Monsters as NPC Hirelings - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Monsters as NPC Hirelings

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
renquist
Jan 24, 2012 11:09:12 I've been having a problem getting players to show up for game sessions, and I think I may have come up with a workable solution to the problem of too few PCs to match the level of encounters I wish to run.

None of the players wishes to play another player's character because of the complexity of powers, class features, etc. I don't blame them. I don't want to do it either. I also don't want to nerf the encounters so low that there are fewer than four or five monsters to fight. That's my preference, because I like the tactical complexity of multiple monsters.

So a solution I've thought of is to use the monster stats for common PC races as shown in the monster builder (example: the dwarf clan guard), and let the PCs hire these "monsters" as men-at-arms. I then plan on letting the PCs control these men-at-arms in combat, and only take over control if the PCs are obviously abusing them. There would be an employment contract and PCs would have to pay these NPCs to accompany them on adventures.

This solution allows for secondary PCs with much simplified stats and powers that hopefully won't overshadow the player's primary character, but still allow for "meat-shields" or artillery to boost the party's combat power.

Two potential problems I've come up with:

1. Healing surges. Monster stats don't come with them, so I drew up the following guidelines:

Some sample classes and healing surges are:

Barbarian: 8 + Con mod

Bard: 7 + Con mod

Cleric: 7 + Con mod

Fighter: 9 + Con mod

Paladin: 10 + Con mod

Ranger: 6 + Con mod

Rogue: 6 + Con Mod

Wizard: 6 + Con Mod

Extrapolating this to the monster roles leads me to:

Artillery: 7 + Con mod

Brute: 9 + Con mod

Controller: 6 + Con mod

Lurker: 7 + Con mod

Skirmisher: 7 + Con mod

Soldier: 8 + Con mod

2. Hireling Loyalty

I've only put a little bit of thought into this, but am thinking of modifying the concordance rules for artifacts to determine the NPC Loyalty score. This would also enable some puposely limited character development for the Hirelings

Just kicking around some ideas, and if you've done something like this, or are interested, reply and discuss
#2
rampant
Jan 24, 2012 16:24:37 Interesting, not much else to tell ya though, Looking at the companion PC and hireling rules might help you out some though.
#3
ciaran
Jan 26, 2012 10:48:08 Monsters have more hp than characters, so don't need as many surges. What they don't have is ways to spend them.
#4
ciaran
Jan 26, 2012 12:33:19 Oh, and for the record, it appears in the core rules that monsters have one healing surge per tier. This is probably not adequate foe what you're doing though.
#5
alitain
Jan 26, 2012 18:32:16 Well as rampant said, the best bet is to use the rules for Hirelings and Companion characters. That being said, if you knew you were playing with a small group you SHOULD cater your encounters to a smaller number of players. I mean I get you want to do big battles or tough battles but don't try and force anything on the players they don't want just because you don't want to lower the number of enemies. Look, I know I'm sounding mean and I'm not trying to be exactly but as the DM you need to cater your game to the players. If you only have say two or three players(assuming since you said you didn't want to lower the enemy count to less than four or five) then you need to make the encounters suitable for a two or three man party.

I'm not saying that getting hirelings is a bad idea, it's a good idea. But you did say they didn't want to have a second character and while hirelings aren't really characters in the same sense and yeah a lot less complicated they're still at least half a character and another body that needs to be taken care of. So just make sure to discuss it with the players and see if they're okay with hiring npcs to fight for them before doing anything.

Though my suggestion would be still to scale down your encounter to fit the group rather than trying to get the group to scale up to match your encounters. If there are only two or three players you can still make encounters that are easy/med/hard it's all based on a relative scale. Four enemies may be more of a medium level battle for two players, while a group of say five or six players would find it easy. So just because there are fewer enemies doesn't mean the battles are any easier/tougher.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 renquist Jan 24, 2012 11:09:12	I've been having a problem getting players to show up for game sessions, and I think I may have come up with a workable solution to the problem of too few PCs to match the level of encounters I wish to run. None of the players wishes to play another player's character because of the complexity of powers, class features, etc. I don't blame them. I don't want to do it either. I also don't want to nerf the encounters so low that there are fewer than four or five monsters to fight. That's my preference, because I like the tactical complexity of multiple monsters. So a solution I've thought of is to use the monster stats for common PC races as shown in the monster builder (example: the dwarf clan guard), and let the PCs hire these "monsters" as men-at-arms. I then plan on letting the PCs control these men-at-arms in combat, and only take over control if the PCs are obviously abusing them. There would be an employment contract and PCs would have to pay these NPCs to accompany them on adventures. This solution allows for secondary PCs with much simplified stats and powers that hopefully won't overshadow the player's primary character, but still allow for "meat-shields" or artillery to boost the party's combat power. Two potential problems I've come up with: 1. Healing surges. Monster stats don't come with them, so I drew up the following guidelines: Some sample classes and healing surges are: Barbarian: 8 + Con mod Bard: 7 + Con mod Cleric: 7 + Con mod Fighter: 9 + Con mod Paladin: 10 + Con mod Ranger: 6 + Con mod Rogue: 6 + Con Mod Wizard: 6 + Con Mod Extrapolating this to the monster roles leads me to: Artillery: 7 + Con mod Brute: 9 + Con mod Controller: 6 + Con mod Lurker: 7 + Con mod Skirmisher: 7 + Con mod Soldier: 8 + Con mod 2. Hireling Loyalty I've only put a little bit of thought into this, but am thinking of modifying the concordance rules for artifacts to determine the NPC Loyalty score. This would also enable some puposely limited character development for the Hirelings Just kicking around some ideas, and if you've done something like this, or are interested, reply and discuss
#2 rampant Jan 24, 2012 16:24:37	Interesting, not much else to tell ya though, Looking at the companion PC and hireling rules might help you out some though.
#3 ciaran Jan 26, 2012 10:48:08	Monsters have more hp than characters, so don't need as many surges. What they don't have is ways to spend them.
#4 ciaran Jan 26, 2012 12:33:19	Oh, and for the record, it appears in the core rules that monsters have one healing surge per tier. This is probably not adequate foe what you're doing though.
#5 alitain Jan 26, 2012 18:32:16	Well as rampant said, the best bet is to use the rules for Hirelings and Companion characters. That being said, if you knew you were playing with a small group you SHOULD cater your encounters to a smaller number of players. I mean I get you want to do big battles or tough battles but don't try and force anything on the players they don't want just because you don't want to lower the number of enemies. Look, I know I'm sounding mean and I'm not trying to be exactly but as the DM you need to cater your game to the players. If you only have say two or three players(assuming since you said you didn't want to lower the enemy count to less than four or five) then you need to make the encounters suitable for a two or three man party. I'm not saying that getting hirelings is a bad idea, it's a good idea. But you did say they didn't want to have a second character and while hirelings aren't really characters in the same sense and yeah a lot less complicated they're still at least half a character and another body that needs to be taken care of. So just make sure to discuss it with the players and see if they're okay with hiring npcs to fight for them before doing anything. Though my suggestion would be still to scale down your encounter to fit the group rather than trying to get the group to scale up to match your encounters. If there are only two or three players you can still make encounters that are easy/med/hard it's all based on a relative scale. Four enemies may be more of a medium level battle for two players, while a group of say five or six players would find it easy. So just because there are fewer enemies doesn't mean the battles are any easier/tougher.