Healer's Lore Alternative - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Healer's Lore Alternative

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
undrave
Jun 28, 2010 1:42:16 I'm trying to think up an interesting alternative class feature for Healer's Lore that would be effective for STR/CHA clerics while retaining the original trigger of Healer's Lore.

Something like

Healer's Fervor

When you heal your ally, you imbue them with a spark of your own faith and drive, making them fight harder. When you let a creature spend a healing surge to regain hit points with one of your Cleric powers that has the Healing keyword, the recipient gains a bonus to all Damage roll equal to your Charisma modifier until the end of their next turn. This bonus damage becomes twice your Charisma modifier at level 21.

Might need a little tweaking of course. I don't know if its too much or too little or too boring.

As a side note how come Healer's Lore seems to only apply to Cleric powers and not 'Cleric and Cleric Paragon Path powers' like similar features??
#2
alitain
Jun 28, 2010 5:20:42
I'm trying to think up an interesting alternative class feature for Healer's Lore that would be effective for STR/CHA clerics while retaining the original trigger of Healer's Lore.

Something like

Healer's Fervor

When you heal your ally, you imbue them with a spark of your own faith and drive, making them fight harder. When you let a creature spend a healing surge to regain hit points with one of your Cleric powers that has the Healing keyword, the recipient gains a bonus to all Damage roll equal to your Charisma modifier until the end of their next turn. This bonus damage becomes twice your Charisma modifier at level 21.

Might need a little tweaking of course. I don't know if its too much or too little or too boring.

As a side note how come Healer's Lore seems to only apply to Cleric powers and not 'Cleric and Cleric Paragon Path powers' like similar features??

Well first to answer the Cleric/Cleric Paragon question. Because they're all Cleric powers. The key is that they have to be Cleric powers so you can't multi with say another leader with healing powers and enhance them.

Healing Fervor seems fine enough, some people might argue that the dam bonus is too much but honest there're quite a few powers out there for dam bonuses that are till the end of their next turn and such, so I think its fine.

But I do have a question. What build are you talking about that would be Str/Cha. The Battle Cleric is Str/Wis, the other two are both Wis/Cha. I'm just confused, because the Battle Cleric has Cha as its Tertiary stat so the bonus probably won't be more than 2 or 3.

So with your Healer's Fervor you'd be giving up the bonus to healing which is based on your Wis mod which for the Battle Cleric is your Secondary stat so its probably 4-6 or there abouts depending on level. Then you'd trade it to give an ally you healed a dam bonus of 2 or 3 for their next atk before end of their next turn.

I've only played a wholy pacifist cleric, so correct me if I'm wrong on this please, but to me even doing a battle cleric I would rather take healer's lore since my powers I imagine are mainly damaging so you may not be getting powers or feats to enhancing healing much so any bonus you can get is for the better.

What I would do is just keep it same as Healer's Lore but instead of healing bonus by Wis mod change it to dam bonus by Wis mod. At least that way if you seriously want to give up healing bonus your getting equivalent bonus to that ally's damage roll.
#3
undrave
Jun 28, 2010 13:28:46 It is quite possible to make a STR/CHA cleriic, there is quite a few powers that benefit from such combinations, Recovery Strike being the first of them. Here on the board we decided to call that build 'Fervant Cleric' as opposed to the STR/WIS Battle Cleric.

While that build has fun aspects (some that need to be boosted, like more powers that make use of CHA and more Paragon Paths) it sacrifices a little of its class feature by not having more than a +2 in WIS, and that's only with the right racial boost to stats.

#4
alitain
Jun 28, 2010 23:19:36
It is quite possible to make a STR/CHA cleriic, there is quite a few powers that benefit from such combinations, Recovery Strike being the first of them. Here on the board we decided to call that build 'Fervant Cleric' as opposed to the STR/WIS Battle Cleric.

While that build has fun aspects (some that need to be boosted, like more powers that make use of CHA and more Paragon Paths) it sacrifices a little of its class feature by not having more than a +2 in WIS, and that's only with the right racial boost to stats.

