I have briefly discussed (with the DM) how the rules would work and just how far i could throw my diminuative partner, but we cant seem to find any rules governing the action.
Currently the halfling has done his part and been working on way to mittigate the damage from the throws and what not. My goliath has a Athletics bonus of 20 and a strength score of 21. We are both 12th level.
The ideas we have come up with so far include
1) Athletics check for a non-attack throw, Athletics roll divided by 10= number of squares thrown. however i would like to find a way to be able to throw him more than just 4 squares with a crit.
2)Then a ranged basic attack as a heavy thrown improvised weapon for the attack, but we cant figure out the range.
I did notice the Gorilla and Giatnkin gloves had ranged throwing properties, but wanted to figure out a non-magical way to do it also
I was hoping the wonderful community out there could provide some extra insight into this matter, and mabye ways of improving it, mabye even to the point that i could throw other enemies as well
The first is to extend RAW by creating a house-rule for throwing creatures, based on the use of Athletics skill to perform a Jump action:
THROW WILLING OR HELPLESS CREATURE
Make an Athletics check to throw a willing or helpless creature in your square or any adjacent square.
The check is a move action. Grabbing an adjacent willing or helpless creature is considered a free action.
Distance Thrown Horizontally: Make an Athletics check and divide your check result by 10 (round down). This is the number of squares you can throw the creature.
Smaller and Larger creatures: Add +5 to your result for every size category the creature is smaller than you. Take -10 from your result for every size category larger the creature is.
Distance Thrown Vertically: Halve the number of squares for vertical throws.
Uses your movement action. The thrown creature does not spend an action.
Ignores difficult terrain. The thrown creature effectively flies the given distance and then crashes.
A willing creature counts as having moved (by flying) for all purposes, including triggering effects from entering intervening squares, and triggering attacks of opportunity.
Thrown creature takes damage as if they fell the same distance, and ends the action prone. A non-helpless creature may make a free action Acrobatics roll to reduce damage, and if successful they are also not prone.
Balance wise this works out fine IMO - for the cost of a Move action and a couple of skill rolls, the Goliath has made the Halfling more mobile, but not by as much as he would gain by having an additional Move, and at a risk of it all going wrong (prone, damaged halfling, or not clearing the diatance).
. . . in addition note that if the Halfling has a higher initiative, he can both Move next to the Goliath, use a Minor for some or other utility, then use his Standard to Ready an attack on the nearest enemy once he lands. That would be all be fine by RAW.
Distance Thrown Horizontally: Make an Athletics check and divide your check result by 10 (round down). This is the number of squares you can throw the creature.Throw a grabbed target
To throw a grabbed target, you must succeed on a Strength attack.
THROW A GRABBED TARGET: STANDARD ACTION, MELEE ATTACK
You must be grabbing the opponent, and there may not be any other immobilise conditions affecting it. The target may not be larger than you.
Strength Attack: Make a Strength attack vs. Fortitude. Do not add any weapon modifiers.
Effect: The grab ends.
Hit: 1d4+Str modifier damage. Slide the target to any unoccupied square within 1 square of you. The target makes a saving throw and is prone if they fail.
Special: Increase slide range to 2 squares if target is one or more size categories smaller than you.
Slam Throw
Heroic Tier
Prerequisite: Goliath
Benefit: Gain +2 (heroic)/+4 (paragon)/+6 (epic) bonus to hit and damage with Strength attacks to throw a grabbed opponent. Increase slide distance by 1.
Collaberative Throw
Heroic Tier
Prerequisite: Goliath
Benefit: When throwing a willing ally, increase horizontal distance by 2 squares, or vertical distance by 1 square. Your ally does not take damage on landing and does not need to make an Acrobatics check to remain standing.
Practiced Body Throw
Heroic Tier
Prerequisite: Goliath, Trained in Athleitcs
Benefit: When throwing a willing ally or helpless opponent, you may choose not to roll d20, and instead use the value 20.
Thrown Charge
Heroic Tier
Prerequisite: Trained in Acrobatics
Benefit: On your turn after being thrown by an ally, you may treat the throw as meeting the movement requirements for a charge attack. If your first action is a melee attack, add +2 damage on a hit.
Note that this last one allows the halfling to be thrown a square short, and charge the remaining single square (kind of continuing the momentum of the throw).
. . . I think that's the basics covered . . . here's one more for fun:
Midair Attack
Heroic Tier
Prerequisite: Trained in Acrobatics, Thrown Charge feat.
Benefit: You may make a basic melee attack whilst flying as an Immediate Reaction. The trigger condition is any enemy changing from being out of melee range to within range during your movement. The target of the attack must be the triggering enemy.
