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| #1SilverthorneMar 08, 2009 22:45:04 | Numa Racial Traits Average Height: 5'5" to 6'5" Average Weight: 130 to 210 ____________________ Ability Scores: +2 Dexterity, +2 Charisma Size: Medium Speed: 7 Vision: lowlight ____________________ Languages: Common, Numa Skill Bonuses: +2 Nature, +2 Perception Numa Ranged: Numa gain one Weapon proficiency with any type of thrown weapon. Charged Throw Numa Racial Power The Numa have developed a great deal of ability in throwing weapons. _______________________ Encounter ✦ Weapon Minor Action Ranged per weapon Target: one enemy Requirement: Must be wielding a thrown weapon. Attack: Strength + 2 (heavy thrown) or Dexterity + 2 (light thrown) VS AC _______________________ Hit: 1[W] + 1d6 (type) Type is set at character generation. Pick one, Fire, Ice, Force, or Lightning. Play a Numa if you want... • you like an unusual challenge. Physical Qualities: Size medium. Physically they follow the appearance of Elves or Humans, in hair and eye color. Their stature however is oddly mixed. Males and females all range between 5 foot and 6 foot tall. There is no difference in heights when comparing males to females. Playing a Numa Due to their lack of contact with outside world, the Numa are viewed with suspicion. 500 years ago, a group of adventurers cleared out a stone fortress. They adventured on and later when their days of adventure wained, returned to the fortress and the servants they had sent there. The three that remained were Melroth, the wizard, Sharna, the warlock, and Andalas, the cleric. Melroth and Sharna were enchanters, they spent many happy hours secluded in their labs crafting minor magical items to sell to wandering adventurers and to merchants along the trade routes. On one such mission to sell their wares, Sharna found a tome on crafting a special type of golem. She gleefully brought the tome home and spent many hours pouring over the tome. She brought in Melroth and Andalas on the actual crafting of the golem. Andalas, a sculptor, was required since he could see the shape of the golem. The group made all the preparations and settled in for the night. A young servant, tasked with cleaning out spider webs in the keep halls, noted a rather large spider duck under one of the doors on the floor she was working. She chased the spider into one of the rooms, she was not supposed to be in, the enchanting room. She killed it and cleaned up the mess. Little did she know that her minor entrance had changed two of the runes. The spider had damaged the magical circle by crossing it. The next morning the three spell casters went in and started the ritual. The spell started to get out of hand almost at once. The three were quickly stunned and then killed as the explosion of magic tore out of the magical circle. The energy effected the servants and the trees at the edge of the fortress perimeter. The human and elven servants were changed, the trees were changed into a wall of wood very thick and very strong. The Numa as they started to call themselves were only able to escape after 300 years. Their numbers are very small, only about 400 exist the numbers do balance a little heavy for females. The power of the magical explosion developed an affinity to certain magical energies. The ability is not powerful enough to shape into a directed attack, but powerful enough to charge a thrown weapon for a quick attack. Numa Characteristics: slender and graceful Male Names: varied, usually short usually no less than 3 by no more than 10 letters Female Names: same as males |
| #2EmpactWBMar 08, 2009 22:58:11 | Precise Throw Numa Racial Power Should be written as: |
| #3Crimson_ConcertoMar 09, 2009 0:06:24 | Precise Throw Numa Racial Power This is both terribly written and a terrible idea to begin with. Terribly written because: A) What kind of action is this? Minor? Move? Standard? Free? Interrupt? B) Is there an attack? Is it DEX vs AC? STR vs AC? DEX vs Reflex? STR vs Reflex? If there's a hit line, there must be an attack. Otherwise, this is an effect. What's the attack? C) What's the damage? All I see is +2 damage? This power only does 2 damage? What +2? [W]+2? DEX+2? [W]+DEX+2? STR+2? [W]+STR+2? I have no idea how much damage this power does. D) Your special line shouldn't be a special line. It should be part of the attack line as an ability score +2 vs a defense. Terrible idea because: 1) It pigeon-holes this race into only being members of weapon-using class. More specifically, ranged weapon-using classes. This is completely contrary to the 4E player race design philosophies. 2) This is seriously all your race gets? This is ridiculously underpowered. If you want your race to have a reputation for being good with ranged weapon, just give them some free weapon proficiencies for them. Say they gain free proficiency with, I don't know, Shurikens or something. Then maybe give them a racial feat that gives bonus damage for some specific thrown weapons or something. After that, give them some actual racial features... |
