So, here is the link to the Auspicious Opportunist, all set up in a PDF. If you have any artwork you'd like to see in it, suggestions, or see any mistakes, please let me know. I'll still watch the thread for your comments.
The class, the Lancer, a spear wielding martial controller.
Lugritor still has his PDf, the original, with pictures. Lancer PDF. (Lugritor, if you take it down, let me know and I'll remove the link.)
Is has a few edits now.
- I reduced the class skills by 1 and removed perception. I'll increase the skill choice back to 4 if someone can suggest another skill for the list.
- I added a new at-will, Rushing Strike.
- I changed all ranged powers to key off of Strength only.
- I changed Encounter 3 Precision Strike to immoblize instead of granting combat advantage.
- I removed the Lancer requirement from the feat Flatten the foe, but it only triggers on powers with the weapon keyword. It seemed to generic to be class specific.
Finally, and most importantly, I added a martial based epic destiny. It has no specific connection to this at the moment, but I've included it here for the moment any way.
That sounds like a decent name, but if I named it a Dragoon, I'd almost feel obligated to include at least a few powers that involved jumping to attack. Although it does give me an idea for a name.
General Henry
A character with a lot of multitarget attacks for one.
In his first 9 levels the fighter has a single double target at-will, and 1 double target encounter power, and 1 burst encounter power
He has a push 1 for an at-will and a slide 1 daily.
For status effects he has 3 slow, 1 prone, 1 ongoing damage 5, 1 immobilize, and 2 AC penalty.
This class has a double target at-will, a burst at-will, 1 blast encounter, 4 burst encounter, 3 burst daily, 1 blast daily, and a psuedo burst daily.
It has an at-will push, 3 encounter push, and 2 daily push, and 1 encounter slide.
It has 2 daze, 3 prone, 3 ongoing damage 5, 1 unconcious, 3 AC penalty, 1 combat advantage for a round, 2 weakened, and 1 attack penalty.
They would feel like very different classes in actual play, even if they might look a little similar at first.
They would feel like very different classes in actual play, even if they might look a little similar at first.
yep, just trying to fill in some of those ???
Currently I'd say defender.
Though at the other end of the spectrum from a paladin.
High offense and containment, but relatively low defense.
oh and speaking of dragoons
http://www.enworld.org/wiki/index.php?title=Dragoon
Defender? Possibly.
Though it is definitly on the opposite end from the paladin.
Flurry of Blows
Defensive Spin
Blinding Swipe
some great defender material in there
Have him spin up like a heavy in team fortress.
minor action, but while he's spun up he's slowed.
Striker
+Xd6 damage
The pattern is either 1/2/3 if its relatively common/easy to do (Ranger/Warlock) or 2/3/5 if not so common/easy (rogue) right now the build you have that most fits strikers is Precision Strike.
Defender
Ability to Mark
Its not much, but the -2 is often a determining factor in whom smart monsters attack, even dumb ones. This will be more true for this guy as he isn't a heavily armored target like Paladin/Fighters. flurry of blows is a defender
Some general comments about powers
Level 1:
Spinning Strike: change to 1[w] with no bonus due to strength, upgrades to 2[w]. Otherwise Spinning Strike is decidedly weak by level 11 as it doesn't get enhancement to damage, and is at best minion control. As this guy isn't a controller, minion control is third-fourth rate choice for him. This one also needs to have Close put onto its burst.
Rapid Strike: Just plain Strength v AC
Strength -2 drops the damage/round potential significantly (by 10% in fact), more so than two hits gain
Its another power that seems mildly controllerish, it could also be fixed by changing it from 'two creatures' to one creature hit twice.
4.4 damage though is still less than average from a basic attack, it does ramp up later as the character gains enhancment bonus to the weapon, but not enough to make up the difference.
Defensive Spin: Drop the damage, turn it into a level 2 utility, make it last int modifer rounds.
General for Encoutners:
Encounter powers that are strong control should be 2[w] pushing 1 square is not strong control. Pushing 2+ squares is. Additionally powers that get more than 1 target should be 1[w]
Swirling Blows: Needs either Close Burst or Close Blast. the way it is now, its wonkily worded. I think Blast is what you are looking for, a blast 1 would be a 1x1 square in front of you though. Close burst 1 would be the eight squares closest to you. (IE all the ones around you). If you go with Blast make it Blast two, as that would be 2x2 square placed in anyway so that 2 squares are touching your squares. I would also change the push value for flurry of blows equal to 1/2 Int Modifer or something similar. If you change push value it needs to stay 1[w] otherwise should be 2[w]
Lunge: See General Comment for Encounter Powers
Blinding Swipe: See Swirling Blows, should stay at 1[w]
Leg Sweep: See General Comment for Encounter Powers
General Comment about Dailies
Dailies that are not strong control should be 3[w] those that are strong but not burst/blast should be 2[w] those that strong and a burst should be 1[w]
Whirling Attack
Should target AC (It should be uncommon for a weapon power to bypass armor when its just plain hitting them), should remain 2[w] (as six potential squares for the defender and 16 for the striker). I would stick a 'must be wielding a pole arm, spear or staff' on it, and just change its AoE to 'close burst 2' it will lead to less confusion.
Bleeding Wound: Up to 3[w], drop ongoing damage on missed attack (2 is a very low amount, and leads to needless book keeping so should be avoided).
Head Wound
Just remove this power, its overpowered and there isn't a good way to fix it.
Quick Strikes: I'm been chewing my lip over this. I like it for a lot reasons, but it feels a tad too good for level 1. for now I suppose its ok.
Level 2 Utility
Sudden block: Change wording to be 'you are targeted by an attack that would normally hit you' interrupt occurs before resolution of that which it interrupts. If its trigger is 'something hits you', it won't technically trigger till after the attack and causes weird time paradoxes.
Vault: +10 is insanely good. +10 is the equivalent of 20 level boost to the skill. Make it +2/+4. Please.
Polearm Wall: Move to 1st Level stick the word 'stance' in it. Or better stick 'sustain: Move Action' Either way, its not a level 2 utility. Utility powers don't attack (outside of illusonary wall) and don't deal damage (generally speaking).
Thats it for now. heh.
Vault: +10 is insanely good. +10 is the equivalent of 20 level boost to the skill. Make it +2/+4. Please.
+10 is actually fine for this; 'Vault' seems comparable to the Wizard's 'Jump' spell, which grants a +10 to one target, whereas Vault does the same but only for oneself (and requiring a polearm at that). Seems balanced to me.
Changed Rapid Strike from -2 to -1.
Changed all of the Bursts and Blasts to Close Bursts and Blasts. I thought that something seemed to be missing from.
Swirling Blows now pushes equal to Dexterity modifier instead of just 1.
Lunge is now 2[W].
Aluman
I considered Leg Sweep as a 2[W] power, but the fighter gets an almost identical attack that is also only 1[W].
Bleeding Wound is fairly similar to Acid Arrow, which also inflicts 2 ongoing damage on a miss.
Head Wound is weaker than sleep, but I am considering moving up to paragon tier once I find a replacement for it. Then again, seems like Polearm Wall can replace it. So Polearm Wall is now a 1st level daily and Head Wound is reserved for later use.
