Low Magic Item Campaign, is it possible? - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Low Magic Item Campaign, is it possible?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
njbst18
Feb 11, 2009 11:40:41 Looking at monsters that are out there and how treasures etc are handed out with the tier system.
Is it even possible to have a campaign that around level 10 the party might only have 2-3 magic items. Where all items have a long detailed back story on how they came to be. Or would the monsters be much to strong for the party b/c the party doesn't have the +2 amulets to boost saves the armor bonuses from magic armor, etc...
Any thoughts?
#2
ostrakon
Feb 11, 2009 12:08:09 Is there a good reason why you don't want them to have magic items? It's not like in 3.X where certain magic items screw up the entire game.

In any case, monster stats now assume that you have an appropriate amount of magic items in the party. You'd be screwing them irrevocably if you didn't either nerf the hell out of the monsters attacks, defenses, and HP, or boost the PCs somehow.

I recommend giving the PCs bonuses the following way so you don't have to adjust the monsters all the time.
(note, this is all enhancement bonuses, so they don't stack with magic items).
At each level (including 1st), they can take a +1 bonus to any of the following categories: AC, Fort, Reflex, Will, or Attack and Damage. This bonus is limited to +1 until they hit level 6, at which point they can raise the inherent bonus to +2. This way, a PC has to raise each stat by 1 before he can start raising other stats to +2.

This will give more or less the same effect as finding appropriate magic items.
#3
mellored
Feb 11, 2009 12:17:29 It is assumed you have magic items in 4e, the game is balanced toward such, but if you don't want them, just change the numbers of either the PC's or the monsters by the amount an item of that level would give you.

So like at lvl 3, drop all monster stats by 1.
and at lvl 8, drop them all by 2.
ect...
#4
nazralte
Feb 11, 2009 12:41:38 Could always combine the magic items into more powerful items.

Or the other option Ive always liked is magic items getting stronger as the players do. And you can work this into the story in different ways.

Personally, im not sure what im going to do yet as I havent run a 4E (will be soon) but I will most likely just give the players fewer yet more powerful items to make up for it, or a combination of the two perhaps.
#5
salla
Feb 11, 2009 14:43:58 The easy way (I think) would be to give the PCs an inherent enhancement bonus to attack rolls, damage rolls, and defenses equal to 1/5 their level (+1 at levels 1-5, +2 at levels 6-10). As it's an enhancement bonus, it won't stack with any magic items they do find; they will, however, miss out on item powers and properties for the stuff they don't have.
#6
lord_karsus
Feb 11, 2009 20:36:25 -You'll have to adjust certain monsters with things like Damage Resistances and things like that, because, obviously, the books take into account that X level characters are going to have "enough" gear, magical and otherwise.
#7
doomsought
Feb 11, 2009 20:57:39 Calculate the static bonus those items would give the PCs and apply that as a penalty to all of the monsters' defenses.
#8
aini
Feb 12, 2009 8:12:14 All my campaigns in D&D 3.5 are low magic item games tbh. I have never found it to be a problem or needed a reason to balance anything around it. That said i can see that it would have a serious impact on the system at higher level. My campaigns tend not to run much past 10th level (if even that high) so the issue has never really needed to be tackled.
#9
Thought
Feb 12, 2009 13:33:22 Well, there are a variety of ways to get around this.

The easiest is to change the flavor of magic items. I think the adventurer's vault contains a suggestion of giving out item levels rather than items as treasure. That is, a Paladin might start out at lvl 1 with a longsword. But by using it to vanquish great evils, the sword begins to take on legendary qualities; not because of magic enchantments, but because the character using it imparts a degree of power to it.

Such an approach would prevent the party from going through several magical items, focusing the powers on a few specific items given those powers for ingame reasons.

Another approach might be to say that the items aren't magical. It is a pure fluff change. Instead of a +5 magic shortbow, it is just a +5 bow. The bonus isn't from magic but it is from being crafted from Elder Trees that can only be found in rare parts of the Feywild, for example. That +5 Platemail? Made from elementite, an ore that is difficult to work with and can only be mined in certain dangerous parts of the Elemental Chaos.

And so on.
#10
Mechalibur
Feb 12, 2009 14:22:03 I have a DM that is very very stingy with magic items. This is balanced out by the fact that all the enemies have lower defenses and attack bonuses. He actually has never once used the MM...

Actually I don't think he's ever read any of the books (except the PHB when he was a player to decide what powers he wanted)

But yeah, it works if you use the right enemies.
#11
Vatras
Feb 15, 2009 8:30:02 The short answer is yes.

