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| #1myouMar 25, 2009 16:14:30 | I'm running a high-powered 3.5 game and I'm curious to see what others think of my house rules. So far we've had no trouble, but I'd like to know how other people would feel about playing with them, and if they have any unforseen effects, since I'm interested in starting up a second game with them. 1. Your Hit Dice always give maximum HP. 2. Spells, spell-like and supernatural abilities and other magical effects that restore the target’s HP give double the HP shown. (1d8+1 becomes 2d8+2, etc). 3. There is no massive damage rule. 4. Weapon critical threat ranges cannot be greater than 12-20. 5. Players die at the half the additive inverse of their HP. If their HP is x they die at 0.5*-x. 6. Player characters get a bonus feat at level 1. 7. Players cannot be evil. If you commit enough evil deeds that your alignment becomes evil you will be killed and will not be raised. 8. No spell, ability or effect can kill automatically without a saving throw (such as Blasphemy/Sphere of Annihilation/vorpal enhancements), such effects are banned from the game. 9. You cannot reduce the cost of a metamagic enhancement below +1 and enhancements always cost +1 or more. 10. Candles of Invocation and Nightsticks do not exist. 11. Spell-like and supernatural abilities have the same experience cost as they do when cast as a spell (if they share their effect with an existing spell, for example, Wish). 12. You cannot force a creature to expend experience when you summon or call it via a Gate spell or similar effect. 13. Summoned or called creatures cannot summon or call further creatures. 14. There are no class-based alignment restrictions. 15. Psionics do no exist. 16. There is no multi-classing penalty, but excessive multi-classing will be subject to DM approval. 17. You cannot take a second prestige class until you have taken all non-epic levels in all of your existing prestige classes. 18. Level 20 is not the limit for character or class levels; there are custom epic level rules. 19. Vows (such as the Vow of Poverty), character flaws and character traits are not allowed. 20. Ability points that have been permanently drained or lost being raised from the dead can be restored by Wish or Miracle. In cases where the ability in question provides benefits at each level (such as bonus HP from Constitution) those benefits are recalculated with the new ability score. 21. Antimagic Field blocks lines of effect and cannot be re-shaped to exclude the target (normally the spell’s caster) from its effect. 22. Full spellcasters who can cast 0th level spells (e.g. wizards but not bards) now have the ability to cast any 0th level spell they know without preparation, even if they couldn't do so before. If they wish to enhance a 0th level spell with metamagic this house rule does not apply. 23. Fighters get their bonus feats at the following class levels; 2, 4, 5, 7, 8, 10, 11, 13, 14, 16, 17, 19, and 20. 24. Druids must use the Shapeshift druid variant from the PHBII. 25. No class gains a familiar. The Summon Familiar class feature is traded for Eschew Material Components. 26. Rangers gain full Animal Companion progression, as a PHB druid. 27. When a character gains a permanent Intelligence increase he gains skill points retroactively. He gains appropriate skill points for all of his character levels rather than just for current and future levels. For example a wizard who begins play with 17 Intelligence and uses his 4th level ability boost to increase his score to 18 immediately gains seven skill points rather than just one. Remember that items which boost ability modifiers do not give extra skill points. 28. Cross-class skills have the same maximum ranks as class skills, but simply cost double. 29. (This is a highly experimental rule, but it's working well so far) Diplomacy checks are rolled against DCs as listed below and items cannot alter your diplomacy bonus. A subject must hear and understand your words for you to make a diplomacy check, thus you cannot normally make a check if the subject is enraged, deafened, or unable to understand speech. A diplomacy check takes one minute. You can attempt a diplomacy check as a full-round action at a -10 penalty. If you beat a check by 10 or more you may attempt another check to improve the subject's attitude again (and may keep doing so each time you beat the DC by ten or more). If you fail a check by more than ten the subject's attitude worsens by one step. If the check succeeds the subject's attitude improves by one step. If you succeed or fail by less that ten, choose not to make further checks to try to improve the subject's attitude, or have improved the subject's attitude as far as possible then no further checks can be attempted for 24 hours. Initial Attitude / Diplomacy DC to improve attitude one stage Hostile = Hit