| Post/Author/DateTime | Post |
|---|---|
| #1yellowdingoSep 11, 2007 5:21:33 | Simmering just below the surface are several conspiracies from the Neutral Hand of Mordenkainen, to the machinations of Tharizdun...What do you see as the next flashpoint for Greyhawk? |
| #2reneshatSep 11, 2007 5:51:39 | A Broadway musical, or perhaps an ice show. "Vecna on Ice" I like it. |
| #3acearSep 11, 2007 8:51:42 | A Broadway musical, or perhaps an ice show. "Vecna on Ice" I like it. Springtime for Iuz and Eye-Eye-Uz! Iuz is happy and gay! We're marching to a faster pace Look out, here comes the Demonic race! Springtime for Iuz and Eye-Eye-Uz Iuz a fine land once more! Springtime for Iuz and Eye-Eye-Uz Watch out, Oerik We're going on tour! Springtime for Iuz and Eye-Eye-Uz! CHORUS: Look, it's springtime LEAD TENOR ORC RAIDER: Winter for Shield Lands and Tenh CHORUS AND ORC RAIDER: Springtime for Iuz and Eye-Eye-Uz! CHORUS: Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! STORMTROOPER: Come on, Iuzians Go into your dance! |
| #4Rhydur_MeithSep 11, 2007 11:42:24 | Springtime for Iuz and Eye-Eye-Uz! Wow! That is amazing. You're either brilliant or demented...or likely both! I love it!:D |
| #5drowbattlemindSep 11, 2007 16:03:22 | But when do we release the cages of dire badgers I brought? |
| #6GreysonSep 13, 2007 17:35:14 | Simmering just below the surface are several conspiracies from the Neutral Hand of Mordenkainen, to the machinations of Tharizdun...What do you see as the next flashpoint for Greyhawk? On a more serious note, I see a couple of "next flash points." One would certainly involve North Kingdom, Ahlissa and other former Great Kingdom lands and personalities. How long does Grenell sit on Eastfair while Ahlissa and Nyrond propser on his borders? How long does he allow Delglath to vex him? How long do the marauding humanoids in Bone March defy his control? Another "how long" question involves Turrosh Mak and the Domain of Greyhawk, and perhaps Celene. How long does the Despot linger on the borders of both of the above? The Domain of Greyhawk and the Principality of Ulek look like they have Mak in a geographic map vise. Do they close that vice, or does Mak break off one if its jaws and break out in one direction or another? Hopefully someone (adventuring PCs) or something gets rid of Iuz. |
| #7gargoyle2kSep 15, 2007 2:37:52 | Let's see: Tharizdun, Iuz, Turrosh Mak, the Splintered GK, the Co8, Lolth, the SB, Dragotha, the Giants. Wow. Umm, barring another "Greyhawk Wars", I think things are well-suited for most any adventurers. Still, let's say that one or more of these "get resolved" when 4E rolls around, and WotC cooks up a new threat. Going into the history of WoG to find a new threat, I'd go for increasing political tensions between the Baklunish west and the rest of the Flanaess, or an Imperial-minded Nyrond. Perhaps renewed cult activity from one of the many demi-gods or lesser gods could become a factor (remember the Age of Worms AP? Kyuss, anyone?); one of the (almost forgotten) hero-gods could become a major player finally. Or maybe the dragons rise up to dominate these inferior creatures of the Flanaess, and lay waste to the kingdoms of men, dwarves and elves, reasserting their rightful dominance of Oerth. Nature is in turmoil and the druids rise to meet the challenge of expanding civilization, some seeking to use words and others to destroy... |
| #8GreysonSep 16, 2007 0:06:42 | ... or an Imperial-minded Nyrond... Or maybe the dragons rise up to dominate these inferior creatures of the Flanaess, and lay waste to the kingdoms of men, dwarves and elves, reasserting their rightful dominance of Oerth. I like these two ideas a lot. As Living Greyhawk ends, our region (Nyrond) shall not be concluding a green dragon arc we started in Year Two. There are two adventures and many proposals to develop this big, bad dragon called "The Green of the Gamboge." An imperial-minded Nyrond sounds great - like Keoland on the mid-300s CY. Something like this would probably take time, and may not be a flash point. But, there are many, many elements to contend with in this direction: The Valorous League of Blindness, Prince Sewarndt, bordering nations, North Kingdom, Bone March humanoids, the Almorian Protectorate, Blackmar Huldane, the elves of the Celadon, an the list goes on. Good thread. |
