Action point change - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Action point change

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
infernice
Apr 27, 2010 20:47:29 If I were to change the Action Point rules to allow my PCs to use more than one action point per encounter, but only once per round, would that be too abuseable? I would still give them Action Points as normal (reset to one after extended rest, one every milestone).

I don't foresee any major problems with it, but has anyone tried and had negative results? Or is there something major I'm forgetting? Becasue as I see it, limiting players to using only one action point per encounter only prevents possible interesting and not terribly broken powers/features.

Examples include the Battlefield Archer PP utility, Archer's Glory. Its completely useless half of the time, when the ranger had an action point and already used it this encounter (or he uses the utility power, and then just has a sitting action point wasted).
#2
pluisjen
Apr 28, 2010 3:34:19 The main issue (and probably the reason it's not allowed by default) is because it allows you to save up all your Action Points until the most important battle of the day and then waste that in 3 rounds.

Same problem occurs with players saving up their Dailies.

Assuming your players don't save up everything they have "just in case" you should have no problems. (Or if you put enough pressure on them that they can't save up everything, that'd work to)
#3
ChrisTheS
Apr 28, 2010 10:34:03 If you left normal action points as is and just universally lifted the restriction for bonus action points (as granted by certain feats/path/destiny features - only some of them specify that the bonus points don't count against the limit), that would avoid the problem too.
#4
mellored
Apr 28, 2010 11:28:01 There's a Warlord ED that let's you do this.

Though in general, i don't see a major problem, assuming no-one trys to abuse it.
#5
poosticks7
Apr 28, 2010 16:41:17 There is also a Bard Paragon Path that does this, its one of their main features (that and the insane bonus you give everyone when you spend an action point).

I would advise against allowing everyone to do this, you could get a scenario where a 5 man Team spend 10 action pts in rapid succession. Way to kill your Big finale.
#6
Bandikoot
Apr 28, 2010 21:32:27 My gaming group has used this house rule almost as long as 4E has been in print and I can report no major problems with it. However, in our group people tend to spend their action points so by the time we hit the big boss battle it is rare for all the PCs to have 2 or more action points.

#7
stargazer_dragon
Apr 29, 2010 22:14:53 my players tend to save there dailies and action points up till they are eather wasting action points or they encounter a realy hard fight, if I allowed them to use action points once per round for as long as they had them availible then my bosses would be in big trouble already with them blowing there dailies on the boss I sometimes watch a realy tuff fight turn into a cakewalk

I mean here is how some of my boss fights end up,

After a few fights they finaly make it to the boss fight not sure yet that thios is actualy the boss they spend a round or to fighting noticeing that this fight is not going well at all or relising that they are likaly able to rest soon they start using there dailies, now immagin a players round when they do the following

Move if necisary otherwise convert to a minor action for extra umph if possible which it often it
Minor action buffing or damaging moves
Standard action daily power
Action point standard action daily power

Now the next person repeats till all the players have gone

The now broken and battered reminents of the encounter try to pull themselves together and make a attack or just flat retreat to try again later.

If the players got anouther round or 2 of double actions the boss battles would realy end up as the easiest battles of the night lol but hey sometimes thats just fun

Overall I see no reason that it would kill the game but be prepaire for shorter lived bosses. I personaly allow extra action points to be use to recharge there second wind power and use it as a free actions. So basicaly I allow them to use the action point & and recharge there second wind power but force the extra action point to be used to use second wind right away. uses up them pesky extra action points and adds a bit more healing to a party that might find it'self in trouble
#8
pluisjen
Apr 30, 2010 3:20:01 If your players have the option of saving all their dailies and action points like that, perhaps you should make the earlier battles a bit harder. It sounds like they might be too easy for them.
#9
stargazer_dragon
Apr 30, 2010 3:28:22 I already tend to run most of my encounters higher lvl then the parties lv, they just don't use action points or dailies till they have no other option, they use there encounter powers all the time and work well as a group. Personaly I don't mind my bosses falling faster then intended the players seam to get a kick out of real kicking ass every so often they seam to enjoy realy unloading on the boss and showing there max potential, Also I do give extended rests relitvly often basicaly whenever it makes sence to me that the plays could rest for a day I let them, I don't go out of my way to hinder there rests or try to cramm x combats betwean rests I just let the game prograss as it seams relistic to prograss long as the players are having fun I am happy, But don't think I make life easy on them I very often beat them around and bring them near party wipe or near death.
#10
koesherbacon
Jun 21, 2010 12:25:20 I typically reward my players for doing things creatively, solving problems, being funny, etc, by giving them an action point. I nix the rule where they can only have up to 3 APs. And I allow them to spend as many APs as they want in an encounter. I also allow them to spend an AP to reroll a die roll (making it similar to Elves' racial power; but Elves' get 1 freebie reroll). I also don't limit it to only 1 AP per round, if they want they can spend as many as they want!