| #4SilverthorneMar 09, 2009 1:55:01 | Some of the information I put into the tool kit did not print.. lets see. Its a work in progress. |
| #5EmpactWBMar 09, 2009 13:26:17 | You need to define "magical", because it isn't a game term. And it's useless for PCs if you base it on power source, because monsters don't have power sources. As a free action, Precise Throw is broken to the ends of the earth. Consider: 1) It can be used off-turn. 2) With Demigod, it can be used forever. You can get an unlimited number of free attacks that you don't even have to use on your turn. With this, you can kill Orcus, Tiamat, and Vecna in one round, before they can act even if you lose initiative. It needs to be at least a minor action. |
| #6SilverthorneMar 09, 2009 14:23:19 | Magical will be defined in the additional fluff text. |
| #7fragsieMar 09, 2009 23:38:21 | ____________________ As this is at the moment, i think you are overpowered; you have low-light vision, speed 7 and bonuses to three skills, these three traits are all above the baseline and so need to be balanced out elsewhere in the race; you've started that by having a slightly restricted racial power. But then Numa Resillience blows that out of the water, you need to choose a keyword for that ability, either +5 bonus to saves against ongoing damage of a specific type, or +5 bonus to save against a specific effect (such as illusion, charm, fear etc). I'm not 100% about the three skills either, as far as im aware there are no official classes with 3 skill bonuses, that's not to say it's broken though, just more awkward to balance out, a way around that may be to keep two of your bonuses and turn the third into a racial ability that gives a situational bonus, rather than a flat bonus. For example +2 to perception for listen checks, or +2 to insight when reading someones body language. |
| #8pigknightMar 09, 2009 23:40:20 | Numa....numa.... ....wait.... |
| #9Crimson_ConcertoMar 10, 2009 0:11:42 | All right then, take two...Skill Bonuses: +2 Nature, +2 Perception, +2 Insight Most races have a bonus to two skills. While it's not necessary, I'd highly recommend sticking to the basic race design structure for the sake of simplicity. What did you have before? It was a bonus to two skills, right? Or else I would have said something. I'd say go back to that. Numa Resiliance: Numa get a +5 bonus versus saves for magical effects. There's no such think as a "magical effect." This ability does nothing. What there are are Charm effects, Conjuration effects, Fear effects, Illusion effects, Poison effects, Polymorph effects, Sleep effects, Teleportation effects, and more. See PHB page 55. Precise Throw Numa Racial Power This has gotten better but not by very much. A) STR or DEX vs what? Is the attack vs AC? vs Reflex? I'm guessing vs AC but it should say so. B) The special line indicates that a throws weapon now gets +4 to hit with this power? That's completely unnecessary and very powerful. Also, your attack line only gives entries for light thrown and heavy thrown weapons, so there's no indication that this power can be used with anything but. This special line should be removed entirely, and the power should have "Requirement: You must be wielding a thrown weapon." above the attack line. C) If there's no effect, you don't need to write "Effect: none." Just leave that part out. D) Most importantly, this power is still a terrible idea from a design philosophy point of view. The power is completely useless to characters not specializing in ranged weapons, especially now that you put the Weapon tag on it such that all Numa characters must keep a magic thrown weapon up to par or have their racial power be useless. This pretty much pigeon-holes Numas into being either Rangers or Rogues. This is bad. I can't even tell if the race is overpowered or underpowered anymore because it's so badly designed. ![]() Does this race not have a shtick other that being good with thrown weapons? Because Elves have the shtick of being good with bows and Dwarfs have the shtick of being really good with hammers, but they also have other things about them that are interesting... EDIT: Without the adjustment, all armors gain a -1 penalty to load, and melee weapons have a -1 penalty to attack, bow type weapons have the -1 penalty as well. I just noticed this. This is terrible. It's another example of creating a race that you're trying to restrict to playing only one type of character. It should definitely be removed. |
| #10SilverthorneMar 11, 2009 6:21:53 | Modified. The adjustments to weapons and armor are a role playing aspect that I want to keep. The weapon proficiency is in to make any class available as they are trained from birth to use a thrown weapon. This is a family trait, what weapon they use. |
| #11SilverthorneMar 17, 2009 6:40:48 | Anything that needs to be changed as of now. |
| #12SilverthorneMar 17, 2009 6:46:55 | I am trying to get this right. I have a world setting in mind. The Numa are a part of it. I need to get them right before moving on to the rest of the world design. There are feats in the back ground that anyone will be able to take, these will help out the Numa racial ability, and anyone else using certain types of weapons. |
| #13rikijiMar 17, 2009 22:44:16 | I really don't like the hidden penalty you wrote into the flavor text. Aside from being generally a bad idea to start with and out of keeping with 4E guidelines, I really don't find your justification for it credible. Having one less digit isn't going to make any major difference in the use of most weapons and won't affect armor at all. Differences in armor between races is really more flavor than mechanics. eg. dwarves use equipment that is proportioned significantly different from humans, but there aren't rules to codify the difference - it's all flavor. The race is weak enough without the penalty. From your smidgin of flavor text I gather that this race is some kind of felinoid? Shouldn't there be racial features that reflect that? |
| #14SilverthorneMar 18, 2009 6:18:31 | Its not a felinoid. They look fairly human/elven. The penalty on weapons and armor is due to balance. Thinking of making a feat for them that allows them to ignore the penalty. But think about trying to get your hand in a glove built for someone with only three fingers. Its going to bind up your little finger and cause you problems. A sword or bow balanced for someone with only three fingers is going to be balanced differently. Looking at it both ways a Numa putting on a glove with 4 fingers is going to mess with any bow the use. Extra flap of material hanging, possibly getting caught in the string when you fire it. |
| #15fragsieMar 18, 2009 11:20:57 | Its not a felinoid. They look fairly human/elven. While i can see where you are coming from; the idea of a race penalty just has no place in 4th ed. Besides that there are two other points to take into consideration that argue against your racial penalty: 1) Dragonborn also have 3 fingers and have no such problems with equipment. 2) Equipment can be reshaped and resized quite easily with the Enchant Magic Item ritual. |
| #16rikijiMar 18, 2009 12:09:19 | Its not a felinoid. They look fairly human/elven. Not a felinoid? Then this doesn't make much sense: There were two mages in the ancient forest. They built many great items in their time. The last creation they were able to make was their greatest failure. They were attampting to cross a feline with a human. The effect failed in the basis that their towers were destroyed. The only survivors were the few Numa that were created before the magic went wild. Now they Numa stay away from most other races, depending on themselves. Numa adventurers are RARE. Even if it doesn't look like a cat, which is fine, why wouldn't a cross between a feline and a human have at least some feline attributes? The penalty on weapons and armor is due to balance. Thinking of making a feat for them that allows them to ignore the penalty. But think about trying to get your hand in a glove built for someone with only three fingers. Its going to bind up your little finger and cause you problems. A sword or bow balanced for someone with only three fingers is going to be balanced differently. Looking at it both ways a Numa putting on a glove with 4 fingers is going to mess with any bow the use. Extra flap of material hanging, possibly getting caught in the string when you fire it. It's not a balancing factor - the race is underpowered to start with and you're giving it a pointless and arbitrary limitation. Think about a human trying to fit into a set of plate armor made for a dwarf - a little more problematic than what you're describing, but it doesn't warrant a mechanical penalty in the game. It's all fluff, and should be treated as such. (For that matter, most archers gloves only have two fingers anyways... ). Also, to add on Fragsie's points: 3) Crafting is entirely relegated to fluff in 4E. Even if nonmagical armor requires modification, a professional adventurer is most likely going to have the skills required - or know someone who does. If you want to use DM's fiat to penalize picking something up off the ground and using it right away, that's your discretion, but there's no reason to build it into the race. |
