Has anyone applied the optional rule from the DMG II (p. 146) requiring characters to aquire components to create magical items?
For anyone who has, please share tips, tricks, and overall knowledge you have for the system, if you would.
For those who haven't i'd like to share ideas for components that would be useful to characters. Some of the obvious choices are:
Materials harvested from monsters. (Dragon's scales, dragon's blood, scorpion's carapace, etc.)
Materials harvested from nature. (herbs, elemental water, adamantine, etc.)
Example:
Darkleaf Armor (PHB p. 228)
Components: Masterwork cloth, leather, or hide. Darkleaves from gravetrees that reside in the Shadowfell. Residuum. Create Magic Item Ritual.
Other requirements: This ritual must be done in the Shadowfell.
I'd like to use this optional rule for my campaign and while I have some thoughts i'd like to hear from others.
hehe - I didn't know they put that in there. I've been doing this since day 1. Residuum doesn't exist in my worlds. You want a magic item you go buy it, or make it. At the moment, a druid is waiting to run across the fabled white stag (to make a stag helm).
edited to add: just fiished reading - I can't help think that this (4e) really was released for broader appeal, and that as time goes on they are trying to teach people how to DM "old school"
Wow. That looks like a major pain in the butt.
One obvious one leaps out at me, since you made a point of it in your post: the 'gathering parts' requirement had a strong tendency to result in PCs in those editions becoming walking butcher/apothecary shops as they stripped and dissected everything they came across for parts, which would surely turn out to be needed at some point.
Another is pacing. Quite simply, if the PCs have to go through extensive hoop-jumping every time they want to make an item (which they will - it's an assumed part of 4E that they'll be doing this at least some of the time), it's going to start to detract from whatever actual adventures you want to run. ("You must complete a quest to resurrect a dead PC" approaches tend to cause the same game-flow issues, which is why D&D generally avoids that shtick.)
The item creation ritual (and the equivalent 3E method) already abstract much of this process rather than requiring it to be played out, in part to avoid both of these problems.
That said, the system does have merit *if* the creation of the item is somehow a central element of the plot (which is also how it appears in fiction), rather than being a general approach to all item creation. This typically means that the PCs are creating something unique and story-centric, more akin to 4E artifacts (though not necessarily as powerful) rather than generic "+1 sword of slicing and dicing" items.
In that context, it might have a use - but it's also more likely to be something initiated by the story than by the PCs.
Some very good points. To be honest, i'm not all that interested in PC's becoming walking butcher shops although one character with that theme would be fun. The reason the system appeals to me is because it lends in-game solutions to magic items and seems to encourage character choice (meaning characters can choose to help out the locals or choose to go after some components for items etc).
I'll be honest and admit that this system seems to detract heavily from linear adventure. When the group playstyle is to show up once a week and run through the scheduled adventure, this system can hinder the game in the ways mentioned. I feel that it can add something to a playgroup who's style is more go with the flow (I won't use THAT word because I don't want a debate 
). In the end, I guess this just helps the game feel more like D&D that I prefer.
So, to continue the thread in its intended direction...
I like the idea of heavily playing on certain items racial themes. For instance, dwarven armors and weapons must be made in dwarven forges and the like. I also like the idea that once a masterwork weapon is created and intended on being enchanted, it must perform some kind of deed in order to gain the magical properties it wants. For example, if a character wanted to create an short sword of ghoul bane, he would need to gather the right materials and also make sure he slayed a ghoul with the sword before the ritual could be complete.
Please share other ideas.
Some very good points. To be honest, i'm not all that interested in PC's becoming walking butcher shops although one character with that theme would be fun. The reason the system appeals to me is because it lends in-game solutions to magic items and seems to encourage character choice (meaning characters can choose to help out the locals or choose to go after some components for items etc).