But you have to have a closer look at encounter levels and use lower level monsters at higher levels.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 njbst18 Feb 11, 2009 11:40:41	Looking at monsters that are out there and how treasures etc are handed out with the tier system. Is it even possible to have a campaign that around level 10 the party might only have 2-3 magic items. Where all items have a long detailed back story on how they came to be. Or would the monsters be much to strong for the party b/c the party doesn't have the +2 amulets to boost saves the armor bonuses from magic armor, etc... Any thoughts?
#2 ostrakon Feb 11, 2009 12:08:09	Is there a good reason why you don't want them to have magic items? It's not like in 3.X where certain magic items screw up the entire game. In any case, monster stats now assume that you have an appropriate amount of magic items in the party. You'd be screwing them irrevocably if you didn't either nerf the hell out of the monsters attacks, defenses, and HP, or boost the PCs somehow. I recommend giving the PCs bonuses the following way so you don't have to adjust the monsters all the time. (note, this is all enhancement bonuses, so they don't stack with magic items). At each level (including 1st), they can take a +1 bonus to any of the following categories: AC, Fort, Reflex, Will, or Attack and Damage. This bonus is limited to +1 until they hit level 6, at which point they can raise the inherent bonus to +2. This way, a PC has to raise each stat by 1 before he can start raising other stats to +2. This will give more or less the same effect as finding appropriate magic items.
#3 mellored Feb 11, 2009 12:17:29	It is assumed you have magic items in 4e, the game is balanced toward such, but if you don't want them, just change the numbers of either the PC's or the monsters by the amount an item of that level would give you. So like at lvl 3, drop all monster stats by 1. and at lvl 8, drop them all by 2. ect...
#4 nazralte Feb 11, 2009 12:41:38	Could always combine the magic items into more powerful items. Or the other option Ive always liked is magic items getting stronger as the players do. And you can work this into the story in different ways. Personally, im not sure what im going to do yet as I havent run a 4E (will be soon) but I will most likely just give the players fewer yet more powerful items to make up for it, or a combination of the two perhaps.
#5 salla Feb 11, 2009 14:43:58	The easy way (I think) would be to give the PCs an inherent enhancement bonus to attack rolls, damage rolls, and defenses equal to 1/5 their level (+1 at levels 1-5, +2 at levels 6-10). As it's an enhancement bonus, it won't stack with any magic items they do find; they will, however, miss out on item powers and properties for the stuff they don't have.
#6 lord_karsus Feb 11, 2009 20:36:25	-You'll have to adjust certain monsters with things like Damage Resistances and things like that, because, obviously, the books take into account that X level characters are going to have "enough" gear, magical and otherwise.
#7 doomsought Feb 11, 2009 20:57:39	Calculate the static bonus those items would give the PCs and apply that as a penalty to all of the monsters' defenses.
#8 aini Feb 12, 2009 8:12:14	All my campaigns in D&D 3.5 are low magic item games tbh. I have never found it to be a problem or needed a reason to balance anything around it. That said i can see that it would have a serious impact on the system at higher level. My campaigns tend not to run much past 10th level (if even that high) so the issue has never really needed to be tackled.
#9 Thought Feb 12, 2009 13:33:22	Well, there are a variety of ways to get around this. The easiest is to change the flavor of magic items. I think the adventurer's vault contains a suggestion of giving out item levels rather than items as treasure. That is, a Paladin might start out at lvl 1 with a longsword. But by using it to vanquish great evils, the sword begins to take on legendary qualities; not because of magic enchantments, but because the character using it imparts a degree of power to it. Such an approach would prevent the party from going through several magical items, focusing the powers on a few specific items given those powers for ingame reasons. Another approach might be to say that the items aren't magical. It is a pure fluff change. Instead of a +5 magic shortbow, it is just a +5 bow. The bonus isn't from magic but it is from being crafted from Elder Trees that can only be found in rare parts of the Feywild, for example. That +5 Platemail? Made from elementite, an ore that is difficult to work with and can only be mined in certain dangerous parts of the Elemental Chaos. And so on.
#10 Mechalibur Feb 12, 2009 14:22:03	I have a DM that is very very stingy with magic items. This is balanced out by the fact that all the enemies have lower defenses and attack bonuses. He actually has never once used the MM... Actually I don't think he's ever read any of the books (except the PHB when he was a player to decide what powers he wanted) But yeah, it works if you use the right enemies.
#11 Vatras Feb 15, 2009 8:30:02	The short answer is yes. But you have to have a closer look at encounter levels and use lower level monsters at higher levels.