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| #1DreamstryderDec 13, 2008 17:50:29 | I'm making playable tribes of animals that can speak in a Japan-inspired setting. For those of you who have played the game Okami or seen the movie Princess Mononoke, you're mostly there. The Izen setting is linked in my sig. I'm puzzling myself over the play experience of someone without opposable thumbs, mainly wolves and boars: what to substitute for the equipment and inventory systems? I'm mainly concerned with the excitement of gaining new toys and wealth. About what would wolves and boars be excited? Digging up food? Equipment So they never change their weapons (teeth/tusks), but they're never without them. I'm considering a usage for their AP beyond extra actions. These tribes may spend any amount of AP to do any combination of: (1) up their weapon damage one step per point (treat as 1-handed weapon), & (2) up their AC by +1 per point. They needn't take a short rest before doing it again. They cannot spend AP at the same time to take an extra action (which would require a short rest before repeating, as normal). These bonuses last until an extended rest (their AP will reset). Items They may be able to hold only two items at once unless someone straps a bag/item to them. No great need for wealth. Healing and defensive boosts come not only from items in 4e, so we're safe, right? Do you see this as working and, best of all, fun? |
| #2half_dragon_infernalDec 13, 2008 19:00:03 | First, you have to give them inherent bonuses to make up for the item loss, so give them +1 to all defenses and +1 to attack and damage at every level 2 and 7. Also, +AC for armor if you don't include better armors. |
| #3DreamstryderJan 07, 2009 16:32:37 | So every even and 7th level (14, 21, etc), they get +1 to all defs, atk, and dmg? I should check out expected PC awards/growth, I suppose. Any other suggestions for running a game with such races? |
| #4solikJan 07, 2009 20:44:13 | Give them magic armors (barding). Reflavor "weapons" as "magic food" that, once they eat it, they have a permanent boost (doesn't stack, so eating two "+1 magic food" still gives their attacks a +1; however, you can replace effects, so eating a different kind of "+1 magic food" can give a different effect on their attacks, replacing the old one). |
| #5DreamstryderJan 12, 2009 23:17:52 | I like the foods idea. I may have to make the barding some spiritual manifestation a la Okami. ![]() |
| #6EmpactWBJan 13, 2009 23:24:49 | So every even and 7th level (14, 21, etc), they get +1 to all defs, atk, and dmg? I should check out expected PC awards/growth, I suppose. Not quite. 2,7,12,17,22,27. About those levels you should expect to have items appropriate to your level as weapons, neck items, and armor. If you go with the spiritual manifestation route, anyway. If you actually make magic barding and use the magic food, then you don't want to do this. As for the magic weapon problem, might I suggest a magic nose ring? Make it a "snout item" or some such that bestows weapon (and possible implement) enchantments to bite attacks and can't be removed from an unwilling conscious subject. Free action to command it to drop off on its own or turn it off and a minor action to put/turn it back on (and make that subject to the Quick Draw feat as well). That actually might be the easiest way to handle the problem in general, if you are looking to avoid the problem rather than explore it (which could also be fun): just give animal items a command word to equip, but don't change the length of time it takes to equip (i.e., 5 minutes for armor, standard action for a shield of some sort, minor action for the weapon ability). As to what boars and wolves are excited about, you might try describing things in smells. Both creatures have exception senses of smell, and nothing makes a player excited quite like getting something with their character that another character would totally miss out on. A lightning nose ring, for example, could smell like ozone, a hint of rain and deep forest and distant smoke (i.e., like a forest fire started by lightning) when used to attack with lightning damage, while the first thing you describe to them on coming to a city are the smells of roasting meat and herd animals outside and the spoor of hundreds of large omnivores, small carnivores, and even smaller scavengers. |
| #7DreamstryderJan 14, 2009 17:47:36 | I figured avoiding the problem was giving them armor, weapons, and a backpack like all the other humanoids. Despite the romance of armored boar warriors and wolves wielding holy blades in their teeth (& ignoring the fact that they can't craft the stuff), I wanted to make use of the fact that they have other things instead of hands. If I substitute nothing, I gather there's some mechanical balance in question and (more importantly) a fun factor to be lost. I'll definitely use the smell descriptions, and I think edibles with game properties will definitely go over well with my group. ![]() For defenses, maybe I'll have scents they can wear. They find them in some area and don them, but if they don another scent or go into water, the previous scent vanishes. I could divide these into groups paralleling armor groups, because they'll be able to take the same classes as everyone else, but I'd rather ignore them like I do weapon proficiencies. Implements will be a special individual who has a jewel (orb) imbedded in his/her head, a tusk (wand, rod, dagger) etched in signs, or a tail (staff) with a rare mark or fork. Scent of Grass +2 AC & Ref, +1 else. Scent of Pine +4 AC & Ref, +2 else. Scent of Earth +2 AC & Fort, +1 else. Scent of Stone +4 AC & Fort, +2 else. Scent of Frost +2 AC & Will, +1 else. Scent of Brine +4 AC & Will, +2 else. |
| #8solikJan 17, 2009 17:21:01 | I like the scents idea, but maybe go for something more fantastic rather than mundane? You know, tossing in some random fantasy-sounding words and names in there for the stuff, especially after the first tier. There's also the option of drink, since it goes so well with the food ![]() |
| #9FireclaveJan 17, 2009 23:39:56 | The alternative item slots for animals in this 3e article might be of some help. For weapons and armor, I would simply have the players choose at creation what weapon and armor they would have normally have their character use, and then have the animal's "natural weapons" and "natural armor" function exactly like that. For example, if the fighter would normally take a bastard sword and scale armor, then his wolf character's fangs would be treated as a heavy blade and deal 1d10 damage just like a bastard sword, and his natural hide would provide +7 AC and -1 speed just like scale armor normally would. And for enchantments, I would simply have the Enchant, Disenchant, and Transfer Enchantment rituals work directly on the creature. That way, you don't have to make a lot of changes to weapons, armor, feats, wealth-by-level, etc. As for switching between weapons and armor, for simplicity's sake, I would simply allow to the player change his effective weapon(s) and armor for a different type that they are already proficient with, at the end of a short rest. For example, at the end of a short rest, Ranger Bear can make claw-1 work identically to a scimitar and claw-2 work identically to a short sword instead of having them both function like longswords. They'll retain whatever enhancement bonus or special abilities they already had. Representing ranged weapons, if you so chose, would be a little more of a stretch. My default would be to represent them as some sort of energy attack, but that may be a bit too "magical" than what you are probably looking for. Growing manticore-like spines would also be an interesting twist. Though one thing I always wanted to try was representing equipment as skin or fur patterns. Imagine a fantastic pattern of sigils, runes, shapes, or images that get more and more colorful and intricate as the creature's enhancement bonus increase, in much the same way that Eberron's dragon marks get more intricate for stronger marks. The end result being an creature that is clearly more fantastic looking than its normal brethren. If you're familiar with Okkufrom NWN2 Mask of the Betrayer, that's kinda of what I'm talking about. About what would wolves and boars be excited? Digging up food? There's always good ol' threats to the natural order of things, like demons and aberrations, coming up into your place, killin' your doods, warping your physics, and drinking your milk straight from the carton. This goes doubly so if your intelligent animals are more like spirits and/or guardians of nature, rather than simply being another sentient race. ![]() |