Houserules fixes for common problems! - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Houserules fixes for common problems!

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
markis
Jul 11, 2009 13:28:36 I'll start with some complaints about 4e and how to fix it. Add in your own common complaints, and solutions as you see fit.

Problem: 4e combat takes too long. Solution: Halve monster HP, use lots of minions.
Problem: 4e Rangers should be controllers. Solution: Choice of new at will powers, replacing Hunter's Quarry. Volley: Ranged weapon, minor action, burst 3 within range (4 at 11th, 5 at 21st), targets enemies. Dex vs. AC, deals 1[W] damage to all targets. Tripwire Shot: (fires a threaded arrow that latches to a nearby object, creating a tripwire) minor action, Wall 5, Creates a tripwire in the zone, enemies entering the zone are knocked prone until the end of your next turn. Zone persists for 1 round at level 1, 2 rounds at level 11, 3 rounds at level 21.

Those are the two biggest problem's I've seen. Feel free to add your own problems, solutions, and tweaks to other people's solutions. Hopefully we'll have a fix for all those little problems after a while.
#2
elricen
Jul 11, 2009 14:15:09 I'd go with:
Problem: The game's math has well known scaling issues (see derivation here); characters lose 4 to hit, 4 to their two strong FRW defenses (assuming they spread stat-points to two different ability scores), 7 to their weak FRW defense, and 2 to AC over 29 levels.

Fix: At levels 5, 15, and 25, characters get +1 to hit and to Fort/Reflex/Will defenses. With this change, characters lose 1 to-hit and 2 to their average FRW defense over these levels.

Ban the Player’s Handbook 2 feats Implement Expertise, Weapon Expertise, Robust Defenses, Epic Fortitude, Epic Reflexes, and Epic Will. Future “Expertise” feats like Focused Expertise are banned as well. The Expertise feats in particular seem like poor attempts to fix the math problems that would have been much better handled by errata.

Problem: Large, constant save penalties are too powerful
Fixes:
Orb of Imposition (Wizard class feature): Orb of imposition’s save penalty power is a free action you can use only once per encounter, but you can choose to apply it after the relevant saving throw roll has already been made

Cunning Weapon, Earthroot Staff, Phrenic Crown, and Skull Mask (all Adventurer's Vault) only apply saving throw penalties to the first saving throw made against the effect.
#3
bone_naga
Jul 11, 2009 21:12:41 Rangers as controllers? Is this really a common problem, because this is the first time I heard about it? Rangers seem pretty striker-ish to me.
#4
Crimson_Concerto
Jul 12, 2009 13:52:06
Rangers as controllers? Is this really a common problem, because this is the first time I heard about it? Rangers seem pretty striker-ish to me.

Seconded. I've heard it proposed that Rangers could have been controllers, but never that their not being controllers is a problem.
#5
DanTracker
Jul 13, 2009 13:09:34
Rangers as controllers? Is this really a common problem, because this is the first time I heard about it? Rangers seem pretty striker-ish to me.

i agree. i'd make the rogue into a crowd controller before the ranger. the ranger seems very well built with the hunter's quarry. great way to replace favored enemy.

the rogue is a good candidate for martial controller, though weak right now in that respect. maybe after assasin makes its debut the rogue will get some different flexing options for control.

honestly, the warlord has some reasonable control aspects, though still not much. control is not always easy to apply to martial skills. the arcane, primal and divine rely on outside influence to use controlling powers. the martial would have to rely on presence, fear, intimidation, and weaponry to make effective controls. some elements of that are RP rather than die rolls or powers.
#6
vebrandsson
Jul 13, 2009 13:25:51 None of these sound like common problems to me (at least not the OP ones, orb I hear about a lot but have never had an issue with it myself) I would have thought the most common houserule and the most common problem would be Versatile weapons, to which my solution is this:

Versatile Weapons: A versatile weapon wielded with two hands is considered to be a two handed weapon for all purposes (this solves many issues with small, not all but many particularly small barbarians, and makes versatile weapons slightly more valuable)
#7
bone_naga
Jul 13, 2009 15:51:58
None of these sound like common problems to me (at least not the OP ones, orb I hear about a lot but have never had an issue with it myself) I would have thought the most common houserule and the most common problem would be Versatile weapons, to which my solution is this:

Versatile Weapons: A versatile weapon wielded with two hands is considered to be a two handed weapon for all purposes (this solves many issues with small, not all but many particularly small barbarians, and makes versatile weapons slightly more valuable)

Indeed that is actually one of my houserules.
#8
mkill
Jul 13, 2009 22:20:25 My group is playing without house rules (*) so far, and it works fine.

But then, we didn't run into issues with orb stun locking or unkillable battleragers simply because nobody build a character based on that. There might be some common issues, but they haven't shown up in our group in one year of weekly sessions.

We did have a barbarian with a jagged weapon, which was errata'd by the FAQ, and my 3rd level ranger got a set of +2 veteran hide armor from the DM, which he promptly used to use Jaws of the Wolf twice in an encounter for 41 and 43 damage. That would have killed two other party members. That was the point where I, as the player, reminded the DM that Veteran's armor was nerfed, and obviously for a reason. The DM changed the armor's enchantment next session.

