CriticalBastard's Wizard and Sorcerer At-Wills

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

CriticalBastard

Apr 29, 2009 18:33:26
Greetings Wizards and Sorcerers,

Should wielding the very forces of reality limit you to a few at-wills? Of course not! This is intended to remediate the highly lacking breadth of arcane diversity for level 1 at-wills. If I get a good response from these I will work on it more and possibly continue through the arcane ranks and levels.

Comments and criticisms are welcome, especially if you find an error or think a power is imbalanced (too weak or too strong).


What’s new here:
-Touch attack wizard/sorcerer spells
-Expending Implement Feature Encounter powers to do “something else”
-True embracing of sorcerers as “artillery”, i.e. multiple opponent strikers
-True embracing of wizards as “controllers”, i.e. as debuffers, not necessarily artillery
-Rebalance of a some at-wills
-Overlap of wizard/sorcerer spells (“arcane standards”)



Sorcerer Level 1 At-Wills








#2

CriticalBastard

Apr 29, 2009 18:36:10
Reserved
#3

CriticalBastard

Apr 29, 2009 18:39:09
More reserved
#4

CriticalBastard

May 03, 2009 2:56:37
Added Illusory Terrain for Orb of Deception. It's an AOE illusion that creates difficult terrain. It's also the first At-Will illusion that doesn't deal psychic damage.
#5

lord_tirian

May 04, 2009 8:42:22
Added Illusory Terrain for Orb of Deception. It's an AOE illusion that creates difficult terrain. It's also the first At-Will illusion that doesn't deal psychic damage.

I like it - but what's the point of the sustain standard? Wouldn't casting it again in the same place achieve exactly the same effect?

Cheers, LT.
#6

CriticalBastard

May 04, 2009 9:19:20
I like it - but what's the point of the sustain standard? Wouldn't casting it again in the same place achieve exactly the same effect?

Cheers, LT.

You can sustain it at longer range than you can cast it. Not much, but it's something. Do you think it needs more? Maybe a rider for sustaining it...
#7

lord_tirian

May 04, 2009 11:06:13
You can sustain it at longer range than you can cast it. Not much, but it's something. Do you think it needs more? Maybe a rider for sustaining it...

Not really, I think it's pretty power- and useful already - I was just wondering about the sustain line. I'd perhaps try to tie it in with the Orb of Deception feature, if anything.

Cheers, LT.
#8

AbdulAlhazred

May 04, 2009 11:55:01
I think the idea of using Implement Mastery to provide a spell with a benefit is a pretty good idea.

I think the power of the at-wills is kind of hard to measure. Most of them seem to have some subtle limits, but at the same time some of them are really right up there with some of the new AP dailies.

Illusory terrain for example. You can create an infinitely movable 3x3 piece of difficult terrain. That is a LOT of control! Technically with an AP you could even create 2 for a round, and I can think of many nasty readying tricks for this.

We haven't even considered the damage part of it yet either. Overall it is not much below the Wizard daily power Grease. In some ways it is actually better, worse in others. However I know I would gladly have the at-will and use my daily slot for something else like Flaming Sphere.

Versus other at-wills, there are plenty of reasons to take some of the other ones, but I suspect it would be the most popular choice around.

I wonder what other people think? It can be pretty hard to judge at-wills. Things that are perfectly fine in an encounter power of the same level can be horribly broken in an at-will.
#9

CriticalBastard

May 04, 2009 11:58:40
Not really, I think it's pretty power- and useful already - I was just wondering about the sustain line. I'd perhaps try to tie it in with the Orb of Deception feature, if anything.

Cheers, LT.

Yea was just going to say I don't think it needs more. Tie the Orb of Deception in with sustaining? Could do something like expend to add Cha to something (attack and/or damage), but I can't think of an option I like better for appropriateness than attack all.
#10

CriticalBastard

May 04, 2009 12:46:17
I think the idea of using Implement Mastery to provide a spell with a benefit is a pretty good idea.

I think the power of the at-wills is kind of hard to measure. Most of them seem to have some subtle limits, but at the same time some of them are really right up there with some of the new AP dailies.

Illusory terrain for example. You can create an infinitely movable 3x3 piece of difficult terrain. That is a LOT of control! Technically with an AP you could even create 2 for a round, and I can think of many nasty readying tricks for this.

We haven't even considered the damage part of it yet either. Overall it is not much below the Wizard daily power Grease. In some ways it is actually better, worse in others. However I know I would gladly have the at-will and use my daily slot for something else like Flaming Sphere.

Versus other at-wills, there are plenty of reasons to take some of the other ones, but I suspect it would be the most popular choice around.

I wonder what other people think? It can be pretty hard to judge at-wills. Things that are perfectly fine in an encounter power of the same level can be horribly broken in an at-will.