| #9cragSep 16, 2007 13:56:16 | I don't see or want another major war; nations need time to recoup. There are already plenty of places to "skirmish". Please not another end of the oerth cult, why not use the tensions between the established faiths for inspiration. Exploration & Dicovery: The Great Unknown * In the west, the baklunish have opened thornward allowing greater access to the east. * In the east, the Sea Barons are ready to set sail on a colombus style exploration. * In the south, the olman within the Sea Princes can establish their culture within the flanaess allowing the first meanful contact between cultures. * Rather then simply have the dragins rise up, why not have them be "power brokers behind the throne" for some far western power such as Celestial Imperium and they send emmissaries to the war ravaged flanaess. All of these scenarios can be played as complete unknowns; an evil cult or another war with an evil demi-god leaves little room for doubt among the players. |
| #10madvladSep 17, 2007 13:49:18 | Thornward is already opened.... |
| #11clawhoundSep 17, 2007 16:02:34 | I'd like to see two things: 1. Wipe the board. There have been as many implementations of Greyawk as there have been Greyhawk campaigns. Write a sourcebook focused on setting up as many adventures as possible. 2. Put up a Greyhawk wiki. Let the players develop the setting. That's very risky, yet possibly very rewarding. Both of those ideas require letting go of the Greyhawk that we know. Personally, I've known about four campaigns worth. |
| #12reneshatSep 17, 2007 23:07:32 | 2. Put up a Greyhawk wiki. Let the players develop the setting. That's very risky, yet possibly very rewarding. If people want to keep LG in the continuity, then that is probably the only way to do it. |
| #13eileenprophetofistusSep 27, 2007 5:53:31 | Tharizdun finally escapes and we get find out what he is really capable of. What a way to incoporate the Points of Light concept for those who feel it currently does not fit the Greyhawk profile. And by this I don't mean a "Tharizdun has escaped, quick let the PCs lock him back up". His time has come, I tremble at his sight. Tharizdun stays, and the deities quake with me. |
| #14clawhoundSep 27, 2007 8:19:47 | We could call this a "Ten Thousand Points of Darkness." Tharizdun has only partially escaped, but that's enough for thousands of evil things to awaken in the world. Each crack is a breach that can be closed. So yes, your adventuring party can have a good effect on the world, but they can't do it themselves, and it requires many, many dedicated adventurers to set things right. |
| #15ixbnMar 09, 2008 17:22:48 | Well, lets put it that way - Tharizdun is just a minor problem we can handle when the major things are done. Anybody heard about the Vecna incident? What has Tovag Baragu to do with doomgrinder? What will be the result, if IUZ has hoodwinked the circle of eight into believing, that the only way to save the world is to help him reach his goals? And, by the way, what are his goals? Can one evil balance another one, or is good the thing to balance out evil? All right! Enough questions for now. Have a nice day!:D |
| #16wrongheadMar 21, 2008 22:36:16 | Aren't they pretty-much tossing Greyhawk out with 4e? |
| #17abanathieMar 22, 2008 0:14:27 | Aren't they pretty-much tossing Greyhawk out with 4e? I wouldn't say tossing. While it can be argued that WoG has the smallest following when compared to other campaign settings, it still has a number of die-hard fans that WotC will want to keep it if at all possible. But back to the thread topic. I see the campaign ending for the current LG campaign as being the big catalyst to bring WoG into the 4th edition. I think we'll see the spellplague, slightly altered geographic features and significant changes to the political landscape in the next campaign book. In essence, we'll have a clean slate to start anew. I also believe this cataclysm will be one of the few things that will remain canon from the current LG campaign. In the long run, I think this (the LG canon part) will make any of future Living campaign (FR or WoG) more popular. After all, it's always cool when you have a personal story of how your character was involved in an earth-shaking, canon event that shaped the current world you play in. |
| #18rob_douglasMar 23, 2008 19:31:07 | Yeah - I think that is the case. The Doomgrinder events appear to be pretty world-shaping. Also, you should note that in the latest D&D podcast on Wizards site, they noted that the gods of 4E were not the only ones you could have, and they postulated that "people playing in Greyhawk" will still use the Greyhawk gods. They mentioned playing 4E in Greyhawk several times, so they certainly consider it a likely scenario. ROB |
