Hello All,
Doing some brainstorming on my campaign world, and one of the ideas that I really, really like and really, really wanted to implement was the idea that day and night lasted for longer periods of time than here on Earth.
I was thinking something like 200 hours of daylight, then 200 hours of darkness at a given time (instead of using the term "day", I'd intended to use the term "spell", as in "I'll pay you for the horses next light spell" or "I haven't seen Euromar since the dark spell before last").
I like this idea because it allows for drastic changes at almost a moment's (well, several hours') notice. Shops might still be open during the dark spell, but open air bazaars almost certainly wouldn't without the ability to light up their immediate area (which wouldn't be terribly difficult, since I'm looking at a high magic game). I like the importance it attaches to the dawn and dusk periods, and I've even done a lot of thinking about how to handle time.
Actually, I'm pretty proud of that, so I'm going to go into it here. My roommate actually provided the basis for this: hourglasses. I know, what? I'm thinking huge hourglasses would be sort of like clock towers for towns. Each major city (and some smaller cities that've raised the funds) would commission enormous hourglasses set to drain for 200 hours. The glasses would be marked on each side (haven't decided how many marks per side), so certain times of the "spell" would be referred to as "marks" (as in, meet me at the tavern at third mark).
If I end up using this idea, I will almost certainly be using the above system. However, a couple hitches have got me kind of concerned, and I'd like some feedback if anyone's willing to give any.
What would be the purpose for people to maintain a typical sleep cycle? Or would they even do so (typical being the "ideal" sleep cycle, 16 hours up, 8 down)? The problem I have with people just doing their own thing as far as sleep goes is the effect it would seemingly have on society. Using real world times, if the blacksmith wakes up at nine in the evening and goes to bed at noon, while the quartermaster of the King's Army isn't awake during those hours, how're they going to get business done? A 24 hour cycle is still pretty important because of the nature of D&D magic...you get spells per day, where "day" is defined as a 24 hour period. How do you handle that? Would it be completely broken to like...multiply your spells per day by 8, and say that's all the spells per...spell (weird syntax...gotta look into that), or maybe 16, and say "that's all you get for the next cycle"? Because if you do that, if you don't balance the encounters right, you end up with someone who has like 48 9th level spells for one encounter, since they're going to refresh in another 10 minutes. This is definitely my major concern.
Agriculture in general. How're plants going to grow if they're in the dark for 200 hours at a time? Artificial sunlight? Druidic magic? I am thinking high magic, so this isn't as big of an issue, but it's still something to consider. And yes, this one could easily be handwaved (D&D plants don't NEED sunlight, damn it!) but I'd rather have some sort of explanation.
These issues (especially the first one) keep cropping up in my head, and it's keeping me from being able to brainstorm on other parts of the campaign world. Any suggestions?
The problem I have with people just doing their own thing as far as sleep goes is the effect it would seemingly have on society. Using real world times, if the blacksmith wakes up at nine in the evening and goes to bed at noon, while the quartermaster of the King's Army isn't awake during those hours, how're they going to get business done?
Either they use some alternative form of time keeping, or they use more relaxed business practices. Sundials (during the "day"), water clocks, the movement of celestial bodies (at "night", or maybe day in the case of a prominent moon). Spells and magic item could be created specifically to track time and even become the standards for how time is measured; even a city-wide magic effect that all magic timepieces are attuned to. Perhaps there's an animal, plant, or mineral that is somehow able to tell time. Birds that change their songs as a spell waxes and wanes; flowers sprot, grow, bloom, and day during each day spell; crystals that glow and change color in response to some universally occurring background radiation. Or perhaps people themselves have an natural, internal sense of the passage of time so that they don't need external time pieces.
Though playing up the relaxed business models would be an interesting approach. Shops are open when they are open and closed when they are closed, so you either deal and wait to later, or bang or the door and hope someone doesn't throw a bucket of water on your head. The postal service might become even more important to keeping everyone on the same page. The blacksmith might not be up when the quartermaster is up and about, but it would be hard for him to miss the carrier pigeon perching on his bed stand with the King's latest order.
