Heavy Weapon Rangers - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Heavy Weapon Rangers

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
jenius
May 21, 2009 17:40:42 In my current campaign, one of the players wants to play a dwarven two weapon fighting ranger. It would be strength based, probably only meeting the dex required for feats. My question is for heavy thrown weapons, is it imbalanced to let their property apply to powers too? Like, the character will primarily be melee, but if he wants to twinstrike two throwing hammers, I'm thinking of letting him just use str for his tohit. Same for other ranged powers.

As far as I can tell it's hardly imbalancing (considering the damage discrepancy between heavy thrown weps and a greatbow for example), but I dunno if that will change later into the game.

As I said, he primarily plans on being in melee, It's just for the odd situation that he'll be actually using projectiles.
#2
Janx_14
May 21, 2009 17:53:20 Its not RAW, but i'd let it work. As you said his ranged damage would pale in comparison to a true archer ranger. As long as you dont have an archer ranger who wants go to melee, it should be alls fair.

Thrown weapons are still kinda 'meh' which is sad.

Perhaps the new primal class in PHBIII will be a some kinda wild hunter who throws stuff.
#3
thegreatgalstaff
May 21, 2009 23:06:19 if he is wielding heavy thrown weapons then he can use them ranged or melee RAW.

since they have the Heavy thrown property use STR to hit and damage they would replace the Dex for hit and damage at range using twin-strike or other power similar RAW.

This is how I interpreted the rules a lot of people agree but some don't, its really up to you but IMO it is RAW to allow him to use STR instead of DEX for range attacks because of the Heavy thrown property.

in fact there is a paragon path dedicated to heavy or light thrown weapons and it rocks, I'm playing one and it deals almost as much as a archer but I have a better version of quick draw and I can get a massive # of attacks with a Action point.

its called the Avalanche Hurler and its on page 58 of Martial power. I like it and its what hes going for, without a question.

Edit:
you guys are right I miss the "basic" part of the heavy thrown property. but there is no real reason not to allow him to use STR for hit and damage, even if it states Dex for Ranged. mostly in part to thrown weapons being really weak in melee and ranged.
#4
jenius
May 22, 2009 14:54:32
if he is wielding heavy thrown weapons then he can use them ranged or melee RAW.

since they have the Heavy thrown property use STR to hit and damage they would replace the Dex for hit and damage at range using twin-strike or other power similar RAW.

This is how I interpreted the rules a lot of people agree but some don't, its really up to you but IMO it is RAW to allow him to use STR instead of DEX for range attacks because of the Heavy thrown property.

in fact there is a paragon path dedicated to heavy or light thrown weapons and it rocks, I'm playing one and it deals almost as much as a archer but I have a better version of quick draw and I can get a massive # of attacks with a Action point.

its called the Avalanche Hurler and its on page 58 of Martial power. I like it and its what hes going for, without a question.

It's not RAW at all, twin strike clearly states you use dex if you're using a ranged weapon, and heavy thrown specifies "ranged basic" for using str, twin strike is not a ranged basic attack. Therefor, strictly by the rules, you are forced to use dex even with heavy thrown weapons while using twin strike.

And no, he's not going for avalanche hurler, and yes I'm aware of avalanche hurler. He's simply going for a two weapon ranger who may occasionally chuck things as his ranged weapon alternative if for some reason he can't realistically get into melee.
#5
AbdulAlhazred
May 22, 2009 15:56:51
It's not RAW at all, twin strike clearly states you use dex if you're using a ranged weapon, and heavy thrown specifies "ranged basic" for using str, twin strike is not a ranged basic attack. Therefor, strictly by the rules, you are forced to use dex even with heavy thrown weapons while using twin strike.

And no, he's not going for avalanche hurler, and yes I'm aware of avalanche hurler. He's simply going for a two weapon ranger who may occasionally chuck things as his ranged weapon alternative if for some reason he can't realistically get into melee.

It obviously isn't RAW, but only because the Twin Strike power explicitly states that it uses dex for ranged attacks.

It probably won't hurt anything to allow this, although it also probably won't stop him from doing it even if you don't. The only situation where it would make sense to do is one where a melee attack is impossible or highly undesirable. At that point even if he is using dex what's the harm in chucking a couple axes? Granted his to-hit will be lower, but if the choice is throw and hit on a 15+ or do nothing then he's going to throw them.