Sudden Block and Vault are directly comparable to the Wizard's Shield and Jump utilities.
Thanks for the comments and criticism. I appreciate the help.
Unconcious is a powerful state the large area of Sleep is negiliable to be honest, this power in addition to a lot of damage 25% of the time effectively Kills the opponent.
I don't really like seeing Acid Arrow do 2onging on a miss, however its damage is acid so it almost makes sense for it to do so. Bleeding Wounds doesn't inflict typical ongoing damage, its more like a fighter or ranger style, where you open an artery and the bleed out. It (to me) doesn't make sense to do ongoing on a miss.
Leg Sweep is like Spinning Sweep, but to me Spinning Sweep is the weakest of the first level encounters for a fighter, it would be fine at 2[w]. Being knocked prone is slightly advantegous but not drastically so. Its a move action to stand, and negates everything without provoking.
Good point, it does give Eldarin another option. Could also multiclass suprisingly well with wizard too.
And I pulled Head Wound entirely for now. If might go in at a far higher level, but for now it's out.
I figured that the since damage was still dealt, it wasn't a total miss, just not as deep as it should have been.
Rather than up the damage on Leg Sweep, I gave it two targets.
Paragon Powers
Rotating Assault
Encounter * Martial, Weapon
Your strike out at all nearby foes.
Standard Action * Close Burst Melee Weapon
Target: All enemies in the burst
Attack: Str vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier damage.
-----Flurry of Blows: Your push all the target a number of squares equal to your Dexterity modifier.
Seems pretty ok to me, about on the level with other attacks of this level, maybe change it to slide 1+dex modifier as IIRC push allows OA's. either way should read read push all the targets.
Blinding Cloud
Encounter * Martial, Weapon
Using your weapon, you sweep up a cloud of dust to blind your foes.
Standard Action * Close Burst 2
Target: All creatures in the burst
Attack: Dex vs. Reflex
Hit: 1[W] and the target is blinded until the beginning of your next turn.
I like this one. reword to be the targets are blinded.
Leap Attack
Encounter * Martial, Weapon
You suprise your foe by attacking in a unorthodox manner.
Standard Action * Melee Weapon
Special: You may shift 5 squares before making this attack. You may ignore difficult terrain during this shift and shift through enemies as though the were difficult terrain.
Target: One creature
Attack: Str +2 vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifer damaged.
-----Precision Strike: You gain a bonus to damage equal to your Intelligence modifier.
This I like too, I'm a little wary of basically phasing 5 squares before the attack but I think it works so until its playtested I would leave alone.
Blinding Assault
Encounter * Martial, Weapon
You rush forward and deliver a blinding flurry of attacks, distracting other nearby foes.
Standard Action * Melee Weapon
Special: You must have moved at least 3 squares to use this power.
Target: One creature
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier
-----Secondary Targets: Burst 5 centered on primary target.
-----Target: All enemies in the burst
-----Secondary Attack: Dexterity vs. Will
-----Hit: Each target provokes an opportunity attack from adjacent enemies and suffers a -2 penalty to attack rolls until the end of your next round. [/sblock]
Change must have moved at least 3 squares, to you must charge to use this attack. Its closer to the flavor text.
Defensive Lunges
Daily * Martial, Weapon
Whenever a foe comes close, you stop them in your tracks.
Immediate Reaction * Close Burst Melee Range +1
Trigger: An enemy moves or shifts into this powers range.
Target: One enemy in range.
Attack: Str vs. Ref
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier and the targets move ends.
-----Sustain Standard: You are immobilized. Whenever an opponent moves or shifts within this powers range, you may repeat this attack.
Miss: Half damage
The main probalm I see with this is it allows Eladrin to use it, then Fey Step (which specifically is ok within bounds of immbolized) and make it where most of the monsters on the field move they get attacked. I think if you state sustain standard: You may not move from your square it would work better.
Impale and Throw
Daily * Martial, Weapon
You strike your foe where it really counts, then toss them aside.
Standard Action * Melee Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Str vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier and ongoing 10 damage (save ends). Slide the target 4 squares.
Miss: Half damage and ongoing 5 damage (save ends). Slide theb target 2 squares
slide the, not theb. Otherwise seems fine.
Mighty Sweep
Daily * Martial, Weapon
With a single determined sweep, you knock all of your foes to the ground.
Standard Action * Close Burst Melee Weapon +1
Target: All enemies within the burst
Attack: Str vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier and the target falls prone.
Miss: Half damage.Lightning Reflexs
Encounter * Martial
With lightning relfexes, you try a last ditch dodge.
Immediate Interrupt * Personal
Trigger: You are hit by an attack
Effect: The attacker must reroll the attack.
Change the name, Lightning Reflexes is a paragon feat that gives +2 to reflex, there is no need to confuse issues.Interposing Block
Encounter * Martial, Weapon
You lash out, trying to block an attack on your allies.
Immedite Interrupt * Melee 1
Trigger: An adjacent ally is hit by an attack
Effect: Your ally gains a +2 power bonus to AC and Reflex defense against the triggering attack..
Trigger: Adjacent ally is attacked.
Otherwise you enter a loop where they are hit, but because of the +2 bonus to defense makes them not be hit, so the trigger doesn't occur.Suprise Strike
Daily * Martial
With careful timing, you make an attack that would otherwise be nearly impossible.
Minor Action * Personal
Effect: Your next weapon based attack gains 1 extra square of reach. Alternatively, you may increase the size of your next weapon based burst or blast by 1.[/sblock]
This seems like something Wizards might MC into just to get. I'm not sure if its worth doing anything about.Assaulting Flurry
Encounter * Martial, Weapon
Ignoring the risk, you make barrage of attacks, leaving all those struck unable to counter attack effectively.
Standard Action * Close Blast Melee Weapon + 1
Target: All creatures in the blast
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier and the target suffers a -2 penalty to attack rolls until the end of your next turn.
-----Flurry of Blows: The penalty to attack rolls is equal to your Dexterity modifier.
I think what you are striving for is a close blast 3 with polearms. Just state close blast 3, and make a requirement: Must be using a weapon with reach.Frenzied Whirlwind
Encounter * Martial, Weapon
You unleash a frenzied whirlwind of blows upon nearby creatures.
Standard Action * Close Burst Melee Weapon +1
Target: All creatures within the burst
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier and the target is knocked prone.
See that one above.Sweep and Strike
Encounter * Martial, Weapon
You deliver a sweeping blow to knock your opponents down, before trying to fin ish one of them.
Standard Action * Close Burst Melee Weapon +1
Target: One enemies within the burst
Attack: Str vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] + Strength modifier and the target is knocked prone.
-----Secondary Target: One prone enemy within melee range +1
-----Secondary Attack: Str vs. AC
-----Hit: 2[W] and the target is weakened (save ends).
Reverse the conditions and Name. Weakened is a stronger debuff then prone. And see above about close burst melee weapon +1 for both of them.Clear the Way
Encounter * Martial, Weapon
With three swift strike, you clear a path you your allies.
Standard Action * Melee Weapon +1
Target: Three seperate creatures
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] + Strength modifier and the target is pushed 3 squares.