Forums (the Roman kind) would probably be pretty big as well, serving as places where people can discuss and get up to date on the latest news and gossip.
A 24 hour cycle is still pretty important because of the nature of D&D magic...you get spells per day, where "day" is defined as a 24 hour period. How do you handle that? Would it be completely broken to like...multiply your spells per day by 8, and say that's all the spells per...spell (weird syntax...gotta look into that), or maybe 16, and say "that's all you get for the next cycle"?
Hell yes, it would. Especially if you're playing 3e, which is what it sounds like. For simplicity, I would change the magic recovery mechanic. There may no longer be a "day" in the conventional sense, but regardless, casters still require a period of time between when they last regain spells (the equivalent of a day) and still need adequate amounts of rest immediately prior to regain spells (the normal 8 hours of rest). In your world, these time periods might have completely different names, but the effects would be the same.
It would be no different than adventuring for extended times in a dungeon, a dense jungle, the underdark, or at the poles.
Agriculture in general. How're plants going to grow if they're in the dark for 200 hours at a time? Artificial sunlight? Druidic magic? I am thinking high magic, so this isn't as big of an issue, but it's still something to consider. And yes, this one could easily be handwaved (D&D plants don't NEED sunlight, damn it!) but I'd rather have some sort of explanation.
If these long periods of light and darkness are natural, then what would conventionally be sun-philic plants would probably evolve to either use less energy to become more similar to shade plants, go into a dormant/low-energy states at "night", or perhaps storing additional energy in thick roots or tubers. Or perhaps your world has extra bright moons that provide just enough light to help plants grow relatively normally until the lights come back on. 200 hours is about 8 1/3 days, which is not too long for a plant to survive if its built for those conditions.
Shops might typically open "from Mark to Halfmark" (i.e. each day from midnight to noon).
Or you could ask someone to meet you "in three Quartermarks" (i.e. in 18 hours).
It could be a social convention that people rest (meet each other, go to the tavern, etc) roughly during the third Quartermark, sleep during the last Quartermark, and business begins at each Mark sharp.
You could just say that plants have enough energy stored up during the 200 hour day to last through the night. I'm not sure if that would really work, but as long as none of the players are botanists, you should be fine.
Also, would seasons affect how long day and night is? 220 hour nights and 180 hour days in winter?
If the cycle is that long then dawn and dusk would last for days/weeks, not hours.
Such a slow transition would have a significant impact on the weather; a 200-day day would keep building heat the whole time while a 200-day night would keep losing heat the whole time. This would have a major impact on habitability, but it would also likely create massive storm fronts in the twilight regions.
Such a slow transition would have a significant impact on the weather; a 200-day day would keep building heat the whole time while a 200-day night would keep losing heat the whole time. This would have a major impact on habitability, but it would also likely create massive storm fronts in the twilight regions.
Actually, the OP stated that his day and night cycles last 200 hours each, so the changes probably wouldn't be as severer as you're thinking. But that's a good point about the twilight storm fronts.
You could create plants that store up more energy than they need during the day that bioluminescence occurs. A patch of... say... starclover would provide dim light in all squares it occupies, while solleaves brightly illuminate the ground under them (all the better to attract animals to fallen fruits and such).
On magic:
Keep the rest periods the same. I think of it as one's mind requiring sleep (or trance) long enough to be capable of holding the arcane/divine energy without wearing out. Makes everything simpler. I've used this for years, mostly due to the fact that there is no night or day on the Negative Energy Plane.
I suggest you also look up some of the alternate sleep cycles: HERE
Kobra, I really like the 25 hour Marks, and the Quartermarks idea. I think I can justify everyone being on the same page by just saying that the government tends to operate during 1st and 2nd Quartermarks, so it makes sense for everyone else to follow suit.