Fair enough I guess, I haven't delved too much into clerics outside of the pacifist I play so I never considered looking into anything dealing damage or whatnot so I was curious.
#5
Neutronium_Dragon
Jun 28, 2010 23:33:58 Ability-scaling effects usually end up causing problems, and in the cleric's case he has a huge number of powers that will trigger it. This would either need to be limited to 1/encounter use, or scaled back severely: +2/3/4 at heroic/paragon/epic, and even that may be pushing it.
#6
urpriest
Jun 29, 2010 3:36:09 As a damage roll bonus, I actually think it's fine to trigger off Cha. +10 or so damage in epic isn't ridiculous as a 3 per encounter (with a few more, and spending surges throughout), though I would limit it to the next attack rather than all attacks until the end of turn. Don't forget that the battle captain gives an ability mod to hit with a 4 per encounter heal.
#7
Neutronium_Dragon
Jun 29, 2010 6:18:49 > +10 or so damage in epic isn't ridiculous as a 3 per encounter

The above isn't limited to Healing Word - it applies to every power with the Healing keyword, which means that this can be going off near-constantly.
#8
urpriest
Jun 29, 2010 6:28:51
> +10 or so damage in epic isn't ridiculous as a 3 per encounter

The above isn't limited to Healing Word - it applies to every power with the Healing keyword, which means that this can be going off near-constantly.

Look again: the power must allow the ally to spend a surge (like the post-errata healer's lore). This will happen more often than healing word, but it still won't be anything near constant use.
#9
undrave
Jul 01, 2010 12:44:07 So I guess 'next damage roll before the end of their next turn.' and I do keep the scaling at 21 right? Or should it double halfway at 15th?
#10
dogbackward
Jul 01, 2010 14:03:37 Lose the scaling completely, actually, and you'll be fine.
#11
undrave
Jul 02, 2010 2:44:07
Lose the scaling completely, actually, and you'll be fine.

Really? You don't think CHA mod to damage is too little for the epic tier?
#12
pluisjen
Jul 02, 2010 5:09:20 Wis mod to health doesn't increase either. This ability becomes more powerful by triggering more often, not by triggering with more oomph.

In Epic, you can expect the Cleric to grant the bonus to every party member with a single power or to a single member every round of the fight; that more then makes up for it being on the low side.
#13
undrave
Jul 02, 2010 9:28:44
Wis mod to health doesn't increase either. This ability becomes more powerful by triggering more often, not by triggering with more oomph.

In Epic, you can expect the Cleric to grant the bonus to every party member with a single power or to a single member every round of the fight; that more then makes up for it being on the low side.