-----Precision Strike: You gain a bonus to damage equal to your Intelligence modifier and push the target a number of squares equal to 2 + 1/2 your Intelligence modifier.[/sblock]
separate. I think it would be better to find something more suitable for precision strike, a three target power is plenty powerful with additional damage and pushing of the target it might be a bit over the top.Level 19 Daily Powers
Suprising Lunge
Daily * Martial, Stance
With expert agility, you can strike beyond your normal reach.
Standard Action * Personal
Effect: Until the end of the encounter, your attacks have an extra 1 square of reach.
This is a utility power not a daily attack, but not super powerful either, maybe move it to 16?Lethal Strike
Daily * Martial, Weapon
With a single strike, you lethally strike your foe.
Standard Action * Melee Weapon
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier and 15 ongoing damage (save ends). If the target saves, it takes ongoning 10 damage (save ends). If the opponent saves, it takes ongoing 5 damage (save ends).
Miss: Half damage and 5 ongoing damage (save ends)
This guarantees on a hit, a minimum of 30 extra damage. I haven't bothered to check to see if its overpowered, seem in line with Ranger.Frenzied Flurry
Daily * Martial, Weapon
With a flurry of attacks, you strike out at neaby foes.
Standard Action * Close Blast melee weapon +1
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Strength modifier and the target is dazed
-----Secondary Attack: Dexterity vs. Reflex
-----Hit: The target is pushed 2 squares and falls prone.[/sblock]
This one needs dazed (save ends) or dazed until the end of your next turn
Save ends keep it this way, until the end of your next turn flip the penalties.
Before I actually get reading the powers, my gut is telling me that this seems to actually be a controlling defender. Similar to what some would call Paladins in World of Warcraft, he seems designed to hold a wave of enemies. He's not damage-oriented, but not really made to hold a single monster on lockdown like the paladin or fighter. A single creature with good crush damage would be a problem, but several little ones would be fine. Let's see if I still think that at the end.
Class features:
Roundabout Capability seems like a really good way to hold down a hallway. I'm pretty fond of it. A fighter could come in to take any heavies, but the masses would have trouble getting through. As random brain storming, a power that reduces the effectiveness of ranged and area attacks that LoS through these squares might would really aid in that "wall" status.
I like that one build-path uses Dexterity, the other Intelligence. They're very similar in function, so people will likely want to take one or the other. As long as no powers require both. The build is extremely lacking in Will defense, so it might be worth noting that instead of boosting Dex and Int, they'll want to make Charisma or Wisdom a weak but not neglected third.
Powers:
At a glance over the first several levels, it seems FoB tactics favor holding the ground and pushing back large groups of enemies. PS seems much more mobile and about tagging one specific enemy.
The FoB route seems to have many more powers capable of filling its role. It has some durability and seems capable of taking a 5x5 block of squares and claiming it for itself with reasonable reliability. Lots of powers seem to use it's primary ability, Dexterity, to good effect, even if they don't specifically call for a FoB bonus.
The PS tree seems far more lack-luster of a choice. The build has good mobility, but doesn't really seem to know what to do with the foe when it gets there. At least in the early levels I've combed through, Intelligence is only a booster stat to a couple mobility utilities outside of the specific PS specific powers. They get where they're going, they can more than reliably tag a single enemy with their spear and push them around a bit, but I'm not sure that tag really counts for much, since the class just isn't (nor should be) meant for damage output. I think I'd still be building a FoB-style fortress in my newly acquired position.
I haven't gone into full balance-review yet, but I have a couple questions on abilities.
Defensive Spin. Is this meant to defend against the enemy attacked, or all defenses? It seems a little odd that your overall defense would be based on how well one opponent can dodge your attack.
Dazzling Assault. I think this creates a situation in which multiple allies can attack each enemy adjacent to them. Two enemies adjacent to two allies would add up to four free attacks. It might be better to limit one attack per ally, excluding yourself since you just got an attack and an effect off. (Then again, I think you might not be allowed to OA on your own turn anyways, but I'm still saying it for completeness.)
I'll give it a deeper look later, but that's my first impression. It seems pretty well thought out so far, on the whole.
Dazzling Assault. I think this creates a situation in which multiple allies can attack each enemy adjacent to them. Two enemies adjacent to two allies would add up to four free attacks. It might be better to limit one attack per ally, excluding yourself since you just got an attack and an effect off. (Then again, I think you might not be allowed to OA on your own turn anyways, but I'm still saying it for completeness.)
You can't make an OA on your own turn, and you can only make 1 OA a turn. so basically even if six enemies are affected, and you have three allies, only three attacks can be made.
I am glad to see that you don't see any real big issues with the paragon powers. I was pretty tired after writing them up and gleemax making me write them twice didn't help.
Rotating Assault
Good new is that forced movement never provokes opportunity attacks,
Leap Attack
I wanted the flavor of a leaping attack. Since it's an unexpected move, it shouldn't normally provoke opportunity attacks, so it's a shift. Obviously, difficult terrain doesn't matter if your jumping, so ignore that. Just to provide some penalty, I added enemies counting as difficult terrain. if you have a better way to word it or capture the concept, I'd appreciate it.
Defensive Lunges
I'm not entirely sure I want to diasble teleportation from allowing a setup with this maneuver. But popping up in the middle of the enemy group would be pretty powerful. I'll add a no teleportation clause. I don't want to add a "may not leave your square" because forced movement would end the power.
Lightning Reflexes
Changed to Lightning Dodge. Any better suggestions for a name?
Interposing Block
I worded it similar to the Ranger Utility Evade the Blow, which as I understand will actually prevent the attack if your no longer in range.
Suprise Strike
That is why I worded it specifically as only effecting weapon based powers. Especially so since this is a warrior class that is friendly to wizard multi class thanks to the secondary focus on Intelligence.
Assaulting Flurry, Frenzied Whirlwind, Sweep and Strike, Frenzied Flurry
I specifically worded these as Close Blast Melee Weapon +1 to be multiclass friendly. A rogue with his dagger or a ranged wielding two swords, or the shield and sword fighter won't be completly unable to use these with their weapon of choice, but they won't be utilizing the full potential either.
Sweep and Strike
I'm not sure why you wanted it reversed? Are you suggesting weakened to up to such a huge amount of possible targets, but prone to only one? Because such a massive radius weakened power seems a bit much.
Clear the Way
I reduced the bonus Intelligence damage to 1/2 Intelligence modifier. If you have a better power idea for Precision Strike, I'd like to hear.
Surpising Lunge
Moved to Level 16 Utility. Any suggestions for a good 19 Daily to replace it?
Lethal Strike
I'll remove the ongoing 15 part and increase the W by 1.
Frenzied Flurry
Dazed (Save Ends)
machmoth
Yeah, a note about the weak Will will definetly be added in the end. I do like that idea of a controlling defender though.
Defensive Spin
I never noticed that on Defensive Spin. It is intended to protect from all attacks. But is will usually be simple to hit with as well. I'll reword it.
Dazzling Assault
As Aluman said, allies can only get one attack, and you don't get any.
