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Half-Vampire

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
shadowmagus
Aug 23, 2008 20:23:50 I mostly built this from the 3.5 half vampire and modified some of the vampire lord template from the DMG as well, take a look.

Half-Vampire

+2 strength, +2 charisma. +1 to fort and will defense(vampires are hardier and more mentally resilient)

Racial Power: Blood Drain(Encounter Power/Standard action) Level+2 vs fortitude(+4 at Paragon tier and +6 at Epic tier) 1d12+charisma mod damage(2d12, and 3d12 for paragon and epic tiers respectively) target is weakened and you regain a healing surge. Must have combat advantage against target.

Deathly Resilience: Resist 5+1/2 level necrotic damage

Bloodlust: Gain +1 racial attack bonus against bloodied foes

I modified Blood drain slightly from the Vampire Lord attack template for Blood Drain, DMG pg 182 to make it more balanced for gameplay and since vamps also have resist necrotic it seemed ok to kinda steal the idea from Tieflings' fire resist ability, and Bloodhunt as well.

What do you think?
#2
theninjad
Aug 24, 2008 9:04:11 I'm not good with template balance so I won't mess you up by commenting on that. My comment has to do with flavor; How does half vampire make any sense?
#3
sphynx01
Aug 24, 2008 9:09:03 I'mwith ninjad on this.... half-vampire?!? Undead can't propogate, and there's no other way to be half-vampire? Or is this a Blade thing? Born to someone dying from a Vampire Bite? o.O Theme needs work before mechanics are tuned.
#4
wyld_mutation
Aug 24, 2008 9:58:43 Have you read Libris Mortis?

Vampires, while undead, have working organs. If they feed enough they can reproduce. It's in Libris Mortis.
#5
theninjad
Aug 24, 2008 11:20:36
Have you read Libris Mortis?

Vampires, while undead, have working organs. If they feed enough they can reproduce. It's in Libris Mortis.

There have been books written that say that the world is flat, too. Doesn't mean it makes sense.

Still, if that is the explanation that OP is going with, I am fine with that. In his game, anyway.

I made the comment I did because I personally have had many ideas that I thought were great at the time and later realized I didn't even like them and not one told me that they weren't that great of ideas.
#6
sphynx01
Aug 24, 2008 11:47:30 You talking about this book? http://shadowsystems.laurencemartin.org/DND_35Ed/Libris%20Mortis.pdf

Not seeing that rule in there anywhere....
#7
wyld_mutation
Aug 24, 2008 13:27:35
HALF-VAMPIRE
In rare circumstances, a vampire that has recently consumed a
signifi cant quantity of blood gains the ability to breed successfully
with living humanoids or monstrous humanoids, creating
half-vampire offspring. Also, in the unusual case of a pregnant
humanoid or monstrous humanoid who survives
a vampire’s blood drain attack, the child
may be born “tainted” by the attacker’s
vampirism. Regardless of the origin,
the children produced by such
events are typically branded
as outcasts, welcome neither
among the living or
the undead.
A half-vampire is drawn
to other living creatures, and
feels far more comfortable
when living in towns or cities.
Still, half-vampires know
that they must keep their identities
secret or else risk the hatred
and violence of others.
Half-vampires are often
physically attractive and persuasive.
Their skin is pale,
even ashen in color.
Unlike their undead forebears,
half-vampires enjoy
the freedom (or curse) of pursuing
any alignment,
though most tend
toward neutrality or
evil. Those rare few
good-aligned half-vampires
often feel haunted
by their heritage, sometimes
working to undo
the evil of their ancestry.

Don't feel like reformatting it... Anyway there are a few legends of vampire-born humans. At least I'm sure I've heard some.
#8
UsagiYojimbo
Aug 24, 2008 13:44:18 Also... um... this is a fantasy based game... it's essentially based on fiction... from books. So... what happens in books tends to determine what happens in DnD.