Dice + (3 x (Wisdom modifier + Intelligence modifier + Circumstance bonuses)) + 10 Unfriendly = Hit Dice + (2 x (Wisdom modifier + Intelligence modifier + Circumstance bonuses)) + 10 Indifferent = Hit Dice + (1 x (Wisdom modifier + Intelligence modifier + Circumstance bonuses)) + 10 Friendly = Hit Dice + (2 x (Wisdom modifier + Intelligence modifier + Circumstance bonuses)) + 10 Helpful = Hit Dice + (3 x (Wisdom modifier + Intelligence modifier + Circumstance bonuses)) + 10 Fanatical n/a 30. (I couldn't find hard rules for the time or cost inherent in researching spells so I made some up) To research a new spell you must expend 8 hours a day for a number of days equal to the level of the spell and a quantity of raw materials worth 200 x the level of the new spell. You may speed this process and research a spell in a single day, but this requires a greater investment of resources and thus the cost increases to 1000 x the level of the spell. At the end of the research period you must make a spellcraft check (DC 20 + the level of the spell) in order for your research to succeed. The DM may choose to have research fail if the spell is not appropriate in power, effect or level. Cantrips are considered ½ level. 31. Characters gain innate magic bonuses as shown here; http://www.zipworld.com.au/~hong/dnd/innate_magic.htm 32. Spellcasters use she spell points variant from Unearthed Arcana. 33. Material from any published sourcebook is allowed as long as a digital copy (.pdf file, web page, etc.) can be produced, but all material used should be cleared with the DM. |
| #2umcorianMar 25, 2009 16:42:03 | Some pretty decent rules here - most are all right changes, or of subject matter that's basically written to be soley your decision anyway (Psionics, for example). I'll just post the ones I don't particularly like. 9. You cannot reduce the cost of a metamagic enhancement below +1 and enhancements always cost +1 or more. I think that's unnecessary - if someone goes through the effort of having an Arcane Thesis for a spell, and loads up on conditional metamagic feats to give himself more utility in dangerous situations, he should be able to reap that benefit. Most use I've ever seen for that is getting free Silent/Still Spells prepared, and mostly for escape or defensive spells at that. 24. Druids must use the Shapeshift druid variant from the PHBII. That's a very dramatic change to the druid class. It's an interesting option to consider, but I definitely wouldn't want it forced on me if it didn't happen to fit the vision I had in mind of a druid character. 25. No class gains a familiar. The Summon Familiar class feature is traded for Eschew Material Components. Those who hate familiars would say that's cool. I would see that as an unnecessary nerf though, as I like using my familiars, and definitely would feel short-changed. I do really like the Innate Magic rule - all in all, I think these are some great house rules. Your players must have alot of fun. |
| #3myouMar 25, 2009 17:09:58 | Some pretty decent rules here - most are all right changes, or of subject matter that's basically written to be soley your decision anyway (Psionics, for example). I'll just post the ones I don't particularly like. Thanks for responding! ^^ Well, the trouble is that with a few feats and the like you can get stuff like Twin for free. But perhaps I should stipulate that rather only feats with a base cost of +2 or higher cannot be reduced below +1, and that no feat can be reduced below +0? Well, the thing is that the existing druid has a huge list of available forms and gains insane power, so the variant reins that in a little, prevents you trolling through books looking for forms to take, and speeds things up. They still get to take on animal forms, so I'm not sure that it affects character concepts so much as character builds. Although I suppose the companion could be missed for reasons other than optimisation, that's something to think about. I know some people will miss them, but there is a feat to allow anyone to get a familiar, you just have to spend the feat, which is fair really - as an arcane caster you get a lot to play with without familiars. Thank you very much, we're having a great time so far! =D The point about character concepts for the druid has given me something to ponder, since I feel Wildshape is too powerful, but as you say, players could miss their companion. |
| #4myouMar 30, 2009 15:52:56 | I'm still looking for feedback ad advice. :3 |