Intelligence is Inferior
Partially it was just how it worked out and partially I'm a bit concerned with multiclassing to wizard. Blast an area then sweep and and pick of the leader. Any suggestions for making Intelligence more equal to Dexterity.
As always, I appreciate the comments and criticism. I hope to have some Epic powers or feats up soon.
Aluman
I am glad to see that you don't see any real big issues with the paragon powers. I was pretty tired after writing them up and gleemax making me write them twice didn't help.
Yeah and some was caused by stupid gleemax running like molasses and my mind not working right :D
Rotating Assault
Good new is that forced movement never provokes opportunity attacks,
I wasn't quite sure, and honestly was too lazy to look up.
Leap Attack
I wanted the flavor of a leaping attack. Since it's an unexpected move, it shouldn't normally provoke opportunity attacks, so it's a shift. Obviously, difficult terrain doesn't matter if your jumping, so ignore that. Just to provide some penalty, I added enemies counting as difficult terrain. if you have a better way to word it or capture the concept, I'd appreciate it.
I got that intent. Maybe just state 'you gain fly 5 (hover) until end of turn, which must result in a charge attack'? I don't know though, that is probably just as wonky in the long rung.
Defensive Lunges
I'm not entirely sure I want to diasble teleportation from allowing a setup with this maneuver. But popping up in the middle of the enemy group would be pretty powerful. I'll add a no teleportation clause. I don't want to add a "may not leave your square" because forced movement would end the power.
Then maybe just 'you may not move from your square' as teleportation is technically movement, but forced movement isn't. This might allow them to shift one square a turn too (I would have to look up shifting see above about me and lazy tonight).
Lightning Reflexes
Changed to Lightning Dodge. Any better suggestions for a name?
Nope, I would suggested something it needs a better name for sure though.
Interposing Block
I worded it similar to the Ranger Utility Evade the Blow, which as I understand will actually prevent the attack if your no longer in range.
But see here is the diffrence: Your power grants a bonus to defense, which means that after the attack roll resolves, it doesn't apply unless you go back in time, Evade the blow you move out of range, so where the ax was, you are not, and I have already taken the black marker to Evade the Blow to change the wording to avoid the causality loop I mentioned.
Suprise Strike
That is why I worded it specifically as only effecting weapon based powers. Especially so since this is a warrior class that is friendly to wizard multi class thanks to the secondary focus on Intelligence.
See missed that. And yeah, its one of the things I have been looking over the burst/blast powers to make sure they aren't likely to be swapped out by any but Gish style multiclassing. This one was the only so far (and it would require three feats to get to, so I wasn't overly concerned).
Assaulting Flurry, Frenzied Whirlwind, Sweep and Strike, Frenzied Flurry
I specifically worded these as Close Blast Melee Weapon +1 to be multiclass friendly. A rogue with his dagger or a ranged wielding two swords, or the shield and sword fighter won't be completly unable to use these with their weapon of choice, but they won't be utilizing the full potential either.
See to me, these are kind of 'class specalities' that shouldn't stray too far from class, and there are plenty of warlords who favor reach weapons who can swing in and nab these for a bit of offense.
Sweep and Strike
I'm not sure why you wanted it reversed? Are you suggesting weakened to up to such a huge amount of possible targets, but prone to only one? Because such a massive radius weakened power seems a bit much.
Its AoE? *goes to check* I even realized it *smacks forhead* Maybe just have the weaken affect, it might be a tad powerful otherwise, but I am not positive. I haven't played at Paragon level to really have a feel for their power base.
Clear the Way
I reduced the bonus Intelligence damage to 1/2 Intelligence modifier. If you have a better power idea for Precision Strike, I'd like to hear.
Not right now I don't. I think that shoudl be fine fix though.
Surpising Lunge
Moved to Level 16 Utility. Any suggestions for a good 19 Daily to replace it?
Hmmm, no. I like the idea behind a sudden swift strike at level 19 for a daily though.
Lethal Strike
I'll remove the ongoing 15 part and increase the W by 1.
Again I'm pretty sure it made it overpowerful, but as I haven't played at that level I can't say for sure.
Frenzied Flurry
Dazed (Save Ends)
I figured that was the likely case.
I think mostly one side needs to mark the other get damage boost, then its clearly a defender/striker hybrid.
I will look over epic, but I warn you now I have never palyed Epic so my balance ability on it will be way off.
Wyld Mutation, glad you like it.
Intelligence is Inferior
Partially it was just how it worked out and partially I'm a bit concerned with multiclassing to wizard. Blast an area then sweep and and pick of the leader. Any suggestions for making Intelligence more equal to Dexterity.
I think a wizard spell or two would probably complement this class's controller nature fairly well. Though, it's the Dex side that seems to synergize better with it. I could see throwing down some icy terrain, then leaping through it to impale a creature, then taking advantage of my Roundabout Capability and reach to hold the line.
Even though the title seems to imply a "I hit one guy well" mentality, I think the branch might still benefit from sticking to the Lancer's AoE guns. Perhaps something like a Fearsome Lunge, which imposes a fear penalty on any he passes in his path to his target. A sonic blow that deafens and disorients an area around his target. Maybe a burning charge that creates a flame wall effect in his wake. A leap that lets him bounce from head to head. All just random half-thoughts, but really, just anything that could take advantage of his mobility to have some effect during the move, or to emphasize the impact of his single, planned strike in a way more than on just the target. Some of them already do that, but I think it'd be a good focus. Just some random thoughts.
However, you mentioned having an effect during the move and 2 epic powers actually have him moving and attack all he comes close to, I came to that idea evenually. Better late than never, right? I do think I need to rework the early Precision Strike powers though.
Currently, this is the closest thing I've seen to a working Martial Controller. I'm pretty interested in this.
My group doesn't meet again for a while, but I'd love to see some play-testing data, if anyone has some.
On the otherhand, the level 12 tornado utility should probably scale to 2[W].
That was the idea behind the Dragoon Utility. You can use the encounter power to move in and attack, then use the utility to move back. Works out perfectly. But yeah, I avoided making them totally untargetable for a round before the hit since it seemed to mystical to be martial.
I'm not running any games yet, but hopefully when I do I can get a player to run it and get some hard test data. If anybody has tried it though and wants to comment, I'd appreciate it.
Wyld Mutation
Tornado Utility is already better than a level 15 Daily stance since it attack out 2 squares and Lightning Strikes only striked out 1 square. I saved the 2[W] stance for level 29. Thanks for the vote of confidence.
Reach characters can use the help, and a reach focused defender will be a nice addition to any team. I can't wait to see more.
Though I do find it ratrher annoying that you get way more replies than I do... Then again I haven't finished posting my heroic powers so maybe things will pick up when I finish my powers. /endgriping
Keep up the good work!
Do you have any other paragon paths brewing?
Because life is pretty boring right now, and note that about 2/3 of my replies are me placing a "bulletin" so that I don't lose the topic.
Most of my posts are on other people's stuff as I limit myself to one project at a time. Part of being unable to focus means taking forever to do one thing, I don't want to take forever to do 2.
However that said... I think maybe I'll put up my TwF and Multiclassing stuff which I created/stole/adapted as I've read a few different threads.