Regarding your actual race I would like you to the other similar thread about Dhampirs. In it they have a good hearty argument going regarding their blood drinking ability. I think you could take some cues from that. Otherwise, this race is far more balanced than that one and I think ready to play.

If that is unclear I will totally be more specific but I don't feel like rewriting the stuff from the other thread... which is here.
http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1074423
#9
realms_walker
Aug 26, 2008 11:25:35 I run 3.5 so can't comment on 4e.

In my 3.5 game I had a player that wanted to play a Half-Vampire. I read up on them and didn't like at all that an undead could procreate with the living no matter how much blood they consumed. So I thought for a day or 2 and came up with 2 ways you could become a half-vampire that made atleast a little sense.

1. Similar to the method posted above, you could become a half-vampire if you were born to someone dieing of a vampires bite. This is extremely rare in my world which my players loved because it kept them first off from being too prolific and gave a incredible start to a back story if they so chose to go this way.

2. It could be forced on someone through magical affliction. An example would be the player I mentioned above. There character stole a minor artifact from a vault full of cursed and dangerous items. When the character put it on they gained the half-vampire template and are currently on a quest to see if the minor artifact can be removed so they can have there old life back.
#10
juk380x
Aug 26, 2008 16:54:35 Just a few quick comments:

You don't add defense bonuses to defenses connected to those abilities which also receive bonuses. If a race gets +2 in STR and CHA, it effectively gets +1 to Fort and Will defenses. No need to increase those further. In fact, it is overpowered to give any defense bonuses to a race which gets ability bonuses in abilities tied to different defenses. The only race (aside from versatile humans) which gets a direct defense bonus are the eladrin, since their ability bonuses (DEX and INT) both improve Ref. They get their +1 to Will as compensation.

Resistance to Necrotic damage seems fine, but you racial power is too deviant. You should mold it after the only comparable power in the PHB, the dragonborn breath weapon. Why make it a Level + X? A normal attack roll of [1/2 level] + [ability mod] + [fixed bonus increased by tier] should suffice. I know that the DMG says blood drain works like what you put here, but monsters and PCs are built differently in 4E. Basically, if you make Blood Drain key off of CHA, you'd get more balanced results, assuming you increase CHA every time.

Level 1 (assumed CHA is 18 with racial bonus included)
level + 2 = 3
1/2 level + 4 + 2 = 6

Level 8 (assumed CHA is increased to 20 )
level + 2 = 10
1/2 level + 5 + 2 = 11

Level 14 (assumed CHA is increased to 22 )
level + 4 = 18
1/2 level + 6 + 4 = 17

Level 21 (assumed CHA is increased to 24 )
level + 6 = 27
1/2 level + 7 + 6 = 23

Level 28 (assumed CHA is increased to 26 )
level + 6 = 34
1/2 level + 8 + 6 = 28

You get a more balanced and gradual progression with the standard PC method. I like the regaining of healing surges idea.
#11
rowl
Aug 27, 2008 2:16:50
Just a few quick comments:

You don't add defense bonuses to defenses connected to those abilities which also receive bonuses. If a race gets +2 in STR and CHA, it effectively gets +1 to Fort and Will defenses. No need to increase those further. In fact, it is overpowered to give any defense bonuses to a race which gets ability bonuses in abilities tied to different defenses. The only race (aside from versatile humans) which gets a direct defense bonus are the eladrin, since their ability bonuses (DEX and INT) both improve Ref. They get their +1 to Will as compensation.

Resistance to Necrotic damage seems fine, but you racial power is too deviant. You should mold it after the only comparable power in the PHB, the dragonborn breath weapon. Why make it a Level + X? A normal attack roll of [1/2 level] + [ability mod] + [fixed bonus increased by tier] should suffice. I know that the DMG says blood drain works like what you put here, but monsters and PCs are built differently in 4E. Basically, if you make Blood Drain key off of CHA, you'd get more balanced results, assuming you increase CHA every time.

