Feat to play as a large Character - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 soci0tard Aug 23, 2008 5:48:24	I have a player who wants to play as a large character (12 feet tall, 900 lbs). I believe that wish fulfilment is an underlying principle of RPGs, so I like to be accomodating. Since there are no player races that are large, I thought a feat would be a good way to modify an existing one. After all, if Dragonborn can access a feat that lets them grow wings, other feats should allow characters to become Large. First I looked at what size does for you, good and bad: Good Improved Reach. Large characters have a reach of 2 squares. Good[ Improved Weapon damage. Large characters can tote very large weapons that pack a lot of damage. Bad Heavy. Medium characters have difficulty carrying Large unconcious characters to saftey. He might fall through the ice on a frozen lake where other characters wouldn't Bad, but no longer an issue easy to hit. There are no more size modifiers to AC (as far as I know). So that's two very good things and one bad thing that might not come up very often. Getting both with one feat seemed power-gamer-ish, and getting one without the other seemed nonsensical. I decided to use one Feat to become "Large", the prerequisite for which is another feat (called "Latent Large Character") that doesn't actually do anything, other than be a prerequisite. Further, A weak large character wouldn't make much sense, so I set another prerequisite: STR 15, CON 15. Those are just a little smaller than the attributes in the Monster Manual for the weakest Large monsters, like riding horses. Final Product: Feat: Latent Large Character Effect: None Feat: Large Character Prerequisites: Latent Large Character, STR 15, CON 15, Medium Size race Effect: Character grows to become large, and enjoys greater reach and heavier weapons.
#2 Kurama_Youko Aug 23, 2008 6:12:40	Reach is very powerful and as a fighter you would obviously love to have it which means every fighter would thus try and get it. Hence to powerful for any tier feat.
#3 wyld_mutation Aug 23, 2008 11:11:03	I'd say large characters just unbalance the party make-up. Give them powerful build and be done with it. (Strength requirement 20, Constitution requirement 18)
#4 soci0tard Aug 23, 2008 11:17:06	You think that reach alone is never balanced? I don't think that sounds right. I can get reach with a longspear. This just lets a character use that trait with any weapon. And there are many existing feats that serve to improve the range of limited range abilities, like Arcane Reach (which is, admitably, a paragon tier feat)
#5 wyld_mutation Aug 23, 2008 11:21:37	Reach is unbalanced when put on everything. All the reach weapons gave up two "points" to be reach weapons. You're going to give that bonus to every weapoon in the game? With only marginal requirements? Rule #1 of balance: If an effect is so good that any character that meets the requirements is going to take it then that effect is not balanced. Being large is such a bonus any character that has the stats will take the feat.
#6 squarecircle Aug 23, 2008 16:39:32	Check out the Minotaur and the Bugbear in the back of the MM. They have the Oversized quality. That should work nicely. My suggestion would be to allow a player to play either a Minotaur or a Bugbear, or even a homebrew race of your own with the Oversized quality. Also, Dragonborn cannot get wings with a feat. It's too powerful for PCs, which is why you won't find it in the PHB or probably in any supplement.
#7 Kurama_Youko Aug 23, 2008 17:51:15	You think that reach alone is never balanced? I don't think that sounds right. I can get reach with a longspear. This just lets a character use that trait with any weapon. And there are many existing feats that serve to improve the range of limited range abilities, like Arcane Reach (which is, admitably, a paragon tier feat) That's hardly what I said or meant. If you really think they thought size was insignificant don't you think they would have added a large race for you to play or even a option for it. Even the Minotaurs that are playable in the MM are medium sized. Obviously being large is not intended for players.

Post/Author/DateTime

Post

soci0tard

Aug 23, 2008 5:48:24

I have a player who wants to play as a large character (12 feet tall, 900 lbs). I believe that wish fulfilment is an underlying principle of RPGs, so I like to be accomodating. Since there are no player races that are large, I thought a feat would be a good way to modify an existing one. After all, if Dragonborn can access a feat that lets them grow wings, other feats should allow characters to become Large.

First I looked at what size does for you, good and bad:

Good Improved Reach. Large characters have a reach of 2 squares.
Good[ Improved Weapon damage. Large characters can tote very large weapons that pack a lot of damage.
Bad Heavy. Medium characters have difficulty carrying Large unconcious characters to saftey. He might fall through the ice on a frozen lake where other characters wouldn't
Bad, but no longer an issue easy to hit. There are no more size modifiers to AC (as far as I know).

So that's two very good things and one bad thing that might not come up very often. Getting both with one feat seemed power-gamer-ish, and getting one without the other seemed nonsensical. I decided to use one Feat to become "Large", the prerequisite for which is another feat (called "Latent Large Character") that doesn't actually do anything, other than be a prerequisite.

Further, A weak large character wouldn't make much sense, so I set another prerequisite: STR 15, CON 15. Those are just a little smaller than the attributes in the Monster Manual for the weakest Large monsters, like riding horses.

Final Product:

Feat: Latent Large Character
Effect: None

Feat: Large Character
Prerequisites: Latent Large Character, STR 15, CON 15, Medium Size race
Effect: Character grows to become large, and enjoys greater reach and heavier weapons.

Kurama_Youko

Aug 23, 2008 6:12:40

Reach is very powerful and as a fighter you would obviously love to have it which means every fighter would thus try and get it. Hence to powerful for any tier feat.

wyld_mutation

Aug 23, 2008 11:11:03

I'd say large characters just unbalance the party make-up.

Give them powerful build and be done with it. (Strength requirement 20, Constitution requirement 18)

soci0tard

Aug 23, 2008 11:17:06

You think that reach alone is never balanced?

I don't think that sounds right. I can get reach with a longspear. This just lets a character use that trait with any weapon.

And there are many existing feats that serve to improve the range of limited range abilities, like Arcane Reach (which is, admitably, a paragon tier feat)

wyld_mutation

Aug 23, 2008 11:21:37

Reach is unbalanced when put on everything.

All the reach weapons gave up two "points" to be reach weapons. You're going to give that bonus to every weapoon in the game? With only marginal requirements?

Rule #1 of balance:

If an effect is so good that any character that meets the requirements is going to take it then that effect is not balanced.

Being large is such a bonus any character that has the stats will take the feat.

squarecircle

Aug 23, 2008 16:39:32

Check out the Minotaur and the Bugbear in the back of the MM. They have the Oversized quality. That should work nicely.

My suggestion would be to allow a player to play either a Minotaur or a Bugbear, or even a homebrew race of your own with the Oversized quality.

Also, Dragonborn cannot get wings with a feat. It's too powerful for PCs, which is why you won't find it in the PHB or probably in any supplement.

Kurama_Youko

Aug 23, 2008 17:51:15

You think that reach alone is never balanced?

I don't think that sounds right. I can get reach with a longspear. This just lets a character use that trait with any weapon.

And there are many existing feats that serve to improve the range of limited range abilities, like Arcane Reach (which is, admitably, a paragon tier feat)

That's hardly what I said or meant. If you really think they thought size was insignificant don't you think they would have added a large race for you to play or even a option for it. Even the Minotaurs that are playable in the MM are medium sized. Obviously being large is not intended for players.