Making whole classes is too much for me most of the time, though I've been figuring out how to make Lycanthropes playable.
Actually I meant to post requesting some ideas for paragon paths. I was going to wait on posting them till I had 4, but I temporarily had a freeze. And yeah, I spent 3 hours ignoring the utility until it became obvious that it could simply be a way to complete the Dragoon Jump power suite. Really cool to consider that at level 30 with a Demigod, you could run these powers one after another every turn.
Wyld Mutation
I went over and took a look at your Battle Sorcerer. I'll go more indepth on it later when I'm not so tired, but it looks like a good idea.
In general, I'm open to ideas for feat, paths and power if anybody wants to suggest them.
Guisarmes had hooks that could be used to pull horsemen of their mounts. There could be a path that specializes in grabbing and moving individual enemies.
Maybe since polearms have had a long history of being used with (and against) mounts, you could have a path that rewards being mounted on something?
I don't know, those are kind of of-the-cuff ideas, I'll think more.
The Elemental Fury and the Divine Shield.
Anyway: I like the sound of those paths. I'm not much for balance myself, but I'm excellent at moral support. Thus I tend to mostly just spout off random things and whatever idea pops into my head.
Are those paths going to use non-martial sources? If so you'd be creating the very first dual-source class. Which would make you the most awesome person on this board in my book.
I'll get back to you on the questions you asked when I get back. Got to leave for now.
And the Divine Shield can select multiclass paladin powers that don't use the implement.
BTW I appreciate your critique of my class. Thank you.
I'm more a flavor person than balance so... Well at least my designs are cool right?
Also, I've added feats now.
"If you already have scale armor proficiency reduce the armor check penalty of plate armor by one
If you already have plate proficiency youo gain resistance to weapon damage 3."
Or something similar. Defenders aren't realy my forte.
I like the feats, they look fairly balanced. Better balanced than my feats... But then I invented a whole new type of feat to make my feats balanced, cause I'm like that.
Also, I've gone over most of the power list and made a few additions and changes. I've improved some of the lower level Precision Strike powes, added a few bonuses for using a staff to several powers, and added a small handful or ranged powers to benefit the use of the only ignored spear with this class, the javelin. Full list of edits are below and in the edit post.
07/17/08 (Night)
-----Removed proficiency with any ranged weapon that isn't also considered a melee weapon (most thrown weapons.)
-----Modified Weapon Talent to offer a +1 bonus to hit with a Javelin.
-----Modified Defensive Spin to increase benefits if using a staff.
-----Lunge now pushes a number of squares equal to 1 + your Intelligence modifier if you have Precision Strike.
-----Leg Sweep now grants a +2 bonus to hit if you are using a staff.
-----Added Distracting Attack at Encounter 1
-----Bleeding Wound now allows a melee or ranged weapon.
-----Polearm Wall now requires a spear or polearm to use.
-----Precision Strike now force combat advantage (save ends) if you have the precision strike class feature.
-----Forceful Blow grants a +2 bonus to hit when using a staff.
-----Dizzying Strikes now grants a +2 bonus to hit if using a staff.
-----Wide Sweep now dazes if using a staff.
-----Heavy Blow now applies a -4 penalty to the saves if using a staff.
-----Added Immobilizing Rain to Daily 9
-----Daily 9 Lunge and Sweep now adds Intelligence to damage to all attacks, not just the first.
-----Encounter 13 Rotating Assault now offers a +2 bonus to hit with a staff.
-----Encounter 13 Leaping Attack with Precision Strike now pushes the target a number of squares equal to your Intelligence modifier.
-----Added Hail Storm to Encounter 13.
-----Daily 15 nows offers a +2 bonus to hit with a staff.
-----Encounter 17 Clear the Way with Precision strike now pushes 1 + Intelligence modifier instead of 2 + 1/2 Intelligence modifier
-----Encounter 17 Sweep and Strike now offers a +2 bonus to hit with a staff.
-----Added Javelin Hail to Daily 19.
-----Encounter 23 Celeritous Spin now grants a +2 bonus to hit if using a staff.
-----Encounter 23 Triple Combo now stuns (save ends) on the third hit if using a staff.
-----Daily 25 Unassailable Bastion now increases AC by 2 + 1/2 your Dexterity modifier if you are using a staff.
-----Added Lethal Storm to Daily 25
-----Added a Miss feature to Daily 29 Crippling Blow.
-----Daily 29 Disatrous Squall now grants a +2 bonus to hit if you are using a staff.
-----Removed proficiency with any ranged weapon that isn't also considered a melee weapon (most thrown weapons.)
-----Modified Weapon Talent to offer a +1 bonus to hit with a Javelin.
-----Modified Defensive Spin to increase benefits if using a staff.
-----Lunge now pushes a number of squares equal to 1 + your Intelligence modifier if you have Precision Strike.
-----Leg Sweep now grants a +2 bonus to hit if you are using a staff.
-----Added Distracting Attack at Encounter 1
-----Bleeding Wound now allows a melee or ranged weapon.
-----Polearm Wall now requires a spear or polearm to use.
-----Precision Strike now force combat advantage (save ends) if you have the precision strike class feature.
-----Forceful Blow grants a +2 bonus to hit when using a staff.
-----Dizzying Strikes now grants a +2 bonus to hit if using a staff.
-----Wide Sweep now dazes if using a staff.
-----Heavy Blow now applies a -4 penalty to the saves if using a staff.
-----Added Immobilizing Rain to Daily 9
-----Daily 9 Lunge and Sweep now adds Intelligence to damage to all attacks, not just the first.
-----Encounter 13 Rotating Assault now offers a +2 bonus to hit with a staff.
-----Encounter 13 Leaping Attack with Precision Strike now pushes the target a number of squares equal to your Intelligence modifier.
-----Added Hail Storm to Encounter 13.
-----Daily 15 nows offers a +2 bonus to hit with a staff.
-----Encounter 17 Clear the Way with Precision strike now pushes 1 + Intelligence modifier instead of 2 + 1/2 Intelligence modifier
-----Encounter 17 Sweep and Strike now offers a +2 bonus to hit with a staff.
-----Added Javelin Hail to Daily 19.
-----Encounter 23 Celeritous Spin now grants a +2 bonus to hit if using a staff.
-----Encounter 23 Triple Combo now stuns (save ends) on the third hit if using a staff.
-----Daily 25 Unassailable Bastion now increases AC by 2 + 1/2 your Dexterity modifier if you are using a staff.
-----Added Lethal Storm to Daily 25
-----Added a Miss feature to Daily 29 Crippling Blow.
-----Daily 29 Disatrous Squall now grants a +2 bonus to hit if you are using a staff.
Nice set of changes by the way.
Maybe like any charging foe that attacks you or an adjacent ally takes [W] damage.
You've got everything else.
Oh and I'd have never finished the Battle Sorceror without your input, so, Thanks.:D
I'd say it's a controller.
Lancer PDF
Note-to-self: Now I need someone to make a PDF for me, or I'll do it myself if I ever feel like it.
Wow! Very nice, a few unclosed VBcodes and one or two spelling errors but its great!