Good point good point. 'K then no scaling.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 undrave Jun 28, 2010 1:42:16	I'm trying to think up an interesting alternative class feature for Healer's Lore that would be effective for STR/CHA clerics while retaining the original trigger of Healer's Lore. Something like Healer's Fervor When you heal your ally, you imbue them with a spark of your own faith and drive, making them fight harder. When you let a creature spend a healing surge to regain hit points with one of your Cleric powers that has the Healing keyword, the recipient gains a bonus to all Damage roll equal to your Charisma modifier until the end of their next turn. This bonus damage becomes twice your Charisma modifier at level 21. Might need a little tweaking of course. I don't know if its too much or too little or too boring. As a side note how come Healer's Lore seems to only apply to Cleric powers and not 'Cleric and Cleric Paragon Path powers' like similar features??
#2 alitain Jun 28, 2010 5:20:42	I'm trying to think up an interesting alternative class feature for Healer's Lore that would be effective for STR/CHA clerics while retaining the original trigger of Healer's Lore. Something like Healer's Fervor When you heal your ally, you imbue them with a spark of your own faith and drive, making them fight harder. When you let a creature spend a healing surge to regain hit points with one of your Cleric powers that has the Healing keyword, the recipient gains a bonus to all Damage roll equal to your Charisma modifier until the end of their next turn. This bonus damage becomes twice your Charisma modifier at level 21. Might need a little tweaking of course. I don't know if its too much or too little or too boring. As a side note how come Healer's Lore seems to only apply to Cleric powers and not 'Cleric and Cleric Paragon Path powers' like similar features?? Well first to answer the Cleric/Cleric Paragon question. Because they're all Cleric powers. The key is that they have to be Cleric powers so you can't multi with say another leader with healing powers and enhance them. Healing Fervor seems fine enough, some people might argue that the dam bonus is too much but honest there're quite a few powers out there for dam bonuses that are till the end of their next turn and such, so I think its fine. But I do have a question. What build are you talking about that would be Str/Cha. The Battle Cleric is Str/Wis, the other two are both Wis/Cha. I'm just confused, because the Battle Cleric has Cha as its Tertiary stat so the bonus probably won't be more than 2 or 3. So with your Healer's Fervor you'd be giving up the bonus to healing which is based on your Wis mod which for the Battle Cleric is your Secondary stat so its probably 4-6 or there abouts depending on level. Then you'd trade it to give an ally you healed a dam bonus of 2 or 3 for their next atk before end of their next turn. I've only played a wholy pacifist cleric, so correct me if I'm wrong on this please, but to me even doing a battle cleric I would rather take healer's lore since my powers I imagine are mainly damaging so you may not be getting powers or feats to enhancing healing much so any bonus you can get is for the better. What I would do is just keep it same as Healer's Lore but instead of healing bonus by Wis mod change it to dam bonus by Wis mod. At least that way if you seriously want to give up healing bonus your getting equivalent bonus to that ally's damage roll.
#3 undrave Jun 28, 2010 13:28:46	It is quite possible to make a STR/CHA cleriic, there is quite a few powers that benefit from such combinations, Recovery Strike being the first of them. Here on the board we decided to call that build 'Fervant Cleric' as opposed to the STR/WIS Battle Cleric. While that build has fun aspects (some that need to be boosted, like more powers that make use of CHA and more Paragon Paths) it sacrifices a little of its class feature by not having more than a +2 in WIS, and that's only with the right racial boost to stats.
#4 alitain Jun 28, 2010 23:19:36	It is quite possible to make a STR/CHA cleriic, there is quite a few powers that benefit from such combinations, Recovery Strike being the first of them. Here on the board we decided to call that build 'Fervant Cleric' as opposed to the STR/WIS Battle Cleric. While that build has fun aspects (some that need to be boosted, like more powers that make use of CHA and more Paragon Paths) it sacrifices a little of its class feature by not having more than a +2 in WIS, and that's only with the right racial boost to stats. Fair enough I guess, I haven't delved too much into clerics outside of the pacifist I play so I never considered looking into anything dealing damage or whatnot so I was curious.
#5 Neutronium_Dragon Jun 28, 2010 23:33:58	Ability-scaling effects usually end up causing problems, and in the cleric's case he has a huge number of powers that will trigger it. This would either need to be limited to 1/encounter use, or scaled back severely: +2/3/4 at heroic/paragon/epic, and even that may be pushing it.
#6 urpriest Jun 29, 2010 3:36:09	As a damage roll bonus, I actually think it's fine to trigger off Cha. +10 or so damage in epic isn't ridiculous as a 3 per encounter (with a few more, and spending surges throughout), though I would limit it to the next attack rather than all attacks until the end of turn. Don't forget that the battle captain gives an ability mod to hit with a 4 per encounter heal.
#7 Neutronium_Dragon Jun 29, 2010 6:18:49	> +10 or so damage in epic isn't ridiculous as a 3 per encounter The above isn't limited to Healing Word - it applies to every power with the Healing keyword, which means that this can be going off near-constantly.
#8 urpriest Jun 29, 2010 6:28:51	> +10 or so damage in epic isn't ridiculous as a 3 per encounter The above isn't limited to Healing Word - it applies to every power with the Healing keyword, which means that this can be going off near-constantly. Look again: the power must allow the ally to spend a surge (like the post-errata healer's lore). This will happen more often than healing word, but it still won't be anything near constant use.
#9 undrave Jul 01, 2010 12:44:07	So I guess 'next damage roll before the end of their next turn.' and I do keep the scaling at 21 right? Or should it double halfway at 15th?
#10 dogbackward Jul 01, 2010 14:03:37	Lose the scaling completely, actually, and you'll be fine.
#11 undrave Jul 02, 2010 2:44:07	Lose the scaling completely, actually, and you'll be fine. Really? You don't think CHA mod to damage is too little for the epic tier?
#12 pluisjen Jul 02, 2010 5:09:20	Wis mod to health doesn't increase either. This ability becomes more powerful by triggering more often, not by triggering with more oomph. In Epic, you can expect the Cleric to grant the bonus to every party member with a single power or to a single member every round of the fight; that more then makes up for it being on the low side.
#13 undrave Jul 02, 2010 9:28:44	Wis mod to health doesn't increase either. This ability becomes more powerful by triggering more often, not by triggering with more oomph. In Epic, you can expect the Cleric to grant the bonus to every party member with a single power or to a single member every round of the fight; that more then makes up for it being on the low side. Good point good point. 'K then no scaling.