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| #1lord_darwathMar 12, 2010 2:00:38 | Are there any good discussions here, or does anyone know of any forums with good discussions about homebrewing entire editions? I had high hopes for 4e prior to its release, only to be roundly disappointed in the actual product. And most of what I'm used to playing has been so heavily modified that I've simply conceded to the idea that the only way to find a "perfect" version of D&D is to just build it your dang self. So... I'm looking for good talk in that vein. |
| #2QubeMar 12, 2010 6:47:27 | hmmm ... the main problem is that these are D&D forums. And what is D&D more then the game system? I'dd try the General Discussion board, but I'm not making any promesses .... Or maybe post your idea's here, and see how people react ... |
| #3tequila_sunriseMar 12, 2010 7:33:28 |
The General forum would just bounce him back here. Here are a few ideas: The Forge is a community specifically for writing your own game: www.indie-rpgs.com/forum/ These communities both have homebrew forums: ENworld: www.enworld.org/forum/index.php Giant in the Playground: www.giantitp.com/forums/ |
| #4lord_darwathMar 12, 2010 10:21:42 | Thanks. Funny thing is, I read OOTS but just never paid much attention to the rest of Burlew's site. Maybe I throw some stuff up here and see how it flies... later. Right now I shoud be on my way to work. Self-employment is a double edged sword. On the one hand the flexibility is great for being able to take care of real life stuff; on the other it's easy to get distracted from the work stuff that still needs to get done. @Qube: A homebrew edition would be just that, an edition rather than a whole new game. When I say build from the ground up I mean break the published game down into pieces and start re-assembling. Keep what's good, change what's marginal and replace what doesn't satisfy your play goals. |
| #5dulsiMar 12, 2010 14:57:26 | Have you tried Pathfinder, Castles and Crusades or Hackmaster? Alternately there are retro conversion products that match older editions. Some release all the text under OGL so they might prove a more complete starting point than the 3.5 SRD. |
| #6oldguygamingMar 12, 2010 15:31:45 | My blog is largely devoted to just what you are describing. Here is a link to get you started: The Development of My House Rules @lurkers: Any large scale overhaul of the rules is bound to bring out a lot of negative comments. Please don't critique the system here. I'm just trying to offer the OP some examples. : ) |
| #7lord_darwathMar 13, 2010 11:42:29 | Have you tried Pathfinder, Castles and Crusades or Hackmaster? Alternately there are retro conversion products that match older editions. Some release all the text under OGL so they might prove a more complete starting point than the 3.5 SRD. I've thought of all of those, but have the issue of no budget to go buying a bunch of games that may or may not satisfy what I'm looking for. @OldGuyGaming took a quick look at your site. Will go thru it more carefully later. |
| #8lord_darwathMar 28, 2010 22:35:18 | Ok, gonna start posting what I have so far in my edition in chunks. I'm assuming famialiarity with D&D so I'll be mostly posting in an abbreviated style. PC Races: Human, Elf, Dwarf, Halfling, Gnome, Half-Orc, Half-Elf. other races possible at DM discretion. Classes and (sub-classes): Fighter (Ranger, Paladin, Monk), Cleric (Druid, Priests of specific deities may have particular spell focus or alternate class skill selections), Mage (may have specialist sub-classes based on spell type/school, elemental source, etc.), Rogue (Bard, Assassin). Ability Scores: Strength, Constitution, Dexterity, Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma... Luck Rolling Method - STR thru CHA: 3d6, re-roll any "1s", drop the low, then add 6 to the result. Do this 6 times and assign the scores to abilities as desired. All scores fall in the range 10 - 18. This reflects that (successful) adventurers are all around extrodinary individuals and means that no one is forced to start with negative modifiers. Rolling Method - Luck: 3d6. -A- "1" may be rerolled -once-, otherwise you get what you get. Ability Score Adjustments: Racial: player's option to use it or not Human: +1(any), -1(any other) Dwarf : +2 Con, -2 Cha Elf: +2 Dex, -2 Con Gnome: +2 Con, -2 Str Half-Elf +1(DEX, INT or CHA), -1(STR or CON) Half-Orc +2 Str, -1 Int, -1 Cha Halfling +2 Dex, -2 Str Reallocation: Increase a score by 1 point (up to 17) by making a 2 point reduction in some other score(s). To raise a score from 17 to 18, deduct 4 points from other score(s). Scores may not be reallocated higher than 18. Max starting score allowed is 19 with racial adjustments included. Minimum score allowed is 3. Luck may not be reallocated. It can only be modified by the Human racial adjustment. Ability Score Modifiers (same as 3.x) 3 -4 4-5 -3 6-7 -2 8-9 -1 10-11 0 12-13 +1 14-15 +2 16-17 +3 18-19 +4 Character Level Progression: All classes progress at the same XP thresholds. They also get a level based modifier to various rolls, equal to one-half of character level, rounded down. Certain ability and skill progressions are also tied to "tiers" of 6 levels each. 1st level starts at 1000 XP to reflect a character's training and development vs. an individual with no adventurer training at all. This enables playing characters all the way from "0" level if desired. Level XP Bonus --------------------------------- 1st tier 1 1000 0 2 2000 1 3 4000 1 4 7000 2 5 11k 2 6 16k 3 --------------------------------- 2nd tier 7 22k 3 8 29k 4 9 37k 4 10 46k 5......... XP progression continues, +10k, +11k, +12k, etc.