Note-to-self: Now I need someone to make a PDF for me, or I'll do it myself if I ever feel like it.
Curses I thought I found all of them, oh well I will fix them when I add the Paragon classes
Just go slowly through. And remember to fix the word "controller" on the role line.
It is very nicely done.
(Note: I'm the only one who notices those sorts of things.)
Unless someone thinks something important is missing or has any suggestions that lead to a big update, I'm wondering what I could work on next.
Maybe you could pop into the Body Master thread and help that guy.
I'm giving it a shot but everyone knows my balance is never quite right.;)
Other than that... Warshaper? Master of Many Forms? Warmage?
Yes I have an obsession with mages! Get over it!
*is sorry for being defensive*
You do great work, anything you try I'll help as much as I can, though I'm better at fixing spelling and syntax issues than anything else.
Maybe go ahead and create an epic destiny that's tied in with this guy? (the fact that they're only 4 really bugs me). A martial destiny that could be like Empire-Founder or something.
SS deals [W] to up to 8 foes. RS deals [W] to 2 foes. Furthermore, at 21st lvl SS gets str mod, RS doesn't.
I'd do something to give RS a little more balance when compared to SS. I'd change RS to deal str-modifier damage and let it be against "one or two foes". Either that or give SS a small negative to attack rolls.
Gave Spinning Strike a -1 to hit and it doesn't differentiate between allies and enemies instead.. Sound better.?
Except the wizard has no penalties. :D
Anyway, good catch James.
Blue Mage
While I don't think of the Lancer as all that hot of a traditional defender, if I were a striker, I'd gladly hide behind his one-spear-wall, so I guess the role fits, even if I consider him, first and foremost, a controller.
8/14/08 - - 4:20
-----Clarified that with Lancer Tactics you choose only one.
-----Removed the -1 attack penalty from Spinning Strike
-----Replaced the At-Will Rapid Strike with the At-Will Burst Strike
-----Added the At-Will Vertical shot to provide javelin throwers an at-will power.
-----Changed Encounter 1 Lunge to deal 1[W] instead of two and weaken the target until the end of your next turn.
-----Changed Encounter 1 Distracting Shot to allow Dexterity instead of Strength
-----Changed Encounter 1 Swirling Blows to only push equal to 1/2 your Dexterity modifier.
-----Added Close the Daily 1 Whirling Attack
-----Changed Daily 1 Bleeding Wound to deal 1[W] damage and added a Precision Strike benefit.
-----Clarified that Utility 2 Careful Positioning wa a personal power.
-----Changed Encounter 3 Flurry of Blows to deal 1[W] instead of 2[W] and add Dexterity to damage if your chose Flurry of Blows.
-----Changed Encounter 3 Precision Strike to target Reflex, not have bonus to the attack roll, and to add Intelligence to damage if you chose Precision Strike.
-----Changed Encounter 3 Forceful Blow to inflict weakened (save ends) if you are using a staff.
-----Changed Encounter 3 Dazzling Assault to remove Strength modifier from damage.
-----Changed Utility 6 Repositioning Maneuver to shift equal to your Intelligence modifier instead of 2 + Int modifier.
-----Changed Utility 6 Dire Recovery to allow only a healing surge with no bonus healing.
-----Changed Encounter 7 Manic Whirlwind to deal 2[W[ damage instead of 3[W].
-----Changed Encounter 7 Forceful Repositioning to slide the target 3 squares instead of 2
-----Changed Encounter 7 Wide Sweepsa to deal 1[W] + Strength modifier damage instead of just 1[W]
-----Changed Daily 9 to daze until the end of your next turn.
-----Changed Daily 9 Furious Flurry to only push 1/2 you Dexterty modifier squares.
-----Changed Daily 9 Immobilizing Rain to allow an option to Dexterity.
-----Changed Utility 10 Defensive Spring to specify a basic melee attack.
-----Moved Utility 10 Diving Attack to utility 16 and increased it's range increase to +2
-----Moved Utility 16 Surpse Strike to Utility 10
-----Changed Encounter 13 Blinding Cloud from 1[W] to 2[W]
-----Changed Encounter 13 Leaping Attack to ignore difficult terrain and large or smaller enemies during it's shift.
-----Changed Encounter 13 Javeling Storm to allow the use of Dexterity.
-----Changed Daily 15 Defensive Lunges to slow the target on a miss. Removed the anti teleportation clasue. Reworded it to act as a zone.
-----Changed Encounter 17 Assaulting Flurry to inflict 1/2 your Dexteirty modifier as a penalty.
-----Changed Encounter 17 Frenzied Whirlwing to deal 3[W] damage instead of 2[W].
-----Changed Encounter 17 to deal additional damage equal to your full Intelligence modifier and push 1 + 1/2 your Intelligence modifier
-----Changed Daily 19 Lethal Strike to deal 4[W] instead of 3[W]
-----Changed Daily 19 Endless Attacks to slow targets as well as you and removed the unsustinable clause in the miss.
-----Clarified Encounter 23 Cleritious Spin to block line of sight in all sqaures adjacent to you.
-----Changed Encounter 23 Devastating Thrust to deal 2[W] instead of 3, Push 1 + 1/2 your Intelligence modifier instead of full, and daze the target until the end of your next round.
-----Changed Encounter 23 Violent Swing to deal 2[W] instead of 3[W].
-----Changed Daily 25 Pinning Sweep to have the Weapon keyword.
-----Changed Daily 25 Obliterating Lunge to have the Weapon keyword.
-----Changed Daily 25 Unassailable Bastion to only add 1/2 your Intelligence modifier to Oppotunity attacks, and to slow you for as long as the stance persists.
-----Changed Daily 25 Lethal Storm to allow for Dexterity.
-----Changed Encounter 27 Lancer's Assault to ignore difficult terrain and large or smaller enemies during it's shift.
-----Changed Daily 29 Disastrous Squall to deal 4[W[] instead of 3[W]
-----Changed Daily 29 Crippling blow to inflict a -3 penalty on saving throws against it's effect.
-----Changed Daily 29 Iron Wall to slow on a miss instead of ending the move. Rewored it to work as a zone, allow teleportation, and allow small amounts of movement,
-----Fixed the Dragoon's Improved Damage Action by specifying trhat it increases damage.
-----Changed Dragoon Daily 20 to deal 4[W] instead of 3[W]
-----Changed Living Tornado Encounter 11 to specify who takes the penalty.
-----Changed Living Tornado Daily 20 to inflict 3[W[ instead of 2[W]
-----Changed Divine Shield's 16th level abilty to specify that the targets to be marked must be targets of the attack.
-----Changed Divine Shield Encounter 11 to attack all creatures in the burst, and yoou must be using a reach weapon to use it.
-----Changed Divine Shield's Daily 20 to specify that you must be using a reach weapon and to deal 3[W[ + Strength instead of 4d6 + Charisma
-----Changed the feat Improved Roundabout Capability to just inflict a -2 penalty to all attack rolls.
-----Removed the -1 attack penalty from Spinning Strike
-----Replaced the At-Will Rapid Strike with the At-Will Burst Strike
-----Added the At-Will Vertical shot to provide javelin throwers an at-will power.