Didn't think it compared that favorably to grease, but I agree it was too powerful as written. Edited it, removed Int damage on hit. Might still be broken...probably needs to be a 2x2 area, but 4.0 has no "clean" way to handle that. Thinking of how to handle it...
#11

nachtsieger

May 04, 2009 14:19:28
probably needs to be a 2x2 area

Blast 2, or have it summon a Large Illusionary creature within [range] that makes the squares it occupies difficult terrain. Allies and enemies can pass through, and end their turns on it's space if they wished to.
#12

CriticalBastard

May 04, 2009 15:03:05
Can you have area blast 2 within 10 squares? Don't think I've seen that before. Don't want to have close blast.
#13

nachtsieger

May 04, 2009 15:47:27
Can you have area blast 2 within 10 squares?

Probably not. The large illusionary creature option is still there though.
#14

CriticalBastard

May 04, 2009 18:43:12
Limited it to range 5, I think that's fair and more appropriate than a 2 by 2. Ideally I'd like Thunder Wave with high wis to be a better choice than Illusory Terrain and Illusory Terrain with high cha to be better than Thunder Wave. So if you still think it's generally more powerful than Thunder Wave, please let me know (and why).

Also, at range 5, I'm sure the option to cast it and sustain while backing up will see more use.

some of them are really right up there with some of the new AP dailies...

Any other balancing issues other than Illusory Terrain?
#15

lord_tirian

May 05, 2009 7:35:07
Ideally I'd like Thunder Wave with high wis to be a better choice than Illusory Terrain and Illusory Terrain with high cha to be better than Thunder Wave.

An idea would be changing a blanket difficult terrain to "Up to 1 + Cha mod squares within the area become difficult terrain" - this makes high Cha characters significantly better, makes it flexible - and you can add in for the Orb of Deception that it allows re-arranging the difficult terrain squares as a free action.

Cheers, LT.
#16

AbdulAlhazred

May 05, 2009 7:47:44
Limited it to range 5, I think that's fair and more appropriate than a 2 by 2. Ideally I'd like Thunder Wave with high wis to be a better choice than Illusory Terrain and Illusory Terrain with high cha to be better than Thunder Wave. So if you still think it's generally more powerful than Thunder Wave, please let me know (and why).

Also, at range 5, I'm sure the option to cast it and sustain while backing up will see more use.

Any other balancing issues other than Illusory Terrain?

Well, it is going to be hard to say for certain if they're balanced. You will really have to playtest them. Being at-wills makes it tough. My experience with home brewing at-wills is that because you can spam out the same power every single turn very small differences in wording and overall effect can make a pretty large difference in the overall balance of the power. A lot of yours are doing things like slowing the target. Most of the official at-wills impose conditions in slightly weaker ways vs outright placing a condition on the target. Slow is a fairly weak condition and often doesn't do much, but it can have a large effect in some battles. Then the question becomes really one of trying to decide if it is better to have an at-will like say Scorching Burst which simply does reliable damage at range, or Frigid Blast that does the same damage in the same size AoE and imposes slowed, but is a blast power.

Overall these powers don't seem too strong though.
#17

CriticalBastard

May 06, 2009 18:10:32
Thank you all for your comments.

Illusory Terrain proved to be too powerful, and it has been reworked. You can no longer attack with it the turn you cast it, making it much more balanced and making sustaining it worthwhile.

Frigid Blast seems to be working out well, which is as a control option for low Wisdom Wizards. Thunder Wave is the better option for high Wisdom Wizards, although need to test out the rider more to see if it's too good.

Edit: nerfed the rider for Frigid Blast a bit.

Ok there you have it, three AOE control options!
Thunder Wave for high Wis
Illusory Terrain for high Cha
Frigid Blast or Illusory Terrain for everyone else
#18

CriticalBastard

May 11, 2009 17:38:51
Vanguard's Lightning is a clear admission that Scorching Burst is underpowered. What to do about it? I have a couple of ideas on how to bring it in line:

-Critical Hit: The target takes 5 ongoing fire damage (save ends).
-Special: You may choose to omit the originating square of the burst from the area of effect.


Thoughts on these? Additional ideas?
#19

syne_lau

May 11, 2009 21:14:06
Off-topic: How do you format your powers in your original post to look like that?

On-topic: As far as Scorching Burst, maybe something to the effect of...

Hit: 1d6 + Intelligence modifier fire damage.
Effect: Each unoccupied square in the burst is filled with lingering flame that lasts until the end of your next turn. Any creature moving into a square containing lingering flame takes 2 fire damage.

The difference between this and Flame Seed/Cloud of Daggers is...

* You don't need to hit at all with Scorching Burst to fill up the area with flame.
* The lingering flame is dependent on unoccupied squares in the burst, so the more creatures you hit with Scorching Burst, the less flame squares you have.
* You have to willingly move to take damage, unlike Flame Seed/Cloud of Daggers. Also, you take damage multiple times if you move through multiple squares.
#20

CriticalBastard

May 11, 2009 23:11:30
Off-topic: How do you format your powers in your original post to look like that?

Here is one outside of a quote. You should be able to quote it and see the code:








#21

CriticalBastard

May 13, 2009 12:45:56
Went with the option to omit square from burst. Here it's being used as both a sorcerer and wizard power, so I went with an "artillery" effect rather than "control" effect: