Oeridians are the human race.
Suel are tieflings, corrupted from cavorting with dark powers. The great Suel mages of power were warlocks.
Baklunes are dragonborn. Paynim nomads don’t ride horses, but rather, ride behemoths and dumbed-down dragons with vestigial wings.
Thus the Suel and Baklune Empires are the Greyhawk equivalents for Bael Turath and Arkhosia.
Flan, wood elves, wild elves, valley elves, and grugarch are elves.
High and grey elves are eladrin.
Rhennee are halflings.
Tiger nomads are Razorclaw Shifters.
Wolf nomads are Longtooth Shifters.
Perrenland, Irongate, and Onnwal are dwarves.
Perrenland creates warforged for its mercenary industry, having learned the technique under Igwylv’s domination.
Thillronian barbarians erase all vestiges of Suel nature and are goliaths. Longships full of fierce goliath warriors are a true terror of the Solnor coast.
Olman are Yuan-Ti.
Ull consists of gnolls.
Stonefist consists of ogres.
Gran March is a regimented society of hobgoblins.
Veluna and Almor have deva in positions of power.
Suel being tieflings shows why Wastri is so bigoted, growing from the desperation of the remaining human slaves. Hating tieflings, his bigotry has lumped all demi-humans into the same boat.
Tieflings as Suel present a problem. The Suel Empire would still have been human at some point in the ancient past, whereby the nobility was corrupted/cursed as tieflings. After such corruption, the humans would have still vastly outnumbered the tieflings. However, if Suel across the modern Flaneass are still primarily human, the dehumanization model starts breaking down since there will still be humans everywhere.
Those Suel which migrated prior to the Rain of Colorless Fire would presumably have been of similar demographic make-up as the empire. However, it can be assumed that the Rain of Colorless Fire was felt far more heavily by the poor/slave population of the Suel Empire rather than the nobility, and so, those Suel which migrated through Slerotin's Tunnel could have primarily been composed of the tiefling nobility. Thus, the demographical make-up of the Suel once they had crossed into the Sheldomar Valley could have been somewhat resembling 50/50 tiefling and human.
Of note is that when tieflings and humans mate, their offspring are always tieflings. While in the empire, noble tieflings would have likely felt it beneath them to mate with humans, the cultural devastation that followed the RoCF could very easily have shattered this taboo. Any humans of decent comeliness would have been taken by tieflings. Within a generation or two, the only humans remaining within Suel culture would be those too ugly for anyone to want to mate (further explaining why Wastri the human demi-god is so warty and deformed). Thus, Suel across the Flaneass could reasonably be considered nearly all tieflings.
This is brilliant. Excellent work indeed. A fantastic reinvisioning that uses all of the material available and applies to Oerth in a unique way giving it a new feel. I commend you.
Thank you. Please contribute any ides you may have.
Vecna's empire was pretty much in the area of Gran March during the migrations. With Flan being elves, the battles between Vecna's hobgoblins and Sheldomar elves would have created the hobgoblin hatred of the fey.
Keoland's establishment of the Knights of the March would have been necessary to quell the hobgoblin tribes that would have existed in the wake of Vecna's destruction. Hobgoblins are particularly well suited to follow a strong military leader, and by the time that the leader of the Knights of the March was named commandant of the Gran March many if not most of the knights were likely hobgoblins - particularly the foot soldiers battling alongside the knights.
It is doubtful hobgoblins would have been allowed within the command structure of the Gran March, more or less the commandant having been a hobgoblin. However, once House Neheli gained the throne, Keoland became a slumbering and stagnant land. Commandants would probably have been likewise.
The crowning of King Tavish and threats of the Brazen Horde would have presented the need for a bold, brutal, and efficient commandant. The time would have been ripe for hobgoblins to begin taking their place in leadership.
In all Keoish history, no general is as infamous as Berlikyn. His ravages bespeak an unrestrained hobgoblin commander.
Somewhat curiously, Gran March appears far more interested in ousting the giants from Geoff than Keoland. As a Flan land, Geoff would have been one of the primary elvin outposts in the Sheldomar. Hobgoblins of Gran March, therefore, would want to oust the giants so they could conquer this land of their old elvin enemies. Hochoch has already been all but annexed as a great barony of Gran March.