-----Changed Encounter 1 Lunge to deal 1[W] instead of two and weaken the target until the end of your next turn.
-----Changed Encounter 1 Distracting Shot to allow Dexterity instead of Strength
-----Changed Encounter 1 Swirling Blows to only push equal to 1/2 your Dexterity modifier.
-----Added Close the Daily 1 Whirling Attack
-----Changed Daily 1 Bleeding Wound to deal 1[W] damage and added a Precision Strike benefit.
-----Clarified that Utility 2 Careful Positioning wa a personal power.
-----Changed Encounter 3 Flurry of Blows to deal 1[W] instead of 2[W] and add Dexterity to damage if your chose Flurry of Blows.
-----Changed Encounter 3 Precision Strike to target Reflex, not have bonus to the attack roll, and to add Intelligence to damage if you chose Precision Strike.
-----Changed Encounter 3 Forceful Blow to inflict weakened (save ends) if you are using a staff.
-----Changed Encounter 3 Dazzling Assault to remove Strength modifier from damage.
-----Changed Utility 6 Repositioning Maneuver to shift equal to your Intelligence modifier instead of 2 + Int modifier.
-----Changed Utility 6 Dire Recovery to allow only a healing surge with no bonus healing.
-----Changed Encounter 7 Manic Whirlwind to deal 2[W[ damage instead of 3[W].
-----Changed Encounter 7 Forceful Repositioning to slide the target 3 squares instead of 2
-----Changed Encounter 7 Wide Sweepsa to deal 1[W] + Strength modifier damage instead of just 1[W]
-----Changed Daily 9 to daze until the end of your next turn.
-----Changed Daily 9 Furious Flurry to only push 1/2 you Dexterty modifier squares.
-----Changed Daily 9 Immobilizing Rain to allow an option to Dexterity.
-----Changed Utility 10 Defensive Spring to specify a basic melee attack.
-----Moved Utility 10 Diving Attack to utility 16 and increased it's range increase to +2
-----Moved Utility 16 Surpse Strike to Utility 10
-----Changed Encounter 13 Blinding Cloud from 1[W] to 2[W]
-----Changed Encounter 13 Leaping Attack to ignore difficult terrain and large or smaller enemies during it's shift.
-----Changed Encounter 13 Javeling Storm to allow the use of Dexterity.
-----Changed Daily 15 Defensive Lunges to slow the target on a miss. Removed the anti teleportation clasue. Reworded it to act as a zone.
-----Changed Encounter 17 Assaulting Flurry to inflict 1/2 your Dexteirty modifier as a penalty.
-----Changed Encounter 17 Frenzied Whirlwing to deal 3[W] damage instead of 2[W].
-----Changed Encounter 17 to deal additional damage equal to your full Intelligence modifier and push 1 + 1/2 your Intelligence modifier
-----Changed Daily 19 Lethal Strike to deal 4[W] instead of 3[W]
-----Changed Daily 19 Endless Attacks to slow targets as well as you and removed the unsustinable clause in the miss.
-----Clarified Encounter 23 Cleritious Spin to block line of sight in all sqaures adjacent to you.
-----Changed Encounter 23 Devastating Thrust to deal 2[W] instead of 3, Push 1 + 1/2 your Intelligence modifier instead of full, and daze the target until the end of your next round.
-----Changed Encounter 23 Violent Swing to deal 2[W] instead of 3[W].
-----Changed Daily 25 Pinning Sweep to have the Weapon keyword.
-----Changed Daily 25 Obliterating Lunge to have the Weapon keyword.
-----Changed Daily 25 Unassailable Bastion to only add 1/2 your Intelligence modifier to Oppotunity attacks, and to slow you for as long as the stance persists.
-----Changed Daily 25 Lethal Storm to allow for Dexterity.
-----Changed Encounter 27 Lancer's Assault to ignore difficult terrain and large or smaller enemies during it's shift.
-----Changed Daily 29 Disastrous Squall to deal 4[W[] instead of 3[W]
-----Changed Daily 29 Crippling blow to inflict a -3 penalty on saving throws against it's effect.
-----Changed Daily 29 Iron Wall to slow on a miss instead of ending the move. Rewored it to work as a zone, allow teleportation, and allow small amounts of movement,
-----Fixed the Dragoon's Improved Damage Action by specifying trhat it increases damage.
-----Changed Dragoon Daily 20 to deal 4[W] instead of 3[W]
-----Changed Living Tornado Encounter 11 to specify who takes the penalty.
-----Changed Living Tornado Daily 20 to inflict 3[W[ instead of 2[W]
-----Changed Divine Shield's 16th level abilty to specify that the targets to be marked must be targets of the attack.
-----Changed Divine Shield Encounter 11 to attack all creatures in the burst, and yoou must be using a reach weapon to use it.
-----Changed Divine Shield's Daily 20 to specify that you must be using a reach weapon and to deal 3[W[ + Strength instead of 4d6 + Charisma
-----Changed the feat Improved Roundabout Capability to just inflict a -2 penalty to all attack rolls.
I appreciate all the work you've done in creating a very interesting and what looks like a fun class. My group is currently reviewing it to add it as one of our "core" house rules as an available class.
While looking at the Lancer, I did see about one power per level that just seemed to unbalance the character either by providing it with too much utility, or by overshadowing other abilities from other classes.
However, that was before your latest change. I will review the new changes and be adapting it to my groups idea of balanced. If youd like, Id love to provide you feedback along the way. Youre doing an excellent job and thank you for your time. - GiD
I do miss Rapid Strike, however, as it was a non burst power to take down minions with that WONT target your allies, but I can understand its removal.
I did have a quick question about
Burst Strike At-Will
How exactly does a Close Blast with Melee range work and is this already defined in current rules? How do you determine its blase range...just use the range 2 of the weapon (making it a 2x2 sqaure)?.
A Longsword gains targets a 1x1 area. No benefit.
A Reach weapon will target a 2x2 area.
Thanks for the support. Please let me know how any playtests go.
I removed Rapid Strike to allow Spinning Strike to attack without penalty, since the penalty was placed to keep it from over shadowing Rapid Strike. Besides which, with the new Burst Strike, situations where Rapid Strike was superior to both became rarer.
Do you think you could point out which powers are trouble makers. I find that I get plenty ot support for ideas, but few people want to look the balance over. It really helps to get a second set of eyes to look things over.
Also don't see why you kept it in if you are going to have Vertical Shot do the exact same thing with an option for either Str or Dex and do more damage.
I vote you remove Vertical Shot and change the Effect line to a Hit line on Defensive Spin.
This would balance it better.
Note: Member of GiD's group
I don't think anyone else in the game can penalize AC (especially by Dex Mod), much less in a 3 square burst, encounter, and at 3rd level.
I would look into this power and see about toning down the AC penalty, restricting it to a penalty toward you, or changing it to an effect such as weakened or slowed.
Is the PDF you put in an updated version that encompasses all these changes? If not, no point in using it.
Thanks
Valdark
Vertical Shot having that effect was a copy paste error. Thanks for pointing that out.
For Defensive Spin, would reducing the bonus to +1, +2 with a staff, then +2/+4 at epic sound reasonable for keeping it as an effect line.
