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Betrayal!

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
Haffle
Apr 02, 2009 15:01:47 Here is my plan. The players will have wizard mentor that has taught them everything they know (they are all arcane power source: wizard, sorcerer, bard, swordmage). However; he is going to attempt to frame them for a devastating event he is responsible for. I want to leave clues that lead the players from adventure to adventure eventually leading back to him (but not too soon). Does anyone have any advice on how to make this premises last throughout my campaign without alerting them to their mentor's deception before the big finale?
#2
stompie5
Apr 02, 2009 16:56:58 What is the devastating event going to be?
#3
gregt_314
Apr 02, 2009 21:05:08 If you want to surprise the players, don't leave clues. Your players are smarter than you think and they'll have figured out your big surprise before they're halfway through the first adventure.

You don't need to point them in the right direction. They'll work out that the BBEG is someone they've met and even in the most expansive game that's still a very small cast of suspects, especially once they narrow it down by power level and opportunity.

You don't need to do anything consistent with your wizard being the BBEG; just don't do anything inconsistent. And even then, good luck not tipping your hand to the players well before you're ready.

Betrayals work better when they're not a traitor all along - when they're genuinely on the players' side, and them something specific makes them betray the players right near the end. Think Judas rather than Saruman.
#4
Haffle
Apr 03, 2009 8:19:12 The major event is as follows: The wizard mentor to the players is going to summon a Balor into a crowded city market and instantly slay it triggering the Balor's Death Burst killing hundreds of innocents. Kind of a fantasy version of a terrorist attack.
#5
quickleaf_dup
Apr 03, 2009 9:00:53 Quick question: Why summon a balor at all? I mean, if this wizard is able to off a 27th level monster with relative ease at range, then they've got other means to orchestrate a terrorist attack. Is it because the wizard wants to implicate someone with demonic allegiances/powers?

I have to agree with Greg, don't leave clues, at least not until they're within a couple levels of the final showdown. For example, if the PCs learn that the balor was summoned through some clues, they'll quickly identify the only wizards capable of such a ritual and are likely to hone in on their old mentor.

Another tact is to make the mentor look suspicious to the PCs from the very beginning. Make it clear they harbor sentiments against the government, make it obvious they have potent summoning magic, and give examples of teachings the mentor gave PCs which were borderline evil. This is the "reverse psychology" scenario. You might play up the relationship between PCs and wizard, with the wizard pretending to help the framed PCs at several points to soothe their suspicions. Or you might have the wizard magically house arrest by a council of mages, and the wizard cajoles the PCs into releasing him because "he is also being framed."
#6
Haffle
Apr 03, 2009 9:11:26 I think Balor is a red herring. To lead them to think the attack has come from demonic forces. This is all in the drawing board phase. I got the idea half from 9-11 and half from Watchmen (the book). I want to start the campaign off with a bang. Literally. I like the idea of it being a political attack. Or maybe just the appearance of a political attack when maybe it has less to do with that.
#7
Haffle
Apr 03, 2009 9:26:29 Also I should add that this my firs ever home-brewed campaign. I have run a ton of modules, so I have the DM experience, just not the plot planning experience.
#8
descrii
Apr 03, 2009 21:28:14 You know what's more devastating than a balor that appears and explodes? One that rampages through the city and then explodes. The wizard doesn't need to slay the balor, just bind it so it can't escape the city and then let the city's defenders drag it down over a terror-filled day of running combat. Then the balor explodes!

The advantage to that approach, plot-wise, would be first that you don't need a Dr. Manhattan character who can snuff a balor in a round as your group's mentor. That would create the old Elminster problem where Super-wizard Elminster is asking some group of nobodies to do something important for the forces of light and goodness that he could do casually on the way home from buying groceries. The players can very rightly ask Dr. Manhattan to lend or create magical items, eliminate their foes, teleport them places, etc.

Also, it means your wizard can participate in the slaying of the balor without arousing suspicion - in fact it will deflect suspicion. Wounded or cursed during the duel with the balor, he can lean on the players for awhile to do things for him, and during their adventures and investigations they can learn more about the ritual that summoned the balor, maybe first pursuing a red herring you set up for them and then somehow arriving at that terrible realization.