I've never been fond of multiple human subraces in GH. GH backstory centers around 4 tribes of humans .... and the published products never made their mind up about to what extent the differences between them "mattered". And to top it off the subraces' cultural associations often led to cliched real world knockoffs of limited, not commercially viable, interest.
Suel as Tiefling and Bakluni as Dragonborn, with humanity comprising Oeridian and Flan, is something I've been mulling over for some time too. It fixes a huge amount of obsolete kruft in one fell swoop and replaces it with cool.
And, it makes it easy to insert those races into the setting, and that's important, because my players like the new races. They want to play them. They don't want to be the only dragonborn/tiefling/shifter/whatever they ever see. In any contest between maintaining continuity of setting and accomodating my players, it isn't going to be close. My players win.
I've got a stack of GH stuff going back almost 30 years. I want to keep using it in the 4e era. Example - Dierdre Longland. Was a human female cavalier of Suel origin. Becomes a Tiefling female cavalier. Ding! work is done, time to enjoy a tasty beverage.
And, it adds some spice. Speaking of the Gynarchs of Hardby. They're interesting as magic using human female matriarchs, but they become REALLY INTERESTING as Tiefling female warlocks (witches?
). Now THAT'S cool. Ditto with Scarlet Brotherhood. As Suel supremacists they became overused and tedious and uninteresting. As Tieflings possiblities just spring off the page. Then there's Bakluni. I hate to say it but arabic-themed is a commercial wasteland, and recasting them as Dragonborn descended from an ancient Arkhosia like empire of the west opens up the NW corner of the GH map in ways it never has.
And, nomads as shifters is just plain inspired, excellent thinking 1 eye. The nomads definitely need some love.
Thillonrians as goliaths would be fine, but I also think that Tiefling barbarians would be a hoot
Nerof Gasgal - as the Lord Mayor, he remains human.
Count Reichart Petrides - remains human.
Fioranna Aielestriel - as a gray elf, she becomes an eladrin.
"Aaron Strachan" - becomes a doppelganger instead of using the hat of disguise business.
Chapter 2, Military and the Law
Tigran Gellner - with features of a Suel, he becomes a tiefling.
Sental Nurev - with features of a Suel, he becomes a tiefling.
Derider Fanshen - remains human.
Glodreddi Bakkanin - remains a dwarf.
Sir Garvin Ambus - remains human because his enormous mustache cries for it.
Chapter 3, Mages and Priests
Kieren Jalucian - becomes a tiefling due to Suel features and a romance with Jalarzi.
Darnak Khorshkan - remains a dwarf.
Jawal Severnian - remains a drow.
Kondradis Bubka - remains a human because only a human could pull off being named Bubba, er..Bubka.
Heironymous Tigana - becomes an actual gnome instead of just looking like one.
Tobin Pontriades - remains a human.
Mordenkainen - remains a human because, well, he is Mordenkainen.
Tenser - becomes a deva since he is Mr. Goody-Goody. This also explains why Tuerny would be so interested in turning him into a dretch.
Bigby - remains a human, he is an exiled Aerdy after all.
Otto - becomes a dwarf despite his joviality because he is corpulent, enjoys over-eating, an would be a fun play against type.
Drawmij - becomes a tiefling due to his Suel features and connection to south Keoland becoming dominated by tieflings.
Nystul - becomes an elf since Flan are now elves and he hails from Tenh.
Rary - becomes a dragonborn since he is Baklune. After he destroys a large portion of the city, Greyhawkers will likely become quite bigoted against dragonborn.
Otiluke - becomes a halfling due to his small stature.
Jallarzi Sallavarian - becomes a tiefling due to her Suel features and that she would be sexy with a tail.
Ravel Dasinder - becomes a tiefling due to his Suel features.
Sarana - remains a human.
Jerome Kazinskaia - remains a human.
Janziduur - becomes a dragonborn since he hails from Bissel (with Bissel having a fair dragonborn population), his name is somewhat exotic, and that there are not too many opportunities for Dragonborn in Folk, Fueds, and Factions.
Chapter 4, Guilds of Greyhawk
Selczek Gobayuik - remains a half-orc.
Ren o' the Star - remains a half-elf.
Chapter 5, Low Life
Org Nenshen - becomes a tiefling due to Suel features.
Pavel Alektrion - becomes an eladrin due to his flamboyancy and taste for the finer things in life.
Tomas Ratek - becomes a half-orc due to being a thug through and through.