| #5kuonjiMar 30, 2009 20:09:43 | 1. Your Hit Dice always give maximum HP. Seems excessive, but fun. 2. Spells, spell-like and supernatural abilities and other magical effects that restore the target’s HP give double the HP shown. (1d8+1 becomes 2d8+2, etc). This makes the spells a little more dangerous vs. undead. Also, turns Heal into even more of a beast. Vigor and other regen spells might be pretty brutal with this rule. 3. There is no massive damage rule. No great loss. 4. Weapon critical threat ranges cannot be greater than 12-20. Looks ok to me. 5. Players die at the half the additive inverse of their HP. If their HP is x they die at 0.5*-x. Good idea. 6. Player characters get a bonus feat at level 1. Sure, why not. 7. Players cannot be evil. If you commit enough evil deeds that your alignment becomes evil you will be killed and will not be raised. Like a lightning bolt suddenly comes out of the sky and kills you? This is kind of ridiculous IMO. I appreciate your desire for no evil characters, but I would hope that you talk to any player about possibly alignment issues before smiting them down for their non-good ways. Perhaps a better way to go is the character becomes an NPC and the player will need to make a new character, same effect, different character end. 8. No spell, ability or effect can kill automatically without a saving throw (such as Blasphemy/Sphere of Annihilation/vorpal enhancements), such effects are banned from the game. Fine with me. 9. You cannot reduce the cost of a metamagic enhancement below +1 and enhancements always cost +1 or more. Makes sense. 10. Candles of Invocation and Nightsticks do not exist. Good. 11. Spell-like and supernatural abilities have the same experience cost as they do when cast as a spell (if they share their effect with an existing spell, for example, Wish). Is this to prevent some kind of specific abuse? 12. You cannot force a creature to expend experience when you summon or call it via a Gate spell or similar effect. OK I guess. 13. Summoned or called creatures cannot summon or call further creatures. This applies to both players, NPCs, and monsters correct? 14. There are no class-based alignment restrictions. Fine. Though it might be hard to explain how you are good and murdered someone for no reason other than to be an assassin. 15. Psionics do no exist. Why? 16. There is no multi-classing penalty, but excessive multi-classing will be subject to DM approval. Define excessive. 17. You cannot take a second prestige class until you have taken all non-epic levels in all of your existing prestige classes. Great rule. :D 18. Level 20 is not the limit for character or class levels; there are custom epic level rules. OK. 19. Vows (such as the Vow of Poverty), character flaws and character traits are not allowed. Just throw out the whole Book of Exalted Deeds. 20. Ability points that have been permanently drained or lost being raised from the dead can be restored by Wish or Miracle. In cases where the ability in question provides benefits at each level (such as bonus HP from Constitution) those benefits are recalculated with the new ability score. I would just eliminate permanent drains. 21. Antimagic Field blocks lines of effect and cannot be re-shaped to exclude the target (normally the spell’s caster) from its effect. Sure. 22. Full spellcasters who can cast 0th level spells (e.g. wizards but not bards) now have the ability to cast any 0th level spell they know without preparation, even if they couldn't do so before. If they wish to enhance a 0th level spell with metamagic this house rule does not apply. Why not just apply this to all casters? 23. Fighters get their bonus feats at the following class levels; 2, 4, 5, 7, 8, 10, 11, 13, 14, 16, 17, 19, and 20. Hard to argue with more feats, however, why these levels? Not getting that bonus feat at level 1 kind of sucks (yes I realize that all characters get a bonus feat in rule 6). 24. Druids must use the Shapeshift druid variant from the PHBII. I highly support this. 25. No class gains a familiar. The Summon Familiar class feature is traded for Eschew Material Components. Why no familiars? I personally do not like them, but some people do. In my games, I label Summon Familiar as a Metamagic Feat and give the appropriate classes a bonus metamagic feat at level 1. 26. Rangers gain full Animal Companion progression, as a PHB druid. You've eliminated familiars but kept companions, interesting. Not sure why since companions usually end up totally useless or heavily abused. 27. When a character gains a permanent Intelligence increase he gains skill points retroactively. He gains appropriate skill points for all of his character levels rather than just for current and future levels. For example a wizard who begins play with 17 Intelligence and uses his 4th level ability boost to increase his score to 18 immediately gains seven skill points rather than just one. Remember that items which boost ability modifiers do not give extra skill points/hit points, etc. Items that boost Con do give extra HPs though, RAW at least. Otherwise this looks fine. 28. When a character gains a permanent Constitution increase he gains hit points retroactively. He gains appropriate hit points for all of his character levels rather