Special: Note limitations on when you can use Immediate actions, which essentially relegates this feat to a benefit when being thrown or otherwise moved on allies' turns.
Let the halfling hold an action to make a melee attack when he hits.
I'd probably add a push 1 or similar effect to it, thought. ;)
Meh. Improvised ranged weapon (heavy thrown)!
Let the halfling hold an action to make a melee attack when he hits.
I'd probably add a push 1 or similar effect to it, thought. ;)
This simple suggestion would cost the tactical setup, plus 2 standard actions to get the effects of one melee attack plus a push 1. Seems balanced to me, once you include the free movement of the melee character. One thing missing from the suggestion - unlike a thrown weapon, the final position of the Halfling needs to be resolved (on a hit or miss), and is of some importance for team tactics . . . this cannot be left to DM ad-hoc rulings (which would be fine for a one off improvisation) since the tactic is going to be used a lot, it needs to be figured out . . . any suggestions how it would be resolved?
I would immediately suggest the ability to use a (smaller) ally as an improvised heavy thrown weapon is in fact a new homebrewed feat that the Goliath should take. The feat can define where the ally ends up.
The OP probably needs more than a minimal how to do it, hence my original feat suggestions which give the concept a little more longevity . . . so could anyone suggest some feats that would take this approach develop so that it is still fun to play in the 20th encounter onwards?
Start out with the halfling making a held action, and then the Goliath picks him up (minor) and throws him (standard).
Attack roll is STR vs/ AC, damage is 1d4+STR, range 5/10, if he hits the halfling can make an attack. The halfling always ends up prone in a square next to the target (unless he has some ability that allows him to land on his feet after a fall). On a hit the attacker choses the square, on a miss the defender choses.
Now I agree that if it's a trained tactic it should be better. Make it a feat that gives an attack bonus to the throw, possibly an attack bonus to the halfling's attack, and adds some effect to the damage (like push 1 and possibly prone).
Halfling Hurl is a ranged attack usable as an RBA, heavy thrown, targetable at empty squares only. On a hit, the halfling lands standing. On a crit, he lands and gains CA against any and all adjacent enemies. On a miss, he lands prone.
Minor to pick him up, Standard to lob him, and you have to do both in the same turn (but you can move in between if you wish, at half speed). Short range, probably between 3/6 and 5/10. The Halfling moves in as straight a line as possible, 1 square off the ground.
Halfling can ready an attack for when he lands if he wants, or go into delay next to the Goliath to come out after the goliath's turn. Counts as forced movement for the halfling, so he doesn't (usually) provoke OAs. If mobs have OAs that can target forced movement, he falls prone in the first square where he can be affected by the power if hit.
Enable it with feats for both characters, Halfling Hurler for the Goliath (prereq: at least medium size, STR 17: you gain the Halfling Hurl power, and can use it to Hurl willing Small creatures who have the Halfling Hurlee feat) and Halfling Hurlee for the ammunition (You can be Hurled by allies with the Halfling Hurler feat).
Some of the other feats suggested above could jive with this. But I also like the idea of adding Halfling Mastery to give expanded crit :D
Added gear: spiked helmet, Does 1d6 Damage when your thrown at a target and hit
Jaged spiked helmet: does 1D8 damage on a hit when thrown
Skiped bootes 1d6+str damage acrobatic roll DC = to targets ac to land on feet.
Spiked armor 1d4 damage and allows a free grab attack, on a sucessfull grab you land in a square adjacent to the target. (minor action; target takes 1D4 damage as long as it remains grabbed)
just gives a few ideas on what the halfling does once he arives at the target weather he headbuts them double boot kicks em or glomps on to them
As for landing, on a hit I would say add push target 1 and land in targets square if target can't be pushed land in square before targets maybe force a acrobatics check or require a feet to remain standing. on a miss then land in the adjacent squaire before the targets. (a miss does not mean you didn't hit the target only that you failed to effect it with the throw, Maybe add a +5 DC to the acrobatics check to not fall prone acrobatics check = targets AC.
as for the galioth, think minor to pick them up standard to throw them, (allow the halfling to use a move action to add a bonus distence thrown = to it's spead (pushes off of the golieths hands with it's feat before twisting into attack position while in the air)
Over all I think I would be prety generouse with the tactic since it is very creative and adds a special flavor, make special mutliclass feats that allow you to get a slowly increasing variety of encounter powers maybe even a daily power. with a little work could be a very fun time at the table
I'm just disappointed that nobody's proposed a rule called "Fastball Special."
That's pretty much what we're all talking about, we're just not calling it that. Mainly because, apparently, none of us thought of it. D'oh.