Has anyone seen or use a good called shots system in any dice based RPG system? I am looking for a system that is logical, easy to use and fun. Every system I have seen or heard of is overly complicated and simply slows everything down. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Swap the order of things, it's the only reasonable way.
So, first you make an attack roll and damage roll, and then if you score a critical, max damage, reduce your opponent to 0 HP, whatever, you describe whatever called shot you like.
Anything else will become messy.
Also do a search on these boards, plenty of attempts have been made 
what system are you using? this will be a HUGE factor in how you implement such a thing.
I once used a homebrewed called shot system where I assigned percentages to enemy parts, example head was 10%, body 60%, etc.
PC's would declare a called shot, then roll a normal attack, then roll a percentile, if they made the attack and percentile, the called shot hit home.
Called shots have several problems with them, both mechanical and thematic.
The Mechanical issues: Called shots tend to take the form of "You take penalty X to gain bonus Y". This quickly devolves into a numbers game. So if the penalty is too low your players will only use called shots, if the penalty is too high your players will never use called shots. If the numbers add up to the exact expected damage per round if you weren't using called shots, then everyone will wonder why you have called shots. Also it doesn't really add an option in combat. Even if it is a good choice (mathematically) the only change is instead of hearing "I attack the goblin," you hear "I do a called shot for the goblin's head."
In a nut shell, implementing called shots either increases the damage output of the party or does nothing. It does not provide more interesting combat.
The thematic issue: What is a called shot? That's where you try to hit the enemies weak point, right? Why are you not trying to hit the enemies weak point every attack?
Really think about it, the goal of the standard attack roll is cause the most damage possible to an enemy. That implies doing obvious things, like trying to circumvent armor, or (in the case of all video games of my youth) hitting the flashing yellow and red part of an opponent.
Called shots for circumventing armor or increased damage just don't make sense.
The "fix": If called shots for damage cause both mechanical problems and thematic problems then they are probably a bad idea. But how about called shots for different effects? Such as attacking a hand to disarm? I think that's a superb idea, but the only issue is some called shots would be much more powerful than others.
If only there was a system in place that let martial characters impose status effects with attack rolls. Wait there is! It is the power system in 4th ed. Exploits are basically called shots. You stun someone by hitting them in the head/gut. You knock someone prone by sweeping their legs out from under them.
So in short, called shots are already in the game, just under a different name.
There exists a Called Shot feat. I if you hit with a creature against whom you recieved the Prime Shot bonus, you deal an extra 5 points of damage.
I've done called shots in the past that generally imposed temporary status affects on the enemy at the cost of increased difficulty to hit. I generally deal with such called shots on the fly rather than write them up, especially in 4e, as the rules in general are quite a bit simplified. As a rule of thumb, I give the attacker a -5 penalty to the attack, and impose a minor status effect or penalty on the target, with a save or minor action ending the effect as I deem appropriate.
A simple disarm, for example, would, in addition to the normal damage, cause the enemy to drop his weapon at his feet -- which isn't that big of a deal in 4e, since retrieving the weapon is a move action that doesn't provoke an OA. A slash to the eyes would cause the target to be temporarily blinded, with a minor action required to wipe the blood from his eyes and end the effect -- so basically, the attacker would take a -5 penalty to an attack to potentially impose a -5 penalty to attacks until the beginning of the target's next turn. A slash to the hamstrings would be a -5 to the attack, and on a successful hit the target is slowed (save ends).
In my experience, such tactical options come in handy in some situations and allow for more cinematic combats, but the -5 penalty to attacks is sufficient to dissuade the PCs from using called shots on a regular basis.
Swap the order of things, it's the only reasonable way.
So, first you make an attack roll and damage roll, and then if you score a critical, max damage, reduce your opponent to 0 HP, whatever, you describe whatever called shot you like.
Anything else will become messy.
Also do a search on these boards, plenty of attempts have been made
Interesting idea and I did try searching the forums, but didn't find anyhting useful really.
what system are you using? this will be a HUGE factor in how you implement such a thing.
I am using a heavily modified version of 4e
I once used a homebrewed called shot system where I assigned percentages to enemy parts, example head was 10%, body 60%, etc.
PC's would declare a called shot, then roll a normal attack, then roll a percentile, if they made the attack and percentile, the called shot hit home.
How did that work in the game. Did the players like it? Did it slow things down? What was the result of a successful called shot?
Called shots have several problems with them, both mechanical and thematic.
