's ok to have suggestions on areas already covered. Having more then one place to put a lair or delve gives DM's more options.
I'll put up a list of them as they come up, along with links to the posts that cover them.
Thank you, in advance, for your participation in this endeavor.
coming soon!
Also coming soon!
again with the soon to be coming!
-You'll have to share the locales/NPCs in those adventures. I don't have them, so I don't know.
Will do. I'm watching the kids solo and feeding my youngest at the present, so it will have to wait a bit.
sorry
I am going to use the 14th level Dungeon Delve as a part of my Thunder Peaks/Cormyr/Bloodthorn Labrynth area. Instaed of a fortress, the delve is part of a tomb for the Drow killing name named Craemmol, the same dwarf who has a hammer named after him. I believe Diffan updated the weapon for the 4th edition.
The party will stop here on the way to Phaervorul, the Drow City featured in the P2 Module, Demon's Queen Enclave. I plan to switch the umber hulks with some savage minotaurs. This change will make a stronger connection to the Bloodhorn region. In addition, if you are familiar with P2, I will replace the name of the dwarven explorer, Goldrun Coinkeeper, with Cremmol. I plan to have the party discover the hammer inside the tomb.
Well, that's one adaptation of Dungeon Delve.
The undead nation of Hantumah is also based on a Realms nation (no, not Thay!), but since the names have been changed (to protect the innocent) it will be much harder to identify.
I'll get the lists and suggestions up tommorow... kids are having their way with me today.
Bloodtower on the Moorland from Open Grave should be easy to place. It's locale has already appeared on a recent Realms map.
Which map?
You should know by now you can't use that word around me. :P
The undead nation of Hantumah is also based on a Realms nation (no, not Thay!), but since the names have been changed (to protect the innocent) it will be much harder to identify.
Halruaa?
Which map?
You should know by now you can't use that word around me. :P
lol, I'd like to know as well...
Halruaa?
Hmm... maybe. I'm currently re-reading AGHotR, trying to find the reference.
My first thoughts was about the Kara-Tur area.
It's North by North west of Elversult, in the Gritstone Moorland.
Can be found in the Backdrop: Cormyr article.
I'm almost done reading the GHotR front to back, but haven't seen more then one or two things that it 'might' be, if they re-flavored it a lot...
*sigh* I have baby duty and haven't had time to do much, but after I finish that book, I'll be re-reading both the FRCG and FRPG...
If anyone finds the connection, please post it. I... feel compelled to find this information. *grrr*
Tan Chin seems to have invaded those regions with undead armies about a decade before the SP.
As for Bloodtower - how old is that ruin? Would it have existed in 3e?
If its in the East, my best guess is that it's Guge, or rather, the mountains around Guge (Kahazari and ra-Khati).
Tan Chin seems to have invaded those regions with undead armies about a decede before the SP.
Thanks, I'll keep an eye out for this area...
As for Bloodtower - how old is that ruin? Would it have existed in 3e?
If it follows the story in Open Grave, then yes, it should have existed before. But it was sunken in the moorland until recently.
PG 146, GHotR;
1360 DR Year of the Turret
The lich Tin Chin (posing as one Raja Ambuchar Devayam) marches an undead army against Ra-Khati and settlements within Katakoro Plateau.
Also, in 1362 DR Year of the Helm, adventurers using the Stone Scepter of Shih slay him.
This follows the fluff for the Open Grave info almost to a tee. I still have to read and see if the realm stays as an undead nation and if the lich possesses the four, but it fits otherwise.
Anyhow, I don't think that posting maps from books is legal (especially not here), but obviously posting the cover of a book is legal, so why not the back cover as well?
This is the back-cover of the 1990 Forgotten Realms Atlas. Note the region at the bottom. ;)
The Katakoro Plateau is the entire region surrounding by mountains, and is also the former region of the Fallen nation of Guge.
Nice research guys. Hantumah is/was Ra-Khati and the surrounding region.
Thanks... but question; Is it on the 4e map?
Thanks... but question; Is it on the 4e map?
-If it's a generic product, then, no, it isn't on the Forgotten Realms map. And, if it is a generic product, there is no specific generic world, so it can be on some theoretical maps, not other theoretical maps, and on and on and on.
Thanks... but question; Is it on the 4e map?
Is Hantumah on the 4e Realms map? No, the map included in the FRCG doesn't go that far east.
-If it's a generic product, then, no, it isn't on the Forgotten Realms map. And, if it is a generic product, there is no specific generic world, so it can be on some theoretical maps, not other theoretical maps, and on and on and on.
It was fr place made generic.
Is Hantumah on the 4e Realms map? No, the map included in the FRCG doesn't go that far east.
This true. krownhunter07 you find it east of endless waste/hordland. MarkusTay63 give map in post before. You go look and find Ra-Khati hidden in hills east of Jampa river gorge.
