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Exploiting Tropes

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
TheMicaMonster
Jul 08, 2011 23:13:44 I'm excited because some of my players will be briefly entering a dungeon soon only to encounter a door with a pedestal holding a cup atop it unceremoniously thrown in front of it in our next game. Nailed to the pedestal will be a piece of wood with the following puzzle written on it

"I’ll give you the reason
You give me the rhyme
Some get rich attaining dreams untold
But ALL get rich when attaining gleaming ___ "

Now I'm pretty sure this is an easy riddle and the answer is gold (specifically putting gold in the cup on the pedestal). That being said, the point is that it should be extra easy. You see the puzzle is a fake. The door can be easily opened by any traveler but there are secret bandits waiting in the wings of this corridor, seeing if the adventurers place gold down. If they do, then the bandit's know it's worth striking...

So I guess what I'm getting at in this post is "Is this too dirty?"

There are certain tropes and cliches that are expected within DND which I wonder if it's too dirty to exploit them. I.E. the players come across a puzzle in a dungeon. Is it almost SO commonplace that making the "reward" to completing a puzzle a fight unfair. I'm all for turning stuff that my players are used to against them, but where is the line?! I've been DMing for about a year and a half and am curious where people think the line is.
#2
David
Jul 09, 2011 10:14:55 Depends on the CR of the encounter, the loot you're handing out and the playstyle of your players. It might also depend on the way you describe the situation.

I'd use the bandits in a roadside encounter when they return from a succesful dungeoncrawl, but that's just me. It's a good idea though.
#3
tardyclock
Jul 09, 2011 16:26:34 The puzzle is trivial and as such I don't think they're going to complain that they don't get stacks of free diamonds for completing it HOWEVER they are being attacked by bandits who have apparently been stealing from adventureres. That means that these bandits are going to have either an awful lot of loot on them or know the location of a place where all the stolen loot is stored.

Either you've just given them a big pile of treasure or you've given them a plot hook that leads to more excitement and treasure.
#4
Book5
Jul 11, 2011 3:37:19 Have the riddle in a rare language that only one of the players know so it seems harder?
#5
crowscape
Jul 11, 2011 5:58:24 While the puzzle is trivial, using its triviality as the only clue that something isn't right is a bit cheap, because as DMs we have to sometimes aim for trivial difficulties with these kinds of mind games to ensure the campaign can continue. So, you might be shooting yourself in the foot for later, as the players waste an entire session to determine who is going to trigger the next "trapped puzzle".

My recommendation for a hint to give your players: the bandits are semi-literate. There are obvious misspellings on the sign.
#6
yellowdingo
Jul 19, 2011 0:57:35 Reminds me of the big demon Idol on the cover of an early DMG. I had it so if you put a gem in the bowl in his lap you got teleported into the stadium seats of an arena in the megadungeon where folks fought monsters and if you attempted to leave without paying (or pry the gems from his eyes) you got teleported into the fight pit with the monster...

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 TheMicaMonster Jul 08, 2011 23:13:44	I'm excited because some of my players will be briefly entering a dungeon soon only to encounter a door with a pedestal holding a cup atop it unceremoniously thrown in front of it in our next game. Nailed to the pedestal will be a piece of wood with the following puzzle written on it "I’ll give you the reason You give me the rhyme Some get rich attaining dreams untold But ALL get rich when attaining gleaming ___ " Now I'm pretty sure this is an easy riddle and the answer is gold (specifically putting gold in the cup on the pedestal). That being said, the point is that it should be extra easy. You see the puzzle is a fake. The door can be easily opened by any traveler but there are secret bandits waiting in the wings of this corridor, seeing if the adventurers place gold down. If they do, then the bandit's know it's worth striking... So I guess what I'm getting at in this post is "Is this too dirty?" There are certain tropes and cliches that are expected within DND which I wonder if it's too dirty to exploit them. I.E. the players come across a puzzle in a dungeon. Is it almost SO commonplace that making the "reward" to completing a puzzle a fight unfair. I'm all for turning stuff that my players are used to against them, but where is the line?! I've been DMing for about a year and a half and am curious where people think the line is.
#2 David Jul 09, 2011 10:14:55	Depends on the CR of the encounter, the loot you're handing out and the playstyle of your players. It might also depend on the way you describe the situation. I'd use the bandits in a roadside encounter when they return from a succesful dungeoncrawl, but that's just me. It's a good idea though.
#3 tardyclock Jul 09, 2011 16:26:34	The puzzle is trivial and as such I don't think they're going to complain that they don't get stacks of free diamonds for completing it HOWEVER they are being attacked by bandits who have apparently been stealing from adventureres. That means that these bandits are going to have either an awful lot of loot on them or know the location of a place where all the stolen loot is stored. Either you've just given them a big pile of treasure or you've given them a plot hook that leads to more excitement and treasure.
#4 Book5 Jul 11, 2011 3:37:19	Have the riddle in a rare language that only one of the players know so it seems harder?
#5 crowscape Jul 11, 2011 5:58:24	While the puzzle is trivial, using its triviality as the only clue that something isn't right is a bit cheap, because as DMs we have to sometimes aim for trivial difficulties with these kinds of mind games to ensure the campaign can continue. So, you might be shooting yourself in the foot for later, as the players waste an entire session to determine who is going to trigger the next "trapped puzzle". My recommendation for a hint to give your players: the bandits are semi-literate. There are obvious misspellings on the sign.
#6 yellowdingo Jul 19, 2011 0:57:35	Reminds me of the big demon Idol on the cover of an early DMG. I had it so if you put a gem in the bowl in his lap you got teleported into the stadium seats of an arena in the megadungeon where folks fought monsters and if you attempted to leave without paying (or pry the gems from his eyes) you got teleported into the fight pit with the monster...