| #19twg_prometheusMar 25, 2008 16:48:09 | They could easily just be referencing Greyhawk home games, however. It's not like they think those will go away.... At D&DXP, people pushed WotC a little to try and learn which settings would be coming back after the Forgotten Realms and Eberron. As expected (and rightly so in my mind) Wizards of the Coast didn't give any information on what would be coming after Eberron. They did say that they had some new campaign worlds that they wanted to introduce, however, and they also said they wanted to 4e-convert some older campaign settings. If they hold to a pace of one campaign setting conversion per year, it could take a while to get around to any particular setting we might have in mind. I personally don't think they'll even try to decide what to do with Greyhawk until the Living Greyhawk campaign is complete however. The word seems to be that they aren't gathering results from LG tables after June or July (?) so I think they'll play their cards close to their vest until then. Why tip your hand when you don't know how Living Greyhawk is going to turn out yet? |
| #20druvasApr 02, 2008 19:40:31 | Please, dear Lord, no more cataclysmic catastrophes! WoG was at its best when the politcal happenings were background stuff, merely providing incentive for adventure, not being the adventure. WoG needs more stuff like Against the Giants, Tomb of Horrors, Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth, Dwellers of the Forbidden City, etc. What happend to that caliber of adventure? No Dragon swarms. No Gods roaming the Oerth. Why does everything have to be massive in scale? Forgotton Realms turned into one horrific Michael Bay movie after another. WoG doesn't need any of that cr@p, although the Wars and aftermath did a pretty good job of messing it up. It wasn't too badly messed up... Perhaps exploring the West would make for some new territory... Maybe some old Baklunish tribes or even Suel peoples have mini-States out there... Certainly, by going West, WoC could still have Greyhawk but have clean slate to do some new stuff. The only thing they would have to keep would be to follow the continental map in the original box set of WoG. |
| #21abanathieApr 02, 2008 19:52:53 | Please, dear Lord, no more cataclysmic catastrophes! WoG was at its best when the politcal happenings were background stuff, merely providing incentive for adventure, not being the adventure. WoG needs more stuff like Against the Giants, Tomb of Horrors, Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth, Dwellers of the Forbidden City, etc. What happend to that caliber of adventure? No Dragon swarms. No Gods roaming the Oerth. Why does everything have to be massive in scale? Forgotton Realms turned into one horrific Michael Bay movie after another. WoG doesn't need any of that cr@p, although the Wars and aftermath did a pretty good job of messing it up. It wasn't too badly messed up... Perhaps exploring the West would make for some new territory... Maybe some old Baklunish tribes or even Suel peoples have mini-States out there... Certainly, by going West, WoC could still have Greyhawk but have clean slate to do some new stuff. The only thing they would have to keep would be to follow the continental map in the original box set of WoG. I don't know. I think a catastrophe could very well less the importance of governments and reset the campaign back to a more original state. Basically, Doomgrinder goes off and almost destroys (or actually destroys depending on who you talk to) the world. Governments will probably fall (others may rise or not) and the point of lights campaign ensues where adventurers become the heroes that go on the Against the Giants and Tomb of Horrors adventures on behalf of a beleagured town. The catastrophe could be a good thing for your wishes for WoG. I think and hope that things look up for Greyhawk. |
| #22pauln6Apr 03, 2008 6:41:57 | Well, the outcome from Vecna Lives if the pcs lose was subtle, leading to a more dangerous world without cataclysmically altering the status quo. It's hard to see what catasrophe could be wrought by the Doomgrinder to give us something more akin to PoL without massively altering the political landscape. I don't want to see so much changed that all my notes on peoples and locations become irrelevant - you may as well just advance the timeline 500 years or start fresh in a new game world if you're going to do that. I want Greyhawk to be Greyhawk after all. I am happy for it to be more dangerous, even in the civilised lands but that is a tweak not a catastrophe. |
