Making a New Class is Really Hard - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Making a New Class is Really Hard

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
spaceboots
Mar 02, 2011 20:20:47 I'm only posting because I'm taking a break from working on my homebrew class. I thought I had a really great idea for a fun new class, and the first page is easy enough, relatively speaking for D&D. But I just counted up the sheer number of powers I'm going to have to come up with, and it gets a bit daunting. Basically for a single class I have to come up with around 80 brand new and unique powers. Plus around 16 powers for paragon paths.

A couple of things I've noticed:

Once you get past the first couple of levels, you can start with "Greater This" and "Greater That". I don't know how I feel about this, since it makes classes start to look like they're really padded out. I'm used to 3rd edition, in which a class might only take up three or four pages. In fourth edition, classes take up twelve pages. Part of the thing was that class features and abilities would often scale in 3rd edition. But in 4th, you have to repeat whole groups of powers every couple of levels.

Another point about 3rd edition though, was that a lot of classes had spells located elsewhere in the PHB. The reason this was done with 4th, was so everything you need to play the class is all in those dozen pages. But that leads to quite a lot of duplication of concepts.

What I found myself doing for my homebrew class, was often just lifting entire powers from other classes, re-titling them, re-flavor-texting them, and dropping them in. It works, but this feels cheap to me.

One of the things you can't do anymore is just knock up a new class by making a new spell list, a la the "witch" from the 3.0 DMG. There is no such thing as a cleric/wizard/sorcerer spell list to draw from anymore.

I guess I don't really mind so much that making new classes is a lot harder in 4th edition. It shows that a new class coming from WotC is actually a pretty big deal. They've effectively made the barrier to entry for making classes a lot higher.

At the same time, I feel like it has become a lot less transparent. In 3rd edition, creating a new spell, for example, was pretty easy. You just compared the spell with something that already existed. There were some parameters, like material components, target, range, duration. But 4th edition really opens up the scope of what powers can do (counterintuitively: by making individual powers more specific and specialized).

Balance is more complex too, because you're not balancing powers against other powers, but as a part of an entire class as a whole. You have a bit of wiggle room to make some powers better than others, but if you screw up one or two key powers, you might screw up an entire class without even being able to see the problem until much later.

/rant
/procrastination
#2
Crimson_Concerto
Mar 02, 2011 22:12:43 What exactly is your class concept here? It might be difficult because the concept isn't enough to warrant an entirely new class. That's a mistake that a lot of home-brewers make when it comes to class.
#3
spaceboots
Mar 02, 2011 23:22:08 Good point. I mean, I thought those were general ideas, but since this is my first 4e homebrew class, I might be being myopic.

The class is called the Surgeon. It's a secular healer who uses Dexterity as much as Intelligence in its application of the healing arts. His main healing is "natural", and not supernatural or divine. There are no glowing lights when he heals, no trumpeting angels, but he gets the job done. Many of the powers are indeed lifted from the cleric, but glowing lights are replaced with spurting arteries and dirty bandages. He also has a bit of an off-role as a striker and booster-leader with his anatomical knowledge of humanoids and monsters, and a little bit of the tactical warlord thrown in.

It's a vaguely steampunkish idea, but I've decided to leave out reference to tools and technology. I prefer games that don't emphasize tools or technology. So a surgeon's main tool is his brain, or his hands? I guess it's both. What I don't want is a surgeon with a magic scalpel (at least not as the default model).

I wanted a concept that could work alongside the fantasy standards, even with the exciting possibility of a surgeon and a cleric in the same party.