It is just off the eastern edge of the naked Hordelands map I did for 4e players.
Bare Old Empires
I'm looking through Open Grave now for further placements.
I think Sandstone Catacombs would work well in Phlan, on the north coast of the Moonsea. Thats a city thats been destroyed several times, built on top of the older ones. Then again, nearly any Moonsea locale would work (including Hulburg, which featured prominently in Swordmage).
Here is my version of Guge, which I am in the process of updating on the Hordelands map.
It is just off the eastern edge of the naked Hordelands map I did for 4e players.
Bare Old Empires
I'm looking through Open Grave now for further placements.
I think Sandstone Catacombs would work well in Phlan, on the north coast of the Moonsea. Thats a city thats been destroyed several times, built on top of the older ones. Then again, nearly any Moonsea would work (including Hulburg, which featured prominently in Swordmage).
Slik road is golden way yes?
The Silk Road is the southern route, coming out of the Old Empires/Shining Lands.
The Golden Way is MUCH further north (it actually runs north of the Dragonwall).
No.
The Silk Road is the southern route, coming out of the Old Empires/Shining Lands.
The Golden Way is MUCH further north (it actually runs north of the Dragonwall).
Thank you for information.
"Where in the Realms is..." Carmen Sandiego.
Curse you, Robot Chicken!
A little off topic, but when I first saw the cut off thread title, I thought:
"Where in the Realms is..." Carmen Sandiego.
Curse you, Robot Chicken!
lol, that was the inspiration for the title. Glad someone noticed.
;)
So, I was brainstorming some possible ideas about the origins of the Bloodtower. It sank several hundred years ago. Why? Did agents from nearby Proskur or Eversult view the tower enough of a threat to sink it? In a previous thread there was a discussion about Sunlord Daelegoth Orndeir and his epic spell, Amauntor's enternal sun, that he cast over Eversult. This was presented in the book Power of Faerun. So does a permanent sun still hover over Eversult?
I have heared no metion of this in the 4e Realms. Anyway, this Sunlord would certainly not like having an organization of Necormancers so close to his beloved Eversult and home for the rising Church of Amauntor. So in 1374 DR, as a conssequence of casting the burning sun epic spell, the Bloodhorn submerged in into the Gritstone Moorland. Sound reasonable?
Also, in room 16 there are three teleporation circles. One leads to room 17. The other two other palces determined by the DM. What do you think would be suitable locations? Obviously, the society of necromancers that once ruled the Bloodtower should be fleshed out a little more.
Any suggestions?
Thanks
Great thread for far, guys. I puchased Open Grave purely based on the discussions here regarding the Bloodtower. I am running a campaign in the Dragon Coast/Cormyr/Thunder Peaks area, so when I saw that Black Petal was a Bleth and the tower was located in the Dragon Coast, I had to buy the product.
Awesome, glad you like it so far... I just have to get the time to work on the OP.
So, I was brainstorming some possible ideas about the origins of the Bloodtower. It sank several hundred years ago. Why? Did agents from nearby Proskur or Eversult view the tower enough of a threat to sink it? In a previous thread there was a discussion about Sunlord Daelegoth Orndeir and his epic spell, Amauntor's eternal sun, that he cast over Eversult. This was presented in the book Power of Faerun. So does a permanent sun still hover over Eversult?
I had an idea of why it sank, now I just have to remember.
As to the eternal sun, I think it was changed to be over Elturgard.
Anyway, this Sunlord would certainly not like having an organization of Necormancers so close to his beloved Eversult and home for the rising Church of Amauntor. So in 1374 DR, as a conssequence of casting the burning sun epic spell, the Bloodhorn submerged in into the Gritstone Moorland. Sound reasonable?
It could be possible, but the second sun is noth east of the area.
Also, in room 16 there are three teleporation circles. One leads to room 17. The other two other palces determined by the DM. What do you think would be suitable locations? Obviously, the society of necromancers that once ruled the Bloodtower should be fleshed out a little more.
Any suggestions?
Thanks
Hmm, maybe one could lead to the Vast Swamp, where the portal to the shadowfell is as suggested for the KoTS adventure?
The second... Skullport? I'll have to think about it.
Hmm, I always thought to put the Tomb of Horrors in the vast swamp, I guess it could be, but ehh.
It could be possible, but the second sun is noth east of the area.
You are correct. I just read under the Eltugard section in the 4e realms book about the enternal sun. That kind of puts a hole into my theory that Bloodtower was sunk by the creation of the eternal sun. After all, the Bloodtower is about 300 miles away from Eltugard. I suppose there could be a link between the two events, but the proxmity to Eversult would work way better. So I guess I need to think of a better reason for the destruction of the necromancer cult than the rising of the eternal sun.