The "fix": If called shots for damage cause both mechanical problems and thematic problems then they are probably a bad idea. But how about called shots for different effects? Such as attacking a hand to disarm? I think that's a superb idea, but the only issue is some called shots would be much more powerful than others.
If only there was a system in place that let martial characters impose status effects with attack rolls. Wait there is! It is the power system in 4th ed. Exploits are basically called shots. You stun someone by hitting them in the head/gut. You knock someone prone by sweeping their legs out from under them.
So in short, called shots are already in the game, just under a different name.
All very good points, and i have thought of using specific powers as "called shots", but it shouldn't be limited to just martial powers. My can't a magic missle or lightning bolt be aimed at a dragon's head? I also think limiting it to effects is reasonable.
However, I am dealing with hit points differently than RAW. Basically your size (mass) + your Con determine your hit points, and it doesn't increase with level. HP in my game are not as abstract as RAW. So I wanted to create a method for players to take on dragons and such without totally getting their ass kicked. Some way to logically reduce the effective hit points of their targets. But I am starting to think called shots isn't the best method.
I've done called shots in the past that generally imposed temporary status affects on the enemy at the cost of increased difficulty to hit. I generally deal with such called shots on the fly rather than write them up, especially in 4e, as the rules in general are quite a bit simplified. As a rule of thumb, I give the attacker a -5 penalty to the attack, and impose a minor status effect or penalty on the target, with a save or minor action ending the effect as I deem appropriate.
A simple disarm, for example, would, in addition to the normal damage, cause the enemy to drop his weapon at his feet -- which isn't that big of a deal in 4e, since retrieving the weapon is a move action that doesn't provoke an OA. A slash to the eyes would cause the target to be temporarily blinded, with a minor action required to wipe the blood from his eyes and end the effect -- so basically, the attacker would take a -5 penalty to an attack to potentially impose a -5 penalty to attacks until the beginning of the target's next turn. A slash to the hamstrings would be a -5 to the attack, and on a successful hit the target is slowed (save ends).
In my experience, such tactical options come in handy in some situations and allow for more cinematic combats, but the -5 penalty to attacks is sufficient to dissuade the PCs from using called shots on a regular basis.
I like the feel of this idea. It seems very simple - how did/does it play out? Do the players like?
Thank you for all of the great ideas and suggestions. Based on the responses here I am think of exploring a couple of options. If you could let me know your thoughts on these I would appreciate it.
Powers: Create specific versions of powers that include penalties to hit specific targets, but include bonuses to damage and/or effects. These would be daily or enounter powers, thus limiting their use.
Effects only please: penalty to hit specific target, but apply appropriate effect on the fly. Such as disarming in hit the hand, slowed or move penalty if hit in the leg, dazed for a head blow, etc.
Skilled attack: Require a skill check or possible a skill challenge to pull off a called shot (with an appropriate damage and/or effect bust for success). This would make it more difficult (for a simple check) hopefully limiting its use. I could also create a range of ever greater effects or damages if I make it skill challenge. Something like setting up an opponent for a kill shot. Get 3 success with no failures and your next hit has some rather nasty effect/damage or something like that.
Called shots only have a benefit against my solo critters. I give a +4 to the critters defenses to hit that given weak point, but let them also hit the critter if they beat its original AC. If they're over the called shot AC, I let them do double damage. If they hit the normal AC, but not the called shot AC, it's still a hit, just regular. Since it's a solo and I hate when things turn to a grind, it makes the battles more involved (where's this things weak point!?!) and fast paced. That, and battles aren't harder than normal, just more detailed. Had a cleric trying to climb a machine dragon, sifting through it's innards looking for a control chrystal. Chrystal was the critter's eyes, but it made for a cool story.
I used called shots with the Players Option system back in 2e. Basically, on a normal hit there was no effect (unless you were targeting an object instead of a creature, like trying to cut the straps on a pouch or something). On a critical hit (since we were using critical hit location and effect charts), you automatically hit the intended location. It seemed pretty well balanced. The only problem was that we were also using partial armor rules, so you could use a called shot to hit unarmored or less armored areas of the body. The problem with that was that if the target's armor bonus was more than 4 (since the called shot penalty was -4 to attack), then it was ALWAYS in your best interest to make the called shot. Do away with that portion and the system worked fine.
I used called shots with the Players Option system back in 2e. Basically, on a normal hit there was no effect (unless you were targeting an object instead of a creature, like trying to cut the straps on a pouch or something). On a critical hit (since we were using critical hit location and effect charts), you automatically hit the intended location. It seemed pretty well balanced. The only problem was that we were also using partial armor rules, so you could use a called shot to hit unarmored or less armored areas of the body. The problem with that was that if the target's armor bonus was more than 4 (since the called shot penalty was -4 to attack), then it was ALWAYS in your best interest to make the called shot. Do away with that portion and the system worked fine.