I am using the Amethyst Foundations Operator class for inspiration, but I have a few major complaints about that class, notably that it relies heavily on technology and that setting's houserules.
#4
spaceboots
Mar 02, 2011 23:31:56 btw, my next class after this is the lawyer ;)
#5
pluisjen
Mar 03, 2011 2:32:55 I dunno, performing surgery in the middle of a battle doesn't sound very viable to me... what kind of class features does the class have? I can't really picture this guy doing anything in battle... do you have a basic write-up?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 spaceboots Mar 02, 2011 20:20:47	I'm only posting because I'm taking a break from working on my homebrew class. I thought I had a really great idea for a fun new class, and the first page is easy enough, relatively speaking for D&D. But I just counted up the sheer number of powers I'm going to have to come up with, and it gets a bit daunting. Basically for a single class I have to come up with around 80 brand new and unique powers. Plus around 16 powers for paragon paths. A couple of things I've noticed: Once you get past the first couple of levels, you can start with "Greater This" and "Greater That". I don't know how I feel about this, since it makes classes start to look like they're really padded out. I'm used to 3rd edition, in which a class might only take up three or four pages. In fourth edition, classes take up twelve pages. Part of the thing was that class features and abilities would often scale in 3rd edition. But in 4th, you have to repeat whole groups of powers every couple of levels. Another point about 3rd edition though, was that a lot of classes had spells located elsewhere in the PHB. The reason this was done with 4th, was so everything you need to play the class is all in those dozen pages. But that leads to quite a lot of duplication of concepts. What I found myself doing for my homebrew class, was often just lifting entire powers from other classes, re-titling them, re-flavor-texting them, and dropping them in. It works, but this feels cheap to me. One of the things you can't do anymore is just knock up a new class by making a new spell list, a la the "witch" from the 3.0 DMG. There is no such thing as a cleric/wizard/sorcerer spell list to draw from anymore. I guess I don't really mind so much that making new classes is a lot harder in 4th edition. It shows that a new class coming from WotC is actually a pretty big deal. They've effectively made the barrier to entry for making classes a lot higher. At the same time, I feel like it has become a lot less transparent. In 3rd edition, creating a new spell, for example, was pretty easy. You just compared the spell with something that already existed. There were some parameters, like material components, target, range, duration. But 4th edition really opens up the scope of what powers can do (counterintuitively: by making individual powers more specific and specialized). Balance is more complex too, because you're not balancing powers against other powers, but as a part of an entire class as a whole. You have a bit of wiggle room to make some powers better than others, but if you screw up one or two key powers, you might screw up an entire class without even being able to see the problem until much later. /rant /procrastination
#2 Crimson_Concerto Mar 02, 2011 22:12:43	What exactly is your class concept here? It might be difficult because the concept isn't enough to warrant an entirely new class. That's a mistake that a lot of home-brewers make when it comes to class.
#3 spaceboots Mar 02, 2011 23:22:08	Good point. I mean, I thought those were general ideas, but since this is my first 4e homebrew class, I might be being myopic. The class is called the Surgeon. It's a secular healer who uses Dexterity as much as Intelligence in its application of the healing arts. His main healing is "natural", and not supernatural or divine. There are no glowing lights when he heals, no trumpeting angels, but he gets the job done. Many of the powers are indeed lifted from the cleric, but glowing lights are replaced with spurting arteries and dirty bandages. He also has a bit of an off-role as a striker and booster-leader with his anatomical knowledge of humanoids and monsters, and a little bit of the tactical warlord thrown in. It's a vaguely steampunkish idea, but I've decided to leave out reference to tools and technology. I prefer games that don't emphasize tools or technology. So a surgeon's main tool is his brain, or his hands? I guess it's both. What I don't want is a surgeon with a magic scalpel (at least not as the default model). I wanted a concept that could work alongside the fantasy standards, even with the exciting possibility of a surgeon and a cleric in the same party. I am using the Amethyst Foundations Operator class for inspiration, but I have a few major complaints about that class, notably that it relies heavily on technology and that setting's houserules.
#4 spaceboots Mar 02, 2011 23:31:56	btw, my next class after this is the lawyer ;)
#5 pluisjen Mar 03, 2011 2:32:55	I dunno, performing surgery in the middle of a battle doesn't sound very viable to me... what kind of class features does the class have? I can't really picture this guy doing anything in battle... do you have a basic write-up?