Level 1 (assumed CHA is 18 with racial bonus included)
level + 2 = 3
1/2 level + 4 + 2 = 6

Level 8 (assumed CHA is increased to 20 )
level + 2 = 10
1/2 level + 5 + 2 = 11

Level 14 (assumed CHA is increased to 22 )
level + 4 = 18
1/2 level + 6 + 4 = 17

Level 21 (assumed CHA is increased to 24 )
level + 6 = 27
1/2 level + 7 + 6 = 23

Level 28 (assumed CHA is increased to 26 )
level + 6 = 34
1/2 level + 8 + 6 = 28

You get a more balanced and gradual progression with the standard PC method. I like the regaining of healing surges idea.

Agree.

The power also needs the melee attack type, maybe even something explaining how the Blood Drain occurs - bite or some kind of magical means (most would think it obvious, but yeah, it's a fantasy game so it's important to be clear)? As a bite, I'd also require that the Half Vamp must be grabbing the opponent to attack with Blood Drain, however you might need something to offset that additional drawback - alternately it could occur as part of a Grab attack (so you wouldn't have to maintain for a 2d round or spend an Action Point to initiate the Blood Drain).

A cool thing to offset that would be that you can sustain the bite as a standard action (I know this is unorthodox), so long as you maintain the Grab (as a minor action, per PHB290) and the target doesn't escape it. The effects apply each round you sustain it. That would be serious harsh, but also require you do to nothing else but sustain it and have the potential to be broken if the target escapes (if it has a high Athletics or Acrobatics the Blood Drain isn't going to be allowed to keep going). Another thing to specify is that the target must be living (not undead or construct, etc) and have greater than 0 hp.

Cha v. Fort should be fine. I'd prefer that you heal as if you used a healing surge instead of regaining one though. Seems more in keeping with Vampiric healing and power regen that most mythos suggest from the feeding. EDIT - the Dhampir one takes this into consideration.

Otherwise, I like it.
#12
rowl
Aug 27, 2008 15:16:47 Consider this:

Blood Drain - Half Vampire Racial Power
Your dark heritage allows you to regain strength by feeding off the lives of your foes.
Encounter - Weapon (Bite)
Standard Action - Melee Bite
Target: One living creature above 0 hit points that you are holding in a grab (PHB290).
Attack: Cha v. Ref
Hit: 1d12 + Con mod damage (2d12, 3d12 @ Paragon and Epic), and you regain hit points as if you had expended a healing surge or as many hit points as the damage inflicted, whichever is less.
Special: You must have Combat Advantage when you initiate the Grab.
Special: You may sustain the Blood Drain as a Standard Action as long as you maintain your Grab on the Target. The damage & healing is applied every round the power is sustained. You may only sustain it until the target reaches 0 hp.

I changed to Ref to reflect the ability to move/twist away from the bite. Fort really wouldn't apply because that is more of a resisting to the damage or movement, while this is more of a struggling against the grab. But you could go either way with it. I also changed the dmg mod to Con because I think it is more fitting for the attack type. It also decreases the likely damage somewhat since it is more likely to be a Cha based char.