than just for current and future levels. For example a fighter who begins play with 17 Constitution and uses his 4th level ability boost to increase his score to 18 immediately gains seven hit points rather than just one. Remember that items which boost ability modifiers do not give extra skill points/hit points, etc. This is how Con works normally. No need for a house rule. 29. Cross-class skills have the same maximum ranks as class skills, but simply cost double. I use this as well. 30. (This is a highly experimental rule, but it's working well so far) What's your goal with this? 31. (I couldn't find hard rules for the time or cost inherent in researching spells so I made some up) You may be better served by making spell research a downtime only thing and handwave the costs and working closely with the player wishing to design a new spell. The next to last line (DM may choose...) seems to indicate that you expect players to design a spell, present it, roll, and then you will tell them it is inappropriate and that it fails without discussing it with them before hand. I'd suggest that you just work with your player(s) interested in designing a new spell and, once everyone is satisfied, introduce the spell in the game somehow (mentor, merchant, treasure, ancient tome, etc.) for immediate use or, again, handwave it as part of downtime without sweating the cost details. 32. Characters gain innate magic bonuses as shown here; http://www.zipworld.com.au/~hong/dnd/innate_magic.htm My initial impression is that this system looks very abusable. I'd have to give it more time to see beyond that, but one would think that this point system, combined with normal progression, could easily generate situations where you could end up with one of: can't be hit, can't miss, can succeed on nearly any DC of skill check, will have HP's beyond belief, saves through the roof, etc. 33. Spellcasters use she spell points variant from Unearthed Arcana. So you are using this but aren't allowing psionics...color me confused. 32. Material from any published sourcebook is allowed as long as a digital copy (.pdf file, web page, etc.) can be produced, but all material used should be cleared with the DM. Standard procedure. |
| #6myouMar 31, 2009 4:11:37 | Seems excessive, but fun. Yeah, I try to make death a pretty big deal, so more HP helps prevent it happening a lot. And makes the players happy. :3 This makes the spells a little more dangerous vs. undead. Also, turns Heal into even more of a beast. Vigor and other regen spells might be pretty brutal with this rule. Actually, when used to cause harm the rule wouldn't apply, so CLW can heal a living creature for 2d8+2 or hurt an undead for 1d8+1. Is that something I need to specify? No great loss. Thakn you! :3 Sure, why not. Well, if a player is going to do something that goes against their alignment I warn them, and if they ignore my warnings and their alignments becomes evil then they'll have a short amout of time to atone before someone shows up to make them pay for whatever crimes they have committed. I do it that way because I just don't like evil characters getting away with their crimes. I do like the idea that the character becomes an NPC though, I can surprise anyone who turns evil with that and then have the party take them down. Fine with me. Partially, yes. The So-called Wish-Economy is built on the idea that creatures with Wish as a spell-like or supernatural ability can create any object worth 25,000gp or less once er day at will without using XP. So this rule prevents that. The other effect is to stop player abuse. By Gating in an Efreet or Solar and commanding it to grant wishes, or taking the Dweomerkeeper PrC and getting the ability to use Wish as a supernatural ability. These things can all still be done, but now you can't get anything for free. This applies to both players, NPCs, and monsters correct? Indeed. :3 Fine. Though it might be hard to explain how you are good and murdered someone for no reason other than to be an assassin. Well, in my game killing evil is a good act (otherwie the game falls apart), so they just have to find someone really evil. Why? For a number of reasons, none to do with balance. 1. They just do what the arcane magic system already does. 2. They have horrible, horrible fluff that clashes with almost everything else in the game and is totally unappropriate for my setting too. 3. Compared to arcane magic they're bland and boring. 