So, intelligence is an ever-so-slightly gimped stat in 4e because it has too much overlap with dexterity while being marginally inferior in general purpose usefulness. This has always bugged me- if you have a build that is reliant on neither dex nor int for powers, it's pretty much always better to use dex. I find that to be an issue, and have come up with a lot of ideas for addressing it.
However, most of the ideas I (and others) have had either skew it in the opposite direction, have problematic ripple effects, or dont' play nice with the character builder.
So, what's my latest and greatest? You apply your intelligence modifier to all damage rolls when you score a critical hit. This approach is great IMO because:
1. Critical hits in 4e tend to be underwhelming anyway
2. The scaling is appropriate, unlike my last idea.
3. It gives just enough boost to Int to make it worth considering over dex without making it overtly superior.
4. It's a behind-the-scenes rule that is easy to retrofit into the game with no consequences.
5. You can easily have it apply to monsters as well so it's symmetrical and there's no real power creep.
6. It's thematically appropriate - you get a lucky opening and basically use your wits to make the most of it.
Now, you could also swap it and have Int govern Initiative and Dex govern critical hit damage bonus, which actually makes more sense probably and is mechically superior (initiative is more generally useful, but the skills tied to dex are more generally useful, so it balances out), but isn't compatible with the CB.
What do you guys think?
Now, you could also swap it and have Int govern Initiative and Dex govern critical hit damage bonus, which actually makes more sense...
I totally disagree with this. INT makes way more sense than DEX for this idea. You can sort of justify DEX making more sense for most weapon attacks, I guess, but it makes no sense for most implement attacks. INT, on the other hand, makes plenty of sense for both.
And I agree with Crimson that Int-to-Crit-damage makes far more sense to me than Dex in that role.
CC, that's kind of the idea- the problem with too many int. ideas (including some of my own) is that they are over the top and just swing the pendulum back in the other direction, I was looking for something subtle that would provide some incentive but would not make it a shoe-in, and thought this made the most sense.
Now, what would be neat-o is a better and more elaborate critical system that utilized Int. in some way, but I wouldn't really know where to start with that, and I tend not to mind simple mechanics - the game can get pretty bogged down already.
CC, that's kind of the idea- the problem with too many int. ideas (including some of my own) is that they are over the top and just swing the pendulum back in the other direction...
That's not what I mean. My initial post was from the perspective of what ideas sound fun and interesting, not what ideas are balanced. Apologies for not being clear enough.
CC, that's kind of the idea- the problem with too many int. ideas (including some of my own) is that they are over the top and just swing the pendulum back in the other direction...
That's not what I mean. My initial post was from the perspective of what ideas sound fun and interesting, not what ideas are balanced. Apologies for not being clear enough.
Oh I understood that, but it kind of applies both ways. I meant that I was looking for something that was kind of subtle conceptually as well as mechanically. I don't want everyone going "oh man I definitely want high Int!", I just want to make it *slightly* more attractive for people that are on the fence.
If you did this, how would it stack out? Mind doing a list comparison of the two stats' effects, with this included? (I'm... having problems remembering if I'm remembering all the applications for Dex.)
Dex - Initiative, Ranged Basic Attack, AC, Reflex, Acrobatics, Stealth, Thievery
Int - Critical Hit Damage, AC, Reflex, Arcana, History, Religion
I think it's a relatively simple, clean, and interesting use for the stat, that functions well with the system as-is. Again, I like it.
This might be a touch on the boring side, but you could just use the higher of Int and Dex for initiative.
I... do think the only problem with that is that it is a bit on the boring side. Easy "fix", but... boring too.
This might be a touch on the boring side, but you could just use the higher of Int and Dex for initiative. That'd even the field markedly, since the skillsets are arguably equal, but the Int bonus to crit damage would be OK too.
This suggestion gets floated around most commonly for all Int fixes, but it has a couple of big issues IMO that make it less than ideal:
1. It's not really that interesting
2. Even if it's simple, it's CB unfriendly, which is an annoying thing to deal with.
3. It's wonky in that monsters' initiative is based off of dex, so you either have to be okay with nonsensical asymmetry that favors players or manually evaluate and potentially adjust every monsters' initiative score.
4. What is arguably Int's biggest problem is that it has too much overlap with Dex. This not only fails to address that, it makes it even worse. I'm looking for a way to both make Int slightly more attractive relative to Dex as well as providing it with a bit more of its own unique identity, in part so that it isn't a total waste to raise both if a player wants to.
In short, I find this to be a much, much better way of addressing the int/dex issue because it addresses all of the above. It may not be the best, but I have yet to see better that I can think of (not to sound pompous - it's a simple idea that I'm surprised hasn't been tossed around before).
This might be a touch on the boring side, but you could just use the higher of Int and Dex for initiative.
That's always my recommendation. It's on the boring side, but it gets the job done in the most balanced, straightforward, and easy to implement way.
This might be a touch on the boring side, but you could just use the higher of Int and Dex for initiative.
That's always my recommendation. It's on the boring side, but it gets the job done in the most balanced, straightforward, and easy to implement way.
I really woudn't say that - please see above.
I really woudn't say that...
I would, as I fail to see the problem with any of your points other than maybe 1. We've already established before that we have a difference of opinion on the matter. I was just trying to let Natural20Username know that his idea had already been brough up before and that it does have its merits.
I really woudn't say that...
I would, as I fail to see the problem with any of your points other than maybe 1. We've already established before that we have a difference of opinion on the matter. I was just trying to let Natural20Username know that his idea had already been brough up before and that it does have its merits.
Well, they're very obviously issues, even if they aren't a big deal to you. Once again, your pointless disagreeableness is duly noted.
EDIT: Did you edit your post or are my eyes playing tricks on me? Because I could swear that your post said something almost exactly like "I don't understand why you go out of your way to be so disagreeable".
What makes you think that I go out of my way to be disagreeable?
EDIT: Did you edit your post or are my eyes playing tricks on me? Because I could swear that your post said something almost exactly like "I don't understand why you go out of your way to be so disagreeable".
I did edit it, but I don't remember exactly how. Just forget it. I understand that you have your ways and I have mine, but there's no need for us to be curt and/or rude with one another.
This might be a touch on the boring side, but you could just use the higher of Int and Dex for initiative. That'd even the field markedly, since the skillsets are arguably equal, but the Int bonus to crit damage would be OK too.
I think a feat I would call Fore-sight would be interesting for that...
I think the crit bonus proposed is too much and doesnt necessarily feel like predictive analytical and rote learning thing of the Int attribute... but Int might need a bit of luvin.