Honestly, I thought that was the whole point of paying a cost for the Enchant Item Ritual - you went to your local apothecary, bought your reagents, maybe a stop at the armorer (or weaponsmith, jeweler, etc.) for the base enchantable- and bang, you made the magic item! Next adventure please...
Personally, I would not use the DMG2 rule for most items - but for some very powerful items, I might make the PCs go after one particular rare bit - which presents a nice one night adventure with maybe a couple fights and a boss mob (AKA the ingredient).
Honestly, I thought that was the whole point of paying a cost for the Enchant Item Ritual - you went to your local apothecary, bought your reagents, maybe a stop at the armorer (or weaponsmith, jeweler, etc.) for the base enchantable- and bang, you made the magic item! Next adventure please...Personally, I would not use the DMG2 rule for most items - but for some very powerful items, I might make the PCs go after one particular rare bit - which presents a nice one night adventure with maybe a couple fights and a boss mob (AKA the ingredient).
That would all depend on how the magic economy is functioning in the particular game world. In mine, for example, there is no residuum, so this would make it a bit different. I use the ritual cost (which is the item cost) to value the components given. Then again, I tend to give my players more gold than is customary (but only the prescribed amount magic items).
Honestly, I thought that was the whole point of paying a cost for the Enchant Item Ritual - you went to your local apothecary, bought your reagents, maybe a stop at the armorer (or weaponsmith, jeweler, etc.) for the base enchantable- and bang, you made the magic item! Next adventure please...
Personally, I would not use the DMG2 rule for most items - but for some very powerful items, I might make the PCs go after one particular rare bit - which presents a nice one night adventure with maybe a couple fights and a boss mob (AKA the ingredient).
You're absolutely right that Ritual rules account for these steps, but the whole idea of the optional rule is to break down the components for magical items and use them as adventure hooks, if it works for your game.
As a think about the idea of PC's carving up all the monsters they kill I can remember back in my high school days when some of my groups would store the pelts and dragon scales they found in their base of operations. They would sometimes use the items for trade in story situations (i.e. the blacksmith will divulge some information but he want's something in trade. Well we just happen to have some black dragon scales at the keep).
So far magical items creation could be broken down into:
- components needed.
- deeds done for the item.
- location of item creation.
- special persons involved in the creation. (Since anyone can choose Ritual Caster as a feat, perhaps items must be made by those who can actually use them).
I realize this system doesn't lend itself to faster gameplay and Ritual Caster for, say, a fighter would be a waste to those wanting to optimize. I'm merely exploring an optional rule and the potential it has for different styles of gaming.
Hey BG, sorry if it sounded like I was smooshing your idea.
In previous games (1st thru 3.5 ed) I've run, I've almost always had item creation rules, and the old Dragon magazines are stuffed with alot of old systems for magic item creation and even spell research by using libraries and all that fun stuff.
But my concern with too much questing for item creation is that the entire focus of the party becomes "reagent gathering", and if they go on a quest to make an item for one person, then another will hollar, "Hey now I want this +2 Backscratcher of Ultimate Doom, and I went to Dragonsquat Mountain for your gizmo... now it's my turn! We ride on the Hells tomorrow..."
A whole campaign arc could be carved into pieces while characters went on these little side excursions, just to get that next neato item.
So like my original post suggested, only make them sweat for "BIG" items... of course, now I suppose you have to figure out what a "BIG" magic item is...
No sweat. You actually gave me a great idea to look even further through old dragon mags to find tips for spell researching.
Can anyone think of a way to apply the rule and NOT derail a campaign?
One solution is seeding the campaign locations with components they can use to create items. So, in one situation the party discovers an altar of Bahamut and the mage wants to spend a couple of hours there to create an item or two. Since she has been carrying the components with her for a while she'll be lobbying to be allowed to spend time there. In this case some DM's might want to throw in an altar or a fey pond every once in a while that would add to the locations too.
Making a list of locations and consulting it to see if any fit into the story wouldn't be too difficult and it might add to the campaign.