Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 hitwobah Aug 11, 2008 12:42:20	I am looking for a hand designing a PC werewolf race for 4E. I am running an evil campaign, so werewolves aren't taboo, but I want them to be balanced. I was thinking Strength and Dex or Con being the +2 stats. It would have Regen equal to its level with weakness to silver equal to an additional 25% of damage dealt plus the regen skips a turn after silver damage. Edit: regen half your level rounded down. The hard part is what to do for the different forms. It should retain stats across forms, but have some advantage and disadvantage for each form. Like the wolf form does less damage, but gains +2 speed and +2 to non damage based Dex bonuses. Human would just be straight up stats as written and the Anthropomorphic form would deal more damage, but get a minus to AC and to would have to use over sized weapons with no advantage. Changing shape would take a full round and would lower defenses by two until the start of the werewolf's next turn. The werewolf would get +'s to perception, intimidate, athletics, nature and/or stealth. That is were I am at right now, but I would really like some feedback and ideas on the balancing of the Lycanthrope as a PC.
#2 wyld_mutation Aug 11, 2008 14:33:59	Ummm... Have you read the MM entry for lycanthropes? It's no longer an affliction. And they are a hybrid naturally. But well if you need a WW race... Werewolf +2Con, +2Dex Speed: 6 Vision: Low-light Skills: +2Nature, +2Intimidate Specials: Shapeshift: You have the Shapeshift Racial Power Show Shapeshift At-Will, Move action, Personal Effect: You assume an alternate form. You always assume the same alternate forms when you use this power. Human: You assume your unique human appearance. In this form you lose your racial abilities and lose access to your racial feats. Wolf: You gain a movement speed of 8, you have a natural bite attack for +2 1d6 damage. You do not benefit from your gear.
#3 Crimson_Concerto Aug 11, 2008 15:17:07	Have you looked at Shifters? Because that's basically what they are is playable Lycanthropes...
#4 catzo Aug 12, 2008 3:16:42	I needed a werewolf as well as a player was one in a high-level campaign we changed from 3.5e to 4e: Werewolf. Ability Scores: +2 Strength, +2 Wisdom Size: Medium Speed: 6 squares (8 in wolf form). Vision: Low-light Languages: Common, choice of one other. Skill Bonuses: +2 Nature, +2 Intimidation Change Shape (minor; at-will) ✦ Polymorph A werewolf can alter its physical form to appear as a gray wolf or a unique human (see Change Shape, page 280). It cannot use its bite attack in human form and cannot make weapon attacks in wolf form. Bite (standard; at-will). Srength vs AC. Hit: 1d6 dam + stength. Regeneration 2 (if the werewolf takes damage from a silver weapon, its regeneration doesn’t function on its next turn). The Regeneration value increases to 3 at Paragon and 5 at epic -tier. Regeneration is a very powerfull ability in 4e. But Reeneration 2 isn't overpowering, one level 1 minion just have to hit you every other turn for it to be mood. It's a nice feature, but not overpowereing. Consider that it's basicly all the werewolf gets. The shapechange is nice to get a little speed boost, but thats all.
#5 Crimson_Concerto Aug 12, 2008 5:55:32	Regeneration is a very powerfull ability in 4e. But Reeneration 2 isn't overpowering, one level 1 minion just have to hit you every other turn for it to be mood. It's a nice feature, but not overpowereing. Consider that it's basicly all the werewolf gets. The shapechange is nice to get a little speed boost, but thats all. Wow... No... Regeneration of any kind if overpowered for a PC to have. While it seems okay if you're okay looking baout its consequences in combat, you need to look out of combat too and realize that it's 100% free out of combat healing without ever needing to spend even a single healing surge. Heck, during a short rest (5 minutes?), a character with Regeneration 1 heals 50 HP with no expenditure of resources at all. A character with Regeneration 2 would heal 100 HP during that same time (just so you know, the current maximum possible HP for a Heroic tier character is 96, I think)... I'll say it again... Wow... No...
#6 catzo Aug 14, 2008 12:56:42	Wow... No... Regeneration of any kind if overpowered for a PC to have. While it seems okay if you're okay looking baout its consequences in combat, you need to look out of combat too and realize that it's 100% free out of combat healing without ever needing to spend even a single healing surge. Heck, during a short rest (5 minutes?), a character with Regeneration 1 heals 50 HP with no expenditure of resources at all. A character with Regeneration 2 would heal 100 HP during that same time (just so you know, the current maximum possible HP for a Heroic tier character is 96, I think)... I'll say it again... Wow... No... Hmm good point, I had only looked at in in combat, and not as post-combat. Hmm, Well it should probably just be an encoutner power then. But how woudl you make it then? DR/Silver is a very important part of the werewolf-stable, so how to best represent this in 4e? I would like to use the renegeration as it's very fitting and often, how 4e does "DR" this way. I don't want to make it an encoutner power becasue that seems very weird... that you can "trigger" your regeneration and it only works a short duration. --- Maybe just make it Resist 2/3/5 instead. This is in some way much more powerfull as it works against all attacks. But then again not, as it doesn't work against energy attacks, and ofcourse not against silver. And it wont help you post-combat.
#7 WEContact Aug 14, 2008 13:04:10	But how woudl you make it then? DR/Silver is a very important part of the werewolf-stable, so how to best represent this in 4e? Did you read WM's post? It's everything you could want or need. Here is a bit that pretty much explicitly answers that question. Werewolf Regeneration Requirements: Werewolf, Con 18 Effect: You have regeneration 1 while you are bloodied. This increases to regeneration 2 at 21st level. This regeneration does not functiuon the turn after you are hit by a silver weapon. Werewolf Toughness Requirements: Werewolf, Con 22 Effect: You have resistance 5 to all damage. Silver weapons suppress your resistance for a turn.
#8 Neutronium_Dragon Aug 14, 2008 13:21:53	The problem with that is that it's doubling up on the effect. Also, 4E werewolves don't *have* damage resistance; they were given regeneration instead.
#9 wyld_mutation Aug 14, 2008 13:40:59	I only included DR because he asked. The stats I put up are the stats I'd put on a Werewolf PC in my campaign.
#10 catzo Aug 14, 2008 17:18:01	Did you read WM's post? It's everything you could want or need. Here is a bit that pretty much explicitly answers that question. Uhm, yes, now I did >.< Sorry, those are good. I should remember to open my eyes when I read posts. Using feat to give the abilitites is better than my idea. As a sidenote. DR in 3.5e, represented both "instant regeneration" and actual Damage Resistance. So I think both regeneration and Resistance is fitting.
#11 wyld_mutation Aug 14, 2008 18:13:01	Just pointing out that werewolves no longer have DR. Which means, while it is still "canon", any PC werewolves would likely lack DR.