Sharyn Messandier - remains a human since she believes herself a chosen of Kurell (a decidedly Oeridian, and therefore human, god.
Repnel Porton - becomes a dwarf based on his shaggy beard and that a dwarf would make a fun character to collect protection money.
Simpkin Furzear - remains a halfling.
Larrat Helfdene - remains a human.
Turin Deathstalker - remains a human because he is so cool it would be a shame to change him in any way.
Vesparian Lafanel - becomes an eladrin since he was a grey elf.
Caprica Molara - remains a human because it keeps with the commoner-in-the-crowd thing she has going on.
Gaspar - becomes a dwarf because the bald, overweight, gaudily dressed king of trash needs to be.
Haarkon Diardra - becomes a dragonborn since he is a Baklune.
Simeon Hellwater - remains a human.
Diarmid Hesperion - becomes a half-orc because it goes with the missing eye.
Zoran Sarraith - becomes a halfling since Rhennee are now halflings.
Old Mother Grubb - remains a human vampire.
Kaarain Mandair - remains a human so she can remain innocent and naive of appearance.
Clannair Blackshadow - remains a drow.
Imogen Gellet - remains a human so she can still gain the eye of most fellows.
Harral Shastri - becomes a doppelganger since at least one member of the Shapechangers needs to actually be one.
Tarnek McGloogan - becomes a goliath so he can really be a big, mean hombre.
Samrad Bevrain - becomes a dark one to hype up the creepiness of the master of monsters as he slinks around the sewers.
Maritai Jaruman - remains a human.
Agarat Esiassen - remains a human due to his typical Oeridian features.
Kaak-erek Arglowan - remains a hobgoblin.
Xanthi Lamman - becomes a shadar kai because it only enhances her terrifying appearance and desire to spend all her time under the city.
Garyne - becomes a shadar kai as well.
Jamir Rellstar - becomes a gnome due to being a small man and the general awesomeness of an evil Nerull-following gnome.
Grotnek Urtekknis - remains a half-orc.
A few things that will need to be fleshed out.
> Olman are Yuan-Ti.
The impression I get is that the Scarlet Brotherhood easily captures many Olman tribesmen as servents and slaves.
Now if you make them Yuan'ti not only will it be harder to capture the slaves for they will put up a decent fight, but the Olmans will have agents within the Scarlet Brotherhood. For an additional twist, perhaps they are the ones behind the whole anti-demi human crusade in the first place.
> Gran March is a regimented society of hobgoblins.
Gran March Hobgoblins vs Keoland humans is fine. However are the Hobgoblins independant from, against or allied to the ogre and giant tribes of the Crystalmists? This decision will greately effect the nature of the recent giant invasions. If they are independant a few history entries about them enjoying the confusing and attacking both sides for territory should fix this.
Likewise are the in contact with/allied to the Pomraj?
> Longships full of fierce goliath warriors are a true terror of the Solnor coast.
This would mean the North Province, Sea Barons and See of Medegia would have suffered many a _fierce_ raids in the past, and may well have contributed to those lands leaving the Great Kingdom.
Again though a few additional history notes of raids and towns coverting loyalty will amend this.
Overall I like the idea.
A few things that will need to be fleshed out.
> Olman are Yuan-Ti.
The impression I get is that the Scarlet Brotherhood easily captures many Olman tribesmen as servents and slaves.
Now if you make them Yuan'ti not only will it be harder to capture the slaves for they will put up a decent fight, but the Olmans will have agents within the Scarlet Brotherhood. For an additional twist, perhaps they are the ones behind the whole anti-demi human crusade in the first place.
Hmmm....that's true. Mayhaps Olman isle is full of little green snake yuan'ti? This is definitely a problem I will have to think about.
> Gran March is a regimented society of hobgoblins.
Gran March Hobgoblins vs Keoland humans is fine. However are the Hobgoblins independant from, against or allied to the ogre and giant tribes of the Crystalmists? This decision will greately effect the nature of the recent giant invasions. If they are independant a few history entries about them enjoying the confusing and attacking both sides for territory should fix this.
Likewise are the in contact with/allied to the Pomraj?
Politics retain the same Greyhawk character across the Flaneass. Gran March hobgoblins are the most loyal tributary of Keoland. Now whether Gran March can be clandestinely supporting the giant tribes to overrun the hated Flan elves of Geoff, and likely subtly working to poison the Lion Throne's ear such that Keoland didn't offer any assistance to Geoff - that is a very good idea to work around. Mmmm....gritty real politik.
> Longships full of fierce goliath warriors are a true terror of the Solnor coast.
This would mean the North Province, Sea Barons and See of Medegia would have suffered many a _fierce_ raids in the past, and may well have contributed to those lands leaving the Great Kingdom.
Again though a few additional history notes of raids and towns coverting loyalty will amend this.
Thillronian barbarians have savagely raided the Solnor coast for centuries even under by-the-book Greyhawk. At one time, they were able to conquer Bone March.
Tieflings coming from Suel because of the Suel cavorting with Dark powers.
Dragonborn could replace the spot Asherati took in Backlun etc
No need to wholesale change whole lands just to have a place races available in 4th edition come from.
You can just leave it as it is. Its much easier to just include background as to why certain races are more common in other areas.
Tieflings coming from Suel because of the Suel cavorting with Dark powers.
Dragonborn could replace the spot Asherati took in Backlun etc
No need to wholesale change whole lands just to have a place races available in 4th edition come from.
I absolutely agree with you. However, that is not the purpose of this thread.
If you have any ideas on how to unabashedly cram 4E into Greyhawk without apologies for the some 30 years of prior development, please contribute.
> Olman are Yuan-Ti.
The impression I get is that the Scarlet Brotherhood easily captures many Olman tribesmen as servents and slaves.
Now if you make them Yuan'ti not only will it be harder to capture the slaves for they will put up a decent fight, but the Olmans will have agents within the Scarlet Brotherhood. For an additional twist, perhaps they are the ones behind the whole anti-demi human crusade in the first place.
After having given it some thought and reflection, I agree that Yuan-Ti are simply too powerful to be representative of the Olman people. Additionally, I think it best to have them as a player race. It is probably best to wait until the Players Handbook III is released to see what is available. Same with the Tuov, best to wait to see what will be available in the future.
Completely agree with the points made previously about previous products never making up their minds about the racial differences in the Flanaess plus the mixing of tribes made it irrelevant in a lot of places. This puts racial and national divisions at the forefront again and, while keeping Greyhawk still Greyhawk for the most part, introduces some great new twists.
Good work One Eye!:D
I suggest that this is what the majority of Olman are. If Hepmonaland and the Amedio are the home of the yuan-ti, the snaketongue cultists need to be there too. Since snaketongue cultists aren't tieflings, they can't be Suel. Therefore, they're Olman.
There's no reason to get dogmatic and insist that every human race has to be replaced with a nonhuman one. Since this version of the world has had human races other than the Oeridians in the past (because the Suel were once human), it might well have other human races in the southern jungles.
I've always liked the idea of the yuan-ti infiltrating the Scarlet Brotherhood, ever since The Scarlet Brotherhood by Sean K. Reynolds came out in 2nd edition.
I'd also add that I don't think it makes sense to turn the Flan into elves if the elves are also elves. That seems like a waste of a race. If the point of this is to make 4th edition races a fundamental part of the world, wood elves and grugach are already well integrated into Oerth. So I think the Flan should be something else. I think, given the options, they should be shifters. Otherwise the shifters of the Tiger and Wolf Barbarians have no history; they obviously aren't descended from the Baklunish, as they are in standard Greyhawk (the Wolf Barbarians are of course already half Flan), if the Baklunish are dragonborn. It'd be a shame for a major race not to be integrated into the history of the world, so I suggest having them be descended from the Flan, and thus connected to the rich in-game history of that people. That way there can be shifters native to other parts of the continent as well; shifter Rovers, shifter Tenha, and so on. The idea of the Tenha as a race of "civilized" shifters sounds more interesting to me than making them "civilized" wood elves.
I'm also going to have to point out the unquestionable scientific truth that you are all horrible, horrible people, and by contributing to this thread in a positive manner I have become more horrible as well.