to be continued |
| #9oldguygamingMar 29, 2010 0:10:40 | Rolling Method - STR thru CHA: 3d6, re-roll any "1s", drop the low, then add 6 to the result. Do this 6 times and assign the scores to abilities as desired. All scores fall in the range 10 - 18. This reflects that (successful) adventurers are all around extrodinary individuals and means that no one is forced to start with negative modifiers. Extraordinary to say the least! That will give you a range of 10-18, but over 90% of scores will be 13 or higher. The average score will be 15+ and each roll has a full 10% chance of being an 18. That may create a challenge for you to come up with balanced encounters for them. just my 2 cents |
| #10lord_darwathMar 29, 2010 0:36:37 | Tough characters = tough monsters. The way I see it, encounter balance is encounter balance, but the players get to look at the numbers and at least feel like they're Barney Badass special. It also goes a long way toward explaining why it's up to -them- in particular to save the day. Regular folks just don't have the chops for it. (it makes more sense as to why this is even an issue if you've ever played in a campaign where you're in a city full of NPCs that all appear to be as or more powerful than the PCs.) |
| #11Xeviat-DMMar 29, 2010 1:31:26 | Why don't you come on down to the Campaign Builders' Guild. We started up on these forums, but it has since grown into its own entity. The CBG We are more than welcome to help with building your setting, individual campaigns, or even whole rule systems. Come on down, we'd love to have you. |
| #12lord_darwathMar 29, 2010 14:19:24 | Thanks for the invite. |
| #13lord_darwathApr 01, 2010 1:34:27 | additional Racial features: race size base move misc Human M 30 none Dwarf M 20 darkvision, discretionary bonus to Survival (dungeon) checks, +2 Fort and Will defense, +1 attack bonus w/ axe and hammer Elf M 30 darkvision, +2 Will defense, +2 perception checks, +1 attack bonus w/ bow and medium sword Gnome S 20 darkvision, +1 AC and Reflex, +1 Perception checks, +1 Knowledge *alchemy*, discretionary bonus when creating illusions Half-Elf M 30 Elven blood, darkvision, +1 Will, +1 Perception, +2 Influence Half-Orc M 30 Orcish blood, darkvision, +1 AC, +1 Athletics Halfling S 20 +2 AC and Reflex, +1 Will, +2 Stealth and Acrobatics, +1 attack bonus w/ sling and thrown weapons Characters start off knowing Common and the language of their race. Humans pick any PC race of their choice as their 2nd language. Half-breeds know the racial language of their non-human side. PCs with INT of 12 or greater are assumed to be able to read and write their known languages. Those with INT 9 or higher may learn a number of additional languages equal to their CLB if desired (assuming opportunity). Darkvision allows characters to see normally in dim light (ex. candle light) and up to half of normal distance, but sans color, in near total darkness. Hit Points: CON score + {(1d class* + CON modifier) X character level} *re-roll any "1s" Class Hit Dice are - Fighter: d10, Mage: d6, Cleric and Rogue: d8 Skills: This is primarily a skill based system. The difference between classes is defined primarily by the set of skills available to them. There are two categories of skills - Combat skills and Adventuring skills. Within each character class, the skills are further broken down into Basic skills and Advanced skills. Basic skills can be learned cross-class while Advanced skills cannot, unless one employs the Multiclass skill. Most skills are listed as belonging to one or more base classes and apply to all sub-classes of the listed base, however, some skills exclude particular sub-classes or belong to a sub-class and not the base class. In such cases Basic skills are availabe to characters within the same base class as if they were Advanced skills, and Advanced skills are likewise available as if they were