4. I don't know psionics well enough to be comfortable using them and I'm not prepared to learn them when there's already a better system. Less balanced but much more fun. Define excessive. Well, if someone wants to go Swordsage2/Swashbuckler3/Monk2/Fighter2/Cleric1/Rogue1 then I'd stop them and ask why they wanted to keep picking up new dips and how they could justify it in game. If I decided thet thet were doing it just to powergame that would be excessive, but if they really had a good (and it better be damn good) reason then I would allow it as long as it wasn't going to give unfair advantage. On the other hand, if they already have a good few levels in each of their classes and aren't just picking up new ones for a single level or two, then that wouldn't be excessive - Swordsage10/Swashbuckler5/Monk6/Fighter8/Cleric5/Rogue10 would be more acceptable. Great rule. :D Thank you! ^^ OK. If we have any problems I may well, but for now I'm happy to let players use it, since we do have it. If it becomes a problem I will indeed ban it. I would just eliminate permanent drains. I don't like them either, but they're a good threat to players without killing them, so I use them sparingly. Sure. It's for two reasons, 1, partial casters like bards have other tricks to fall back on, but once a sorcerer is out of spells he's just a commoner in very expensive clothes. 2, it makes sense to me that only those of are truely dedicated to magic would attain that level of mastery, that they can cast simple spells at will. Hard to argue with more feats, however, why these levels? Not getting that bonus feat at level 1 kind of sucks (yes I realize that all characters get a bonus feat in rule 6). It's for a few reasons, beyond them just really needig it. Fighters tend to overshadow other classes at level 1, with more feats than anyone else at a time when feats are gold, this just lessens that initial dominance a little (otherwise a human fighter starts with 4 feats, that's too many), and has the side-effect of making fighters slightly less appealing as a dip and taking more levels more rewarding. It also gives a straight fighter a feat at every single level, which is a lot better than loads of dead levels where he'll be sorely tempted to multiclass or take a PrC. I highly support this. Thank you! :3 Why no familiars? I personally do not like them, but some people do. In my games, I label Summon Familiar as a Metamagic Feat and give the appropriate classes a bonus metamagic feat at level 1. Well, to me arcane casters get enough fun stuff, and familiars are a pain for me to manage (as are material components). There's a feat to give a player a familiar somewhere or other, so they're welcome to have one at level one if they want one that much, it just stops them getting one for free. Also, to me they are silly. xD You've eliminated familiars but kept companions, interesting. Not sure why since companions usually end up totally useless or heavily abused. Well, I felt that rangers ought to have a companion, it makes sense to me (unlike familiars), but that the half-progresion companion really is useless, so the full progression companion would be of more help. Items that boost Con do give extra HPs though, RAW at least. Otherwise this looks fine. Edit: Damn, how did I manage to get so mixed up on that? >< This is how Con works normally. No need for a house rule. Oh, did I mix it up with the way that int gains work? D: I use this as well. I'm trying to prevent someone with maxed diplomacy being able to make anyone neutral his best friend, etc. So far it's working. You may be better served by making spell research a downtime only thing and handwave the costs and working closely with the player wishing to design a new spell. The next to last line (DM may choose...) seems to indicate that you expect players to design a spell, present it, roll, and then you will tell them it is inappropriate and that it fails without discussing it with them before hand. I'd suggest that you just work with your player(s) interested in designing a new spell and, once everyone is satisfied, introduce the spell in the game somehow (mentor, merchant, treasure, ancient tome, etc.) for immediate use or, again, handwave it as part of downtime without sweating the cost details. Well, I do advise them, yes, that line is more a warning in case they don't listen to me. To do their research they do need downtime - they can't really do stuff like that in a dungeon. Maybe I need to clarify both of those points in the wording? My initial impression is that this system looks very abusable. I'd have to give it more time to see beyond that, but one would think that this point system, combined with normal progression, could easily generate situations where you could end up with one of: can't be hit, can't miss, can succeed on nearly any DC of skill check, will have HP's beyond belief, saves through the roof, etc. You did see that it doesn't stack with magic or items, right? It replaces a large proportion of their weath by level too, so they can't put all of their points into one area the bost others with items. So you are using this but aren't allowing psionics...color me confused. It's the one thing I like about psionics. xD Standard procedure. Thank you very much for such detailed feedback! =D |