Makes me think of a very cool char concept with a Hellboy attitude and a Blade kind of crusade as a Paladin who doesn't really worship any god, but is used by a church's Pally brotherhood as a weapon against their enemies.
#13
juk380x
Aug 29, 2008 11:13:55 ^^ You would need to add a bonus to attack per tier, otherwise it'll never hit. Also, you might let the player decide on whether to key the attack and damage bonus off of Con or some other attribute (why not Str? Makes more sense) like in several other racial powers.
#14
half_dragon_infernal
Aug 30, 2008 9:43:35 For the Half-Vampire, If you've read the last book in Stephanie Meyer's series, the book is Breaking Dawn, the main character (human female), and her husband (she knows he's a vampire), on their honeymoon she get's pregnant because they didn't know how close the chromosones were. Accelerated Growth Rate and having the resiliance of vampires are the hallmarks of their child.
#15
pschirf
Aug 30, 2008 14:01:44 The best way to make a half-vampire is to use an axe.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 shadowmagus Aug 23, 2008 20:23:50	I mostly built this from the 3.5 half vampire and modified some of the vampire lord template from the DMG as well, take a look. Half-Vampire +2 strength, +2 charisma. +1 to fort and will defense(vampires are hardier and more mentally resilient) Racial Power: Blood Drain(Encounter Power/Standard action) Level+2 vs fortitude(+4 at Paragon tier and +6 at Epic tier) 1d12+charisma mod damage(2d12, and 3d12 for paragon and epic tiers respectively) target is weakened and you regain a healing surge. Must have combat advantage against target. Deathly Resilience: Resist 5+1/2 level necrotic damage Bloodlust: Gain +1 racial attack bonus against bloodied foes I modified Blood drain slightly from the Vampire Lord attack template for Blood Drain, DMG pg 182 to make it more balanced for gameplay and since vamps also have resist necrotic it seemed ok to kinda steal the idea from Tieflings' fire resist ability, and Bloodhunt as well. What do you think?
#2 theninjad Aug 24, 2008 9:04:11	I'm not good with template balance so I won't mess you up by commenting on that. My comment has to do with flavor; How does half vampire make any sense?
#3 sphynx01 Aug 24, 2008 9:09:03	I'mwith ninjad on this.... half-vampire?!? Undead can't propogate, and there's no other way to be half-vampire? Or is this a Blade thing? Born to someone dying from a Vampire Bite? o.O Theme needs work before mechanics are tuned.
#4 wyld_mutation Aug 24, 2008 9:58:43	Have you read Libris Mortis? Vampires, while undead, have working organs. If they feed enough they can reproduce. It's in Libris Mortis.
#5 theninjad Aug 24, 2008 11:20:36	Have you read Libris Mortis? Vampires, while undead, have working organs. If they feed enough they can reproduce. It's in Libris Mortis. There have been books written that say that the world is flat, too. Doesn't mean it makes sense. Still, if that is the explanation that OP is going with, I am fine with that. In his game, anyway. I made the comment I did because I personally have had many ideas that I thought were great at the time and later realized I didn't even like them and not one told me that they weren't that great of ideas.
#6 sphynx01 Aug 24, 2008 11:47:30	You talking about this book? http://shadowsystems.laurencemartin.org/DND_35Ed/Libris%20Mortis.pdf Not seeing that rule in there anywhere....
#7 wyld_mutation Aug 24, 2008 13:27:35	HALF-VAMPIRE In rare circumstances, a vampire that has recently consumed a signifi cant quantity of blood gains the ability to breed successfully with living humanoids or monstrous humanoids, creating half-vampire offspring. Also, in the unusual case of a pregnant humanoid or monstrous humanoid who survives a vampire’s blood drain attack, the child may be born “tainted” by the attacker’s vampirism. Regardless of the origin, the children produced by such events are typically branded as outcasts, welcome neither among the living or the undead. A half-vampire is drawn to other living creatures, and feels far more comfortable when living in towns or cities. Still, half-vampires know that they must keep their identities secret or else risk the hatred and violence of others. Half-vampires are often physically attractive and persuasive. Their skin is pale, even ashen in color. Unlike their undead forebears, half-vampires enjoy the freedom (or curse) of pursuing any alignment, though most tend toward neutrality or evil. Those rare few good-aligned half-vampires often feel haunted by their heritage, sometimes working to undo the evil of their ancestry. Don't feel like reformatting it... Anyway there are a few legends of vampire-born humans. At least I'm sure I've heard some.