The Vast swamp seems to be a good portal destination. We need to think of the other one......
There was an 'unknown Mage' of great power (Trying to find his name ATM) who united all the tribes of the Stonelands and Goblin Marches and drove them west, where he met defeat at the Battle of Bones.
I think the 'Bloodtower' would have been the perfect 'home' for that guy, and it sank, possibly, when he died (either the magics that mainatined it above the swamps failed, or some sort of contingency kicked-in).
I'm not familiar with the adventure - is there still a Lich or something in there?
I'm not familiar with the adventure - is there still a Lich or something in there?
No lich, just zombies, skeletons, a boneclaw, and other minions of the Black Petal. The history mentions that the group of necromancers were led by someone named Mervaun. I don't know if this has any relevance in the history of the Realms.
I will investigate the whole battle of the bones angle.
In centuries past the Bloodtower was home to a society of necromancers and pale masters known as the Companions of the Pallid Mask. The members of this cloistered sect, easily recognized by their smooth shaved heads, unadorned gray robes, and white gloves, were known for their expertise in combating and commanding undead.
In time, one among them rose from obscurity to lead the order. His name was Nulathoe the Doomscribe, and his expertise in the fields of necrology and demonology were unparalleled. Many of the necromantic spells used today by wizards and warlocks were first penned by this inscrutable individual.
For reasons unknown the Bloodtower inexplicably vanished into the moor several centuries past. The necromancer Nulathoe and his Companions of the Pallid Mask were never seen or heard from again
Here's info on the group... err, a little info, I'll find more.
A handful of Jergal's followers still follow the old ways of the Companions of the Pallid Mask, an order whose members specialized in combating or commanding the undead whose existence was not sanctioned by the church or who had proven to be troublesome.
and
Records of the Jergali church speak of two now-extinct affiliated groups: the Companions of the Pallid Mask and the Hand of Jergal. The Companions of the Pallid Mask were a group of Jergali priests who specialized in combating or commanding the undead. They eliminated undead creatures whose existence was not sanctioned by the church or who had proved to be troublesome. They also supervised nonsentient undead work crews that the church sometimes ran for profit long ago. The Hand of Jergal was an elite group of fanatic priests who led others under their command to avenge slights upon the church of Jergal at the direction of a high priest. They acted against those of other faiths who raised or resurrected someone without paying due tribute to Jergal or who violated or looted a tomb under the protection of the church.
Interesting note here... not sure if this is the same person, but they share a name and interest in the dark arts.
Nulathoe: Famous today for his ninemen spell (that
makes the bones and sinews of skeletons supple so they
don’t fall apart upon being animated), Nulathoe was a
mage intensely interested in necromancy, who lived in
various places around the Sword Coast North. He created
many strange guardian creatures by combining skeletal
parts from various monsters, and ultimately, as he grew
elderly and frail, prepared his own series of skeletal bodies
to live on in. He’s presumed to have hidden his various
bodies up and down the Sword Coast, and to be inhabiting
them yet, jumping from one to another as he desires.
I'll get the stuff up for that shortly.
Anyways, I have some ideas for a few more in that book.
*Col Fen graveyard could be near Loudwater... or another small town that fits better?
*Sandstone Catacombs could fit nicely under Winterhaven (if someone was to use winterhaven in the Realms, which would be located in the Thunder peaks, as per the 'in the realms' article for KotS)
*Battlefield downs could be in the High Moor or another place that has seen many battles in the past and is a semi out of the way location.
*Mausoleum of Ssra-Tauroch screams Najara to me. Not sure exactly where... could be in Chult as well.
What are your thoughts?
"Several Hundred Years ago" puts the tower closer to the Goblin wars of the (nearby) Stonelands. That sun was only created a century ago.
There was an 'unknown Mage' of great power (Trying to find his name ATM) who united all the tribes of the Stonelands and Goblin Marches and drove them west, where he met defeat at the Battle of Bones.
I think the 'Bloodtower' would have been the perfect 'home' for that guy, and it sank, possibly, when he died (either the magics that mainatined it above the swamps failed, or some sort of contingency kicked-in).
I'm not familiar with the adventure - is there still a Lich or something in there?
I referenced Elminster's ecolgies: Battle of the Bones. THe "unkown mage" who assisted by Goblins was a evil mage from Kara-tur named Ignar Turc Abolin. I suppose he could have been the head of the Bloodtower. He was also reputed to be a lich.
Mervaun should actually be Nulathoe. Here is the unedited background:
I checked out the information provided by Krownhunter regarding Nulathoe in the Magic of Faerun. He seems like a good candidate to be the Bloodtower head honcho. Another than that nineman spell, is there any more info on this guy?
Ok, well seeing as we have a few examples for Open Grave, I think we can tackle that book first.
I'll get the stuff up for that shortly.
Anyways, I have some ideas for a few more in that book.
