Martial Art Training:
Heroic tier: you get a +2 enhancement bonus to implement attacks
Paragon Tier: Prereq. Heroic Martial Art Training you get a +4 enhancement bonus to implement attacks
Epic Tier: Prereq. Paragon Martial Art Training You get a +6 enhancement bonus to implement attacks
It means that they will definitely be outshining their compatriots more quickly but it's a signifigcant Feat tax. Plus there is an economy of language that means monks still can switch between weapons and hand to hand (not sure why they would) but won't stack with their weapons enhancement bonus. Alternatively it could be something like "Heroic Tier Martial Training: you gain a +1 enhancement bonus which increases to +2 at 6th Level."
Is this just limiting them? Pure Feat Tax for no fun? If it does sound right how should I add in those Implement powers? This will allow them more treasure they don't need to worry about armed items, but will this just be wondrous items? Will that feel frustrating, like "what the heck do I need this stuff for?"
The following would be based on the assumption that the group's item progression follows that of inherent bonuses (namely, getting better equipment at levels 2, 7, 12, 17, 22, and 27):
Heroic -> at best, you beat the group at +2 to hit and damage for the first level; at worst, you're paying a feat that the Brawler Fighter gets for free. By level 2 (or low to mid heroic) you're likely just 1 point above other players, and by level 7 (or mid to upper heroic), you effectively lost your mechanical advantage. Anyone with an Expertise feat will lose out to you by 1 point at level 1, and outstrip you by level 7.
Paragon -> completely unnecessary feat tax for a much weaker benefit at this point.
Epic -> even worse than the Paragon feat.
It's not so much feat tax, as simply horribly designed (no offense intended). The only advantage it provides is that it allows you to boost your attacks even if you were completely unarmed, regardless of power source.
Here's my suggestion: if you're that offended by the concept of Ki Focuses, just use the Inherent Bonuses from Dungeon Master's Guide 2, or better yet the Fixed Enhancement Bonuses from Dark Sun Campaign Setting; basically, everyone gets a free increase in to-hit and damage at levels 2, 7, 12, 17, 22 and 27, as well as an increase to AC and non-AC defenses at levels 5, 9, 15, 19, 25 and 29 -- for DSCS in particular, the increase is an enhancement type of bonus [and it's easy to houserull the DMG2 version to not stack with enhancement bonuses], and each increase in to-hit and damage also brings with it extra crit dice... so it's like everyone gets a free +X Magic weapon/implement at levels 2, 7, 12, 17, 22 and 27
Now, if you're really hell-bent on using a feat instead, here's my suggestion:
Martial Art Training
Prerequisite: Must be proficient in ki focuses
Benefit: You gain a +1 feat bonus to all weapon and implement attacks. This bonus increases to +2 at level 11, and +3 at level 21. In addition, you gain a +1 enhancement bonus to all weapon and implement attacks. This bonus increases by 1 at levels 7, 12, 17, 22, and 27 (for instance, at level 12 you gain a +3 enhancement bonus to weapon and implement attacks).
Assassins have weapon attacks, monks use weapons as if they were implements, and even though vampires are mechanically pure implement users, nothing is stopping them from having ranged weapons benefit from their ki focus (they just can't add their Charisma modifier to the damage).
Note that I also re-made the feat as if it was an Expertise feat, so that the feat tax is lessened. I couldn't follow the original 2/4/6 enhancement bonus route, because it made the whole thing way too powerful relative to feat expense (and frankly I still think the feat is too powerful, although it shouldn't be a problem if the party regularly gets better equipment, or if Inherent Bonuses/Fixed Enhancement Bonuses are in effect).
I'm thinking of just making ki focuses feats, so it feels more like they spent time training their new martial art style or skill.
Do you make Fighters take a feat so it feels more like they spent time training their new weapons style or skill?
Do you make Wizards take a feat so it feels more like they spent time training their new magic style or skill?
So, for whatever reason Ki Foci just rub me the wrong way. I am thinking for Monks, Assassins, and Vampires I want a whole other mechanic to offer my players, without having to rewrite everything. I'm thinking of just making ki focuses feats, so it feels more like they spent time training their new martial art style or skill. So this is my idea a tiered feat
Martial Art Training:
Heroic tier: you get a +2 enhancement bonus to implement attacks
Paragon Tier: Prereq. Heroic Martial Art Training you get a +4 enhancement bonus to implement attacks
Epic Tier: Prereq. Paragon Martial Art Training You get a +6 enhancement bonus to implement attacks
It means that they will definitely be outshining their compatriots more quickly but it's a signifigcant Feat tax. Plus there is an economy of language that means monks still can switch between weapons and hand to hand (not sure why they would) but won't stack with their weapons enhancement bonus. Alternatively it could be something like "Heroic Tier Martial Training: you gain a +1 enhancement bonus which increases to +2 at 6th Level."
Is this just limiting them? Pure Feat Tax for no fun? If it does sound right how should I add in those Implement powers? This will allow them more treasure they don't need to worry about armed items, but will this just be wondrous items? Will that feel frustrating, like "what the heck do I need this stuff for?"
What I'm confused about is what rubs you the wrong way about Ki Focuses? They're just basically implements that can be literally anything. Not that big a deal, they're just the same as any other class' implements or weapons. Why do you feel that ki focuses need feats to make them more powerful above anyone else? Just seems...unnecessary. Unless you plan on making a series of feats designed to give even more crazy bonuses to weapon attacks.
But I think I'm misunderstanding these feats. Others seem to say these bring no real mechanical benefit but...I'm not seeing it. All I see is someone with a +1 ki focus grabbing the Heroic tier feat and it would effectively make his +1 ki focus like a +3 ki focus. That to me seems like a significant mechanical benefit. Or are you meaning that instead of say a monk being able to purchase a +1 ki focus(of whatever enchantment) they would be instead required to sacrifice a feat to take the heroic training feat to get a +2 atk bonus? Because if that's the case, that just sounds ridiculous so I hope I'm misinterpreting. Because no offense but if I was playing a monk and was forced to take these feats every tier because I wasn't allowed to purchase a magic item I'd be pissed and probably wouldn't play.
Going off the belief that these feats would be an additional bonus on top of the bonus you already get from say a +1 ki focus, then they're too powerful simply put since the bonuses from these feats stack with say Implement Expertise. If nothing else you need to change the bonuses to feat bonuses, and so it would say something like this;
Heroic tier: you get a +2 feat bonus to implement attack rolls.
Though in the end, just seems like this is all unnecessary but I'm personally curious why you feel so strongly against ki focuses that you need to make these confusing feats when they're no real different than any implement.
And in the end, the use of Inherent Bonuses (and maybe a free feat bonus to hit at levels 1, 11, and 21 to replace Expertise feats) is probably the easiest and simplest way to deal with the issue.
Yeah, I was really unsure about this, but then the article came out with the martial arts styles and I'm thinking now that I'm just going to call ki-focuses Grand Master Training
I think Ki-Focuses were just kind of trying to fit the implement/magic item mechanic where it didn't belong.
The idea that a monk has to carry around a magic stone or a training manual just rubs me the wrong way. Personally I don't think all character archetypes should depend on a material item. It works great for Fantasy Fighters and Wizards, just not for the Monk or the Vampire.
If anyone wants to play a vampire in my game I'm going to turn the ki-focuses into power they get from drinking high level monster's blood (changing Ki-Focus into an alternative reward)
So in the end I'm just refluffing.