#8 UsagiYojimbo Aug 24, 2008 13:44:18	Also... um... this is a fantasy based game... it's essentially based on fiction... from books. So... what happens in books tends to determine what happens in DnD. Regarding your actual race I would like you to the other similar thread about Dhampirs. In it they have a good hearty argument going regarding their blood drinking ability. I think you could take some cues from that. Otherwise, this race is far more balanced than that one and I think ready to play. If that is unclear I will totally be more specific but I don't feel like rewriting the stuff from the other thread... which is here. http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1074423
#9 realms_walker Aug 26, 2008 11:25:35	I run 3.5 so can't comment on 4e. In my 3.5 game I had a player that wanted to play a Half-Vampire. I read up on them and didn't like at all that an undead could procreate with the living no matter how much blood they consumed. So I thought for a day or 2 and came up with 2 ways you could become a half-vampire that made atleast a little sense. 1. Similar to the method posted above, you could become a half-vampire if you were born to someone dieing of a vampires bite. This is extremely rare in my world which my players loved because it kept them first off from being too prolific and gave a incredible start to a back story if they so chose to go this way. 2. It could be forced on someone through magical affliction. An example would be the player I mentioned above. There character stole a minor artifact from a vault full of cursed and dangerous items. When the character put it on they gained the half-vampire template and are currently on a quest to see if the minor artifact can be removed so they can have there old life back.
#10 juk380x Aug 26, 2008 16:54:35	Just a few quick comments: You don't add defense bonuses to defenses connected to those abilities which also receive bonuses. If a race gets +2 in STR and CHA, it effectively gets +1 to Fort and Will defenses. No need to increase those further. In fact, it is overpowered to give any defense bonuses to a race which gets ability bonuses in abilities tied to different defenses. The only race (aside from versatile humans) which gets a direct defense bonus are the eladrin, since their ability bonuses (DEX and INT) both improve Ref. They get their +1 to Will as compensation. Resistance to Necrotic damage seems fine, but you racial power is too deviant. You should mold it after the only comparable power in the PHB, the dragonborn breath weapon. Why make it a Level + X? A normal attack roll of [1/2 level] + [ability mod] + [fixed bonus increased by tier] should suffice. I know that the DMG says blood drain works like what you put here, but monsters and PCs are built differently in 4E. Basically, if you make Blood Drain key off of CHA, you'd get more balanced results, assuming you increase CHA every time. Level 1 (assumed CHA is 18 with racial bonus included) level + 2 = 3 1/2 level + 4 + 2 = 6 Level 8 (assumed CHA is increased to 20 ) level + 2 = 10 1/2 level + 5 + 2 = 11 Level 14 (assumed CHA is increased to 22 ) level + 4 = 18 1/2 level + 6 + 4 = 17 Level 21 (assumed CHA is increased to 24 ) level + 6 = 27 1/2 level + 7 + 6 = 23 Level 28 (assumed CHA is increased to 26 ) level + 6 = 34 1/2 level + 8 + 6 = 28 You get a more balanced and gradual progression with the standard PC method. I like the regaining of healing surges idea.
#11 rowl Aug 27, 2008 2:16:50	Just a few quick comments: You don't add defense bonuses to defenses connected to those abilities which also receive bonuses. If a race gets +2 in STR and CHA, it effectively gets +1 to Fort and Will defenses. No need to increase those further. In fact, it is overpowered to give any defense bonuses to a race which gets ability bonuses in abilities tied to different defenses. The only race (aside from versatile humans) which gets a direct defense bonus are the eladrin, since their ability bonuses (DEX and INT) both improve Ref. They get their +1 to Will as compensation. Resistance to Necrotic damage seems fine, but you racial power is too deviant. You should mold it after the only comparable power in the PHB, the dragonborn breath weapon. Why make it a Level + X? A normal attack roll of [1/2 level] + [ability mod] + [fixed bonus increased by tier] should