*Col Fen graveyard could be near Loudwater... or another small town that fits better?
*Sandstone Catacombs could fit nicely under Winterhaven (if someone was to use winterhaven in the Realms, which would be located in the Thunder peaks, as per the 'in the realms' article for KotS)
*Battlefield downs could be in the High Moor or another place that has seen many battles in the past and is a semi out of the way location.
*Mausoleum of Ssra-Tauroch screams Najara to me. Not sure exactly where... could be in Chult as well.
What are your thoughts?
I'd place the Sandstone Catacombs in the Moonsea area (Phlan?) instead of Winterhaven. This would better fit the historical background of the Sandstone Catocombs ("the ruins of at least two long forgotten cities, including a crumbling temple, lie underneath the town"). The Moonsear area has a history of cities being destroyed and built again.
I checked out the information provided by Krownhunter regarding Nulathoe in the Magic of Faerun. He seems like a good candidate to be the Bloodtower head honcho. Another than that nineman spell, is there any more info on this guy?
A quick google search is how I found the info on him... I'll look more indepth.
I'd place the Sandstone Catacombs in the Moonsea area (Phlan?) instead of Winterhaven. This would better fit the historical background of the Sandstone Catocombs ("the ruins of at least two long forgotten cities, including a crumbling temple, lie underneath the town"). The Moonsear area has a history of cities being destroyed and built again.
That is a good idea, I didn't get to the Moonsea yet.
(Having started this, I've been re-reading all of my FR sourcebooks... 2e-4e.
:embarrass
I guess it's a little OCD'ish, but I like to know what I'm talking about.)
That would, IMHO, be an ideal site where the fluff for Kravenghast Necropolis can still be used. Now, in place of them being locked away alone in the ruined city, they are locked away alone in a ruined city overran with undead and lycans that are not aware of them.
It could also be one of very, very few cults of Vecna are hidden in Fearun.
The Cold Fields is a treeless moor south of Harrowdale and north of Scardale known for undead sprites from countless battles fought there. It wouldn't be too hard to add that recently deceased turn into zombies in one area...
* Col Fen would fit somewhere in the Volkumburgh area - somewhere along the vale just off the track towards the East Way.
* Sandstone catacombs. Hm. Depends how much back-story you want to keep. I'd put it much further south, because you're looking for a human civilisation, so down towards the marsh.
* Battlefield downs goes in the Dales alright.
* Bloodtower is covered elsewhere.
* Kravenghast Necropolis would fit in a valley somewhere in the Peaks, again down south, but why bother? They're 19th level. Put it in Chult, whatever.
1. Coppernight Hold fits in nicely somewhere around Archendale.
2. Broken Tower fits in as a ancient defensive tower from the same era as Shadowfell keep, so put it somewhere along the south of Thunder Gap.
3. Orc stronghold - The Lord of Winterhaven would like that tower, abandoned a generation or two ago, back, thank you very much. Place it along the Gap, well south of the road.
4. Raider's hideout - plant rumours of gnollish raids on caravans and it's just a matter of time before Lord Padraic has to have something done about it. The gnolls are refugees from the dungeons under the Bloodhorn, having had a falling out with their clan.
5. ??
6. Threat to Thunderstone's outlying settlements from the Vast Swamp. Or maybe a threat to the Hidden Vale.
I'll update the OP with the Open Grave info soon, but feel free to add ideas from other books, adventures or what-have-you.
Mervaun should actually be Nulathoe. Here is the unedited background:
In centuries past the Bloodtower was home to a society of necromancers and pale masters known as the Companions of the Pallid Mask. The members of this cloistered sect, easily recognized by their smooth shaved heads, unadorned gray robes, and white gloves, were known for their expertise in combating and commanding undead.
In time, one among them rose from obscurity to lead the order. His name was Nulathoe the Doomscribe, and his expertise in the fields of necrology and demonology were unparalleled. Many of the necromantic spells used today by wizards and warlocks were first penned by this inscrutable individual.
For reasons unknown the Bloodtower inexplicably vanished into the moor several centuries past. The necromancer Nulathoe and his Companions of the Pallid Mask were never seen or heard from again.
Question: We know from the Old Grey Box that Nulathoe was Nchaser's tutor. We also know that Nchaser was active up until at least the time of the publication of Magic of Faerun. Does that mean that Nchaser is/was considerably older than we might otherwise think?
He'll have you sticking EVERYTHING in the Thunderpeaks. :P
Heh - I was trying to do what this thread is doing with older 2e stuff this morning. I was trying to fit the Night Below locales into the north (actually, just south of The North :P ), but it was more trouble then it was worth.
But, if anyone has suggestions for other areas and/or places things from other sources, please feel free to do so.
Open Graves is covered (for the most part). But other stuff is waiting for your creativity.