I'd also add that I don't think it makes sense to turn the Flan into elves if the elves are also elves. That seems like a waste of a race. If the point of this is to make 4th edition races a fundamental part of the world, wood elves and grugach are already well integrated into Oerth. So I think the Flan should be something else. I think, given the options, they should be shifters. Otherwise the shifters of the Tiger and Wolf Barbarians have no history; they obviously aren't descended from the Baklunish, as they are in standard Greyhawk (the Wolf Barbarians are of course already half Flan), if the Baklunish are dragonborn. It'd be a shame for a major race not to be integrated into the history of the world, so I suggest having them be descended from the Flan, and thus connected to the rich in-game history of that people. That way there can be shifters native to other parts of the continent as well; shifter Rovers, shifter Tenha, and so on. The idea of the Tenha as a race of "civilized" shifters sounds more interesting to me than making them "civilized" wood elves.
Particularly good idea. Making all Flan into elves has not been settling terribly well with me, particularly given that my homebrew history heavily emphasizes the friction betwixt Flan and elves prior to the cataclysms. Shifters fit very well. Plus, it gives a reason for the Rovers to have their dog references. Hmmm....necromantic Ur-Flan shifters....ideas to work with.
I still want the Chakyik and Wegwuir to stand out as totally different. Perhaps they could be full-fledged lycanthropes, weretigers and werewolves respectively.
I'm also going to have to point out the unquestionable scientific truth that you are all horrible, horrible people, and by contributing to this thread in a positive manner I have become more horrible as well.
Agreed. This is pure blasphemy completely counter to where I have been developing my home game for the past 20 years. Ain't DnD fun?
Particularly good idea. Making all Flan into elves has not been settling terribly well with me, particularly given that my homebrew history heavily emphasizes the friction betwixt Flan and elves prior to the cataclysms. Shifters fit very well. Plus, it gives a reason for the Rovers to have their dog references. Hmmm....necromantic Ur-Flan shifters....ideas to work with.
I still want the Chakyik and Wegwuir to stand out as totally different. Perhaps they could be full-fledged lycanthropes, weretigers and werewolves respectively.
Just a thought but how about making the Flan into Goliaths. They remain a distinct race but could arguably be descended from humans. They once inhabited the lowlands but have since retreated to the hills and mountains of the world following the migrations from the West. Tenh as a civilised Goliath kingdom would be particularly interesting then.
Don't get me wrong, Tenh would also be fascinating if inhabited by civilised shifters but I like the idea of the Wolf and Tiger Nomads being longtooths (longteeth?) and razorclaws, distinct from anyone else but still a PC race.
This idea fascinates me despite, as has been said above, it being GH blasphemy, so just wanted to add a couple of thoughts.;)
Sueloise wizards made pacts and deals with genei and elemental lords long ago. After the Invoked Devastation some of the wizards fled (or were teleported) to the Spindrift Isles.
Years later some Keoland mages discovered records of the pacts and elemental powers and started working to regain that power, forming the Silent Ones of Keoland.
Some ideas of my own, which may or may not fit with the OP's idea for this rendition of the Flanaess, are:
*Genasi were citizens or residents of the Dragonborn's Baklunish Empire. They may or may not have lent their elemental prowess to sending the Rain of Colorless Fire against the Suel. After the Invoked Devastation, the Genasi came to outnumber the Dragonborn in parts of their former empire and now rule the nations of Zeif & Ekbir.
*Genasi were Suel survivors of the Rain of Colorless Fire, ordinary citizens w/out Infernal taint. The Rain of Colorless Fire transformed these Suel into Genasi, who drove their hated Suel-Tiefllng masters from the Sea of Dust. Suel-Genasi remain in the Sea of Dust to this day, despising both the Dragonborn & Suel-Tieflings. Some, mostly Water & Storm Souled, have since become the Sea Princes. Suel-Genasi also have a presence in the Hellfurnace Mtns, where they oppose a growing Drow influence.
*Genasi are the original inhabitants of the Bright Desert and now an important fixture in the City of Greyhawk.
Humans - remember, in 4e humans are supposed to be "mutated" so you can have Tieflings and humans as part of the same tribe(s). I used the new fluff and married it to the old fluff in the following ways:
1) Tieflings - Lands of Iuz/Empire of Iuz, Great Kingdom, Bright Desert (the curse of the Scorpion King), and Ull. The Great Kingdom is really a no brainer. The only catch is certain houses of the Great Kingdom are true fiend-seers while others are Human. Furthermore, not all of a house's bloodline is Tiefling or Human.