suffice. I know that the DMG says blood drain works like what you put here, but monsters and PCs are built differently in 4E. Basically, if you make Blood Drain key off of CHA, you'd get more balanced results, assuming you increase CHA every time. Level 1 (assumed CHA is 18 with racial bonus included) level + 2 = 3 1/2 level + 4 + 2 = 6 Level 8 (assumed CHA is increased to 20 ) level + 2 = 10 1/2 level + 5 + 2 = 11 Level 14 (assumed CHA is increased to 22 ) level + 4 = 18 1/2 level + 6 + 4 = 17 Level 21 (assumed CHA is increased to 24 ) level + 6 = 27 1/2 level + 7 + 6 = 23 Level 28 (assumed CHA is increased to 26 ) level + 6 = 34 1/2 level + 8 + 6 = 28 You get a more balanced and gradual progression with the standard PC method. I like the regaining of healing surges idea. Agree. The power also needs the melee attack type, maybe even something explaining how the Blood Drain occurs - bite or some kind of magical means (most would think it obvious, but yeah, it's a fantasy game so it's important to be clear)? As a bite, I'd also require that the Half Vamp must be grabbing the opponent to attack with Blood Drain, however you might need something to offset that additional drawback - alternately it could occur as part of a Grab attack (so you wouldn't have to maintain for a 2d round or spend an Action Point to initiate the Blood Drain). A cool thing to offset that would be that you can sustain the bite as a standard action (I know this is unorthodox), so long as you maintain the Grab (as a minor action, per PHB290) and the target doesn't escape it. The effects apply each round you sustain it. That would be serious harsh, but also require you do to nothing else but sustain it and have the potential to be broken if the target escapes (if it has a high Athletics or Acrobatics the Blood Drain isn't going to be allowed to keep going). Another thing to specify is that the target must be living (not undead or construct, etc) and have greater than 0 hp. Cha v. Fort should be fine. I'd prefer that you heal as if you used a healing surge instead of regaining one though. Seems more in keeping with Vampiric healing and power regen that most mythos suggest from the feeding. EDIT - the Dhampir one takes this into consideration. Otherwise, I like it.
#12 rowl Aug 27, 2008 15:16:47	Consider this: Blood Drain - Half Vampire Racial Power Your dark heritage allows you to regain strength by feeding off the lives of your foes. Encounter - Weapon (Bite) Standard Action - Melee Bite Target: One living creature above 0 hit points that you are holding in a grab (PHB290). Attack: Cha v. Ref Hit: 1d12 + Con mod damage (2d12, 3d12 @ Paragon and Epic), and you regain hit points as if you had expended a healing surge or as many hit points as the damage inflicted, whichever is less. Special: You must have Combat Advantage when you initiate the Grab. Special: You may sustain the Blood Drain as a Standard Action as long as you maintain your Grab on the Target. The damage & healing is applied every round the power is sustained. You may only sustain it until the target reaches 0 hp. I changed to Ref to reflect the ability to move/twist away from the bite. Fort really wouldn't apply because that is more of a resisting to the damage or movement, while this is more of a struggling against the grab. But you could go either way with it. I also changed the dmg mod to Con because I think it is more fitting for the attack type. It also decreases the likely damage somewhat since it is more likely to be a Cha based char. Makes me think of a very cool char concept with a Hellboy attitude and a Blade kind of crusade as a Paladin who doesn't really worship any god, but is used by a church's Pally brotherhood as a weapon against their enemies.
#13 juk380x Aug 29, 2008 11:13:55	^^ You would need to add a bonus to attack per tier, otherwise it'll never hit. Also, you might let the player decide on whether to key the attack and damage bonus off of Con or some other attribute (why not Str? Makes more sense) like in several other racial powers.
#14 half_dragon_infernal Aug 30, 2008 9:43:35	For the Half-Vampire, If you've read the last book in Stephanie Meyer's series, the book is Breaking Dawn, the main character (human female), and her husband (she knows he's a vampire), on their honeymoon she get's pregnant because they didn't know how close the chromosones were. Accelerated Growth Rate and having the resiliance of vampires are the hallmarks of their child.
#15 pschirf Aug 30, 2008 14:01:44	The best way to make a half-vampire is to use an axe.