I changed Encounter 3 Flurry of Blows to inflict -2 to AC (save ends) if you have the Flurry of Blows tactics. Sound better?
The PDF is not up to date as of today. I didn't actually create in and have no ability to update it unless Lugritor finds the time. I'll drop him a private message and hope he has the time.
Valdark
Vertical Shot having that effect was a copy paste error. Thanks for pointing that out.
For Defensive Spin, would reducing the bonus to +1, +2 with a staff, then +2/+4 at epic sound reasonable for keeping it as an effect line.
I changed Encounter 3 Flurry of Blows to inflict -2 to AC (save ends) if you have the Flurry of Blows tactics. Sound better?
Actually reviewing this with Gnome in Denial we don't really have a problem with Defensive Spin as it stands.
The defense bonus gives him a significant edge over his shield wielding friends but only on rounds where he uses this At-Will.
He must sacrifice his defense for offense and vice versa which works.
Neither of us feel the vertical shot makes sense or is necessary to the class.
By adding ranged At-Wills you may be spreading the class too thin.
-----Precision Strike: You deal additional damage equal to your Intelligence modiifer and the target grants combat advantage (save ends).
You may be stepping on the toes of both the Rogue and the Warlord classes.
They each have similar powers but combat advantage only lasts till the end of their next turn and is restricted to either personal or an ally of your choice.
I say that if you are set on this portion of the power at least push it back to later levels.
Vertical Shot was added because the class has a serious spear focus, with a class feature that benefits using a Javelin, and with 5 other ranged weapon based attacks, the Javelin provides an interesting option. The class can function with a Shield and Spear, providing increased defense at the cost of damage and a bit of accuracy. or you can downgrade damage further with a javelin and have some ranged capability.
I map the weapon options as follow.
Javelin + Shield - - - +2 Prof 1d6 damage - - ranged, reach
Spear + Shield - - - +2 Prof 1d8 damage - - reach
Quarterstaff - - - +2 Prof 1d8 damage - - reach, various staff bonus powers, wizard multi compatability
Long Spear - - - +2 Prof 1d10 damage - - reach, +1 to hit
Halberd - - - +2 Prof 1d10 damage - - reach, +1 to hit, Axe
Glaive - - - +2 Prof 2d4 damage - - reach, +1 to hit, Heavy Blade
Anything else is shutting down your class features and minimizing your impact on the battlefield. Does this rational for Vertical Shot sound reasonable?
At the same time though, I just realized that you can benefit from reach and a shield at the same time as written. I'm probably going to reduce those Defensive Spin bonuses as I suggested.
I'm not especially set on any powers actual effects. Have any suggestions for what to replace it with?
If you re-read above, Valdark retracted his comment with Defensive Strike. Returning it back to normal +2/+3 and then +3/+6 works with us just fine, even leaving it as an effect line. We both feel that the shield user will still have a significant advantage being able to use his +3 AC/Ref bonus (+2 shield and +1 shield spec) while still using encounter and daily powers to a larger effect. We also definately like the visual it gives us of a staff fighter swinging at air (missing) but still whilring around, driving enemies back (hence it being an effect line). In short, the bonuses before were fine, and moving them down makes the effect too small, imho.
EDIT after reading your comment about shield stacking: Either make it a shield bonus so it wont stack (but I do like the benefit of a shield/spear user) OR Leave it reduced but not reduced for STAFF where you cant use a shield.
It seems like youre definately determined about vertical shot. In my opinion, a ranged at will is not needed. The class itself, as you said, is very spear heavy, and if someone wants to shoot out a 'basic attack' at ranged with their javelin, they can do so, but an at will spreads the class a bit wild. Keeping him Str based melee gives more focus. Some Encounter or Daily abilities woulnt be bad for ranged though, but an at will seems too much...again IMHO. This is not balance but merely personal preference talking.
I will eventually sit down with a book and go over a full power comparison. Thank you for your time.
Burst Strike
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
You attack with a burst of strikes.
Standard Action * Close Blast Melee Weapon
Target: All creatures in the blast
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] damage.
-----Increase to 2[W] + Strength modifier damage at 21st level
Burst Strike, I think, is actually underpowered. Without other abilities (such as the stance that increases your range), its only a 2x2 Blast 1[W].
Compare to the Wizard At-Will Thunderwave:
At-Will * Martial, Weapon
You attack with a burst of strikes.
Standard Action * Close Blast 3, Implement
Target: All creatures in the blast
Attack: Int vs. Fort
Hit: 1d6 + Int thunder damage, and you push the target a number of squares equal to Wis mod.
-----Increase to 2D6 + Int modifier damage at 21st level
So, the wizard power has larger blast naturally, does more damage (+int scales), and pushes. I wouldn't suggest adding a push mechanic to your power (bc you already have a push at will), but something additional and maybe some more damage wouldn't hurt this power, or even more range. (Not all 3 of course =P) Its something to consider, as this power is lacking compared to its other controller variant.
I map the weapon options as follow.
Javelin + Shield - - - +2 Prof 1d6 damage - - ranged, reach
Spear + Shield - - - +2 Prof 1d8 damage - - reach
Quarterstaff - - - +2 Prof 1d8 damage - - reach, various staff bonus powers, wizard multi compatability
Long Spear - - - +2 Prof 1d10 damage - - reach, +1 to hit
Halberd - - - +2 Prof 1d10 damage - - reach, +1 to hit, Axe
Glaive - - - +2 Prof 2d4 damage - - reach, +1 to hit, Heavy Blade
Dont forget, Double Javelin or Double Spear to multi class into ranger ^^
I did weaken Defensive Spin, but left the part where it is better when using a staff. +1 normlly, +2 with a staff, doubling at epic. Does it seem too weak?
You've convinced me then. Vertical Shot is out. I figured it couldn't hurt to have the option, especially for humans with their option for a third at-will.
Burst Strike. So, do I increase it to Blast 3, add Strength, or push 1?
Edit: Thanks Lugritor. You've been great.
for a great class.Has anybody actually played it?
In fat, has anybody managed to playtest this class. I'd love to hear about. Also, if anyone has a suggestion to replace Perception on the skill list, I'd be glad to hear the suggestion.
He's a defender so you could exchange it for insight. (Being able to predict enemy movement.)
Another possibility is history (I wish all the old "types" were still around, as I could specifically state military).
Dungeoneering is possible, or on a further limb is nature. (Lancers from FFT have that kind of feel in the outfit.)
There aren't really enough skills to have a decent pool to pick from as a replacement.
Edit: Bluff is possible too.
- I reduced the class skills by 1 and removed perception. I'll increase the skill choice back to 4 if someone can suggest another skill for the list.
- I added a new at-will, Rushing Strike.
- I changed all ranged powers to key off of Strength only.
- I changed Encounter 3 Precision Strike to immoblize instead of granting combat advantage.
- I removed the Lancer requirement from the feat Flatten the foe, but it only triggers on powers with the weapon keyword. It seemed to generic to be class specific.
Most interestingly, I've added an epic destiny. It is not class specific, but I've added it here for the moment.
I think that it was tested in a few spots and had favorable feedback.