Cross-class. Skills are gained and improved by expending Skill Points (SkP). Basic skills cost 2SkP per rank, Advanced skills are 4SkP per rank and Cross-class skills are 6SkP per rank. Any given skill may only be increased by one rank per character level, up to a maximum of 3 ranks per tier (6 character levels). Each rank in an Adventuring skill gives a +1 bonus to checks with that skill. Combat skills function differently than adventuring skills. Each rank in a combat skill opens up new class abilities, or provides bonuses to combat actions or stats, or some combination thereof. The skill descriptions will list what different skill ranks will accomplish. The formula for determining a character's skill points is: 8 + (INT modifier X character level). PCs also gain one additional skill point each time their Character Level Bonus increases. A negative INT modifier does not take away SkP. SkP do not have to be used as soon as they are gained. The total of any unused SkP should be maintained on one's character sheet. Skill points may be freely applied to either Combat or Adventuring skills as the player desires. Each base class receives certain Bonus Skill Ranks when rolling up a new character. These are in addition to any ranks purchased with Skill Points, and so a rank derived as a Class feature does not preclude the character from training a second rank in that skill at first level. Subclasses have certain mandatory ranks which do deduct from their starting SkP pool, but do not count as their 1 rank per level.
The Class Bonus and Subclass Mandatory Skill Ranks are:
Fighter – Weapon Class Proficiency [choose one], Fighting Style [choose one], Athletics Ranger – Stealth, Survival [choose one] Paladin – Heal, Influence Monk - Perception, Acrobatics
Cleric – Mana Channel [Wis], Spell Casting [Cleric], Knowledge [religion] Druid – Survival [choose one], Heal
Mage – Mana Channel [Int], Spell Casting [Mage], Knowledge [arcana]
Rogue – Weapon Proficiency [choose one], Sneak Attack, Survival [urban] Bard – Influence, Perception Assassin – Assassination, Stealth
next installment - skill lists and descriptions |
| #14lord_darwathApr 25, 2010 18:26:07 | Combat Skills:
The following list is in the format: Skill Name [specifier], Advanced or Basic, and Class assignment.
Shield Proficiency [buckler, light, medium], Basic, Fighter/Cleric/Rogue Shield Proficiency [heavy], Advanced, Fighter except Monk.
Light Armor Proficiency [Padded, Leather, Hide], Basic, Fighter/Cleric/Rogue Light Armor Proficiency [Unarmored], Basic, Rogue/Monk Heavy Armor Proficiency [Chainmail, Plate, Full Plate], Basic, Fighter except Monk
Weapon Proficiency [dagger, staff, longsword], Basic, Fighter/Mage/Cleric/Rogue Weapon Proficiency [unarmed strike, unarmed grapple], Basic, Fighter/Rogue/Cleric Weapon Proficiency[-all others-], Basic, Fighter/Rogue/Cleric
Weapon Class Proficiency [unarmed], Advanced, Fighter/Rogue Weapon Class Proficiency [axe, bow, crossbow, flail, bludgeon, heavy blade, medium blade, light blade, heavy thrown, light thrown, heavy polearm, light polearm], Advanced, Fighter
Fighting Style [sword & shield, two weapon, two handed weapon, bastard weapon, archer, thrower, boxer, wrestler, blind fighting], Advanced, Fighter Fighting Style [empty handed], Advanced, Monk
Weapon Mastery [unarmed], Advanced, Monk Weapon Mastery [unarmed strike, unarmed grapple, -all others-], Advanced, Fighter
Sneak Attack, Advanced, Rogue Assassination, Advanced, Assassin
Mana Channel, [Int], Basic, Mage Mana Channel [Wis], Basic, Cleric Mana Channel [Int, Wis], Advanced, Ranger Mana Channel [Wis, Cha], Advanced, Paladin/Bard
Spell Casting [Mage], Advanced, Mage Spell Casting [Cleric], Advanced, Cleric
Multi-Class [secondary class or subclass], Basic, Fighter/Mage/Cleric/Rogue
Combat Skill explanations:
Shield Proficiency – each rank gives a +1 bonus to AC when using a shield of that type.