| #17SilverthorneMar 19, 2009 6:47:53 | still trying to figure out the basics of race generation in 4e. I do not see why a cross between a human and feline would not have some racial characteristics. The cross here is a failed golem ritual and humans/elves. |
| #18EmpactWBMar 19, 2009 13:07:39 | So... were you ever going to describe that in the fluff? Because the only thing you describe before the race is how two wizards were trying to combine felines and humans. Nothing is mentioned about golems or elves, so no one is going to know anything about the actual race and will assume that "the few Numa that were created before the magic went wild" were the product of "attempting to cross a feline with a human", just like everyone here did. |
| #19FireclaveMar 19, 2009 15:03:14 | 1) Dragonborn also have 3 fingers and have no such problems with equipment. And to add to this, warforged only have two. still trying to figure out the basics of race generation in 4e. It's fairly simple, actually. Most races follow this pattern: Pattern Ability Score: +2 stat, +2 different stat Size: Medium or Small Speed: 5-7 Vision: Normal or Low-light Languages: Common, 0-1 other language Skill Bonuses: +2 one skill, +2 different skill Defense Bonus: If this races stat bonuses apply to the same defense, grant the race +1 to a different defense. Else, don't grant a defense bonus. Ability One: A mechanically significant ability Ability Two: A mechanically significant ability 0-2 Minor Abilities: Abilities with little or no mechanical impact. Racial Power: A racial encounter or at-will power Clarifications and Design Considerations:
If you look at the races in the PH, you will find that all of them fall under these guidelines. |
| #20SilverthorneMar 19, 2009 15:53:57 | Will go back to the drawing board. Will try to write up the full fluff information so that everyone can see, first. Posted.. |
| #21Crimson_ConcertoMar 19, 2009 17:04:04 | It's fairly simple, actually. Most races follow this pattern: |
| #22EmpactWBMar 20, 2009 2:34:48 | Much better on the fluff. Heed Fireclave, he's got it down. |
| #23FireclaveMar 20, 2009 14:25:02 | The origin fluff is a start, but could still use more. A physical descripition and some psychology and customs would really enhance the fluff.Charged Throw Numa Racial Power The racial power is better now. The Hit line is redundant though. Since both heavy and light thrown weapons deal the same damage, you don't need two identical entries. And I'm curious as to why the extra damage is energy base, as nothing in your fluff indenticates an innate affinity with elemental forces (except the wizard-did-it part, but since that applies to almost everything it D&D, it doesn't really count :P) Born of a magical mistake created by two very powerful mages. Nitpick: I'm farily sure this is your race's one-sentence flavor text. If so, it should be moved out from the middle of the stat block and below the race's name. @Crimson_Concerto & EmpactWB Thanks for the kind words. Since I already written that much, I'm considering expanding those suggestions into a full Race Creation Guide. If I do, I'll be sure to incorporate your suggestions Crimson. |
| #24SilverthorneMar 21, 2009 13:51:49 | Minor updates. Once the race is fixed, I will post some feats that are Numa specific, possibly Dragonborn available. Still working out some of the roughness in it. Innate Powered Attack. Your inborn attack power is fine at range, but when the bad guy is in your face, you need a bit of an edge. Your ranged attack channels though your melee weapon. Effect: Any ranged energy attack channels though your weapon in hand to deliver it damage. A miss is still a miss. |
| #25mufflonMar 22, 2009 18:13:14 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60og9gwKh1o |
| #26SilverthorneMar 22, 2009 19:06:41 | not going to comment on the video. I totally forgot about that.. lol |