[4e] Feat to lessen item reliance - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

[4e] Feat to lessen item reliance

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
Reyemile
Mar 30, 2009 23:35:19 One of the classic situations of adventure novels is when the hero or heroes are captured, forced to escape from a desperate situation with only what they can scavenge and their own wits.

Unfortunately, in DnD, this makes you suck. Trying to have a remotely on-level fight with non-magical gear makes you incredibly underpowered, particularly at epic where you've just take a -5 penalty to ALL your combat stats.

So what do you think of the following feat?

Always Prepared [Paragon]
You have a +2 enhancement bonus to all your Weapon and Implement attacks and to all your defenses.
Increase this bonus to +4 at 21st level.
#2
Quintarius
Mar 31, 2009 2:04:33
Always Prepared [Paragon]
You have a +2 enhancement bonus to all your Weapon and Implement attacks and to all your defenses if you wear less than 2 magic items.
Increase this bonus to +4 at 21st level.

Emphasis by me ;)
#3
wyld_mutation
Mar 31, 2009 16:03:40 Or remove item enhancement altogether.

+1 Enhhancement bonus at lvl3, and each 5 levels thereafter I believe.

Fixes it, doesn't require a feat, and still has Magic Items worth getting.
#4
Reyemile
Mar 31, 2009 17:23:08
Always Prepared [Paragon]
You have a +2 enhancement bonus to all your Weapon and Implement attacks and to all your defenses if you wear less than 2 magic items.
Increase this bonus to +4 at 21st level.

Emphasis by me ;)

Why?

Or remove item enhancement altogether.

+1 Enhhancement bonus at lvl3, and each 5 levels thereafter I believe.

Not sure how this would function, since it would seriously muck up the gold costs of everything. Would be nice to not require a feat, though, you're right.
#5
bartleby42
Mar 31, 2009 18:19:22 Why make this a feat?

If you feel the system makes PCs too reliant of items then why make the PCs all take a feat? Why not give every a +1 to hit and defenses at 3rd, 11th and 21st? Which I think was suggested in a wonderful post a few weeks ago that explained the "scaling gap" between PCs and monsters.
#6
vebrandsson
Mar 31, 2009 18:59:15 I think people don't see the brilliance of this feat. It gives a typed enchantment bonus so it doe not stack with normal magic items, and is a poor bonus compared to normal magic items of the level intentionally, makes having magic items still worth it but you aren't screwed without them. I like this feat its brilliant and well done.
#7
wyld_mutation
Mar 31, 2009 19:11:05
Not sure how this would function, since it would seriously muck up the gold costs of everything. Would be nice to not require a feat, though, you're right.

It doesn't muck up anything, magic items STILL have an enhancement of their own, thus they can "beat" your enhancement. Or you can get a "weak" version of an item at a higher level.

Now there might be some minor changes to be made (see weapons such as Frost Weapons) but overall it should work out fine.
#8
Reyemile
Apr 01, 2009 0:32:43
I think people don't see the brilliance of this feat. It gives a typed enchantment bonus so it doe not stack with normal magic items, and is a poor bonus compared to normal magic items of the level intentionally, makes having magic items still worth it but you aren't screwed without them. I like this feat its brilliant and well done.

:embarrass :embarrass :embarrass

But yeah, I guess I thought it was obvious cause I came up with it. Let me explain, since apparently people don't understand what this feat is meant to do. The Enhancement bonus does nothing with the standard array of magic items--at the levels the boost comes in, you are practically guaranteed to already have an equal or greater enhancement bonus from your items that the feat offers..

However, with this feat, when your 25th level character snaps the neck of a guard and scoops up a completely non-magical longsword, he is taking a survivable -1 or -2 to his attack roll compared to his normal magic weapon. Without this feat, he'd face a crippling -5 or -6. Similarly, taking off Godplate to wear Stormtrooper armor as a disguise could cost as many as 9 full points of AC, factoring in enhancement and Masterwork bonuses; the +4 epic enhancement bonus offered by my feat makes this ploy a little less suicidal.
#9
Salamandyr2000
Apr 01, 2009 16:52:55 I think in my games I would rather just give the property to players than tax them a feat for it. For one thing, it's too situational to provide a bonus all that often, so unless you make it clear that there are going to be times where they are without magic items in your games, most players I think are more likely to go with feats that help them all the times and worry about the hypothetical when it happens.

When I start my campaign back up, I as DM plan to give players a +1 enhancement bonus at 6th, 12th, 18th, and 24th, making sure they are a 1 to 2 points off the top end, making sure they want magic armor, a primary magic weapon, and a neck slot item, but freeing up the cost for their secondaries, like say a fighter's longbow.
#10
mellored
Apr 03, 2009 10:36:54 There needs to be one where rogues can use their powers without a lightblade/crossbow. Seriously without one they loose everything.
#11
umcorian
Apr 05, 2009 20:32:08
One of the classic situations of adventure novels is when the hero or heroes are captured, forced to escape from a desperate situation with only what they can scavenge and their own wits.

Unfortunately, in DnD, this makes you suck. Trying to have a remotely on-level fight with non-magical gear makes you incredibly underpowered, particularly at epic where you've just take a -5 penalty to ALL your combat stats.

So what do you think of the following feat?

Always Prepared [Paragon]
You have a +2 enhancement bonus to all your Weapon and Implement attacks and to all your defenses.
Increase this bonus to +4 at 21st level.