Armor Proficiency – each rank gives a +1 bonus to AC when using armor of that type and reduces the armor penalty to skill/ability checks by 1.
Weapon Proficiency – each rank grants +1 to hit when wielding the proficient weapon. For every three ranks of weapon proficiency, characters gain 1 primary attack per round using the specified weapon.
Weapon Class Proficiency – each rank grants a +1 to hit when wielding a weapon from the proficient class. This bonus does NOT stack with Weapon Proficiency except in the case of Rogues taking Weapon Class Proficiency [unarmed]. Every three ranks of Weapon Class Proficiency grants one primary attack per round when using a weapon in the proficient class. This does not stack with Weapon Proficiency.
Fighting Style each rank gives +1 bonus to hit when engaged in the appropriate fighting style, plus other benefits. Sword and Shield +1 bonus per rank to AC. Every 3 ranks grants an additional attack per round. Two Weapon Without this skill, characters may only wield two weapons if at least one of them has the “off-hand” property or they are “twin” weapons. They gain no extra attacks, but may attack with either hand using the to-hit bonus of whichever weapon is more favorable. They also gain a +1 to damage if proficient in both weapons. Two weapon fighters may use any two “one-handed” or “bastard” weapons together. Every two ranks grants a +1 to AC. For every three ranks, the Two Weapon fighter gains an off-hand attack per round. Two-Handed +1 bonus per rank to damage. +1 to AC per two ranks. One extra attack per round for every 3 ranks. Bastard Weapon Always does damage as if wielded 2-handed. +1 to AC per two ranks. One extra attack per round for every 3 ranks. Archer Gains 10' per rank to base range. +1 per two ranks to AC vs. ranged attacks. Plus one attack per round for every 3 ranks. Thrower +1 to damage per rank. Gains 5' to base range for every 2 ranks. Plus one attack per round for every 3 ranks Boxer +1 bonus per rank to AC when fighting unarmed opponents. +1 damage per 2 ranks with [unarmed strike]. One extra attack per round per two ranks when using [unarmed strike]. Wrestler +1 bonus per rank to defense when fighting unarmed opponents. +1 damage per 2 ranks when using [unarmed grapple]. One extra attack per round per 2 ranks when using [unarmed grapple]. Blind Fighting Fighting while unable to see normally strips a character of all bonuses for Proficiencies and Fighting Style. Every rank of Blind Fighting allows a character to retain one rank of offensive or defensive proficiency and utilize the +1 per rank to-hit bonus in place of their normal to-hit and defensive bonuses for fighting style. Applies only to melee and base throwing range or closer combat. Empty Handed The Empty Handed fighter uses both striking and grappling with equal skill. His entire body flows in a graceful dance of destruction. +1 AC bonus per rank against all attacks. +1 damage per rank with unarmed attacks. One extra attack per round per 2 ranks using unarmed attacks.
Weapon Mastery – (prerequisite – 3 ranks in Weapon Proficiency or Weapon Class Proficiency) each rank gives a +1 bonus to-hit and damage when wielding the mastered weapon. Every three ranks of Weapon Mastery improves that weapon's crit range by one.
Sneak Attack – each rank gives a +1 bonus to-hit and +2 damage on attacks when the target is caught unaware of the pending attack. Crit range is improved by 1 for every three ranks.
Assassination - (prerequisite – Sneak Attack) After rolling a successful to-hit with a Sneak Attack against a humanoid creature, roll Assassination vs. the target's FORT. If this check is successful, double the damage from the Sneak Attack. If the Sneak Attack was a critical the target is instantly felled.
Mana Channel - gives access to basic magic abilities. The [specifier] indicates which ability score becomes the basis for one's Magic Point pool. MP are equal to (Character Level Bonus + {ability mod X lvl}) up to 6th level, after that no additional Magic Points are gained. The first rank in Mana Channel creates the MP pool and grants knowledge of 10 cantrips and 5 General Spells per available spell level. Each additional rank enables knowledge of 10 more cantrips and 5 more General Spells per castable spell level. A character may not train in more than one iteration of Mana Channel unless they are multi-classing two or more spell using classes. In such a case the Mana Channel [secondary specifier] skill adds [secondary specifier]-mod MP per level to their pool, but not Character Level bonus. Similarly, they only add 5 cantrips and 3 General Spells per spell level to their knowledge base per rank in the secondary Mana Channel skill.