Thank you for the suggestion. That seems very simple to implement. However, if I understand correctly, there was no advantage to hitting with the penalty. You only got a bonus effect if you rolled a crit? I don't understand the advantage of calling the shot if it provide no bonus and you got the effect automatically on a crit. Could you clarify a little.
Thank you for the suggestion. That seems very simple to implement. However, if I understand correctly, there was no advantage to hitting with the penalty. You only got a bonus effect if you rolled a crit? I don't understand the advantage of calling the shot if it provide no bonus and you got the effect automatically on a crit. Could you clarify a little.
On a normal hit, the called shot had no effect. On a crit, you automatically got an effect for that location without having to roll for it. On a normal crit, you rolled the location randomly. So not only could you try to set yourself up to decapitate someone, but you could aim for a weak point (without bypassing AC, since as I described earlier that creates problems). What I mean by that is that the effects on the critical hit chart were usually lessened if the target was wearing armor. So if you targeted an unarmored part (still rolling against normal AC, otherwise you get balance issues), you automatically hit that location (head was usually best), and your critical effect wouldn't be reduced because you were hitting an unarmored location.
So for example, I'm fighting a gladiator with a breastplate and helmet. If I roll a crit, I roll randomly for location. If I roll torso or head, the effect of the crit will be lessened due to armor. If I make a called shot for the arm or leg, I roll normally, and if I crit, the location is the spot I aimed for (no random location roll), and I will get the full effect from my crit. An ideal situation would be an opponent without a helmet, because then I could get the deadliest effects from the crit, and still not worry about armor taking away my mojo.
Does that clarify it?
Personally I hate the idea of called shots, because it's hard to give proper advantages. For example, hitting someone in the head will do less damage with many weapons, because the head can roll back with the blow. Or the spine, heart, or brain... all three can be stabbed with a dagger, but you're much more likely to be able to stab someone in a fatal place on the torso than on the head.
That's why we have critical hits. A critical hit means you hit some critical area on the enemy, all of which have the same effect of extra damage. Due to how any semi-inteligent animal protects it's most vital areas in combat though, we have the coupe de grace for delivering fatal blows. Then all you have to do is use common sense. In any situation where a target would be helpless, it takes a coup de grace, whether it be unconscious for some reason, such as you snuck up on it in it's sleep, or maybe it's hogtied and hanging from a butchers hook with an apple in it's mouth... Who knows... be creative.
So for example, I'm fighting a gladiator with a breastplate and helmet. If I roll a crit, I roll randomly for location. If I roll torso or head, the effect of the crit will be lessened due to armor. If I make a called shot for the arm or leg, I roll normally, and if I crit, the location is the spot I aimed for (no random location roll), and I will get the full effect from my crit. An ideal situation would be an opponent without a helmet, because then I could get the deadliest effects from the crit, and still not worry about armor taking away my mojo.
Does that clarify it?
Yes that does - thank you.
I use called shots in my game extensively...but then I also reward role played combat extensively.
I recommend not using them unless you are really good at balancing things out on the fly and rolling with the players actions suitably to maintain a good storytelling atmosphere.
In a game where players are concerned with every point and action, every feat and skill...and they HAVE to know that the effect of every action that they take is exactly what it says will happen in the book...DO NOT USE THEM. Your players won't appreciate them and they will only use them if they provide an advantage over their normal attack moves.
Sadly...I can't advise using them unless you have the right players and run the right game.
My system is simple...called shots suffer a -4 to hit penalty and their effect to the area hit is proportional to the damage dealt and the hit point total of the creature/person hit. Roughly 20% of total hit points damage done to one location will disable that location and the action of the encounter will reflect that disabling.
I use called shots in my game extensively...but then I also reward role played combat extensively.
Sadly...I can't advise using them unless you have the right players and run the right game.
My system is simple...called shots suffer a -4 to hit penalty and their effect to the area hit is proportional to the damage dealt and the hit point total of the creature/person hit. Roughly 20% of total hit points damage done to one location will disable that location and the action of the encounter will reflect that disabling.
Vey good points. I really like the simplicity of your system, and I think it probably make the most sense. I think I have decided not to use called shots for now, but I may try them out later. If I do i think I will probably do something like the system that you are using.
Thank you again.