My players really enjoy being able to reroll an attack roll or make multiple actions in any given round. It makes the characters even more heroic, they can do things that others around them can only dream about. It also makes encounters go much more quickly, which is a huge plus when they start dragging on. I'll tell them, "Now's the time you want to spend all your APs!" and they go nuts. It's awesome

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 infernice Apr 27, 2010 20:47:29	If I were to change the Action Point rules to allow my PCs to use more than one action point per encounter, but only once per round, would that be too abuseable? I would still give them Action Points as normal (reset to one after extended rest, one every milestone). I don't foresee any major problems with it, but has anyone tried and had negative results? Or is there something major I'm forgetting? Becasue as I see it, limiting players to using only one action point per encounter only prevents possible interesting and not terribly broken powers/features. Examples include the Battlefield Archer PP utility, Archer's Glory. Its completely useless half of the time, when the ranger had an action point and already used it this encounter (or he uses the utility power, and then just has a sitting action point wasted).
#2 pluisjen Apr 28, 2010 3:34:19	The main issue (and probably the reason it's not allowed by default) is because it allows you to save up all your Action Points until the most important battle of the day and then waste that in 3 rounds. Same problem occurs with players saving up their Dailies. Assuming your players don't save up everything they have "just in case" you should have no problems. (Or if you put enough pressure on them that they can't save up everything, that'd work to)
#3 ChrisTheS Apr 28, 2010 10:34:03	If you left normal action points as is and just universally lifted the restriction for bonus action points (as granted by certain feats/path/destiny features - only some of them specify that the bonus points don't count against the limit), that would avoid the problem too.
#4 mellored Apr 28, 2010 11:28:01	There's a Warlord ED that let's you do this. Though in general, i don't see a major problem, assuming no-one trys to abuse it.
#5 poosticks7 Apr 28, 2010 16:41:17	There is also a Bard Paragon Path that does this, its one of their main features (that and the insane bonus you give everyone when you spend an action point). I would advise against allowing everyone to do this, you could get a scenario where a 5 man Team spend 10 action pts in rapid succession. Way to kill your Big finale.
#6 Bandikoot Apr 28, 2010 21:32:27	My gaming group has used this house rule almost as long as 4E has been in print and I can report no major problems with it. However, in our group people tend to spend their action points so by the time we hit the big boss battle it is rare for all the PCs to have 2 or more action points.
#7 stargazer_dragon Apr 29, 2010 22:14:53	my players tend to save there dailies and action points up till they are eather wasting action points or they encounter a realy hard fight, if I allowed them to use action points once per round for as long as they had them availible then my bosses would be in big trouble already with them blowing there dailies on the boss I sometimes watch a realy tuff fight turn into a cakewalk I mean here is how some of my boss fights end up, After a few fights they finaly make it to the boss fight not sure yet that thios is actualy the boss they spend a round or to fighting noticeing that this fight is not going well at all or relising that they are likaly able to rest soon they start using there dailies, now immagin a players round when they do the following Move if necisary otherwise convert to a minor action for extra umph if possible which it often it Minor action buffing or damaging moves Standard action daily power Action point standard action daily power Now the next person repeats till all the players have gone The now broken and battered reminents of the encounter try to pull themselves together and make a attack or just flat retreat to try again later. If the players got anouther round or 2 of double actions the boss battles would realy end up as the easiest battles of the night lol but hey sometimes thats just fun Overall I see no reason that it would kill the game but be prepaire for shorter lived bosses. I personaly allow extra action points to be use to recharge there second wind power and use it as a free actions. So basicaly I allow them to use the action point & and recharge there second wind power but force the extra action point to be used to use second wind right away. uses up them pesky extra action points and adds a bit more healing to a party that might find it'self in trouble
#8 pluisjen Apr 30, 2010 3:20:01	If your players have the option of saving all their dailies and action points like that, perhaps you should make the earlier battles a bit harder. It sounds like they might be too easy for them.
#9 stargazer_dragon Apr 30, 2010 3:28:22	I already tend to run most of my encounters higher lvl then the parties lv, they just don't use action points or dailies till they have no other option, they use there encounter powers all the time and work well as a group. Personaly I don't mind my bosses falling faster then intended the players seam to get a kick out of real kicking ass every so often they seam to enjoy realy unloading on the boss and showing there max potential, Also I do give extended rests relitvly often basicaly whenever it makes sence to me that the plays could rest for a day I let them, I don't go out of my way to hinder there rests or try to cramm x combats betwean rests I just let the game prograss as it seams relistic to prograss long as the players are having fun I am happy, But don't think I make life easy on them I very often beat them around and bring them near party wipe or near death.
#10 koesherbacon Jun 21, 2010 12:25:20	I typically reward my players for doing things creatively, solving problems, being funny, etc, by giving them an action point. I nix the rule where they can only have up to 3 APs. And I allow them to spend as many APs as they want in an encounter. I also allow them to spend an AP to reroll a die roll (making it similar to Elves' racial power; but Elves' get 1 freebie reroll). I also don't limit it to only 1 AP per round, if they want they can spend as many as they want! My players really enjoy being able to reroll an attack roll or make multiple actions in any given round. It makes the characters even more heroic, they can do things that others around them can only dream about. It also makes encounters go much more quickly, which is a huge plus when they start dragging on. I'll tell them, "Now's the time you want to spend all your APs!" and they go nuts. It's awesome