(*) House rules in the sense of changing game mechanics. I added a homebrew weapon, a flame-shaped scimitar-like blade, for the dragon cult that is a main religion in the game world, but I consider that setting material not house rules.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 markis Jul 11, 2009 13:28:36	I'll start with some complaints about 4e and how to fix it. Add in your own common complaints, and solutions as you see fit. Problem: 4e combat takes too long. Solution: Halve monster HP, use lots of minions. Problem: 4e Rangers should be controllers. Solution: Choice of new at will powers, replacing Hunter's Quarry. Volley: Ranged weapon, minor action, burst 3 within range (4 at 11th, 5 at 21st), targets enemies. Dex vs. AC, deals 1[W] damage to all targets. Tripwire Shot: (fires a threaded arrow that latches to a nearby object, creating a tripwire) minor action, Wall 5, Creates a tripwire in the zone, enemies entering the zone are knocked prone until the end of your next turn. Zone persists for 1 round at level 1, 2 rounds at level 11, 3 rounds at level 21. Those are the two biggest problem's I've seen. Feel free to add your own problems, solutions, and tweaks to other people's solutions. Hopefully we'll have a fix for all those little problems after a while.
#2 elricen Jul 11, 2009 14:15:09	I'd go with: Problem: The game's math has well known scaling issues (see derivation here); characters lose 4 to hit, 4 to their two strong FRW defenses (assuming they spread stat-points to two different ability scores), 7 to their weak FRW defense, and 2 to AC over 29 levels. Fix: At levels 5, 15, and 25, characters get +1 to hit and to Fort/Reflex/Will defenses. With this change, characters lose 1 to-hit and 2 to their average FRW defense over these levels. Ban the Player’s Handbook 2 feats Implement Expertise, Weapon Expertise, Robust Defenses, Epic Fortitude, Epic Reflexes, and Epic Will. Future “Expertise” feats like Focused Expertise are banned as well. The Expertise feats in particular seem like poor attempts to fix the math problems that would have been much better handled by errata. Problem: Large, constant save penalties are too powerful Fixes: Orb of Imposition (Wizard class feature): Orb of imposition’s save penalty power is a free action you can use only once per encounter, but you can choose to apply it after the relevant saving throw roll has already been made Cunning Weapon, Earthroot Staff, Phrenic Crown, and Skull Mask (all Adventurer's Vault) only apply saving throw penalties to the first saving throw made against the effect.
#3 bone_naga Jul 11, 2009 21:12:41	Rangers as controllers? Is this really a common problem, because this is the first time I heard about it? Rangers seem pretty striker-ish to me.
#4 Crimson_Concerto Jul 12, 2009 13:52:06	Rangers as controllers? Is this really a common problem, because this is the first time I heard about it? Rangers seem pretty striker-ish to me. Seconded. I've heard it proposed that Rangers could have been controllers, but never that their not being controllers is a problem.
#5 DanTracker Jul 13, 2009 13:09:34	Rangers as controllers? Is this really a common problem, because this is the first time I heard about it? Rangers seem pretty striker-ish to me. i agree. i'd make the rogue into a crowd controller before the ranger. the ranger seems very well built with the hunter's quarry. great way to replace favored enemy. the rogue is a good candidate for martial controller, though weak right now in that respect. maybe after assasin makes its debut the rogue will get some different flexing options for control. honestly, the warlord has some reasonable control aspects, though still not much. control is not always easy to apply to martial skills. the arcane, primal and divine rely on outside influence to use controlling powers. the martial would have to rely on presence, fear, intimidation, and weaponry to make effective controls. some elements of that are RP rather than die rolls or powers.
#6 vebrandsson Jul 13, 2009 13:25:51	None of these sound like common problems to me (at least not the OP ones, orb I hear about a lot but have never had an issue with it myself) I would have thought the most common houserule and the most common problem would be Versatile weapons, to which my solution is this: Versatile Weapons: A versatile weapon wielded with two hands is considered to be a two handed weapon for all purposes (this solves many issues with small, not all but many particularly small barbarians, and makes versatile weapons slightly more valuable)
#7 bone_naga Jul 13, 2009 15:51:58	None of these sound like common problems to me (at least not the OP ones, orb I hear about a lot but have never had an issue with it myself) I would have thought the most common houserule and the most common problem would be Versatile weapons, to which my solution is this: Versatile Weapons: A versatile weapon wielded with two hands is considered to be a two handed weapon for all purposes (this solves many issues with small, not all but many particularly small barbarians, and makes versatile weapons slightly more valuable) Indeed that is actually one of my houserules.
#8 mkill Jul 13, 2009 22:20:25	My group is playing without house rules () so far, and it works fine. But then, we didn't run into issues with orb stun locking or unkillable battleragers simply because nobody build a character based on that. There might be some common issues, but they haven't shown up in our group in one year of weekly sessions. We did have a barbarian with a jagged weapon, which was errata'd by the FAQ, and my 3rd level ranger got a set of +2 veteran hide armor from the DM, which he promptly used to use Jaws of the Wolf twice in an encounter for 41 and 43 damage. That would have killed two other party members. That was the point where I, as the player, reminded the DM that Veteran's armor was nerfed, and obviously for a reason. The DM changed the armor's enchantment next session. () House rules in the sense of changing game mechanics. I added a homebrew weapon, a flame-shaped scimitar-like blade, for the dragon cult that is a main religion in the game world, but I consider that setting material not house rules.