I saw one set of rules awhile back that were deliberately geared to diminishing or all together removing magical items, posted by Myou.

http://www.zipworld.com.au/~hong/dnd/innate_magic.htm

It *is* heavily exploitable, so I wouldn't use them without combining it with a low magical item setting... but I think they add a ton of flavor.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Reyemile Mar 30, 2009 23:35:19	One of the classic situations of adventure novels is when the hero or heroes are captured, forced to escape from a desperate situation with only what they can scavenge and their own wits. Unfortunately, in DnD, this makes you suck. Trying to have a remotely on-level fight with non-magical gear makes you incredibly underpowered, particularly at epic where you've just take a -5 penalty to ALL your combat stats. So what do you think of the following feat? Always Prepared [Paragon] You have a +2 enhancement bonus to all your Weapon and Implement attacks and to all your defenses. Increase this bonus to +4 at 21st level.
#2 Quintarius Mar 31, 2009 2:04:33	Always Prepared [Paragon] You have a +2 enhancement bonus to all your Weapon and Implement attacks and to all your defenses if you wear less than 2 magic items. Increase this bonus to +4 at 21st level. Emphasis by me ;)
#3 wyld_mutation Mar 31, 2009 16:03:40	Or remove item enhancement altogether. +1 Enhhancement bonus at lvl3, and each 5 levels thereafter I believe. Fixes it, doesn't require a feat, and still has Magic Items worth getting.
#4 Reyemile Mar 31, 2009 17:23:08	Always Prepared [Paragon] You have a +2 enhancement bonus to all your Weapon and Implement attacks and to all your defenses if you wear less than 2 magic items. Increase this bonus to +4 at 21st level. Emphasis by me ;) Why? Or remove item enhancement altogether. +1 Enhhancement bonus at lvl3, and each 5 levels thereafter I believe. Not sure how this would function, since it would seriously muck up the gold costs of everything. Would be nice to not require a feat, though, you're right.
#5 bartleby42 Mar 31, 2009 18:19:22	Why make this a feat? If you feel the system makes PCs too reliant of items then why make the PCs all take a feat? Why not give every a +1 to hit and defenses at 3rd, 11th and 21st? Which I think was suggested in a wonderful post a few weeks ago that explained the "scaling gap" between PCs and monsters.
#6 vebrandsson Mar 31, 2009 18:59:15	I think people don't see the brilliance of this feat. It gives a typed enchantment bonus so it doe not stack with normal magic items, and is a poor bonus compared to normal magic items of the level intentionally, makes having magic items still worth it but you aren't screwed without them. I like this feat its brilliant and well done.
#7 wyld_mutation Mar 31, 2009 19:11:05	Not sure how this would function, since it would seriously muck up the gold costs of everything. Would be nice to not require a feat, though, you're right. It doesn't muck up anything, magic items STILL have an enhancement of their own, thus they can "beat" your enhancement. Or you can get a "weak" version of an item at a higher level. Now there might be some minor changes to be made (see weapons such as Frost Weapons) but overall it should work out fine.
#8 Reyemile Apr 01, 2009 0:32:43	I think people don't see the brilliance of this feat. It gives a typed enchantment bonus so it doe not stack with normal magic items, and is a poor bonus compared to normal magic items of the level intentionally, makes having magic items still worth it but you aren't screwed without them. I like this feat its brilliant and well done. :embarrass :embarrass :embarrass But yeah, I guess I thought it was obvious cause I came up with it. Let me explain, since apparently people don't understand what this feat is meant to do. The Enhancement bonus does nothing with the standard array of magic items--at the levels the boost comes in, you are practically guaranteed to already have an equal or greater enhancement bonus from your items that the feat offers.. However, with this feat, when your 25th level character snaps the neck of a guard and scoops up a completely non-magical longsword, he is taking a survivable -1 or -2 to his attack roll compared to his normal magic weapon. Without this feat, he'd face a crippling -5 or -6. Similarly, taking off Godplate to wear Stormtrooper armor as a disguise could cost as many as 9 full points of AC, factoring in enhancement and Masterwork bonuses; the +4 epic enhancement bonus offered by my feat makes this ploy a little less suicidal.
#9 Salamandyr2000 Apr 01, 2009 16:52:55	I think in my games I would rather just give the property to players than tax them a feat for it. For one thing, it's too situational to provide a bonus all that often, so unless you make it clear that there are going to be times where they are without magic items in your games, most players I think are more likely to go with feats that help them all the times and worry about the hypothetical when it happens. When I start my campaign back up, I as DM plan to give players a +1 enhancement bonus at 6th, 12th, 18th, and 24th, making sure they are a 1 to 2 points off the top end, making sure they want magic armor, a primary magic weapon, and a neck slot item, but freeing up the cost for their secondaries, like say a fighter's longbow.
#10 mellored Apr 03, 2009 10:36:54	There needs to be one where rogues can use their powers without a lightblade/crossbow. Seriously without one they loose everything.
#11 umcorian Apr 05, 2009 20:32:08	One of the classic situations of adventure novels is when the hero or heroes are captured, forced to escape from a desperate situation with only what they can scavenge and their own wits. Unfortunately, in DnD, this makes you suck. Trying to have a remotely on-level fight with non-magical gear makes you incredibly underpowered, particularly at epic where you've just take a -5 penalty to ALL your combat stats. So what do you think of the following feat? Always Prepared [Paragon] You have a +2 enhancement bonus to all your Weapon and Implement attacks and to all your defenses. Increase this bonus to +4 at 21st level. I saw one set of rules awhile back that were deliberately geared to diminishing or all together removing magical items, posted by Myou. http://www.zipworld.com.au/~hong/dnd/innate_magic.htm It is heavily exploitable, so I wouldn't use them without combining it with a low magical item setting... but I think they add a ton of flavor.