The only thing I worry about with this kind of thing is just so eroding the distinction between a melee and ranged build that you end up with the "good at everything" character.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 jenius May 21, 2009 17:40:42	In my current campaign, one of the players wants to play a dwarven two weapon fighting ranger. It would be strength based, probably only meeting the dex required for feats. My question is for heavy thrown weapons, is it imbalanced to let their property apply to powers too? Like, the character will primarily be melee, but if he wants to twinstrike two throwing hammers, I'm thinking of letting him just use str for his tohit. Same for other ranged powers. As far as I can tell it's hardly imbalancing (considering the damage discrepancy between heavy thrown weps and a greatbow for example), but I dunno if that will change later into the game. As I said, he primarily plans on being in melee, It's just for the odd situation that he'll be actually using projectiles.
#2 Janx_14 May 21, 2009 17:53:20	Its not RAW, but i'd let it work. As you said his ranged damage would pale in comparison to a true archer ranger. As long as you dont have an archer ranger who wants go to melee, it should be alls fair. Thrown weapons are still kinda 'meh' which is sad. Perhaps the new primal class in PHBIII will be a some kinda wild hunter who throws stuff.
#3 thegreatgalstaff May 21, 2009 23:06:19	if he is wielding heavy thrown weapons then he can use them ranged or melee RAW. since they have the Heavy thrown property use STR to hit and damage they would replace the Dex for hit and damage at range using twin-strike or other power similar RAW. This is how I interpreted the rules a lot of people agree but some don't, its really up to you but IMO it is RAW to allow him to use STR instead of DEX for range attacks because of the Heavy thrown property. in fact there is a paragon path dedicated to heavy or light thrown weapons and it rocks, I'm playing one and it deals almost as much as a archer but I have a better version of quick draw and I can get a massive # of attacks with a Action point. its called the Avalanche Hurler and its on page 58 of Martial power. I like it and its what hes going for, without a question. Edit: you guys are right I miss the "basic" part of the heavy thrown property. but there is no real reason not to allow him to use STR for hit and damage, even if it states Dex for Ranged. mostly in part to thrown weapons being really weak in melee and ranged.
#4 jenius May 22, 2009 14:54:32	if he is wielding heavy thrown weapons then he can use them ranged or melee RAW. since they have the Heavy thrown property use STR to hit and damage they would replace the Dex for hit and damage at range using twin-strike or other power similar RAW. This is how I interpreted the rules a lot of people agree but some don't, its really up to you but IMO it is RAW to allow him to use STR instead of DEX for range attacks because of the Heavy thrown property. in fact there is a paragon path dedicated to heavy or light thrown weapons and it rocks, I'm playing one and it deals almost as much as a archer but I have a better version of quick draw and I can get a massive # of attacks with a Action point. its called the Avalanche Hurler and its on page 58 of Martial power. I like it and its what hes going for, without a question. It's not RAW at all, twin strike clearly states you use dex if you're using a ranged weapon, and heavy thrown specifies "ranged basic" for using str, twin strike is not a ranged basic attack. Therefor, strictly by the rules, you are forced to use dex even with heavy thrown weapons while using twin strike. And no, he's not going for avalanche hurler, and yes I'm aware of avalanche hurler. He's simply going for a two weapon ranger who may occasionally chuck things as his ranged weapon alternative if for some reason he can't realistically get into melee.
#5 AbdulAlhazred May 22, 2009 15:56:51	It's not RAW at all, twin strike clearly states you use dex if you're using a ranged weapon, and heavy thrown specifies "ranged basic" for using str, twin strike is not a ranged basic attack. Therefor, strictly by the rules, you are forced to use dex even with heavy thrown weapons while using twin strike. And no, he's not going for avalanche hurler, and yes I'm aware of avalanche hurler. He's simply going for a two weapon ranger who may occasionally chuck things as his ranged weapon alternative if for some reason he can't realistically get into melee. It obviously isn't RAW, but only because the Twin Strike power explicitly states that it uses dex for ranged attacks. It probably won't hurt anything to allow this, although it also probably won't stop him from doing it even if you don't. The only situation where it would make sense to do is one where a melee attack is impossible or highly undesirable. At that point even if he is using dex what's the harm in chucking a couple axes? Granted his to-hit will be lower, but if the choice is throw and hit on a 15+ or do nothing then he's going to throw them. The only thing I worry about with this kind of thing is just so eroding the distinction between a melee and ranged build that you end up with the "good at everything" character.