2) Olman are Halfling Headhunters - I made the Olman Halfing Headhunters like the tribals from Raiders of the Lost Ark. The humans who worship Zehir were mutated, keeping in line with the 4e fluff. The Halfings are not Yuan-Ti mutants. They pay homage to the Yuan-Ti as a Primal Spirit of the World Serpent. Linguistically this leaves Olman as a pigeon creole of Ancient Suel, Halfling and Abyssal.
3) Touv as Dwarves - The Touv gave me similar ideas. Like the Olman the Touv live in a vast jungle but their is no dominant race. The Dwarves in 4e are mutated like Humans as slaves of the giants. The Touv lived as slaves under the rule of ape demons, mutating slightly, growing hairy and more feral (I'm at work and can't remember the demon type's name). The new 4e rules for Duegar fits well.
4) Shardar-Kai as Suel and Flan - The Suel who followed Weejas "The Raven Queen" fled into Shadowfell during the Twin Cataclysms. They can be found in the Underdark (esp around the Pass of Slerotin), the Land of Black Ice (which is an area tainted by an arctic portion of Shadowfell) and various verboten reaches. The Shardar-Kai is a Flan name which was appropriated into the ocmmon tongue. They are the Ur-Flan who broke with tradition of worshipping the Sun and Earth and turned to the darkness. They fled, taking many Flan with them, weakening the ancient tribes shortly before the Great Migrations.***
5) Genasi as Baklunes and Flan - The Baklunes is a no brainer. The Flan Genasi were the subjects of the tyrant Wizard Tzunk in the Barren Wastes (Greyhawk Wars Boxed Set fluff actually getting a role in the RPG fluff is a welcome change). The Barren Wastes overlap the Elemental Plane of Chaos allowing it to spill into Oerth (as per new MotP fluff). It is thought the ancient and wicked artifact The Codex of the Infinite Planes is responsible. A once lush paradise vanished. The large Flannae empire was drawn into the maelstrom of Chaos disappearing from this world.***
6) Shifters - I changed the Tiger and Wolf Nomads to shifters like you. Although, I kept the humans in there with them but giving them a lesser role. I like the change because it makes the Nomads completely untamable; unlike when they're humans where we could always rationalize them as having the capacity for civility. By making them a minority in an inhuman world it doesn't even have to come up. We can still have human tribal leaders, but it's not exactly a tribe of humans.
*** by spreading the Shardar-Kai and Genasi between different races and cultures it gives players greater variety to choose from. A Druid Genasi will most likely be of Flan origin while a Wizard or Sorcerer Genasi will be Baklunish. A Shardar-Kai Rogue/Assassin would have a Suel heritage while an Avenger would be Ur-Flan. I did this to keep the new fluff thematically consistent with the old concept of Greyhawk - no one event is responsible for everything. I wanted to create a variety of ways humans became Tieflings, Genasi, and Shardar-Kai to remain true to the original setting as a shared world which easily allowed for multiple interpretations. It also gave me a reason to say why the Flan disappeared without a trace - they were
swept up into different planes.
Elves as Flan... Hmm... It's tempting but I agree with ripvanwormer. I've merely expanded the Kingdoms of Elves and Dwarves to give them a greater role in the Flanaess. Ulek is remnants of an ancient Dwarven Kingdom. The three Uleks are the "same" except two are baronies under the Dwarven Principality. Dwarves control Onwal and Irongate, not humans. Elves control Highfolk and Eladrin Celene. The Eladrin also control the Lendore Isles.
Lendore - The reason the Lendore Isles is difficult to navigate is it's not always there. The Lendore Isles travel back and forth between Oerth and Feywild, concealed by mists. The magical language of the Eladrin is Supernal, which is added as a background language for a Lendore Gray Elf (Eladrin). There is a term that I can't remember (it's in MotP and I'm at work so I can't check) for a place that crosses to the Feywild. I felt that was the easiest way to make it "inaccessible" to outsiders. The moments the Isles shift are known only to the Eladrin and shared with no one. (basically the DM knows and ain't tellin' :P )
BTW, I love some of the ideas you've come up with. I wholeheartedly agree that the presence of non-humans needs to be much greater and a simple way of doing that is changing the race. I just thought I'd share some of my work to compare with your own, a bit of cross pollination.
In many ways I cringe at the thought of WotC touching Greyhawk with the 4e stick. One of the reasons is it's was well designed in that the races and histories could be altered in profound ways which wouldn't take away from the story of feel of the setting. I'm obvious not a purist or fundamentalist Hawker but I do have standards :D