Fireclave, I really like the plants/birds idea, with their blooming/songs changing as the spell progresses. It wouldn't be something used for exact times, but if the party's out in the woods and they notice the birds' songs getting longer, they would know the dusk is on the way (or something). I also like the concept of plants having bigger leaves and more complex root structures in order to absorb/store more energy for the night period. I think, though, that I'm going to introduce "greenhouses", where certain plants must be grown, because they're too precious/fragile. I'm thinking of a small wooden structure with a permanent daylight spell cast inside. They might grow medicinal herbs or spice plants in these.
Regarding magic, I've decided that using Kobra's system, there shouldn't be an issue, simply changing the wording to read "spells per mark". The one hour shouldn't be enough of an issue to really be concerned with...I may just make all the quartermarks 6 hours, and the last one 7, to reflect a little longer sleep cycle.
I've also decided (and this isn't related to the day/night cycle so much...well, I guess it kind of is) that the sun and moon are sentient beings (and are in fact deities) that physically cross over the world during each spell. I've considered making it so that the sun flies east to west across the world, meeting the moon at the far west. The moon then flies west to east back across. The next cycle, the sun flies west to east, meets the moon at the far east, who then flies east to west. This is going to allow me to create two cults (Moon and Sunwalkers) that actually walk on foot across the land, following the two celestial deities.
I saw a question by Mechalibur asking about seasons...the seasons, for my world, I think I'm going to have them be independent of the day/night cycle. I haven't worked out how long the seasons are going to be, but I'm going to tie each of the 4 seasons to an element.
- Spring - Earth
- Summer - Fire
- Autumn - Wind
- Winter - Water/Ice
Now they're obviously not going to be called spring, summer, etc.; rather, they'll be referred to as Earth Season, Fire Season, etc., but will otherwise function as our seasons.
N_D, I think you misread...I'm going for 400 HOUR cycles, not 400 DAY cycles, lol. As it stands, I think I'm going to keep the weather more based off the season than the time of day...I don't know if that's going to work out or not, but I'm going to try it.
Shinikama, I like the idea of plants that only bloom during certain spells, in addition to Fireclave's idea of plants the change as the spells progress.
Doomsought, if I'm not mistaken, I read that thread, though I don't remember what it was. I remember someone suggesting (apparently you) that the sun be mortal, so to speak, and able to be killed by the party, given their power level was high enough and they had that inclination. That's where the basis of my travelling deities actually came from, though I think the sun/moon should be very, very difficult to kill.
And I think I got everything. Anyone got any other questions or suggestions? It actually makes it easier for me to get all this out when it's in response to someone else, so please, feel free to give me your feedback.
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Plants can have addapted to the situation. Humans may sleep erratically, like cats. Keep the 24 hour spell refresh cycle I think. Apprentices etc make mis-matched sleep cycles easier to handle... think shifts. Consider making Goggles of Low-light vision noticable common for travelers (since torches might tend to attract too much attention).
Because telling time is so important (and difficult), there could be one cult -or part of another one, e.g. a branch of the Sunwalkers and/or Moonwalkers- who dedicate themselves to that task specifically. They are appointed as keepers of the spellglasses, and some also spend time researching alternative timekeeping methods (which has led to considerable theological debate, as the more orthodox claim the scriptures' mention of hourglasses must be interpreted literally, while others disagree...). These monks keep a sacred spellglass in their temple, turn it over when needed, and ring bells/gongs/something at each mark, quartermark, and even at each halfquarter, so the population at large do not need to actually look at the spellglass. They could also keep track of the seasons, the calendars and the star alignments.
They'd actually make for a pretty cool Cleric/Paladin background, too...
Here's an interesting interview: http://www.cabinetmagazine.org/issues/30/foer.php
Just a bit of news: I have set up a wiki for this campaign world, and will be updating it as I can. If anyone's interested in being invited to the wiki to critique and whatnot, send me an email at "roninfrosty (at) yahoo (dot) com" and I'll add your email address to the access list.