Maybe you could open the game with some short adventures asking the characters to go to certain places on the city wall and place items or inscribe symbols. They're creating a ward "to protect the city against demons" for their master, who has "forseen" a demonic attack. The wall will be impossible for demons to cross, holding any potential invasion outside the city. Tragically, when the balor appears inside the city, the barrier will serve to trap it there instead of holding it out as intended. Archmage is suitably remorseful, players bear a portion of the guilt. Roll opening credits?
#9
Haffle
Apr 04, 2009 8:30:45 Thanks to everyone for the suggestions. It's all been really great advice. Wish me luck. I get the feeling I will need it.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Haffle Apr 02, 2009 15:01:47	Here is my plan. The players will have wizard mentor that has taught them everything they know (they are all arcane power source: wizard, sorcerer, bard, swordmage). However; he is going to attempt to frame them for a devastating event he is responsible for. I want to leave clues that lead the players from adventure to adventure eventually leading back to him (but not too soon). Does anyone have any advice on how to make this premises last throughout my campaign without alerting them to their mentor's deception before the big finale?
#2 stompie5 Apr 02, 2009 16:56:58	What is the devastating event going to be?
#3 gregt_314 Apr 02, 2009 21:05:08	If you want to surprise the players, don't leave clues. Your players are smarter than you think and they'll have figured out your big surprise before they're halfway through the first adventure. You don't need to point them in the right direction. They'll work out that the BBEG is someone they've met and even in the most expansive game that's still a very small cast of suspects, especially once they narrow it down by power level and opportunity. You don't need to do anything consistent with your wizard being the BBEG; just don't do anything inconsistent. And even then, good luck not tipping your hand to the players well before you're ready. Betrayals work better when they're not a traitor all along - when they're genuinely on the players' side, and them something specific makes them betray the players right near the end. Think Judas rather than Saruman.
#4 Haffle Apr 03, 2009 8:19:12	The major event is as follows: The wizard mentor to the players is going to summon a Balor into a crowded city market and instantly slay it triggering the Balor's Death Burst killing hundreds of innocents. Kind of a fantasy version of a terrorist attack.
#5 quickleaf_dup Apr 03, 2009 9:00:53	Quick question: Why summon a balor at all? I mean, if this wizard is able to off a 27th level monster with relative ease at range, then they've got other means to orchestrate a terrorist attack. Is it because the wizard wants to implicate someone with demonic allegiances/powers? I have to agree with Greg, don't leave clues, at least not until they're within a couple levels of the final showdown. For example, if the PCs learn that the balor was summoned through some clues, they'll quickly identify the only wizards capable of such a ritual and are likely to hone in on their old mentor. Another tact is to make the mentor look suspicious to the PCs from the very beginning. Make it clear they harbor sentiments against the government, make it obvious they have potent summoning magic, and give examples of teachings the mentor gave PCs which were borderline evil. This is the "reverse psychology" scenario. You might play up the relationship between PCs and wizard, with the wizard pretending to help the framed PCs at several points to soothe their suspicions. Or you might have the wizard magically house arrest by a council of mages, and the wizard cajoles the PCs into releasing him because "he is also being framed."
#6 Haffle Apr 03, 2009 9:11:26	I think Balor is a red herring. To lead them to think the attack has come from demonic forces. This is all in the drawing board phase. I got the idea half from 9-11 and half from Watchmen (the book). I want to start the campaign off with a bang. Literally. I like the idea of it being a political attack. Or maybe just the appearance of a political attack when maybe it has less to do with that.
#7 Haffle Apr 03, 2009 9:26:29	Also I should add that this my firs ever home-brewed campaign. I have run a ton of modules, so I have the DM experience, just not the plot planning experience.
#8 descrii Apr 03, 2009 21:28:14	You know what's more devastating than a balor that appears and explodes? One that rampages through the city and then explodes. The wizard doesn't need to slay the balor, just bind it so it can't escape the city and then let the city's defenders drag it down over a terror-filled day of running combat. Then the balor explodes! The advantage to that approach, plot-wise, would be first that you don't need a Dr. Manhattan character who can snuff a balor in a round as your group's mentor. That would create the old Elminster problem where Super-wizard Elminster is asking some group of nobodies to do something important for the forces of light and goodness that he could do casually on the way home from buying groceries. The players can very rightly ask Dr. Manhattan to lend or create magical items, eliminate their foes, teleport them places, etc. Also, it means your wizard can participate in the slaying of the balor without arousing suspicion - in fact it will deflect suspicion. Wounded or cursed during the duel with the balor, he can lean on the players for awhile to do things for him, and during their adventures and investigations they can learn more about the ritual that summoned the balor, maybe first pursuing a red herring you set up for them and then somehow arriving at that terrible realization. Maybe you could open the game with some short adventures asking the characters to go to certain places on the city wall and place items or inscribe symbols. They're creating a ward "to protect the city against demons" for their master, who has "forseen" a demonic attack. The wall will be impossible for demons to cross, holding any potential invasion outside the city. Tragically, when the balor appears inside the city, the barrier will serve to trap it there instead of holding it out as intended. Archmage is suitably remorseful, players bear a portion of the guilt. Roll opening credits?
#9 Haffle Apr 04, 2009 8:30:45	Thanks to everyone for the suggestions. It's all been really great advice. Wish me luck. I get the feeling I will need it.