| #23druvasApr 03, 2008 7:00:17 | Well, the outcome from Vecna Lives if the pcs lose was subtle, leading to a more dangerous world without cataclysmically altering the status quo. It's hard to see what catasrophe could be wrought by the Doomgrinder to give us something more akin to PoL without massively altering the political landscape. I concur. Leave the political landscape intact. A catastrophe is soooo old hat and unoriginal. The game is about being creative and thoughtful. Greyhawk has been pretty well tweaked and altered. A nuclear detonation just seems so trite and silly to me. Like I said, leave the Flanaess alone and maybe develope some of the continent to the West. It's new land, untouched by published content and ripe for exploration. Otherwise, let the WoG die until some future date when someone willing to pay homage to EGG comes along. In my opinion, every time WoC touches a pre-WoC campaign setting, it turns to doo-doo. If WoC wants to create a new campaign setting, wonderful! I'll probably check it out. |
| #24ixbnApr 03, 2008 8:57:47 | Forget about dommgrinder! I would say it is an effect not the reason. And the outcome depends on the decisions the players have to make - it may be cataclystic or not. I would assume the outcome is highly dependant on the outcome of the obsidian citadell adventures and a lot of common sense from the PCs. ;) |
| #25akossApr 06, 2008 20:08:58 | Greyhawk could use a dose of spicing up IMO. Yeah, I would bring the world to war (IMG I'm creating a world war with Elemental Princes of Evil), then build it back up again better leverging the strengths the setting has (particularly the villains - Iggwilv, St. Kargoth, Kas, Eclavdra, the Giants, the Far Realm, Elementals...). Each nation would have a clearer "mission statement", incorporate the dragonborn and tieflings, spice up the geography a bit and you've got a nice foundation to build on for the next edition. |
| #26druvasApr 07, 2008 7:01:52 | Greyhawk could use a dose of spicing up IMO. If you want to go the "war" route in your campaign, that's great. You should do it if it fits the way your players like it. My whole problem with the way WoC does things is that they can't seem to do anything subtly. There already was a "great" war in the Flanaess (which turned off about half of their customer base). Another one would just be trite and overdone. IMHO, I think it would allow DM's to be much more creative if they just implemented the new rules and didn't explain why most of the changes happened. A teaser always generates more buzz than just making up some poorly conceived explanation (being pretty good at marketing, one would think that WoC would understand this...) Perhaps down the road they could sell us all a "players guide to Greyhawk" with some of the changes explained. The intent behind Greyhawk was to create a baseline world that home-grown campaigns could make thier own. That was successfully done. I wish WoC would just leave it alone. They have made a trainwreck out of the two best campaign worlds (Greyhawk and FR). |
| #27akossApr 07, 2008 15:29:51 | If you want to go the "war" route in your campaign, that's great. You should do it if it fits the way your players like it. My whole problem with the way WoC does things is that they can't seem to do anything subtly. There already was a "great" war in the Flanaess (which turned off about half of their customer base). Another one would just be trite and overdone. IMHO, I think it would allow DM's to be much more creative if they just implemented the new rules and didn't explain why most of the changes happened. A teaser always generates more buzz than just making up some poorly conceived explanation (being pretty good at marketing, one would think that WoC would understand this...) Perhaps down the road they could sell us all a "players guide to Greyhawk" with some of the changes explained. The intent behind Greyhawk was to create a baseline world that home-grown campaigns could make thier own. That was successfully done. I wish WoC would just leave it alone. They have made a trainwreck out of the two best campaign worlds (Greyhawk and FR). The first GH war was just handled really poorly, or perhaps not so much "poorly" as... dull. Poorly and dull? It just didn't generate any real excitement for me or my group at the time. With all the great GH villains running around, Iuz has always struck me as a bit of boring villain. I think war can be a great tool for change though, and I think there should always be some part of the Flanaess engaged in war at the time the campaign is running. Even if the PCs never become embroiled in it themselves, it provides that exciting backdrop of conflict to the campaign. And JFEI... at I-CON, there apparently has been confirmation that Greyhawk will be supported in 4e! (we just don't know when.) Woot! :D I know some of you aren't keen on the idea, but at the very least there should be elements worth purloining from it (even if just stat blocks for your own games)... |