Spell Casting - (prerequisite – Mana Channel) This skill enables the Mage or Cleric to expand beyond the General Magic list and cast spells from the appropriate class spell lists. It also removes the level 6 cap on the growth of their Magic Point pool and immediately adds ½ [specifier] (rounded down) in additional MP. Each rank gives the knowledge of 5 spells per available spell level. Additionally, each rank in Spell Casting gives a +1 to-hit bonus when casting spells that require a to-hit roll, or enhances spells not requiring a to-hit by 1 unit of range, duration, area of effect, damage/healing, or other effective parameter (caster's choice). Characters multi-classing Mage and Cleric may only add the ½ [specifier] to their Magic Point pool once, but they may use whichever [specifier] is greater.
Multi-Class – This skill is used to train in skills and features of a class other than one's primary class. With one rank in Multi-Class, a character may train in the Basic Class skills of [secondary class] as if they were an Advanced Class skill of their primary class (ie, each rank would cost 4 SkP rather than 6.) Advanced Class skills of the secondary class may now be learned cross-class (ie, 6 SkP per rank.) A second rank in Multi-Class allows training in the secondary class' skills at normal cost (2SkP for basic and 4SkP for Advanced). Three ranks in Multi-Class grants the bonus Class Skill ranks that would have been awarded if the secondary class had been the primary class (these are listed later.) The third rank also allows the character to use whichever class is more advantageous for Hit Dice. The Hit Die upgrade is not retroactive (unless rolling up a new, experienced character) but will be in effect any time a new character level is gained.
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| #15lord_darwathApr 25, 2010 18:31:21 | Adventuring Skills: Listed in the format – Skill [specifier], modifying ability, Basic or Advanced, Class Acrobatics, DEX, Basic, Monk/Rogue Athletics, STR, Basic, Fighter/Rogue Deft Touch, DEX, Basic (Advanced), Rogue (Mage/Ranger) Heal, WIS, Basic, Cleric/Rogue/Paladin/Ranger Influence, CHA, Basic (Advanced), Cleric/Rogue/Paladin (Mage) Knowledge [Alchemy, Arcana], INT, Basic (Advanced), Mage/Bard (Cleric) Knowledge [History], INT, Basic, Cleric/Bard/Mage Knowledge [Poisons], INT, Basic (Advanced), Rogue (Cleric/Mage) Knowledge [Religion], INT, Basic (Advanced), Cleric/Bard (Mage) Mechanics, DEX, Basic (Advanced), Rogue (Ranger) Perception, INT, Basic, Rogue/Mage/Cleric/Ranger/Monk Stealth, DEX, Basic, Rogue/Ranger Survival [arctic, desert, jungle, mountain, plain, woodland], INT, Basic, Ranger/Druid Survival [dungeon, urban], INT, Basic, Ranger/Rogue
Adventuring Skills Explanations: The Adventuring Skills are all employed by rolling a d20, adding the total Skill Modifier and hopefully beating a DM assigned difficulty. Unlike Combat Skills, Adventuring Skills can sometimes be used without investing training ranks because they all hinge on knowledge or experience that would be common enough to most adventurers to give them a least a small chance at succeeding in some minor skill related endeavor. For this reason, Adventuring Skills can be modified by related ability scores as well as training ranks. These skills are generally fairly self-explanatory and the general gist of them can be gleaned from their descriptions in 3.x and/or 4e. Exceptions to this are as follows: Deft Touch – includes such things as picking pockets and sleight of hand tricks. Influence – replaces Bluff, Intimidate and Diplomacy, and also covers things like public performances. Knowledge [Alchemy] - has to do with the brewing of potions. Knowledge [Poisons] - has to do with making and using various poisons and their antidotes. Mechanics – includes skills like finding and removing traps, picking complex locks, etc. Perception - covers, spot, listen, insight, etc. Stealth – is hiding, moving silently, and so forth. Survival [dungeon] - replaces Dungeoneering Survival [urban] - replaces Streetwise.
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